2017 Defensive Ends

[Orijinal]

I think the group I am least excited about heading into the season is our returning group of defensive ends:

Kendall Coleman
Josh Black
Jake Picard
Jaquan Nelson (who may not even play)

But what I think I AM excited about is our incoming group of defensive ends:

Josh Allen
Brandon Berry
Justin Ellis
Jonathon Kingsley
Zach Morton

I think the staff has done a good job of identifying a weakness and creating competition for the fall

Who does everyone think will be the top 3 DEs at the end of summer?

I hope Coleman steps up a little more because he might be able to hold onto his spot. I'm not counting on Nelson to even be on the team (hope I'm wrong), and I have a good feeling about Brandon Berry. My #3 might be Black or Allen. And I say that knowing that Allen is coming in with some cred.

 

[blizz]

Agree with your thoughts 100%.

No idea what to expect but I think best scenario (barring a huge leap in development by either Coleman, Black, et al) is for Allen and Berry to take the #1 spots (strongside and weakside respectively). Allen is an intriguing prospect, but I have no sense of what level he's coming in at. Berry looks to me like a dangerous pass rusher coming off the edge, which is critical in the T2. I think he will see significant time this year as a result, but I'm concerned with his current ability against the run.

Either way we need much more out of this group in order to take a significant step forward on d.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

I think this is an incredibly unfair assessment. You're writing off two guys who played as true freshmen, who will have a full year of S&C and experience at the ACC level, and replacing one of them with a guy who is the same age and has a year of experience at the JUCO level. Based on what? His tape?

Guys improve and don't always need to be replaced by someone new.

 

[bigmike]

I like both Coleman and Black to move forward this year in the level of their play, and I like one of the incoming guys (not sure who) to join them in the top 3.

 

[cusefan88]

Coleman and Black to start with Pickard, Allen, and Berry in the rotation. The rest need to redshirt.

 

[Chip]

In any normal situation, Coleman and Black would have redshirted. They both have the size to play the position which is a good place to start. I'm bullish on both. Too much evaluation of them last season doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Even this year, which would be their redshirt freshman year, they'll struggle a bit, but that head start will only help.

This is what happens when you lose a guy early to the pros and 2 guys to drug suspensions.

 

[Orijinal]

I think this is an incredibly unfair assessment. You're writing off two guys who played as true freshmen, who will have a full year of S&C and experience at the ACC level, and replacing one of them with a guy who is the same age and has a year of experience at the JUCO level. Based on what? His tape?

Guys improve and don't always need to be replaced by someone new.

I hope Coleman and Black take that step forward as well. It was hard to assess last year because both were freshman thrown into ACC play, I agree. But if neither take a step forward I could definitely see a newcomer challenging.

In my younger years, I thought it was all about the incoming guys. Now that I'm a little more seasoned (in some respects), I do like to take a look at who's returning first to see what we have. All I'm saying is that if production off of last year gives us any indication for production this year, here's the position I'm concerned about

 

[AAM62]

Agree with your thoughts 100%.

No idea what to expect but I think best scenario (barring a huge leap in development by either Coleman, Black, et al) is for Allen and Berry to take the #1 spots (strongside and weakside respectively). Allen is an intriguing prospect, but I have no sense of what level he's coming in at. Berry looks to me like a dangerous pass rusher coming off the edge, which is critical in the T2. I think he will see significant time this year as a result, but I'm concerned with his current ability against the run.

Either way we need much more out of this group in order to take a significant step forward on d.

Have you seen Allen's pics? Dude has a gut. Sad thing is I think Sheppard plays and has a good year for Ole Miss and that will hurt.

 

[OttoMets]

What happened to Nelson? Thought he was supposed to be one of the better defensive recruits a couple years ago.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

What happened to Nelson? Thought he was supposed to be one of the better defensive recruits a couple years ago.

He redshirted and is still suspended.

 

[OttoMets]

He redshirted and is still suspended.

Oh, the burglar. Damn, forgot about that.

