Empty dome...

[rrlbees]

Lets be honest here, Syracuse fans epitomize fair weather/bandwagon fans. People will show up for big events or winning teams but are no where to be found when things get a little dicey. I understand the frustration with the football team, but you would think there would be some more enthusiasm being our first season in the ACC. Even the basketball games, look at the poor attendance of midnight madness and the St. Francis game. We are a top 10 team with excellent success in the past few years and we are not drawing all that well for those two events. People will say the St. Francis attendance was 23,000, but people at the game say that wasn't even close because its tickets sold not people showing up. Its just frustrating.

Sounds like fans everywhere.

As to basketball, we are redic with the number of season tix we've sold. And 99.9% of colleges wish they could have the butts in the seats that SU had for St Francis. I don't get the complaints about basketball attendance at all. Football neither if you look at everything that impacts attendance.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[RMH44]

Lets be honest here, Syracuse fans epitomize fair weather/bandwagon fans. People will show up for big events or winning teams but are no where to be found when things get a little dicey. I understand the frustration with the football team, but you would think there would be some more enthusiasm being our first season in the ACC. Even the basketball games, look at the poor attendance of midnight madness and the St. Francis game. We are a top 10 team with excellent success in the past few years and we are not drawing all that well for those two events. People will say the St. Francis attendance was 23,000, but people at the game say that wasn't even close because its tickets sold not people showing up. Its just frustrating.

I actually think much of the attendance problems are economy driven. After years of zero growth and the loss of jobs in CNY, people are being far more selective how they spend their entertainment dollars.

More than ever, SU FB needs to win on the field before the fans decide to spend money to attend games. Just my opinion and I could be wrong.

 

[JoeSU]

Students are away and apparently none stayed for the game.

I was happy to see the SUMB was there, however.

 

[Stern]

I'm not sure what Stern said there that you're taking offense to - he pretty much nailed it.

To some people the truth hurts and they don't like to hear it. Since they can't debate the topic they last out at the poster (me in this instance)

 

[Stern]

Nobody wants to see SU play Wagner, horrible product...no wait can't go to Tulane, not good enough. Pitt...too average. Clemson... too good, we'll get killed. It's never enough or fit that circle just perfect. Face it, SU has 25K loyals and they have to win to bump that fickle crowd up and that goes across the board for the whole northeast, this isn't just a Syracuse area person not showing up. It's embarrassing.

Here is what SU needs to do...play a bunch of the "Wagner's" of the world for like 5 or 6 years. Load up on cupcake OOC games. Have 3 or 4 wins going into conference play by beating up on the little sisters of the poor. Wagner, Buffalo, Tulane...etc...all of the easy wins you can find. And schedule 3 or 4 of those games EVERY YEAR...consistently!!! Yes the attendance will SUCK for those games...gonna have to bite the bullet for a few years. And guess what the attendance sucks anyway so what are you losing? Nothing! Just gaining an easy win!!! GUARANTEE yourself a bunch of 6 win seasons in a row. Go to 5 or 6 or 7 bowl games in a row. Build up CONFIDENCE among the local Syracuse fans that Syracuse Football is a bowl team every year!!! THEN sprinkle in 1..yes just 1... OOC game vs a USC or a Penn St or some legit team...like 7 or 8 years from now. But no more scheduling these Big 10 Schools and such OOC. It's too much!

This notion that SU needs to play a killer OOC schedule is silly. It's dumb because we lose the majority of the time. It hurts the program in reaching a bowl game. You don't get brownie points or extra credit for playing a tough schedule. We used to laugh at VT all those years ago for there OOC schedule and how it was a joke...but they built a program that way and then started playing the Alabama's of the world to open a season and such. That's the blueprint and the road map back to success. Yes it means a bunch of years with boring games in the Dome vs bad teams...but so what!!!!! It's about compiling wins!! Going to bowls on a consistent basis. Telling recruits you come here and you will play in a top conference, you will play vs the likes of FSU and Clemson every year. You will go to a bowl every year...and so on and so forth. That's the sales pitch! We don't have that sales pitch when we schedule ourselves to be 0-2 or 1-3 most years by a little after Labor Day!!!

It's about Wins and Losses at the end of the day and for SU and where the SU football program is right now...nobody is looking for "quality wins" or "style points"! Schedule WINS! And from there everything else falls into place...attendance, better recruits, bowl games, more money coming into the football program,...etc!!

 

[rocklloyd]

I've got an idea. what we need now is a to knock down carrier down and build an open air stadium up in south campus for $300M. So all the folks who were worried about driving to game in snow can sit in snow. Open air stadium will drive attendance by at least 50% right.

