How to Fix SU Football?

[HRE Otto IV]

Yea if Dino wins 7 i think it would be a bit of a disappointment based off the start and the Sr. 3 year starting QB, but Syracuse can’t be firing coaches with back to back 7 win seasons as low of a bar that sounds. These last 5 games are going to be a huge lens into the future of Babers at Syracuse. As mentioned before it’s a bit disappointing, especially if none of the wins come vs Clemson/UNC and let’s see how we perform vs FSU. 7 wins with 3 blowouts to those teams will be a big blah. If we could find a way to compete and see improvements in areas he has consistently lacked it wouldn’t be a problem, but we s see. I do think stability counts for something.

Just putting a name out there but Curt Cignetti would be an outstanding candidate. for HC, but he’s 62 years old. If he was 10 years younger i would say he would have been a perfect candidate.

IMO it depends on how you get to 7-5 and how long Dino’s contract is.

If we are 7-2 and Dino has 2 years or less left then that next Monday we should bump him to 3 years. Don’t care if we lose the next 3 games.

If we go 7-5 with an FSU W, I would do the same.

But if we go 7-5 with 2 bad Ls and he has one year or No years left, IMO you move on.

6 Ws with an FSU L should be fired.

 

[CousCuse]

I think Rich Rod should be in the top 3 coaches for Syracuse to get, maybe no.1.

 

[RF2044]

Yea if Dino wins 7 i think it would be a bit of a disappointment based off the start and the Sr. 3 year starting QB, but Syracuse can’t be firing coaches with back to back 7 win seasons as low of a bar that sounds. These last 5 games are going to be a huge lens into the future of Babers at Syracuse. As mentioned before it’s a bit disappointing, especially if none of the wins come vs Clemson/UNC and let’s see how we perform vs FSU. 7 wins with 3 blowouts to those teams will be a big blah. If we could find a way to compete and see improvements in areas he has consistently lacked it wouldn’t be a problem, but we s see. I do think stability counts for something.

Just putting a name out there but Curt Cignetti would be an outstanding candidate. for HC, but he’s 62 years old. If he was 10 years younger i would say he would have been a perfect candidate.

Agreed.

7 wins would be a big disappointment, with the hot start, and would not capitalize on having a very good senior college QB.

8 wins would be a good season, and get us to a quality bowl.

9 wins would be a very good season, and get us to a good bowl.

Lots of football left to be played.

As GoSU96 has outlined, the back 5 games set up favorably, with no top flight QBs to worry about, and several poor defenses we'll be facing. Doesn't mean that they are sure wins / easy games, but it sets up favorably,

 

[storange]

Completely nuts.

Old players are almost the funniest - they walk around wondering where all the kids from RFA and other local schools are.

What I’ve learned in just two weeks from posters here.
Two Weeks Ago
Coach Beck - Head Coach in waiting, but probably will be scooped up by Georgia or Bama as their new head coach..
Coach Long- Defensive genius , could stop any offense on earth with ease, Probably Chiefs or Eagles next DC.
Garret Shrader- Best duel threat QB in the land.
Defense - half the squad will be NFL starters next year.
Our WRs- Fast rising stars in the making.

Today
Beck- Overrated, has no clue.
Long-Over the Hill. 3-3-5 is garbage.
Garret Shrader- Should have left him at Miss St. Wouldn’t start for Colgate.
Defense- Swiss Cheese endorsements on the way.
WRs- See GS and Colgate.

 

[im4cuse]

I'm old enough to remember beating Clemson 41-0 so maybe I look at things differently than you do. We came close to FSU a couple of years ago and they got better and we stuck with Dino.

Me too. We also won bowl games against Georgia Colorado OSU and Arizona. We didn’t always suck. Again what program tolerates 18-42??

 

[IthacaMatt]

We don't succumb to blow outs by Clemson and we've played Miami all of one time in this conference, and it was a competitive game.

Go runs these stats better than me on wins and losses and who've we've played.

