And then there were two, the Cavs and Warriors

[RF2044]

Bravado? I called Cavs in 6 two weeks ago because right now I think they are playing better; nothing has occurred to make me change that & a split at Oracle was what I was looking for.

Kudos to you for making that prediction two weeks ago, but I think we both know that has zero applicability to the point I was making about many [then] life long Heat fans confidently predicting that last year's series was over after Miami beat SA on the road in game 2 last year.

 

[longislandcuse]

I think GSW is going to win.

But you can't compare any other team to one that has Bron on it. Dude is averaging a 41.5 / 12 / 8.5. Those are video game numbers. Or, to put it another way, he's having arguably the greatest finals ever through two games.

The emotion he showed after Game 2 was pretty awesome. That was some "This is Sparta" type ish.

 

[RF2044]

Anyone think Curry is battling an undisclosed inury from his fall against Memphis? His playoff numbers before and after are night and day so far.

Personally, I don't think that's it. I think it is more about Curry being [and this is going to sound funny, since he is having an incredible year and is the MVP] a bit too small to bull his way through the extra defensive attention he's gotten. He's played a bit too cute, and it hasn't worked. He'll probably adjust [that's true for the entire GSW team], but if they don't they'll have difficulty winning the series. Simple as that.

The Cavs have come out both games and hit them in the mouth defensively. GSW can go on fast scoring binges, but in the first two games the shots haven't dropped. Will that change? Stay tuned.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I think GSW is going to win.

But you can't compare any other team to one that has Bron on it. Dude is averaging a 41.5 / 12 / 8.5. Those are video game numbers. Or, to put it another way, he's having arguably the greatest finals ever through two games.

Oh I'm not. My point was, it's not like them suddenly being tied 1-1 heading on the road is suddenly the end of the world.

Yes, lebron is the best player in the world. But they are well coached. And his numbers are unreal but you can't discount Fg%. The defense last game on him was actually very good. Which is epic considering the stats he still had.

Do I think GSW wins it all still? Yes. Would I be shocked if cleveland did? No.

 

[Knicks411]

True, that's why Lebron is Lebron and Melo is Melo. Melo doesn't have the ability to be Magic Johnson in a PF body. We talk about how Golden State's pieces fit together for who they have. I think Cleveland has some talent and that talent compliments Lebron. Great Defense. Great Rebounding. Three point shooters everywhere. They don't have a post up player or playmaker but Lebron can be both. Golden State is in a huge disadvantage because they can't rebound and go, they have to gang rebound and then go against Cleveland's set defense. This keeps the score low and gives Cleveland a chance. Lebron is great but the narrative about his teammates is obnoxious. This isn't the Knicks with Langston Galloway as your second best scorer and Jason Smith/Cole Aldrich beasting in the post.

This is the one thing I'd quibble with, how much shooting do they really have around him? Shump isn't a great shooter. JR is JR, he's ok. Delly is solid. Jones is a good shooter but so insanely limited. Very strong rebounding when they play the two bigs, but that also cuts down on the shooting. And the fact that Lebron is so great that he can be the post guy and the playmaker doesn't make the teammates any better, it just speaks to the singular greatness of Lebron.

Second bolded part is huge; and Cleveland has been keeping the turnovers down so the Warriors are having a lot of trouble running.

Certainly they aren't the Knicks, but how many teams make the finals with a worse roster past their best player? The 2007 Cavs come to mind, and that's it? Maybe some of the early 2000's east champs?

 

[NineOneSeven]

I also live in akron so yes, you can imagine I interact with cavs fans often.

And osu fans.

 

[NineOneSeven]

This is the one thing I'd quibble with, how much shooting do they really have around him? Shump isn't a great shooter. JR is JR, he's ok. Delly is solid. Jones is a good shooter but so insanely limited. Very strong rebounding when they play the two bigs, but that also cuts down on the shooting. And the fact that Lebron is so great that he can be the post guy and the playmaker doesn't make the teammates any better, it just speaks to the singular greatness of Lebron.