Instead, How about we focus on getting talent in skill positions, schedule a bit easier when we're trying to rebuild fan base, and win the games we're supposed to win. You can't keep asking fair weathers to show up and lay offensive eggs. This ain't the year. Attention all stud qb and WR recruits. Playing time up for grabs. And lots of it

 

[rrlbees]

I've got an idea. what we need now is a to knock down carrier down and build an open air stadium up in south campus for $300M. So all the folks who were worried about driving to game in snow can sit in snow. Open air stadium will drive attendance by at least 50% right. Instead, How about we focus on getting talent in skill positions, schedule a bit easier when we're trying to rebuild fan base, and win the games we're supposed to win. You can't keep asking fair weathers to show up and lay offensive eggs. This ain't the year. Attention all stud qb and WR recruits. Playing time up for grabs. And lots of it

Retractable roof.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[jkmac]

Great post Stern, you nailed it!

 

[TexanMark]

These two games (Pitt/BC) are predictable for attendance. The ACC did us no favors with two late season home games without the students.

 

[Scooch]

It's Groundhog Day!

We had 48,ooo fans in attendance for a game THIS YEAR.

Here's the deal... the program is, at best, mediocre. And has been a devastatingly non-entertaining mediocre for years, aside from a few game stretch last season. People don't care about coming out to see us, maybe, get bowl eligible.

It seems obvious that Syracuse is an event-driven town. The hoops team has been at a point for several years where every game they play is an event. Hence the baseline 22K in attendance. Some of those events are nationally attention-grabbing, hence the 30K+ crowds.

When SU football played it's ACC opener against a well-known top 5 team THAT was an event. The program itself hasn't been an event in over a decade.

SU probably built the Dome 6-8K seats too big anyway. That we've topped 45K for football many, many times over the years is quite an accomplishment when you compare our region size/alumni base to others.

 

[TexanMark]

Great post Stern, you nailed it!

Pretty much nailed it but it won't happen as they won't break the MetLife contract.

Cuse needs to revise the schedule going forward with a 1AA (Colgate after they meet min scholie levels or Nova, Wagner) yearly, a nearby MAC (a 2 for 1 with UMass, UB, Akron, Kent or Directional Michigan), a traditionally bad SunBelt or equivalent team in a great recruiting area (Ga St, ODU, JMU if they upgrade, Tulane, FIU, FAU, USA, TX midmajors), Army or Navy as often as possible, and finally either the MetLife game or a decent named mid level P5 team (Illinois, Rutgers...yeah I know, Maryland, Vandy, Purdue). I'd throw USF, UCF in that group too.

Finally, I'd schedule a game out in Hawaii bracketed around any year we play in the Maui Invitational. Cuse can just schedule Hawaii first and then alert Maui they are available.

Game 1 Labor Day Weekend: 1 AA game work with State Fair for giveaways.
Game 2 Home or Away: the 2 for 1 with a team like Akron or UB or UMass (or crappy mid major)
Game 3 H/H with Army/Navy/USAFA or UConn/Temple (or other midmajor)
Game 4/5 ACC Game
Game 5/4 MetLife game or middling P5team
Bye set up the weekend before or after Columbus Day weekend depending on if we have a 1 bye or 2 bye schedule.


The whole goal is to give yourself a high chance of 3 wins in the MetLife years and a decent chance at 4 wins in the non MetLife years.

Scooch I agree the Dome is too big...I'd make the seats between the 20s (or 30s) individual seatbacks and make the roll out basketball seats the same (it might mean a new re-engineered system for those seats)

 

[rocklloyd]

Retractable roof.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

Forgot about that feature

 

[anomander]

Pretty much nailed it but it won't happen as they won't break the MetLife contract.

Cuse needs to revise the schedule going forward with a 1AA (Colgate after they meet min scholie levels or Nova, Wagner) yearly, a nearby MAC (a 2 for 1 with UMass, UB, Akron, Kent or Directional Michigan), a traditionally bad SunBelt or equivalent team in a great recruiting area (Ga St, ODU, JMU if they upgrade, Tulane, FIU, FAU, USA, TX midmajors), Army or Navy as often as possible, and finally either the MetLife game or a decent named mid level P5 team (Illinois, Rutgers...yeah I know, Maryland, Vandy, Purdue). I'd throw USF, UCF in that group too.

Finally, I'd schedule a game out in Hawaii bracketed around any year we play in the Maui Invitational. Cuse can just schedule Hawaii first and then alert Maui they are available.

Game 1 Labor Day Weekend: 1 AA game work with State Fair for giveaways.
Game 2 Home or Away: the 2 for 1 with a team like Akron or UB or UMass (or crappy mid major)
Game 3 H/H with Army/Navy/USAFA or UConn/Temple (or other midmajor)
Game 4/5 ACC Game
Game 5/4 MetLife game or middling P5team
Bye set up the weekend before or after Columbus Day weekend depending on if we have a 1 bye or 2 bye schedule.