Come on Bayside, you know the truth behind what he's saying:

• 38-3 last year vs. Florida State
• 41-3 vs. Louisville two years ago
• 31-6 vs. UNC in the season opener COVID year, along w/ a 30-0 loss to Louisville again
• 2019, coming off the 10 win Dungy season, 63-20 loss to a bad Maryland team, followed by a 41-6 loss at home vs. Clemson (I thought they never blow us out?), followed by losses where we gave up 58 points to freaking Boston College, and 56 to Louisville.
• Even in the 10 win season in 2018, we are sitting at 8 wins, playing at home on national TV vs. Notre Dame, and they blow us out 36-3.
• In 2017, Dungy's junior year, most of our losses were close ones, except 56-10 to Louisville AGAIN, losing 42-14 to Boston College and giving up 64 points to Wake Forest, both of which were home losses.
• 2016: Losing to Louisville 62-28 in game 2 at home, followed by a 25 point loss AT HOME to South Florida in game 3, 54-0 to Clemson, 45-14 vs. Florida State, giving up 50 points to Notre Dame and 76 points (!!) to Pitt in the season finale.

It's a wonder anyone still comes to our football games, to be honest.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Yea if Dino wins 7 i think it would be a bit of a disappointment based off the start and the Sr. 3 year starting QB, but Syracuse can’t be firing coaches with back to back 7 win seasons as low of a bar that sounds. These last 5 games are going to be a huge lens into the future of Babers at Syracuse. As mentioned before it’s a bit disappointing, especially if none of the wins come vs Clemson/UNC and let’s see how we perform vs FSU. 7 wins with 3 blowouts to those teams will be a big blah. If we could find a way to compete and see improvements in areas he has consistently lacked it wouldn’t be a problem, but we s see. I do think stability counts for something.

Just putting a name out there but Curt Cignetti would be an outstanding candidate. for HC, but he’s 62 years old. If he was 10 years younger i would say he would have been a perfect candidate.

We will know from possession 1 how Saturday's game will go.

 

[storange]

Come on Bayside, you know the truth behind what he's saying:

• 38-3 last year vs. Florida State
• 41-3 vs. Louisville two years ago
• 31-6 vs. UNC in the season opener COVID year, along w/ a 30-0 loss to Louisville again
• 2019, coming off the 10 win Dungy season, 63-20 loss to a bad Maryland team, followed by a 41-6 loss at home vs. Clemson (I thought they never blow us out?), followed by losses where we gave up 58 points to freaking Boston College, and 56 to Louisville.
• Even in the 10 win season in 2018, we are sitting at 8 wins, playing at home on national TV vs. Notre Dame, and they blow us out 36-3.
• In 2017, Dungy's junior year, most of our losses were close ones, except 56-10 to Louisville AGAIN, losing 42-14 to Boston College and giving up 64 points to Wake Forest, both of which were home losses.
• 2016: Losing to Louisville 62-28 in game 2 at home, followed by a 25 point loss AT HOME to South Florida in game 3, 54-0 to Clemson, 45-14 vs. Florida State, giving up 50 points to Notre Dame and 76 points (!!) to Pitt in the season finale.

It's a wonder anyone still comes to our football games, to be honest.

Cherry picking our worst games.

 

[Bayside44]

Come on Bayside, you know the truth behind what he's saying:

• 38-3 last year vs. Florida State
• 41-3 vs. Louisville two years ago
• 31-6 vs. UNC in the season opener COVID year, along w/ a 30-0 loss to Louisville again
• 2019, coming off the 10 win Dungy season, 63-20 loss to a bad Maryland team, followed by a 41-6 loss at home vs. Clemson (I thought they never blow us out?), followed by losses where we gave up 58 points to freaking Boston College, and 56 to Louisville.
• Even in the 10 win season in 2018, we are sitting at 8 wins, playing at home on national TV vs. Notre Dame, and they blow us out 36-3.
• In 2017, Dungy's junior year, most of our losses were close ones, except 56-10 to Louisville AGAIN, losing 42-14 to Boston College and giving up 64 points to Wake Forest, both of which were home losses.
• 2016: Losing to Louisville 62-28 in game 2 at home, followed by a 25 point loss AT HOME to South Florida in game 3, 54-0 to Clemson, 45-14 vs. Florida State, giving up 50 points to Notre Dame and 76 points (!!) to Pitt in the season finale.

It's a wonder anyone still comes to our football games, to be honest.

That's not what he said, at least be accurate.

Otherwise yeah, we lost games we weren't favored in. Trying to go fast can lead to some blowouts. The program is a 500 - ish type place, can still have good seasons. Like any other sport can we can use some breaks (2018 UNC failing to close out a game) and not have breaks go against us (Clemson in general).

