A suggestion to everyone..,.

[RF2044]

I also hate these arguements, but cannot help myself either.

The biggest difference between the '10 team and the '13 team is depth. We only went 7 deep in '10 and we have gone 9 deep so far in '12-13. Coleman and Xmas are both likely pro prospects, while Arinze and RJ (as much as I liked both players) did not have that level of talent. Wes was special and I agree he is a better player than Fair. Rautins was one of my favorite players and I would take him as a Senior over Triche as a Senior. However, Triche is solid and would hardly be considered a weakness on this year's team. PG play on the '10 was a weakness. Freshman Triche and Sophmore Scoop were serviceable at the point but are not even close to the production we are getting out of MCW. MCW is a great player and every bit as dominant as Wes was in 2010. We don't lose much when we sub and depending on the match-up, sometimes this year's team gets better when Southerland, Grant, Keita or Cooney come into the game. The '10 team had Joseph and Scoop, but absolutely nothing after that.

IMO, the biggest difference between the '10 team and this year's team is that the '10 team had consistent low post scoring with Arinze [and to a lesser extent, Rick]. That doesn't mean that this group can't get there with Coleman / Rak / Keita, but right now those contributions are intermittent.

The '10 team also shot the ball better from outside, but hopefully last night's performance is a sign of things to come in '13.

I agree with your premise that depth is better on this year's team. The '10 team had perfect balance / chemistry, and couldn't overcome the loss of Arinze at the end of the year, with Riley not being up to the task. Contrast that with this year; if [heaven forbid] Coleman got injured, Keita would be a more than adequate replacement. In fairness, he's an experienced junior to Riley's situation as inexperienced frosh.

 

[RF2044]

mcw i think ends up the best player in the country this year. this team as its growing slowly into its potential is scary good and just plays a pretty brand of hoops. For once i think we just might be the team who really seperates from the pack as number one.. iu is damn good but with mcw we are wow. i was so impressed with this team i almost forgot i was watching a cuse team tonight.

i think we have a shot to be better than the last two 30 win teams, both of which should have competed for all the marbles had our centers not gone down.

on an individual player note- dc2 is getting closer.. he is trying to go up quicker, next comes putting a softer touch when he does..

love this team too..

I hope you're right--I honestly do. DC providing more consistent inside scoring would really make this team dangerous. He's not quite there yet...

 

[OttoMets]

IMO, the biggest difference between the '10 team and this year's team is that the '10 team had consistent low post scoring with Arinze [and to a lesser extent, Rick]. That doesn't mean that this group can't get there with Coleman / Rak / Keita, but right now those contributions are intermittent.

The '10 team also shot the ball better from outside, but hopefully last night's performance is a sign of things to come in '13.

I agree with your premise that depth is better on this year's team. The '10 team had perfect balance / chemistry, and couldn't overcome the loss of Arinze at the end of the year, with Riley not being up to the task. Contrast that with this year; if [heaven forbid] Coleman got injured, Keita would be a more than adequate replacement. In fairness, he's an experienced junior to Riley's situation as inexperienced frosh.

Yeah, to the tune of over 39%. About what we shot from the field last night.

That group was offensively gifted.

 

[Millhouse]

Pour yourself a beverage of your choice, kick back in your favorite chair and enjoy this team. As much fun as last years team was, there were a ton of frustrating moments.

Watching this team play at its peak is pure enjoyment.

IMO, it all starts at the point. MCW. Enjoy him whole you can. Without a doubt the best playmaker at point since Sherman.

His play opens everything up for the test of the team. Run the floor, present yourself and he will find you.

If we get consistent contributions from grant and Cooney. We are going to be a major player in march. And if Coleman starts to contribute...wow.

Love. This. Team.

Am I the only finding himself hollering out happily at the TV more than they have since the 80s teams?

I dvr to skip the timeouts and halftime and it still takes two hours because I'm constantly rewinding

 

[br801]

i'l be ready to aplogize. nothing would make me happier. we ha 9 deep and the b est player

Never too soon to lay down the first "JB only wins it all because he has the best player" brick, is it?

 

[pfister1]

Never too soon to lay down the first "JB only wins it all because he has the best player" brick, is it?

Except that having the best player has no effect on whether we win it all or not when he is sitting at the end of the bench being Boeheimed.

 

[SoBristol]

No doubt this team is deeper than the 2010 team and has a special PG in MCW. It can beat up on bad teams better than any recent SU team.

