Syracuse Budget Report and Athletics | Syracusefan.com

Syracuse Budget Report and Athletics

Crusty

Living Legend
Joined
May 21, 2012
Messages
13,388
Like
18,563
During our chat with Stephen Bailey, he passed along the link to the SU Senate Committee on Budget and Fiscal Affairs (SBC) Part II, which includes comments on the Athletics Department. Here is the link.

I have put some pertinent comments in boldface and I inserted a comment in brackets.

Athletics:

History and Background

There is likely no more controversial topic on campus than the role of athletics, generally, and its relationship to the University budget, specifically. As noted by our new Chancellor, there has also never been a comprehensive statement from the Administration of the University as to the policy towards athletics. The various views on campus are wide reaching ranging from those who think athletics are of fundamental importance to the success of the University to those who think we should drop athletics entirely and focus solely on academics. Our perspective is that most of the University community appreciates Athletics as a significant part of the fabric of our University. However, we are uncomfortable as to the perception of how it is managed and how it blends into the school’s overall mission. It is interesting that at the time of this writing, a story has been aired on ESPN about the rise and fall of the Big East conference that may shed some light on some of the issues we present. The recent decision by a regional office of the National Labor Relations Board has further implications for the cost of athletics at private universities.


Revenue Neutral? Contributory? Net recipient?

The athletic program at Syracuse has evolved significantly over time. Expenditures have grown and expanded as programs aspire to be the best. The New York Times recently reported that the growth of athletic programs spending nationally have exceeded expenditures for teaching, research and public service (“Colleges Increasing Spending on Sports Faster than Academics, Report Finds,” New York Times, April 7, 2014). There is impression on campus that the Athletic program may be drawing financial support from the Academic centers. This “feeling” is exacerbated by the absence of transparency of its budget and the role athletics plays in the overall budget process. With the advent of RCM and the inclusion of athletics as a responsibility center, some of these concerns were addressed as Athletics was taxed and contributed its portion of the participation allocation. During discussions with the SBC, it became apparent that Athletics is actually a net expense to the University overall, in that subvention is required to balance the books; that, in fact, the athletic program has a negative fund balance as spending outpaces revenues.


Beast of the East?

This committee cannot help but wonder whether, in an effort to remain competitive at the highest levels of college athletics, we have entered an arena where we must continue to get bigger to survive.That is similar to some business models where a contraction or a leveling off of growth will lead to the eventual downfall and demolition of the enterprise. There is an appearance that we must continue to expand our facilities, build new ways to generate revenues, and continue to expand our Athletic Department or be trampled by the competition. It seems clear that the move to the ACC was required by some of this thinking. The ESPN story and recent reports that a new stadium was proposed also seem to confirm this assumption.


Athletics cost shift

The committee was told that some of the financial costs of having student/athletes on campus have been shifted to the home college of each athlete. This creates an interesting budget issue in our opinion. For example, if a football player on a full scholarship resides in the College of Arts and Science, the tuition revenue is allocated to A&S, but there is a corresponding offset to the revenue because of the scholarship being counted in the expenses of the A&S budget.Yet, the tax is applied to the gross revenue, and participation is applied based on A&S’s overall revenues to total revenues. In effect, A&S will pay a tax and participation for the student/athlete, but get no corresponding cash flow offset for having done so. This results in a net cost to the school instead of just being revenue and expense neutral. The revenue that is generated by athletics remains in the Athletic Department’s budget. Although the cost shift makes some sense from an accounting perspective, what this effectively does is shift some of the cost of the athletic program to the home school or college thereby freeing funds to be spent on other athletic needs.

[Are they saying that they want the burden expense (“tax”) absorbed by the Athletics Department? How are other non-athletic scholarships treated?]