Dino Part 2 isn't as interesting but think they're figured out a more competitive formula.

 

[Scooch]

If I see one more reference to a "CEO" I'm gonna lose it.

Let me be clear: there is no such thing as a "CEO" head coach as opposed to another kind.

Head coaches work extremely hard and are involved in every aspect of the program. They all delegate to their coordinators AND have the responsibility to sign off on their plans, as well as assist in constructing them.

The only thing that occasionally occurs is an "Emeritus" type head coach. Think 80+ year old Paterno and Bowden.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Cherry picking our worst games.

He said this team is generally competitive.
That's precisely what I was doing - pointing out the MANY times we absolutely QUIT as a team.

It happens at least a couple times every single year - even in recent times, not just the ancient past.

That was the point.

 

[Chip]

If we go 7-5 back to back years, Dino isn't getting fired. I have no clue what the contract situation is, I think Thamel leaked something at one point, but we're private and can spin any yarn we want about it.

We may be individually disappointed by how we ended up at 7-5 each of the past two years, but he isn't going anywhere if it happens.

6-6, he will have almost no one defending him.

 

[Scooch]

If we go 7-5 back to back years, Dino isn't getting fired. I have no clue what the contract situation is, I think Thamel leaked something at one point, but we're private and can spin any yarn we want about it.

We may be individually disappointed by how we ended up at 7-5 each of the past two years, but he isn't going anywhere if it happens.

6-6, he will have almost no one defending him.

He'll probably be back even at 6-6.

Maybe this year we can play a bowl at a lousy baseball stadium on the moon.

 

[BomberOrange]

Guys, we are 4-2, not 1-5. It‘s still possible we could have one of our better seasons of this century. The 2001 and 2018 teams started 4-2, as well.

I know UNC (who literally may be playoff level good) cleaned our clock, but there is a lot of football left to play.

Best post I have seen all week...sure we will be 4-3 after Saturday, but there is a lot of football left.

 

[Chip]

He'll probably be back even at 6-6.

Maybe this year we can play a bowl at a lousy baseball stadium on the moon.

It would be less slippery. One would think.

I do enjoy that stadium for baseball, albeit expensive. But closing it for a few months and then opening back up for one day? Yeah, no thank you.

 

[CousCuse]

If we go 7-5 back to back years, Dino isn't getting fired. I have no clue what the contract situation is, I think Thamel leaked something at one point, but we're private and can spin any yarn we want about it.

We may be individually disappointed by how we ended up at 7-5 each of the past two years, but he isn't going anywhere if it happens.

6-6, he will have almost no one defending him.

Is 7-5 good for a contract extension? 4 more years?

 

[Chip]

We will know from possession 1 how Saturday's game will go.

I'd say from possession 0. I won money last Saturday, assuming I will again this Saturday. Last week's line was too small, this week's is too. It's not personal, it's business. I'd be perfectly happy losing it, but don't think I will.

Once we get this Saturday out of the way, the important part of the season, and a run to 10 wins (including the bowl game) begins.

 

[Chip]

Is 7-5 good a contract extension? 4 more years.

You don't say anything publicly. If asked, you just say Dino is going to be here a long time.

Everyone knows things change quickly in this sport, no one will care if "a long time" only means 12 more months.

 

[GoSU96]

The premise of this thread is wrong.

The program doesn’t need to be fixed, it needs continued improvement.

If SU is going to move from mid tier ACC to upper tier then prerequisite is better offensive line.

The last two seasons there have been 8 losses.

SU is 0-5 vs teams 1-20 in the Sagarin ratings. (UNC, Clemson, FSU, ND, Clemson) In all five of those games the offense held to less than 300 yds.

Average score 14-35, 246 vs 453 yds.

SU is 4-3 vs teams 23 - 60. Wins - Purdue, NCSt, Purdue, Lville. Losses -Minn, Wake, Pitt

Average Score 27-22, 385 vs 367 yds

Those three losses are all unique. Minn(24) 20-28. outplayed them statistically. 447 to 215 total yds. That’s more than FSU outgained SU last year. Pick 6, KOR, failure to generate points to go with yds.

Pitt (32) 9-19 with CDRW. Held to under 300 yds by an excellent Pitt defense.

