Does Taurean Thompson change how we are recruiting?

[OttoMets]

But that is contrary to what started this thread because an Arinze type player who produces right away won't stay more that 2 years tops.
Just think what is being asked, 12 guys on a roster, ideally 3 in each class with 1 each developing so you have a balance of high end talent to start and long term decent players who turn into good players by year 4/5. Now try to write the formula for that one.

Maybe. I've given up on guessing what kid might leave early (and I'm still amazed that Arinze was on an NBA roster this year). But as a general rule I think guys like Arinze and, to a lesser extent, Thompson are good choices for SU. Enough basketball skill to be productive winners in college, not enough athleticism or height to get an NBA team to roll the dice.

 

[retro44]

Or could it be some schools keep agents at better than arms length from their players vs. schools like pay pal cal that has allowed sports agents to set up office in the players dorm building.

 

[Cusefan0307]

His teammates were OK his freshman year, a total disastrous nightmare his middle two years, and excellent his senior year. Arinze wasn't a plus defender, but by the time he was an upperclassman he knew where he needed to be and he wasn't a liability.

Though I think Boeheim ideally would prefer a taller and rangier center if he had his pick.

Me, I like a guy like Arinze with basketball skills who can produce right off the bat.

Coleman was supposed to be Arinze 2.0. It didn't happen because of injuries and whatever else. I think a lot of people forget that the first 2 years we got nothing from Arinze. His freshman year he wasn't that good and his sophomore year he missed the entire season because of injuries.

 

[RF2044]

Coleman was supposed to be Arinze 2.0. It didn't happen because of injuries and whatever else. I think a lot of people forget that the first 2 years we got nothing from Arinze. His freshman year he wasn't that good and his sophomore year he missed the entire season because of injuries.

That's not true--Arinze was a backup his freshman year, and displayed advanced offensive skills for a frosh. He got injured the next year.

It's not like he suddenly developed later on--he had good skills offensively coming in.

 

[OttoMets]

That's not true--Arinze was a backup his freshman year, and displayed advanced offensive skills for a frosh. He got injured the next year.

It's not like he suddenly developed later on--he had good skills offensively coming in.

Exactly, he had impressive skills from Day One. Played a big role in upsetting West Virginia at the Dome in '05-'06. But he was stuck behind a very strong junior in Mookie in a fairly deep backcourt. After his injury redshirt, his sophomore season was as productive as any Syracuse big man.

I know many hoped Coleman would develop into a similar player (and that would have been fine for these recent teams, in my opinion), but he came in with a major skills deficit by comparison.

 

[Cusefan0307]

That's not true--Arinze was a backup his freshman year, and displayed advanced offensive skills for a frosh. He got injured the next year.

It's not like he suddenly developed later on--he had good skills offensively coming in.

Ehh. Agree to disagree here. He definately refined them over time. I think Taurean is much more advanced, but that's just my opinion.

 

[OttoMets]

Ehh. Agree to disagree here. He definately refined them over time. I think Taurean is much more advanced, but that's just my opinion.

Agree with the last part; I've never seen a first-year Syracuse big with Thompson's skills.

 

[TCuse99]

I think Thompson type players will be coming here more once Hop takes over. Offensive talent like him we need. And playing man to man more will hide his weaknesses. He's just so darn skilled. I think he honestly approaches 20 per game next year for us.

Him and Battle will both be top 20 picks in the draft.

Side note on some of the trashing of White I read around here... really? Dude is our best shooter in the past 10 years. He's every bit on offense of what we hoped Cooney would be, but never was.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think Thompson type players will be coming here more once Hop takes over. Offensive talent like him we need. And playing man to man more will hide his weaknesses. He's just so darn skilled. I think he honestly approaches 20 per game next year for us.

Him and Battle will both be top 20 picks in the draft.

Side note on some of the trashing of White I read around here... really? Dude is our best shooter in the past 10 years. He's every bit on offense of what we hoped Cooney would be, but never was.

A bit of a stretch. I don't think he's the best shooter on this team.

 

[Consigliere]

Ideally it needs to be a balance. You build a program with "program" guys who stay four years. You supplement with the superstars who can drive a team to the next level. (See Syracuse Orange 2003.) With the growing prevalence of the one and done culture it is essential to fill all 13 spots with potential contributors, particularly in a system like ours that is by no means plug and play. This is key and borne out by this year's struggles IMO.

Having capable pieces, even if they are stop gap solutions while a talented freshman learns the ropes makes transition periods easier to navigate when there are unexpected departures. As the NBA moves toward its stated goal of 30 for 30 with one D-League team for each NBA team this will become even more challenging. While as fans we see D-league as a step down from high major college ball, this is becoming more and more the prevalent route to the NBA and the relatively small salaries in the D-League seem irrelevant to many of us, it's more than a player makes at any college (with the possible exception of Kentucky), and a high paying job for many of these kids from low income households.

 

[RF2044]

Ehh. Agree to disagree here. He definately refined them over time. I think Taurean is much more advanced, but that's just my opinion.

Yeah, agree to disagree on that assessment--he was the best offensive center coming in as a frosh that we've ever brought in, in terms of ability to score inside, finish consistently with both hands, etc.

​

Not a big deal, though.

 

[pfister1]

Yeah, the UNC kids stay to get their degree in African and Afro-American Studies.

I was thinking more along the lines that they stay because there are no actual academic demands made on them, no classes to attend or pesky papers to research and write.

 

[Jasoncuse]

UNC hasn't had a freshman go pro since Brandan Wright 10 years ago and only 3 sophs. Since then, we've had 4 kids go after their freshman year and another 5 after their soph seasons.