Implications of the NLRB decision

The recent decision by a regional office of the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB)
that Northwestern University football players were employees and had the right to
unionize has serious potential implications for the Athletic Departments at private
universities. Without delving into the merits of the decision or its prospects upon an
expected appeal, the question of whether student/athletes in revenue-generating sports
should share in the revenues they help to generate has been thrust into public discourse.
Should the decision be sustained, it would likely disrupt the funding of non-revenue
sports (a.k.a. Olympic sports) as more resources would be allocated to football and
basketball, the two primary revenue-generating sports. Of course, questions of equality in
compensation for the Olympic sports, especially through Title IX, would need to be
addressed. While it is premature to speculate as to the final resolution of this decision,
Syracuse University should begin planning in the eventuality that the NLRB decision is
upheld. (See Academe Today, March 26, 2014)

Final Comments and Suggestions:

Some policy statement on Athletics needs to be determined and communicated to the
campus as a whole that can explain the philosophy behind athletics, its expected
contribution to the overall academic mission of the University, and the way in which it
will be held accountable for its specific mission. It would seem that the continued costs
to be competitive in an expanded (and expanding) ACC will need to come from funds outside of the existing academic programs and accounted for separately. It is unlikely that athletics will not be a part of the University’s plan as there are countless ways that sports help to make SU what it is.
However, a more clearly defined financing mechanism should be enacted that removes the apparent distrust of the existing system and puts the true cost of athletics squarely on the shoulders of the unit that not only generates the revenues, but also incurs the costs.

ACC benefit to enrollment
Lastly, the question of whether Syracuse University’s membership in the ACC would benefit its recruitment of students in the Southeast has been assumed. Data from the Enrollment Office has shown an increase in the number of undergraduate students matriculating from this region to have grown over the past several years. However, it appears that this increase predates ACC membership and is likely the result of enhanced recruiting efforts on the part of Admissions. The SBC has also questioned whether the added costs associated with travel to campus results in greater discount rates to entice this enrollment growth. Finally, the Ad Hoc Committee report “Major Effects of the Athletics Program at Syracuse University” called into question whether athletic team success influenced the enrollment decisions of prospective students. (See Ad Hoc Report to the Senate, April 2006)
 
It always strikes me that academic folks really, really underestimate the positive affect sports has on the perception of the university.

Also - why would you expect the enrollment boost to come from the SE? Seems like a bad assumption from the get go.
 
TheCusian said:
It always strikes me that academic folks really, really underestimate the positive affect sports has on the perception of the university. Also - why would you expect the enrollment boost to come from the SE? Seems like a bad assumption from the get go.

Increased name recognition via sports and games played down there.
 
rrlbees said:
Increased name recognition via sports and games played down there.

If it were pre-ESPN, pre-Internet that might make a bigger difference. I'd venture a guess that most people who watch sports have heard of Syracuse.

The increased name recognition would come from increased TV/Media coverage nationally, not regionally.
 
If it were pre-ESPN, pre-Internet that might make a bigger difference. I'd venture a guess that most people who watch sports have heard of Syracuse.

The increased name recognition would come from increased TV/Media coverage nationally, not regionally.

I would have to guess we will have more regional coverage than national on a average basis. There are definitely students in NC, SC, Georgia, that may consider Cuse now that we have a more regular presence locally. TV news, Sports, etc.
 
Wow, the bitterness and hostility are apparent.

Denying that entry into the ACC has helped make SU more attractive to potential students is particularly embarrassing.

The committee is behaving like a bunch of dumb babies. If their concern was the lack of accountability for where the money is going and how it is spent, they would have made a worthwhile analysis.
 
jr4750 said:
I would have to guess we will have more regional coverage than national on a average basis. There are definitely students in NC, SC, Georgia, that may consider Cuse now that we have a more regular presence locally. TV news, Sports, etc.

True.

I guess if they are pinning their hopes on increased SE attendance being the thing that matters most? Seems tenuous.
 
Wow, the bitterness and hostility are apparent.

Denying that entry into the ACC has helped make SU more attractive to potential students is particularly embarrassing.

