Coach Mac

[OttoMets]

On this topic, far more important than a debate between two sides that will neither agree nor be validated for another year (or three, depending on how many more 'bad luck' excuses are needed next season), regarding Coach Mac:

Is he well? It seemed weird that he was glued to his golf cart seat during the event last month, then I saw him being pushed around the concourse in a wheelchair on Saturday. Haven't seen him out at Varsity (where he's a semi-regular) in some time.

Hope he's OK.

 

[Crusty]

I'm not wasting my time, just sharing my opinion. I truly believe in this guy and I think he is giving us an incredible opportunity to be a premier northeast program again.

I can't agree more. I say wasting your time because some will never see and some don't want to see. I think he is going to build something special because he is something special.

 

[Rocco]

CMU was an OT win.
Wake we hit 2 big long TD passes late in the 3rd qtr.

We can argue over semantics all day, i just want everyone who uses the old, "we lost on the last play of the game twice" to realize that we also did just about the same in two of our wins and we COULD easily be 1-6 or 2-5. It goes both ways folks.

You're comparing 3rd qtr TD passes in a win over WF to a loss in 3OT to UVA and a loss on a game-winning FG by Pitt?

 

[xc84]

CMU was an OT win.
Wake we hit 2 big long TD passes late in the 3rd qtr.

We can argue over semantics all day, i just want everyone who uses the old, "we lost on the last play of the game twice" to realize that we also did just about the same in two of our wins and we COULD easily be 1-6 or 2-5. It goes both ways folks.

SU scored 7 in the 3rd Q v. Wake and 10 in the 4th. More importantly, they held Wake scoreless the 2nd half. It was not one you can say was "close". They won by 13.

 

[orangeinjersey]

SU scored 7 in the 3rd Q v. Wake and 10 in the 4th. More importantly, they held Wake scoreless the 2nd half. It was not one you can say was "close". They won by 13.

ok fine, so we could easily be 2-5. Is that better? Still proves my point. Cant say we barely lost a game or two when we also barely won a game or two.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The cupboard certainly wasn't full when he took over. Marrone's 2012 team was laden with seniors and he then took the majority of the staff with him right during peak recruiting season. Shafer had to pick up the pieces and assemble a staff last minute (a la McScreen) and try and save some of the recruits. He wasn't able to hang onto many of them and it left with us with a terribly small 2013 class. Now that he is in the swing of things, you can see what kind of talent he and his assistants are capable of bringing in when given the time. Dungey, Erv, Fredericks, Zaire, Clark, Strickland, etc.

Could a few games have easily gone our way and turned into wins under Shafer? Yep. But we are right in the majority of the losses and it only takes a little more fine-tuning to reverse those outcomes into the win column.

Not sure why people have cannot see the value of what his approach is setting us up for long-term. The whole "win now" thing is not the approach at Syracuse. People need to get off the pipe dream that we're going to go and hire some stud unless Syracuse drastically changes their football commitment and salary $$ allocations.

Year 3 isn't win now, that is the whole point and like I said and have said 1,000 times he needs to win a couple coming in because I really don't see much validity in your point of view if he can't do that. people are having a tough time seeing the approach because right now he just looks like a mediocre to bad football coach, which won't get it done at Syracuse.. The offense stills stinks and the recruiting is the most overblown part of the argument. Marrone had a really good class put together if he stayed in 2012 for a guy that could not recruit. In addition, haven't seen one flash of brilliance in his entire tenure, no big wins, nothing like the other coaches we have had other than GROB. I think you are kidding yourself but like I said, he has 5 more games this year and most likely next to prove his worth but he hasn't yet.

You can call me overly pessimistic but I think it's a legit outlook and fair as to what we have seen SO FAR. Go win a big game Shafer, show something. Outcoach someone, out scheme someone, anything for people to get excited for. Get a big win. I want the guy to succeed but can't continue to bury my head in the sand either

 

[RMH44]

I can't agree more. I say wasting your time because some will never see and some don't want to see. I think he is going to build something special because he is something special.

Absolutely agree...and just as important to me is that he is doing the right way. I couldn't be more impressed with the character quality of the players/recruits.

I've said it more than once, I'd rather drop to Division 3 than have a program full of unsavory "student athletes".

 

[IthacaBarrel]

You are wasting your time. When you are building a foundation some see it as a hole in the ground and others see a mansion. I think Coyle can see what Shafer is building.

Shafer is welcome at more high schools and has established credibility with HS coaches. Parents and players seem to love him and he has delivered with early playing time. He is doing what Pete Carroll did at USC - competition at every position and by making it fun.

This guy is going to deliver big time.

Comparing Shafer to Carroll is laughable. What has he shown to make you think that he is "special"

 

[Rocco]

Year 3 isn't win now, that is the whole point and like I said and have said 1,000 times he needs to win a couple coming in because I really don't see much validity in your point of view if he can't do that. people are having a tough time seeing the approach because right now he just looks like a mediocre to bad football coach, which won't get it done at Syracuse.. The offense stills stinks and the recruiting is the most overblown part of the argument. Marrone had a really good class put together if he stayed in 2012 for a guy that could not recruit. In addition, haven't seen one flash of brilliance in his entire tenure, no big wins, nothing like the other coaches we have had other than GROB. I think you are kidding yourself but like I said, he has 5 more games this year and most likely next to prove his worth but he hasn't yet.

You can call me overly pessimistic but I think it's a legit outlook and fair as to what we have seen SO FAR. Go win a big game Shafer, show something. Outcoach someone, out scheme someone, anything for people to get excited for. I want the guy to succeed but can't continue to bury my head in the sand either

Fair enough. I still think Shaf is the guy. As a diehard fan, you and I want the best for the program. I am in the Shafer camp, you're not so much at this point, which is understandable. I guess we value what is going on behind the scenes differently.