Second bolded part is huge; and Cleveland has been keeping the turnovers down so the Warriors are having a lot of trouble running.

Certainly they aren't the Knicks, but how many teams make the finals with a worse roster past their best player? The 2007 Cavs come to mind, and that's it? Maybe some of the early 2000's east champs?

Certainly the 07 roster.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Anyone think Curry is battling an undisclosed inury from his fall against Memphis? His playoff numbers before and after are night and day so far.

No. He was 10-20 in game one.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Lee has really fallen off a cliff. I like Lee, but his shot is gone, he can't play any defense and he doesn't fit their offense. I understand the need to try something when your chips are down, but there is too much other talent on the team, imo, to go to Lee.

In the playoffs he hasn't produced much, but his efficiency in the Regular season was off the charts. He averaged 8 and 5 in 18 minutes a game on 51% shooting. He isn't as good a shooter but he does mostly everything else better than an out of shape/hobbled Speights right now. I agree he isn't going to win them this series, but they need someone with size to battle Thompson on the boards and Lee is the best per minute rebounder Golden State has.

 

[Knicks411]

Certainly the 07 roster.

Bad times
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2007.html

 

[Cusefan0307]

Certainly the 07 roster.

2001 Sixers with AI. George lynch, Aaron Mckie, Eric Snow, Tyrone Hill and washed up versions of Toni Kukoc and Dikembe Mutombo

 

[rrlbees]

I don't think this series has anything to do with James. He's played great and lost and played great and won. He can't play much better. This series is about Curry and the Warriors. Curry will decide who wins or loses the series.

 

[44cuse]

Draymond Green is so overrated. I will lose my mind if the Knicks even entertain the thought of maxing him out.

You're crazy dude. You know I like your NBA takes, but I saw or listened to almost every GSW game this year. Draymond is very, very good.

44cuse

 

[44cuse]

The Spurs, GSW and a handful of others are well run from top to bottom. It's like anything else in the business world. These orgs have the right people, systems and structures in place for success.

In the 18 years I have been a W's fan, these words have never been spoken. Anywhere.

44cuse

 

[44cuse]

the Cavs have now played Golden State 3 times with Lebron in the lineup and held the Warriors under 100 in regulation in every one of them - 2 of them in the most difficult road environment in the Association.

evidence usually trumps hope.

As a Warriors fan, I agree with this. And as someone who sees almost game, I agree with this. With one caveat...the Cavs have to play well every night. That was one of, if not the worst, games I have seen the GSW's play all year. But it wasn't because the Warriors had an off night. The Cavs MADE them have an off night. Steph Curry wasn't sick. Dellavadova beat him silly and out worked him (and that is hard to do). And Dellavadova was cramping at the end. So the question is part will the W's adjust...more high ball screens (which the Cavs weren't defending late in the game) to free Steph and Klay, but the bigger questions is can the Cavs do that three more times?

LeBron may have been showing signs of tiring (Draymond beat him on a OFF Reb for a bucket where LBJ didn't slide over) and can Dellevadova chase Steph that effectively every night. If they can, the Cavs will probably win because they took the W's out of their game.

44cuse

 

[44cuse]

Kudos to the Cavs for an excellent defensive game plan both of the games thus far that GS has not yet been able to adjust to.

Exactly. The Cavs AND LeBron deserve a $#%@ ton of credit for what they did defensively. Not about the W's playing poorly. It's about the Cavs making them play poorly.

44cuse

 

[NineOneSeven]

Exactly. The Cavs AND LeBron deserve a $#%@ ton of credit for what they did defensively. Not about the W's playing poorly. It's about the Cavs making them play poorly.

44cuse

Yes. But curry missed shots he usually
Makes. Not all were open (credit cavs), but certainly some.