Andy made up for the PG play; Wes was a much better shooter, passer and shot blocker from the 3; and the inside scoring gave that 2010 team a balance that the current team gets only in spurts. The 2012 team had shot blocking that the current group can't match. You might believe MCW is elegant, but Scoop & Dion closed out tight games better than any SU guard pairing I can recall.

The current team goes 9 deep -- and still, where does that get you in the second halves of tight games? Maybe you just keep romping, and don't have tight games. But we will see in the league.

 

[br801]

Except that having the best player has no effect on whether we win it all or not when he is sitting at the end of the bench being Boeheimed.

Igor loves the "best player" argument. If we win it all, it will be because we had MCW. If we fall short of that, it will be because Grant was Boeheimed.

 

[Cuseregular]

this has been a fascinating and enjoyable thread for those of us footbal mostly folks who enjoy hoops but arent officianados. Very informative and enlightening in some respects and is one of the reason I enjoy spending time on these boards. Good stuff guys (and probably gals too). Thanks.

 

[Cuseregular]

Am I the only finding himself hollering out happily at the TV more than they have since the 80s teams?

I dvr to skip the timeouts and halftime and it still takes two hours because I'm constantly rewinding

no you're not, even at the game I kept turning to the people I was with and asking when is the last time we've seen this for the whole game relentless attacking and drubbing teams this early like this. Big potential once again this year for this team.

 

[MGP]

I kicked back in my chair around 1978 (and on my Daddy's lap before that) and have been enjoying ever since. THAT'S what this program brings to the table that is like no other!

 

[br801]

this has been a fascinating and enjoyable thread for those of us footbal mostly folks who enjoy hoops but arent officianados. Very informative and enlightening in some respects and is one of the reason I enjoy spending time on these boards. Good stuff guys (and probably gals too). Thanks.

Much the same could be said for what you and others do on the football side. Thanks for good stuff over there.

 

[billsin01]

That 2010 team lost to a shitty UL team twice.

OK. This team has played exactly two teams that had a prayer of beating them (partially b/c they are really good, which no one is denying, and partially b/c of the schedule). One of those teams had to play them on an aircraft carrier that rendered its outside game useless. The other played exactly zero defense.

The 2010 team lost a total of 5 games the entire season. Three of those were without Onuaku for all intents a purposes -- a loss that clearly made this a different team. If this team goes out and wins 30+ games, which they certainly have a good shot at doing, then it's more of a discussion, but I still don't know that I'm putting games against ND, Gtown, Pitt and others in the win column yet. They are going to face far tougher challenges going forward -- even in Temple.

 

[billsin01]

I also hate these arguements, but cannot help myself either.

The biggest difference between the '10 team and the '13 team is depth. We only went 7 deep in '10 and we have gone 9 deep so far in '12-13. Coleman and Xmas are both likely pro prospects, while Arinze and RJ (as much as I liked both players) did not have that level of talent. Wes was special and I agree he is a better player than Fair. Rautins was one of my favorite players and I would take him as a Senior over Triche as a Senior. However, Triche is solid and would hardly be considered a weakness on this year's team. PG play on the '10 was a weakness. Freshman Triche and Sophmore Scoop were serviceable at the point but are not even close to the production we are getting out of MCW. MCW is a great player and every bit as dominant as Wes was in 2010. We don't lose much when we sub and depending on the match-up, sometimes this year's team gets better when Southerland, Grant, Keita or Cooney come into the game. The '10 team had Joseph and Scoop, but absolutely nothing after that.

Valid points and I agree to a large extent, but I'm just not sure 7 games tells us enough about this team. The counters to your arguments are these:

-- We don't know exactly where we stand on depth yet. The last few games have given us more confidence in Coleman/Cooney/Grant, but we have no idea if these guys will actually factor in when we're playing real games. I'd argue there's still a pretty solid chance that in BE play, MCW/Triche play 36+ mpg and we see almost exclusively Southerland/Fair/Keita/Christmas in most games, with a sprinkling of Coleman. We could still, potentially, end up with primarily 7 guys.

-- Coleman and Christmas are pro prospects -- I agree -- but they are pro prospects who've done nothing as of yet. RJ handled the 4 defensively, played really well at the high post offensively and averaged 10/7/2 (blocks) while shooting close to 60%. Christmas hasn't proven he can do any of those things. Onuaku put up 10 and 5 in just 23 mpg while shooting 68% while playing adequate defense. Coleman is awful defensively and is putting up 7 and 6 on 47% shooting vs. the light portion of the schedule. Xmas/Coleman are better athletes and may be better players by year's end, but that's an awful lot of projection at this point.