 

[TheCusian]

CMU was an OT win. Wake we hit 2 big long TD passes late in the 3rd qtr. We can argue over semantics all day, i just want everyone who uses the old, "we lost on the last play of the game twice" to realize that we also did just about the same in two of our wins and we COULD easily be 1-6 or 2-5. It goes both ways folks.

Yeah. Losing by 3 on a FG is that same as beating a team by 2 TD in the 3rd.

Not semantics.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Fair enough. I still think Shaf is the guy. As a diehard fan, you and I want the best for the program. I am in the Shafer camp, you're not so much at this point, which is understandable. I guess we value what is going on behind the scenes differently.

Agree to disagree. I value wins and I don't really want to know what goes on behind the scenes, I certainly don't want to know when it comes to basketball and I certainly don't want to when it comes to football. I quite honestly don't care. I expect many kids to dumb things and I expect many kids to get very poor grades. When they do get rid of them or make them pay their dues. As coach O'Leary says get rid of the roaches and bring in the ANTS

 

[xc84]

ok fine, so we could easily be 2-5. Is that better? Still proves my point. Cant say we barely lost a game or two when we also barely won a game or two.

Yes, instead of 3-4 we could be 2-5 or 6-1. That's what kind of year it has been. It's been that close.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

Agree to disagree. I value wins and I don't really want to know what goes on behind the scenes, I certainly don't want to know when it comes to basketball and I certainly don't want to when it comes to football. I quite honestly don't care. I expect many kids to dumb things and I expect many kids to get very poor grades. When they do get rid of them. As coach O'Leary says get rid of the roaches and bring in the ANTS

But its how the sausage is made that makes it sausage.

 

[TheCusian]

ok fine, so we could easily be 2-5. Is that better? Still proves my point. Cant say we barely lost a game or two when we also barely won a game or two.

They don't invalidate each other. A close loss and a close win look very different on the w-l ledger - but not so much if you're saying "we're close to being good"

 

[Crusty]

Comparing Shafer to Carroll is laughable. What has he shown to make you think that he is "special"

Whoa big boy. I was pointing out that Shafer has made it open competition for every position rather than incumbency that many coaches do. He has also made it fun - just ask any player. That will pay off over time.
BTW Carroll was a very unpopular choice at USC when he was hired.

 

[orangeinjersey]

If a genie told DG that HCSS would be 13-19 midway through year 3, would he still have hired him? Would you still have wanted to hire him? No way. Dont give me injuries, dont give me cupboard bare. He was a continuity hire. And 13-19 with ZERO signature big wins over anyone good is not good no matter which way you slice it.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

But its how the sausage is made that makes it sausage.

And I don't think most people want to know how sausage is made, they just like to eat it.

 

[orangeinjersey]

Yes, instead of 3-4 we could be 2-5 or 6-1. That's what kind of year it has been. It's been that close.

EXACTLY. We are what we are, in the middle. A mediocre football season.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Whoa big boy. I was pointing out that Shafer has made it open competition for every position rather than incumbency that many coaches do. He has also made it fun - just ask any player. That will pay off over time.
BTW Carroll was a very unpopular choice at USC when he was hired.

Coach speak nonsense. We already whiffed on trying to hire a Pete Carroll type. Fans often don't like certain hires, doesn't mean anything. THE USC brass got lucky as he was about their 4th or 5th choice.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

If a genie told DG that HCSS would be 13-19 midway through year 3, would he still have hired him? Would you still have wanted to hire him? No way. Dont give me injuries, dont give me cupboard bare. He was a continuity hire. And 13-19 with ZERO signature big wins over anyone good is not good no matter which way you slice it.

Would You also get to look into the glass ball and tell DG that:

1. He wouldn't have Nassib due to injury for two seasons. (Tell me how 2012 plays out after being 2-4, losing to Rutgers if Nassib blew out his arm)
2. Have to play two perennial top ten in conference teams each year (one winning the national championship and one time being the runner up
3. Switching conferences from JV (BE) to Varsity (ACC).

 

[TheCusian]

If a genie told DG that HCSS would be 13-19 midway through year 3, would he still have hired him? Would you still have wanted to hire him? No way. Dont give me injuries, dont give me cupboard bare. He was a continuity hire. And 13-19 with ZERO signature big wins over anyone good is not good no matter which way you slice it.

Big difference between "not good" and "fire him because there's no hope" ...

If everyone had hindsight, decision making would be much easier.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

And I don't think most people want to know how sausage is made, they just like to eat it.

That's my point.

 

[Rocco]

Agree to disagree. I value wins and I don't really want to know what goes on behind the scenes, I certainly don't want to know when it comes to basketball and I certainly don't want to when it comes to football. I quite honestly don't care. I expect many kids to dumb things and I expect many kids to get very poor grades. When they do get rid of them or make them pay their dues. As coach O'Leary says get rid of the roaches and bring in the ANTS

That's fine, not everything is about wins and losses. If we see marked improvement (which we are undoubtedly seeing this year), I'm willing to have more patience with such a young team. Shaf gets a pass in my book and I think next year will be enormous. I still think we win 5-6 games this year.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

That's fine, not everything is about wins and losses. If we see marked improvement (which we are undoubtedly seeing this year), I'm willing to have more patience with such a young team. Shaf gets a pass in my book and I think next year will be enormous. I still think we win 5-6 games this year.

Agree. Next year IMO was the year for intense evaluation anyways, but it was a no brainer once Hunt was hurt again. If we aren't 6-8 wins next year then we can discuss the merits of making a switch.

 

[xc84]

EXACTLY. We are what we are, in the middle. A mediocre football season.

I agree. It is mediocre but showing signs it is heading in the right direction similar to Mac's 5th year (also a frustrating one).