The committee is behaving like a bunch of dumb babies. If their concern was the lack of accountability for where the money is going and how it is spent, they would have made a worthwhile analysis.


Interesting and concerning.
 
It's a little disappointing that they don't use other schools' practices as comparisons.

"The practice of allocating common costs causes confusion and makes it appear that responsibility centers are operating in deficit."

Maybe they meant to say that the way SU allocates common costs causes confusion etc but they said that the practice of allocating common costs causes confusion

cost accounting is very hard and there might be some very good reason for these professors to gripe

"However, we are uncomfortable as to the perception of how it is managed and how it blends into the school’s overall mission."

Uncomfortable as to the perception? What the hell does that mean? How does a committee of professors not catch that gibberish?

I wonder if this committee wants the athletic department to keep all the revenues from ACC TV? I doubt that.

"Those familiar with admissions processes on the SBC indicate that there may be untapped potential for deploying small amounts of merit aid to capture middle class students who require lower overall discount rates, but might be attracted by the prestige of such an award from this institution over an otherwise cheaper but less well ranked institution. Has this been studied at SU or elsewhere? "

Can you imagine handing in a paper to these professors asking them if someone has studied something?

I give them a D on this draft
 
It always strikes me that academic folks really, really underestimate the positive affect sports has on the perception of the university.

Also - why would you expect the enrollment boost to come from the SE? Seems like a bad assumption from the get go.

By the same token, Athletics scandals can often have a negative effect on student enrollments. PSU took a big hit because of the Sandusky mess. UNC's academic reputation has suffered because of the paper-writing scandal. SU's rep as a "party school" comes in part from big-time athletics.

No doubt, athletics can help recruit students but the impact is easy to overstate and the longterm impact of big-time athletics on a school's culture is not always a net positive.
 
Couple of things people need to remember: many SU folks didn't like RCM budgeting and Cantor's thoughts on budgets/spending. Gross, as we know from the MetLife contract talk, has a habit of making statements without providing detail. To many at SU, they see the news about how the move to the ACC has increased revenues tremendously, they hear about these great marketing/branding ventures (NY's College Team), and now they hear that Athletics is still losing money. That's why they are hostile and bitter.

Tough for many faculty to be understanding when the guy who says he's not making money leaves the meeting and hops in his Porsche, when you turn on the tv and see several SU staff behind the bench at MSG, or when the IRS report says that the w. lax coach is in the top 5 for highest paid employees.
 
Wow. I have to say that this is extremely discouraging and unbelievably short sighted. My personal story may be a complete exception...but I doubt it.

I am from Albany, NY. When I was applying for college (and then for law school), the athletic programs played a major role in where I sent applications...SU, Texas, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, Minnesota, North Carolina were the spots that I applied along with SUNY Albany because my folks asked me to apply there.

I chose SU because of the excellent undergraduate rep but also the Athletics program. I attended SU from 89-93. Great basketball, great football and great lacrosse.

For law school I applied to a bunch of major athletic schools: SU, Miami, Pitt, Nebraska, Kentucky, Houston. I ended up selecting Albany Law because of their academics but primarily because it was where my parents lived.

Full circle, I ultimately had the opportunity to move back to Syracuse. The number one reason I did so was because of the ability to regularly attend games at The Dome. I have five season tickets for football and three for basketball.

I can assure you that the reason I came here and so many others I went to school with was the whole package with sports playing a major role.

Although I did not go to Newhouse, the University should be very careful about taking a contradictory approach to athletics as that so often feeds one of the top Communications programs in the country. It gives students hands on training, opportunities, etc. that they may not have elsewhere. Many go to Newhouse so they can train at a great school with major athletics at their doorstep. If that dissipates, who knows what happens regarding applications.

There is a miscellaneous line in there about the positives the program brings...however, that appears to be targeted in negative fashion the rest of the way.

My wife is extraordinarily intelligent. She got her undergraduate diploma from Washington University in Saint Louis...a phenomenal school as the new Chancellor is aware.