 

[44cuse]

Yes. But curry missed shots he usually
Makes. Not all were open (credit cavs), but certainly some.

He definitely did. No question. The question, IMO, is still...can the Cavs play like that again 3 times?

44cuse

 

[MikeSU02]

In the 18 years I have been a W's fan, these words have never been spoken. Anywhere.

44cuse

Oh, I'm aware. Not as keenly aware as you are, I am sure, since you are a fan. But it sure seems like the house is in order now.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

I also live in akron so yes, you can imagine I interact with cavs fans often.

And osu fans.

How 'bout Zips and Golden Flashes fans?

 

[NineOneSeven]

How 'bout Zips and Golden Flashes fans?

Not too many zips fans. Mostly osu.

Decent amount of zips' soccer fans though.

 

[NineOneSeven]

He definitely did. No question. The question, IMO, is still...can the Cavs play like that again 3 times?

44cuse

It's intriguing. I've been enjoying it all.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

As a Warriors fan, I agree with this. And as someone who sees almost game, I agree with this. With one caveat...the Cavs have to play well every night. That was one of, if not the worst, games I have seen the GSW's play all year. But it wasn't because the Warriors had an off night. The Cavs MADE them have an off night. Steph Curry wasn't sick. Dellavadova beat him silly and out worked him (and that is hard to do). And Dellavadova was cramping at the end. So the question is part will the W's adjust...more high ball screens (which the Cavs weren't defending late in the game) to free Steph and Klay, but the bigger questions is can the Cavs do that three more times?

LeBron may have been showing signs of tiring (Draymond beat him on a OFF Reb for a bucket where LBJ didn't slide over) and can Dellevadova chase Steph that effectively every night. If they can, the Cavs will probably win because they took the W's out of their game.

44cuse

I don't watch all that much NBA hoops (Celts fan here) and definitely not Warriors games, but do they shoot that early in the shot clock that often. I saw a lot of what I call hero ball last night, not working the offense all that much. I really like when they do run the offense, and just hate to see Klay or Steph take a sideways shot off the curl while floating to one side with 6 seconds off the shot clock. I know Golden State doesn't seem to get all that many offensive rebounds, but you've got no shot of that when you don't even let your bigs get close to the paint.

 

[44cuse]

Oh, I'm aware. Not as keenly aware as you are, I am sure, since you are a fan. But it sure seems like the house is in order now.

It is. And it's interesting how they got there. Lacob was booed incessantly after trading Monta for Bogut. It was bad and it was on Chris Mullin number retirement night. But they focused on culture and they focused on advanced metrics and started building around those. The locker room is tight and it's generally what you would expect from a Spurs type (yes, they have a LONG LONG way to go to make that claim, I get that) situation.

Kind of a nice contrast to my first love which is in disarray (SU hoops).

44cuse

 

[44cuse]

I don't watch all that much NBA hoops (Celts fan here) and definitely not Warriors games, but do they shoot that early in the shot clock that often. I saw a lot of what I call hero ball last night, not working the offense all that much. I really like when they do run the offense, and just hate to see Klay or Steph take a sideways shot off the curl while floating to one side with 6 seconds off the shot clock. I know Golden State doesn't seem to get all that many offensive rebounds, but you've got no shot of that when you don't even let your bigs get close to the paint.

The answer is yes and no. More no than yes. The curl off the screen and let it rip...yep. Early in the shot clock...yep. But they usually get into their offense much more quickly. That's why I keep saying yeah, the W's played poorly, but I have seen them play poorly on nights when they just didn't play well. This was the Cavs making them play poorly.

#1 in Assists per game at 26.9.
#1 in shooting %
#1 in TS%
#1 in FG%

Basically...they move the ball incredibly well, they make the extra pass, and they knock down open shots. Steph opens up a lot of that with his ability as a playmaker (threat of shooting off the dribble) and the Cavs took them out of that.

44cuse