#8 Football Factory - Video Link

[Stern]

Well apparently the idiot administrators at Boise State, SD State, SMU, University of Houston, et. al. didn't laugh it off.

They apparently thought it was a good idea.

But they apparently know so much less than you do, right?

And Boise and SD State lasted how long in that conference...right!! They backed out before it started!

 

[Stern]

I know why you supposedly gave up the tix - you told me - you were angry with the Athletic Department.

I don't need anymore answers on that issue - you told me that were angry.

Well I never said that but if you want to believe it so we can end this discussion...go ahead! lol

 

[sutomcat]

-Taylor was in an AFC Championship game with the Jets and played in multiple playoff games in Miami in the late 90's and early 2000's. You got the facts totally wrong. Another fact you have wrong is he was All Pro 4 times to Dwight's 3. Has him beat there

-Sack totals are sack totals, the Hall really doesn't distinguish a difference between LB's and DE's in that regard.

I will concede Taylor played in a couple of playoff games. He certainly was not a factor for the Jets in that AFC Championship game; he was not a good player for the Jets during his one year with them.

This web site says he was a 3 time All Pro. Others confirm this. I can find no evidence he was a 4 time All Pro. Do you have any proof?

Again, Freeney has more sacks than Taylor at the same time in his career. Again, Freeney has already been named to the Pro Bowl more times than Taylor ever was. If you have to be a slave to stats to try and make your point, you should at least be sure the stats back you up.

Bottom line, trying to portray Taylor as clearly better than Freeney is misguided.

As is arguing against Freeney by comparing him to a linebacker.

If you want to argue, at least start with an apples to apples comparison. The linebacker and defensive end positions are fundamentally different, and the stats they roll up reflect that. You might as well use Jim Brown's rushing numbers or Jerry Rice's receiving numbers to make your argument.

Much respect though to the depth of your negativity. It is quite impressive.

 

[Stern]

I will concede Taylor played in a couple of playoff games. .

You aren't conceding anything...he actually played in those games!

And Taylor played as a RDE in Miami's 4-3 defense for many years. Same position as Freeney

 

[sutomcat]

You aren't conceding anything...he actually played in those games!

And Taylor played as a RDE in Miami's 4-3 defense for many years. Same position as Freeney

FYI, here is the definition of concede:

Admit that something is true or valid after first denying or resisting it.

One of the few things I agree with you on is that Taylor did play DE.

The linebacker statement referred to Kevin Greene, who was a linebacker, not a defensive end.

 

[OrangePA]

Well I never said that but if you want to believe it so we can end this discussion...go ahead! lol

Did you attend Syracuse University?

Did you attend another college?

 

[shandeezy7]

Slightly higher sack total...uh no. Much higher sack total.

Taylor has a NFL Defensive player of the year award as well, highest honor a defensive player can get in this league. Dwight doesn't.

Yeah in a career that was 4 years longer, as of right now. I would not be surprised to see Freeney end up around 125 career sacks, if he can play another 2 or 3 healthy years. I don't understand why it can't get through your thick skull that these guys might be pretty comparable players :crazy:

 

[wfschrec]

I will concede Taylor played in a couple of playoff games. He certainly was not a factor for the Jets in that AFC Championship game; he was not a good player for the Jets during his one year with them.

This web site says he was a 3 time All Pro. Others confirm this. I can find no evidence he was a 4 time All Pro. Do you have any proof?

Again, Freeney has more sacks than Taylor at the same time in his career. Again, Freeney has already been named to the Pro Bowl more times than Taylor ever was. If you have to be a slave to stats to try and make your point, you should at least be sure the stats back you up.

Bottom line, trying to portray Taylor as clearly better than Freeney is misguided.

As is arguing against Freeney by comparing him to a linebacker.

If you want to argue, at least start with an apples to apples comparison. The linebacker and defensive end positions are fundamentally different, and the stats they roll up reflect that. You might as well use Jim Brown's rushing numbers or Jerry Rice's receiving numbers to make your argument.

Much respect though to the depth of your negativity. It is quite impressive.

On top of that how many rings does Taylor have ... and how many Pro-Bowlers did Taylor (ahem Zack Thomas as well as a couple others) have as a supporting cast while for quite some time the Colts had no help for Freeney defensively until Bob Sanders arrived. Taylor has played in 70 more games than Freeney for crying out loud.