The whole goal is to give yourself a high chance of 3 wins in the MetLife years and a decent chance at 4 wins in the non MetLife years.

Scooch I agree the Dome is too big...I'd make the seats between the 20s (or 30s) individual seatbacks and make the roll out basketball seats the same (it might mean a new re-engineered system for those seats)

It's pretty simple right. Now if only the people running the show can figure it out

 

[rrlbees]

Forgot about that feature

Nope

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[storange]

Syracuse is not a sports town.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

yes thats correct, they will lead the nation in college basketball attendance but its a terrible sports town

 

[RF2044]

Here is what SU needs to do...play a bunch of the "Wagner's" of the world for like 5 or 6 years. Load up on cupcake OOC games. Have 3 or 4 wins going into conference play by beating up on the little sisters of the poor. Wagner, Buffalo, Tulane...etc...all of the easy wins you can find. And schedule 3 or 4 of those games EVERY YEAR...consistently!!! Yes the attendance will SUCK for those games...gonna have to bite the bullet for a few years. And guess what the attendance sucks anyway so what are you losing? Nothing! Just gaining an easy win!!! GUARANTEE yourself a bunch of 6 win seasons in a row. Go to 5 or 6 or 7 bowl games in a row. Build up CONFIDENCE among the local Syracuse fans that Syracuse Football is a bowl team every year!!! THEN sprinkle in 1..yes just 1... OOC game vs a USC or a Penn St or some legit team...like 7 or 8 years from now. But no more scheduling these Big 10 Schools and such OOC. It's too much!

This notion that SU needs to play a killer OOC schedule is silly. It's dumb because we lose the majority of the time. It hurts the program in reaching a bowl game. You don't get brownie points or extra credit for playing a tough schedule. We used to laugh at VT all those years ago for there OOC schedule and how it was a joke...but they built a program that way and then started playing the Alabama's of the world to open a season and such. That's the blueprint and the road map back to success. Yes it means a bunch of years with boring games in the Dome vs bad teams...but so what!!!!! It's about compiling wins!! Going to bowls on a consistent basis. Telling recruits you come here and you will play in a top conference, you will play vs the likes of FSU and Clemson every year. You will go to a bowl every year...and so on and so forth. That's the sales pitch! We don't have that sales pitch when we schedule ourselves to be 0-2 or 1-3 most years by a little after Labor Day!!!

It's about Wins and Losses at the end of the day and for SU and where the SU football program is right now...nobody is looking for "quality wins" or "style points"! Schedule WINS! And from there everything else falls into place...attendance, better recruits, bowl games, more money coming into the football program,...etc!!

Stern, historically I don't often resonate with your posts.

But I agree 100% with everything in this one. TGD's approach has driven me nuts for years. Especially when our program is struggling to right the ship. Thank you for taking the time to outline what needs to be said.

Could. Not. Agree. More.

 

[rrlbees]

Here is what SU needs to do...play a bunch of the "Wagner's" of the world for like 5 or 6 years. Load up on cupcake OOC games. Have 3 or 4 wins going into conference play by beating up on the little sisters of the poor. Wagner, Buffalo, Tulane...etc...all of the easy wins you can find. And schedule 3 or 4 of those games EVERY YEAR...consistently!!! Yes the attendance will SUCK for those games...gonna have to bite the bullet for a few years. And guess what the attendance sucks anyway so what are you losing? Nothing! Just gaining an easy win!!! GUARANTEE yourself a bunch of 6 win seasons in a row. Go to 5 or 6 or 7 bowl games in a row. Build up CONFIDENCE among the local Syracuse fans that Syracuse Football is a bowl team every year!!! THEN sprinkle in 1..yes just 1... OOC game vs a USC or a Penn St or some legit team...like 7 or 8 years from now. But no more scheduling these Big 10 Schools and such OOC. It's too much! This notion that SU needs to play a killer OOC schedule is silly. It's dumb because we lose the majority of the time. It hurts the program in reaching a bowl game. You don't get brownie points or extra credit for playing a tough schedule. We used to laugh at VT all those years ago for there OOC schedule and how it was a joke...but they built a program that way and then started playing the Alabama's of the world to open a season and such. That's the blueprint and the road map back to success. Yes it means a bunch of years with boring games in the Dome vs bad teams...but so what!!!!! It's about compiling wins!! Going to bowls on a consistent basis. Telling recruits you come here and you will play in a top conference, you will play vs the likes of FSU and Clemson every year. You will go to a bowl every year...and so on and so forth. That's the sales pitch! We don't have that sales pitch when we schedule ourselves to be 0-2 or 1-3 most years by a little after Labor Day!!! It's about Wins and Losses at the end of the day and for SU and where the SU football program is right now...nobody is looking for "quality wins" or "style points"! Schedule WINS! And from there everything else falls into place...attendance, better recruits, bowl games, more money coming into the football program,...etc!!