In the approximate ten years of marriage I am not sure I recall anyone coming up to her to talk about Wash U. On the flip side, I was confronted on a twelve person cutter off the coast of British Columbia/Washington State about GMac because I was wearing knit SU hat on the water.

The balance sheet does not always tell it all. Certainly, there should be accountability, a close monitor and a solid plan for the athletic department, funding it and what to do with its revenue. I agree one thousand percent. However the tone of the original story was really disheartening to backers of the program, myself included.

SUOrange44
 
If it were pre-ESPN, pre-Internet that might make a bigger difference. I'd venture a guess that most people who watch sports have heard of Syracuse.

The increased name recognition would come from increased TV/Media coverage nationally, not regionally.
I am not so sure about that. In NC we get the ACC Sports shows and there is quite a bit of exposure. I would also say that this area is quite parochial.
 
The athletic program at Syracuse has evolved significantly over time. Expenditures have grown and expanded as programs aspire to be the best. The New York Times recently reported that the growth of athletic programs spending nationally have exceeded expenditures for teaching, research and public service (“Colleges Increasing Spending on Sports Faster than Academics, Report Finds,” New York Times, April 7, 2014). There is impression on campus that the Athletic program may be drawing financial support from the Academic centers. This “feeling” is exacerbated by the absence of transparency of its budget and the role athletics plays in the overall budget process. With the advent of RCM and the inclusion of athletics as a responsibility center, some of these concerns were addressed as Athletics was taxed and contributed its portion of the participation allocation. During discussions with the SBC, it became apparent that Athletics is actually a net expense to the University overall, in that subvention is required to balance the books; that, in fact, the athletic program has a negative fund balance as spending outpaces revenues.


How is this any different that all other aspects of the University? Seems like there is a arms race on the academic side just as there is on the athletic side. Or am I imagining all those new buildings and elaborate new dorms?
 
SU's identity is inextricably tied to sports. The bias in the writing makes me wonder whether they underreport revenue and exaggerate costs. Their analysis on the consequences of the NLRB decision is two-dimensional based on conjecture. I wonder if the people who wrote this wish SU were more like a Colgate or Bard. Because that's where it's going to end up if SU gets out of the sports business. SU does not distinguish itself in STEM and the most prominent program, Newhouse, is so tied to athletics.

If you read the full report, it's obvious SU faces serious challenges. The mistake is seeing athletics as part of the problem, not part of the solution.
 
I have been a Syracuse fan since I was born, thanks to my dad.

The only school I ever wanted to go to was SU. And once I received the acceptance letter, that was the only school that mattered.

Administration is delusional if they think athletics doesn't play a role in attracting students to school.
 
TheCusian said:
If it were pre-ESPN, pre-Internet that might make a bigger difference. I'd venture a guess that most people who watch sports have heard of Syracuse. The increased name recognition would come from increased TV/Media coverage nationally, not regionally.

But everyone is a sports fanatic. I'm sure our increased exposure down there would increase the visibility to the average hs student.
 
Wow. I have to say that this is extremely discouraging and unbelievably short sighted. My personal story may be a complete exception...but I doubt it.

I am from Albany, NY. When I was applying for college (and then for law school), the athletic programs played a major role in where I sent applications...SU, Texas, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, Minnesota, North Carolina were the spots that I applied along with SUNY Albany because my folks asked me to apply there.

I chose SU because of the excellent undergraduate rep but also the Athletics program. I attended SU from 89-93. Great basketball, great football and great lacrosse.

For law school I applied to a bunch of major athletic schools: SU, Miami, Pitt, Nebraska, Kentucky, Houston. I ended up selecting Albany Law because of their academics but primarily because it was where my parents lived.

Full circle, I ultimately had the opportunity to move back to Syracuse. The number one reason I did so was because of the ability to regularly attend games at The Dome. I have five season tickets for football and three for basketball.