 

[Stern]

Yeah in a career that was 4 years longer, as of right now. I would not be surprised to see Freeney end up around 125 career sacks, if he can play another 2 or 3 healthy years. I don't understand why it can't get through your thick skull that these guys might be pretty comparable players :crazy:

Freeney is probably in his last season or two though. Nobody wanted to sign him this year when he was a UFA and he signed in a place he didn't want to go but it was his only offer. And San Diego ONLY signed him because Melvin Ingram tore his ACL. If Ingram doesn't get hurt then Freeney's career is probably over right now. This is probably the end of the road for him in 2013 or 2014

P.S...125 sacks isn't hall of fame worthy! He ain't getting in with only 125

 

[shandeezy7]

Freeney is probably in his last season or two though. Nobody wanted to sign him this year when he was a UFA and he signed in a place he didn't want to go but it was his only offer. And San Diego ONLY signed him because Melvin Ingram tore his ACL. If Ingram doesn't get hurt then Freeney's career is probably over right now. This is probably the end of the road for him in 2013 or 2014

P.S...125 sacks isn't hall of fame worthy! He ain't getting in with only 125

Gonna have to agree to disagree on this one I guess. If he ends up top 12-15 all-time in sacks (yeah I know, sacks haven't always been a stat) with a super bowl ring, 4 time all-pro, 7 time pro-bowler, AFC Defensive Player of the Year, all Decade Team for the 2000s and being one of the most schemed against defensive players in this era, I really don't see how you can keep him out. Sure, he might have to wait a while, but saying he will without a doubt never get in is asinine.

And P.S. - the Chargers weren't the only team to offer Freeney. They were the only team willing to pay him $4m per.

 

[Stern]

Gonna have to agree to disagree on this one I guess. If he ends up top 12-15 all-time in sacks (yeah I know, sacks haven't always been a stat) with a super bowl ring, 4 time all-pro, 7 time pro-bowler, AFC Defensive Player of the Year, all Decade Team for the 2000s and being one of the most schemed against defensive players in this era, I really don't see how you can keep him out. Sure, he might have to wait a while, but saying he will without a doubt never get in is asinine.
.

Dwight has just over 100 sacks now, he plays 2 more years as a part-time pass rusher and he won't pile up huge numbers most likely. When guys with MORE sacks aren't in the hall, its tough to make a claim for Dwight to get in! Nobody cares about super bowl rings for defensive players trying to get into the Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame is all about NUMBERS!! What are the numbers...if you have to use the "he was the most schemed against defensive player" (which there is no way of actually proving) he has less of a shot than I even thought!! lol

Leslie O'Neil a DE retired with 132.5 sacks...he in the hall? NOPE!
Clyde Simmons a DE retired with 121 sacks...he in? NOPE!
Sean Jones a DE who retired with 113 sacks...he in? NOPE
You have Simeon Rice a DE who retired with 122...he might end up with more sacks than Freeney if Freeney does little this year and next and when all is said and done. I don't see Rice as a hall of fame player just like I don't see Dwight.

Unless Dwight gets "near" the 140 sack range...he ain't getting in. And its not even really debatable! And I don't think Dwight has another 30 sacks left in him. I mean he only has a year or two left on the field as a player. Especially when you got people from his era at his same position DE (Strahan, Taylor, Jared Allen, Peppers,and John Abraham) who all have more sacks than him now and more than likely probably retire with more sacks than him.

 

[shandeezy7]

Dwight has just over 100 sacks now, he plays 2 more years as a part-time pass rusher and he won't pile up huge numbers most likely. When guys with MORE sacks aren't in the hall, its tough to make a claim for Dwight to get in! Nobody cares about super bowl rings for defensive players trying to get into the Hall of Fame. Hall of Fame is all about NUMBERS!! What are the numbers...if you have to use the "he was the most schemed against defensive player" (which there is no way of actually proving) he has less of a shot than I even thought!! lol

Leslie O'Neil a DE retired with 132.5 sacks...he in the hall? NOPE!
Clyde Simmons a DE retired with 121 sacks...he in? NOPE!
Sean Jones a DE who retired with 113 sacks...he in? NOPE
You have Simeon Rice a DE who retired with 122...he might end up with more sacks than Freeney if Freeney does little this year and next and when all is said and done. I don't see Rice as a hall of fame player just like I don't see Dwight.

Unless Dwight gets "near" the 140 sack range...he ain't getting in. And its not even really debatable! And I don't think Dwight has another 30 sacks left in him. I mean he only has a year or two left on the field as a player. Especially when you got people from his era at his same position DE (Strahan, Taylor, Jared Allen, Peppers,and John Abraham) who all have more sacks than him now and more than likely probably retire with more sacks than him.

Ok dude, thanks for a peek into your crystal ball. Why is Howie Long in the Hall of Fame if it's all about numbers? In 16 more games than Dwight, he had 15 less sacks. Was a Pro-Bowler 8 times to Freeney's 7 and All-Pro 5 times to Freeney's 4. Howie's in the Hall and Freeney is guaranteed to not make it there. Glad you saved us all the time of waiting around to see if he will get in or not. :blah:

 

[Stern]

Ok dude, thanks for a peek into your crystal ball. Why is Howie Long in the Hall of Fame if it's all about numbers? In 16 more games than Dwight, he had 15 less sacks. Was a Pro-Bowler 8 times to Freeney's 7 and All-Pro 5 times to Freeney's 4. Howie's in the Hall and Freeney is guaranteed to not make it there. Glad you saved us all the time of waiting around to see if he will get in or not. :blah:

Howie Long played more DT than DE which changes everything. Plus he played in a different era

 

[Moontan]

Once Dwight appears on Dancing With The Stars he'll be a lock.