-- The gap between rautins/Triche (at this point) is every bit as big as the gap between MCW/Scoop. MCW is a guy who will likely be used along with sherm as the standard for PGs here for a long, long time. But Scoop had a great year in 09-10 -- 9 ppg, 4.3 assists/game, better than 2:1 assist/TO ratio, .489/.750/.389 shooting on a team that averaged 81 ppg. Obviously those numbers pale in comparison to MCW, but at this point MCW is shooting under 40% overall and 17% from 3 so he hasn't been flawless. Rautins was a POY candidate, averaged 5 assists/game, shot over 40% from 3. Triche is a 2-guard who is shooting under 30% from 3 and turning the ball over 3 times/game (huge number for an off-guard).

 

[cusetown1]

OK. This team has played exactly two teams that had a prayer of beating them (partially b/c they are really good, which no one is denying, and partially b/c of the schedule). One of those teams had to play them on an aircraft carrier that rendered its outside game useless. The other played exactly zero defense.

The 2010 team lost a total of 5 games the entire season. Three of those were without Onuaku for all intents a purposes -- a loss that clearly made this a different team. If this team goes out and wins 30+ games, which they certainly have a good shot at doing, then it's more of a discussion, but I still don't know that I'm putting games against ND, Gtown, Pitt and others in the win column yet. They are going to face far tougher challenges going forward -- even in Temple.

We were also 1 possession away form losing to an 8-13 (1-7 conference) DePaul team. Don't get me wrong I loved that team and believe they would have won the whole thing if Onuaku was healthy. I just really hate these fantasy games on what team is better on a given year. Every year is different. Talent, teams, injuries, coaching, who's girlfriend left them, blah blah blah. It's like the grass is always greener concept.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Hard to really see any landmines for this team, cept Louisville. Those teams that hustle for 40 mins and shoot the 3 give us trouble.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

That and watching scoop play pg was enough to nearly kill my will.

But, but...he was our leader...30+ wins...etc etc.. no player in the universe could have done more...

 

[br801]

Hard to really see any landmines for this team, cept Louisville. Those teams that hustle for 40 mins and shoot the 3 give us trouble.

There are plenty of potential landmines for a team with inconsistent outside shooters, a tendency to get sloppy with the ball and unproven inside scoring. A good, aggressive defense can keep you in any game, but some nights you will need more than that.

 

[cusetown1]

There are plenty of potential landmines for a team with inconsistent outside shooters, a tendency to get sloppy with the ball and unproven inside scoring. A good, aggressive defense can keep you in any game, but some nights you will need more than that.

I really think Trevor Cooney is the X factor. If he shoots it well it puts this team on another level.

 

[RF2044]

But, but...he was our leader...30+ wins...etc etc.. no player in the universe could have done more...

But, but...we lost THREE games...if only JB had been smart enough to scrap what he did and play a different lineup...

 

[br801]

I really think Trevor Cooney is the X factor. If he shoots it well it puts this team on another level.

Barring injury or foul trouble, Cooney will not play enough in close games to be an X-factor. Next season might be a different story.

 

[cusetown1]

Barring injury or foul trouble, Cooney will not play enough in close games to be an X-factor. Next season might be a different story.

I just don't see how you can leave a shooter like him on the bench. I just get the feeling he will be a vital asset this year.

 

[GoSU96]

Am I the only finding himself hollering out happily at the TV more than they have since the 80s teams?

I dvr to skip the timeouts and halftime and it still takes two hours because I'm constantly rewinding

There is a ton of flow right now, and the defense is nasty, it's a fun watch, but the physical disparity with the teams they are playing right now is huge.

They can take a lot of risks on particular plays and go for the spectacular because there is no risk of losing the game.

It's not a critique of JB's scheduling, building a dominating mentality is a good thing and it allows him to play the new guys for extended minutes without penalty (you can see what that has done for Cooney and Grant the last two games), but we shouldn't expect this game in and game out all year.

 

[stuckinbig11]

Good time to be a Syracuse Hoops fan.

What makes us different is that it is ALWAYS a good time to be a Syracuse Hoops fan.

 

[IthacaMatt]

It all starts with MCW. I love watching him play.

Still worried about the 4 and 5 consistently...more specifically Coleman. Not playing to where I thought he would.

As far as Grant...we shall see if he's playing in Jan and Feb.

Sorry to sound negative. Not meaning to. Trying to tame huge optimism.

Coleman's not there yet. I agree. Great game for Cooney last night, though. That should get him going.