I can assure you that the reason I came here and so many others I went to school with was the whole package with sports playing a major role.

Although I did not go to Newhouse, the University should be very careful about taking a contradictory approach to athletics as that so often feeds one of the top Communications programs in the country. It gives students hands on training, opportunities, etc. that they may not have elsewhere. Many go to Newhouse so they can train at a great school with major athletics at their doorstep. If that dissipates, who knows what happens regarding applications.

There is a miscellaneous line in there about the positives the program brings...however, that appears to be targeted in negative fashion the rest of the way.

My wife is extraordinarily intelligent. She got her undergraduate diploma from Washington University in Saint Louis...a phenomenal school as the new Chancellor is aware.

In the approximate ten years of marriage I am not sure I recall anyone coming up to her to talk about Wash U. On the flip side, I was confronted on a twelve person cutter off the coast of British Columbia/Washington State about GMac because I was wearing knit SU hat on the water.

The balance sheet does not always tell it all. Certainly, there should be accountability, a close monitor and a solid plan for the athletic department, funding it and what to do with its revenue. I agree one thousand percent. However the tone of the original story was really disheartening to backers of the program, myself included.

SUOrange44
How come all of our wives are smarter than we are?
 
"During discussions with the SBC, it became apparent that Athletics is actually a net expense to the University overall, in that subvention is required to balance the books; that, in fact, the athletic program has a negative fund balance as spending outpaces revenues."
If this is the case, now that we are receiving $15-20 million more in ACC money plus whatever is brought in from our NYC games, then why wasn’t this an issue prior to us joining the ACC when we were bringing in so much less? I truly and honestly might just "not be getting it", lord knows im not the brightest bulb in the batch, but I just don't see the drastic change in expenditures from when we were in the Big Eas t2 years ago (receiving $15 million less). The Gaits and tennis coaches salaries of the world are a drop in the bucket compared to the numbers were talking about.
IF we are now having to take into account paying for scholarships in some fashion (taxes or tuition etc) that were once being picked up by other departments for the previous 30 plus years of modern college athletics, then how was it financially feasible for our Athletics Department to exist at all for so long? What took the financial hit at the university, how did that affect the University as a whole, and why is it stopping now? Could the cause of this be internal budget fights with other departments trying to get their hands on some of the ACC money?
 
"During discussions with the SBC, it became apparent that Athletics is actually a net expense to the University overall, in that subvention is required to balance the books; that, in fact, the athletic program has a negative fund balance as spending outpaces revenues."
If this is the case, now that we are receiving $15-20 million more in ACC money plus whatever is brought in from our NYC games, then why wasn’t this an issue prior to us joining the ACC when we were bringing in so much less? I truly and honestly might just "not be getting it", lord knows im not the brightest bulb in the batch, but I just don't see the drastic change in expenditures from when we were in the Big Eas t2 years ago (receiving $15 million less). The Gaits and tennis coaches salaries of the world are a drop in the bucket compared to the numbers were talking about.
IF we are now having to take into account paying for scholarships in some fashion (taxes or tuition etc) that were once being picked up by other departments for the previous 30 plus years of modern college athletics, then how was it financially feasible for our Athletics Department to exist at all for so long? What took the financial hit at the university, how did that affect the University as a whole, and why is it stopping now? Could the cause of this be internal budget fights with other departments trying to get their hands on some of the ACC money?

No, it's about a more transparent process under the new Chancellor. I think people need to just step back a bit before getting freaked out. SU is not in a very good spot financially, and like many other areas of SU (trust me everywhere is under increased budget scrutiny) Athletics is in the spotlight right now and valid questions are being asked.

For a while now the Athletics subvention has been blamed on the BE money and the costs associated with the dept (staff and facilities upgrades). People were told that the move to the ACC would "solve these problems".

Let me ask the board something...if you think Syverud and the BOT wanted to move away from big-time athletics, why did the IPF project happen? Why is SU spending millions on a new track practice facility? Just take a deep breath and hope the next AD understands how to remain competitive and be fiscally responsible...or at least be a much better fundraiser.
 