I don't know what that says. Does UNC not play freshmen as much? They haven't had a freshman that was really good since Harrison Barnes. They always have depth, it seems, so not playing freshman big minutes probably helps limit their exposure and possibility of leaving early, right?

On the other hand, we've had Malachi, Donte Greene and Tyler Ennis play all the minutes they could handle. Their games were all out there for the NBA to see and maybe they felt they had nothing more to prove at that point? McCullough played a lot before his injury, but he's an interesting case.

 

[billsin01]

But that is contrary to what started this thread because an Arinze type player who produces right away won't stay more that 2 years tops.
Just think what is being asked, 12 guys on a roster, ideally 3 in each class with 1 each developing so you have a balance of high end talent to start and long term decent players who turn into good players by year 4/5. Now try to write the formula for that one.

That's not what I was getting at or intending at least. I was thinking more along otto's lines -- arinze was great but not a great fit at the next level. Now how do you determine that niche accurately? Tougher question and maybe impossible, as some have suggested. But what I do know is a program that does this or at least lucks into (UNC?) can reap serious benefits and enjoy a modicum of continuity.

 

[billsin01]

Ehh. Agree to disagree here. He definately refined them over time. I think Taurean is much more advanced, but that's just my opinion.

Arinze improved but was impressive at least relative to the reputation he had coming in as a fresh. Thompson is a totally different animal -- something arinze was never going to be. That said I think people want all their bigs to be like Thompson with a ton of skill. Guys like arinze who do a couple things but do them very well are undervalued by most of us who are drooling over hat Thompson could potentially be one day.

 

[billsin01]

Ideally it needs to be a balance. You build a program with "program" guys who stay four years. You supplement with the superstars who can drive a team to the next level. (See Syracuse Orange 2003.) With the growing prevalence of the one and done culture it is essential to fill all 13 spots with potential contributors, particularly in a system like ours that is by no means plug and play. This is key and borne out by this year's struggles IMO.

Having capable pieces, even if they are stop gap solutions while a talented freshman learns the ropes makes transition periods easier to navigate when there are unexpected departures. As the NBA moves toward its stated goal of 30 for 30 with one D-League team for each NBA team this will become even more challenging. While as fans we see D-league as a step down from high major college ball, this is becoming more and more the prevalent route to the NBA and the relatively small salaries in the D-League seem irrelevant to many of us, it's more than a player makes at any college (with the possible exception of Kentucky), and a high paying job for many of these kids from low income households.

I agree -- it's absolutely a balance. My question is do we shift our focus a bit in terms of looking for more polish on the multi-year players perhaps at the expense of some raw athleticism? We still will pursue some high end guys and one-and-done types. But do we try to find taurean Thompson instead of donte Greene or jeremi grant?

 

[tbonezone]

he's a bit like tristan thompson without the defensive aptitude or kardashian.

 

[baggerbob]

Agree with the last part; I've never seen a first-year Syracuse big with Thompson's skills.

The original DC had all those skills, and was a good defender, back when JB played man to man.

 

[br801]

The original DC had all those skills, and was a good defender, back when JB played man to man.

He was also the best and most instinctive rebounder I've ever seen in Orange.

 

[tbonezone]

DC also had a mad handle up the court. incredible really for a guy his size. press breaker !

 

[thebigeast44]

I think you're underestimating the recruiting advantage North Carolina has over us as one of the blue bloods of college basketball.

Number of McDonald's AA:

North Carolina - 71
Syracuse - 20

 

[Ghost]

That's not true--Arinze was a backup his freshman year, and displayed advanced offensive skills for a frosh. He got injured the next year.

It's not like he suddenly developed later on--he had good skills offensively coming in.

I concur with this because I remember how shocked I was at how adept he was offensively with such little fanfare coming in - at least for a guy with the skills he presented right away. He was such a pleasant surprise - similar to Thompson, who I thought would be okay, but not nearly ready, but his offensive game is far more refined than I would have guessed. Arinze around the rim though blew my mind - such great touch even early on.

Now, Otis Hill, that's the type of big guy we need again! I loved that dude - just wanted to mention his name. No actual commentary.

 

[billsin01]

I think you're underestimating the recruiting advantage North Carolina has over us as one of the blue bloods of college basketball.

Number of McDonald's AA:

North Carolina - 71
Syracuse - 20

Not sure if this is addressed to the original post but I'm not sure I care if we get mcd's or not. And in carolina's case it's been the solid players -- mcd's or not -- that have been pretty impressive he past couple years. Johnson and Paige, 4 years, Jackson at least 3, berry at least three etc. good players who aren't NBA prototypes are the thought -- mcd's or not

 

[Briancuse]

I think you're underestimating the recruiting advantage North Carolina has over us as one of the blue bloods of college basketball.

Number of McDonald's AA:

North Carolina - 71
Syracuse - 20

Thats why I always find it funny when the haters knock Jb for not winning more, they make it sound like we have 4 or 5 mcdonalds all americans a year, we haven't had that many.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Thats why I always find it funny when the haters knock Jb for not winning more, they make it sound like we have 4 or 5 mcdonalds all americans a year, we haven't had that many.

Carolina's recruiting has changed a lot recently. They aren't getting top 20 kids anymore like they used to. They've had 2 top twenty kids since they signed Harrison Barnes. Justin Jackson and James McAdoo. Roberson was a higher ranked recruit than Meeks.

Edit: Next year they have a class of 4 guys. One of them is ranked in the top 100. I don't think they are killing it on the trail. This isn't a UK/Duke scenario. They are getting the exact same type of kids we should get.