Ah well, hope they can find someone decent who's not a menace to his classmates.

 

[Chip]

Have you seen Allen's pics? Dude has a gut. Sad thing is I think Sheppard plays and has a good year for Ole Miss and that will hurt.

Jameel Dumas had a gut. It didn't stop him.

(It just slowed him down considerably).

 

[blizz]

I think this is an incredibly unfair assessment. You're writing off two guys who played as true freshmen, who will have a full year of S&C and experience at the ACC level, and replacing one of them with a guy who is the same age and has a year of experience at the JUCO level. Based on what? His tape?

Guys improve and don't always need to be replaced by someone new.

Assuming this was directed at me, I think I wasn't clear in making the point that, I'm not trying to say anything negative about either Coleman, Black, or Pickard. I think they performed admirably last season, certainly beyond my expectation. What I meant by saying the best case scenario is that they are displaced on the depth chart is that would imply that Allen and Berry (or any other newcomer/unknown commodity) would represent a big uptick in the capability/quality at the position. Without a doubt, those guys have been grinding, and will be much better for it in the coming year. All I meant was it would be better to get a developmental leap at DE, and I was trying to say that leap could just as well come from one of them.

 

[blizz]

Oh, the burglar. Damn, forgot about that.

Ah well, hope they can find someone decent who's not a menace to his classmates.

If it was up to you, how much time would both of thoae guys be doing?

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

Assuming this was directed at me

It wasn't. You responded to OP about 30 seconds before I did.

 

[OttoMets]

If it was up to you, how much time would both of thoae guys be doing?

It isn't up to me, and I'm not talking about time, I'm talking about removing the criminals from the campus community. But we should probably stick to the topic of defensive ends.

 

[dasher]

Yep. the new guys we haven't seen are good players. It's the guys that we have seen play we don't like,.

 

[PhatOrange]

I'm very excited about Coleman and Black. Why not.

 

[Ish88888]

Coleman and Black to start with Pickard, Allen, and Berry in the rotation. The rest need to redshirt.

Good call, just not a pickard fan. Just think he lacks the natural burst, athleticism, and strength needed for the position. Hopefully, he makes me eat crow.

 

[anomander]

I think the group I am least excited about heading into the season is our returning group of defensive ends:

Kendall Coleman
Josh Black
Jake Picard
Jaquan Nelson (who may not even play)

But what I think I AM excited about is our incoming group of defensive ends:

Josh Allen
Brandon Berry
Justin Ellis
Jonathon Kingsley
Zach Morton

I think the staff has done a good job of identifying a weakness and creating competition for the fall

Who does everyone think will be the top 3 DEs at the end of summer?

I hope Coleman steps up a little more because he might be able to hold onto his spot. I'm not counting on Nelson to even be on the team (hope I'm wrong), and I have a good feeling about Brandon Berry. My #3 might be Black or Allen. And I say that knowing that Allen is coming in with some cred.

ummm i think you have this backwards? You're more excited with a couple lightly recruited JUCO's rather than 2 rising true FR who given the circumstances had pretty damn good Freshman season? I am excited for Kingsley and Morton, but otherwise don't get your logic?

 

[rocklloyd]

I'm excited the new defensive ends coach is going to be my neighbor. Can't wait to wow him with the recruiting knowledge I've learned here

 

[cusefan88]

Good call, just not a pickard fan. Just think he lacks the natural burst, athleticism, and strength needed for the position. Hopefully, he makes me eat crow.

Ditto here. But as a rotation guy? Could be worse. Hopefully the increased competition will bring up the overall quality of this group.

 

[OrangeBlood]

Coleman and Black start. Allen and Kingsley are primary backups. That's my prediction.

 

[Dcuse]

Don't forget everybody. It's...Kingsley Jonathon

 

[TheCusian]

I think it's likely that the the DE position will be better than last year, but not good enough to be a consistent strength. Same goes for our secondary.

We were so bad defensively this is all a net positive. Our O will jump up nationally again, so if our D can just get respectable...