That plan is the death knell of SU football UNLESS, the NJ games are completely canceled going forward and replaced by similar type teams in the Dome.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[JeremyCuse]

That plan is the death knell of SU football UNLESS, the NJ games are completely canceled going forward and replaced by similar type teams in the Dome.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

Exactly, playing nothing but scrubs at home OOC and the only big game being in NJ will have attendance even worse then it is now.

 

[Stern]

Exactly, playing nothing but scrubs at home OOC and the only big game being in NJ will have attendance even worse then it is now.

The attendance won't improve until the wins come first. Pad the WINS!! Pile up years and years of 6 and 7 win seasons (hopefully more) by playing nobody's. Then attendance will grow. People don't pay money to watch a team lose or a team that is a loser more years than not. Sorry its the reality of it.

 

[rrlbees]

The attendance won't improve until the wins come first. Pad the WINS!! Pile up years and years of 6 and 7 win seasons (hopefully more) by playing nobody's. Then attendance will grow. People don't pay money to watch a team lose or a team that is a loser more years than not. Sorry its the reality of it.

Read what your saying. Then ask yourself, where is it easier to win, the Dome or NJ.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[Stern]

Read what your saying. Then ask yourself, where is it easier to win, the Dome or NJ.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

Exactly, playing nothing but scrubs at home OOC and the only big game being in NJ will have attendance even worse then it is now.

So its worse in the short term but eventually will get better when the program has a history of going to bowls year in and year out. It's about changing the perception SU is a losing program. It's about going to a bowl game 5, 6, 7 years in a row. Building up a program, The attendance sucks now, so it sucks a little more in the next few years...is that really a big deal? Short term pain for long-term gain!

 

[JeremyCuse]

The attendance won't improve until the wins come first. Pad the WINS!! Pile up years and years of 6 and 7 win seasons (hopefully more) by playing nobody's. Then attendance will grow. People don't pay money to watch a team lose or a team that is a loser more years than not. Sorry its the reality of it.

You have to win conference games to get bowl eligible, going into the ACC 3-1 playing 3 nobodys isn't going to help attendance if were getting blown out every other week in conference. You have to pad the team and win games the casual fan cares about. Your not going to get the casual fan to flood the dome for Wagner, Stony Brook, Villanova, Umass, Toledo, etc. Your theory was tried by Rutgers and after some modest success the smoke and mirrors has been exposed and both there team and attendance are in the trash.

 

[JeremyCuse]

So its worse in the short term but eventually will get better when the program has a history of going to bowls year in and year out. It's about changing the perception SU is a losing program. It's about going to a bowl game 5, 6, 7 years in a row. Building up a program, The attendance sucks now, so it sucks a little more in the next few years...is that really a big deal? Short term pain for long-term gain!

Thats the same plan Rutgers tried, go over to there board and see how its working now.

 

[rrlbees]

So its worse in the short term but eventually will get better when the program has a history of going to bowls year in and year out. It's about changing the perception SU is a losing program. It's about going to a bowl game 5, 6, 7 years in a row. Building up a program, The attendance sucks now, so it sucks a little more in the next few years...is that really a big deal? Short term pain for long-term gain!

Do you get what we're saying? You keep screaming that we need more wins. Fine, then you need to get rid of NJ. It's easier to win that game or something similar in the Dome than NJ. You're either not reading what you write or talking out of both sides of your mouth.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

 

[Stern]

You have to win conference games to get bowl eligible, going into the ACC 3-1 playing 3 nobodys isn't going to help attendance if were getting blown out every other week in conference. You have to pad the team and win games the casual fan cares about. Your not going to get the casual fan to flood the dome for Wagner, Stony Brook, Villanova, Umass, Toledo, etc.

We aren't getting the casual fans for Pittsburgh now either! That's a problem!!!! The fans have given up completely. The attendance sucks now, it will suck going forward staying on the same path we are on now, it will suck if we tried things the way I want them to be tried.

Of course you need to win conference games, who is saying otherwise? But I would like to know if in a down year we only win 2 or 3 conference games we still go to a bowl!!! That's the point! We aren't competing for national championships, so the goal is 6 wins at worst every year and a bowl. Make the path to 6 as easy as possible! The attendance is going to suck either way, so might as well get to your 6 wins.