"During discussions with the SBC, it became apparent that Athletics is actually a net expense to the University overall, in that subvention is required to balance the books; that, in fact, the athletic program has a negative fund balance as spending outpaces revenues."
If this is the case, now that we are receiving $15-20 million more in ACC money plus whatever is brought in from our NYC games, then why wasn’t this an issue prior to us joining the ACC when we were bringing in so much less? I truly and honestly might just "not be getting it", lord knows im not the brightest bulb in the batch, but I just don't see the drastic change in expenditures from when we were in the Big Eas t2 years ago (receiving $15 million less). The Gaits and tennis coaches salaries of the world are a drop in the bucket compared to the numbers were talking about.
IF we are now having to take into account paying for scholarships in some fashion (taxes or tuition etc) that were once being picked up by other departments for the previous 30 plus years of modern college athletics, then how was it financially feasible for our Athletics Department to exist at all for so long? What took the financial hit at the university, how did that affect the University as a whole, and why is it stopping now? Could the cause of this be internal budget fights with other departments trying to get their hands on some of the ACC money?
Very good questions. The entire tone of this report seems very slanted.

If I am understanding their bitch (and it is a bitch) the cost of an athletic scholarship is 1) paid by the athletic department to the individual school's account, and 2) credited back to the university so the net result is zero. However, since the overhead tax is assessed on 1, and no tax refund is granted in 2, the school is left with a tax expense that is not reimbursed by the AD. I am not sure how that is different than an academic scholarship so I am not sure if their issue is legitimate.

Accounting for tuition has always driven me crazy because the accounting is so obtuse.
 
No, it's about a more transparent process under the new Chancellor. I think people need to just step back a bit before getting freaked out. SU is not in a very good spot financially, and like many other areas of SU (trust me everywhere is under increased budget scrutiny) Athletics is in the spotlight right now and valid questions are being asked.

For a while now the Athletics subvention has been blamed on the BE money and the costs associated with the dept (staff and facilities upgrades). People were told that the move to the ACC would "solve these problems".

Let me ask the board something...if you think Syverud and the BOT wanted to move away from big-time athletics, why did the IPF project happen? Why is SU spending millions on a new track practice facility? Just take a deep breath and hope the next AD understands how to remain competitive and be fiscally responsible...or at least be a much better fundraiser.
That is one view and it probably has some merit, however there is no denying the outright hostile tone of that report. It would be naive to think that jealousy at the high coaching salaries, player facilities, etc was not behind a lot of it. (If I am not mistaken the IPF fundraising was well under way before TGC got here.)

What is most likely happening is the beginning of a real fight over resources and the academics see the AD as an easy mark. Until the ACC money gets the AD solidly in the black they will be on the defensive. We simply don't know where TGC will come out.

We're not hiring Les Miles any time soon.
 
No, it's about a more transparent process under the new Chancellor. I think people need to just step back a bit before getting freaked out. SU is not in a very good spot financially, and like many other areas of SU (trust me everywhere is under increased budget scrutiny) Athletics is in the spotlight right now and valid questions are being asked.

For a while now the Athletics subvention has been blamed on the BE money and the costs associated with the dept (staff and facilities upgrades). People were told that the move to the ACC would "solve these problems".

Let me ask the board something...if you think Syverud and the BOT wanted to move away from big-time athletics, why did the IPF project happen? Why is SU spending millions on a new track practice facility? Just take a deep breath and hope the next AD understands how to remain competitive and be fiscally responsible...or at least be a much better fundraiser.
we are missing a major piece of revenue on the athletic side and that is donations. We need to do a better job
 

Forum statistics

Threads
167,790
Messages
4,727,329
Members
5,920
Latest member
CoachDiddi

Online statistics

Members online
274
Guests online
2,477
Total visitors
2,751


Top Bottom