Wake (34) 35-45 Sam Hartman. Coming off of the gauntlet defense didn’t play well. One of two games in the last two years gave up more than 500 yds. Offense did their job 477yds

7 games vs 88 or worse. 7-0. Average score 43-11. 496 vs 224 yds

This isn’t a bad program that needs to be fixed. It needs focused improvement to the roster and program infrastructure. Get to the point where the 0-5 is 1-4/2-3, the 4-3 is 5-2/6-1.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

If we go 7-5 back to back years, Dino isn't getting fired. I have no clue what the contract situation is, I think Thamel leaked something at one point, but we're private and can spin any yarn we want about it.

We may be individually disappointed by how we ended up at 7-5 each of the past two years, but he isn't going anywhere if it happens.

6-6, he will have almost no one defending him.

It would be ironic if the money from Yankee Stadium was the buyout money.

Not all 7-5 scenarios are the same. For instance we beat FSU. Or we suffer a major injury.

That being said I think we go 8-4 or 9-3.

If this is the last year of his contract why bring him back at 7-5?

If he has one more year and we have 2 more uncompetitive Ls while going 7-5, why let him finish out? It would be delaying the inevitable.

If he has 2 or more years, any 7-5 is fine.

 

[Deleted member 8116]

Is 7-5 good for a contract extension? 4 more years?

No. He has been a terrible recruiter, so a 7-5 record should not be enough when you consider both. He is complaining about depth and they still have half a season to go. If they can 9-3/8-4 and we see improvement with recruiting as well; then ok.

 

[Millhouse]

IMO it depends on how you get to 7-5 and how long Dino’s contract is.

If we are 7-2 and Dino has 2 years or less left then that next Monday we should bump him to 3 years. Don’t care if we lose the next 3 games.

If we go 7-5 with an FSU W, I would do the same.

But if we go 7-5 with 2 bad Ls and he has one year or No years left, IMO you move on.

6 Ws with an FSU L should be fired.

This is weirdly contingent on one or two games

 

[Millhouse]

The premise of this thread is wrong.

The program doesn’t need to be fixed, it needs continued improvement.

If SU is going to move from mid tier ACC to upper tier then prerequisite is better offensive line.

The last two seasons there have been 8 losses.

SU is 0-5 vs teams 1-20 in the Sagarin ratings. (UNC, Clemson, FSU, ND, Clemson) In all five of those games the offense held to less than 300 yds.

Average score 14-35, 246 vs 453 yds.

SU is 4-3 vs teams 23 - 60. Wins - Purdue, NCSt, Purdue, Lville. Losses -Minn, Wake, Pitt

Average Score 27-22, 385 vs 367 yds

Those three losses are all unique. Minn(24) 20-28. outplayed them statistically. 447 to 215 total yds. That’s more than FSU outgained SU last year. Pick 6, KOR, failure to generate points to go with yds.

Pitt (32) 9-19 with CDRW. Held to under 300 yds by an excellent Pitt defense.

Wake (34) 35-45 Sam Hartman. Coming off of the gauntlet defense didn’t play well. One of two games in the last two years gave up more than 500 yds. Offense did their job 477yds

7 games vs 88 or worse. 7-0. Average score 43-11. 496 vs 224 yds

This isn’t a bad program that needs to be fixed. It needs focused improvement to the roster and program infrastructure. Get to the point where the 0-5 is 1-4/2-3, the 4-3 is 5-2/6-1.

It's boring to talk about and football guy wants it to be more complicated but get a guy who can throw the ball and make his decisions about getting rid of it quickly, they can be more competitive against good teams and sometimes win a shootout

There is no reason we can't find a guy who can make decisions and throw accurately in the transfer era. Maybe he's short, maybe he didn't have a cannon, maybe he's Chinese, whatever, they can do it

Right there the ceiling raises

 

[GoSU96]

No. He has been a terrible recruiter, so a 7-5 record should not be enough when you consider both. He is complaining about depth and they still have half a season to go. If they can 9-3/8-4 and we see improvement with recruiting as well; then ok.

Terrible?

Four kids with eligibility are on NFL rosters and four got recruited off for NIL deals from just last year.

 

[007]

6-6, he will have almost no one defending him.

Except maybe the guy that makes the decision. Playing in a 13th game and building off of last year is the publically stated criteria.