are there any JB defenders left?

[tptcuse]

I'm not sure if I'm a JB defender but I'm not interested in forcing him out. If the two choices are retire end of next season or force out end of this I pick the first.

How do we know those are the two choices? JB nor the university have given any indication that is the case.

 

[Eric15]

I dont agree on the end of 13-14.

We lost six out of our last nine games that year and haven't been the same program since.

 

[cuseinseattle]

We lost six out of our last nine games that year and haven't been the same program since.

We won 28 games and were the #1 seed in the nation

 

[RF2044]

Come on man it absolutely unequivocally is a 9 season slide. The 2014-15 season (perhaps even the end of the 2013-14 season) is precisely when we stopped playing conference games as a ranked team and started finishing at or below .500 every single year in conference play. The data couldn't be more straightforward.

Agreed.

But despite the clear trend, some people refuse to accept evidence that their baby's ugly.

 

[cuseinseattle]

How do we know those are the two choices? JB nor the university have given any indication that is the case.

We dont. I'm guessing

 

[DilemaCuse]

We won 28 games and were the #1 seed in the nation

Wrong, seeded as a 2 or 3 seed in buffalo, not a 1 seed. That after a 25-0 start. Eric15 is right.

 

[Scooch]

I don’t think its important to pinpoint when a decline began, or anything like that.

I’d sincerely like to hear from someone who thinks that JAB can turn SU back into a top 25 program. That’s what matters.

We haven’t been ranked at all in 4 years. Haven’t been ranked after January 1st in 9 years.

Is Boeheim the guy that will get us ranked again?

 

[Cusefan0307]

I don’t think its important to pinpoint when a decline began, or anything like that.

I’d sincerely like to hear from someone who thinks that JAB can turn SU back into a top 25 program. That’s what matters.

We haven’t been ranked at all in 4 years. Haven’t been ranked after January 1st in 9 years.

Is Boeheim the guy that will get us ranked again?

No.

And I’m someone who believes we would have won 22 or so games prior to the tournament had JB not had his suspension moved up in 2016, but arguing about the past doesn’t matter much at this point.

 

[samspann1]

Wrong, seeded as a 2 or 3 seed in buffalo, not a 1 seed. That after a 25-0 start. Eric15 is right.

3 seed. Listless effort in the Round of 32 against Dayton.

 

[NineOneSeven]

We won 28 games and were the #1 seed in the nation

We did, then we made 1 shot outside the paint and lost to Dayton. And some of us saw the glaring issues even at 25-0 while still somehow winning games because “a win is a win”, I guess. Until we stopped winning at that same frequency.

(I’ll take that season again though!)

 

[stuckinbig11]

me

 

[NineOneSeven]

You're throwing in a bs last sentence. I'm sure someone has said it but most people who think think you can't fire him don't think we will be sorry when he's gone

Everyone is in such a tizzy that they're misrepresenting people

You can't fire a legend for going.500

It’s easier if that person is 78 vs 64 though, right?

 

[OrangeDW]

3 seed. Listless effort in the Round of 32 against Dayton.

Didn’t make a shot outside of the paint the entire game, I believe?

 

[NineOneSeven]

Didn’t make a shot outside of the paint the entire game, I believe?

1, which is wild. Obviously that team had elite paint players, but that’s pretty wild.

 

[Dave]

i dont read this board as much as i used to (having a 3 yr old will do that) , but in the past whenever boeheim got criticized or soneone wanted him gone there were always posters running to his defense saying “ he built syracuse basketball, hes in the hall of fame, we made the final 4 recently, he deserves to leave whenever he wants, youll be sorry when hes gone, etc etc”

surely theres not any of those people left is there?? even the most committed jb defenders have gotta admit his a$$ has gotsta go.

and dont call me surely.

100% back Boeheim.

 

[Brooky03]

Come on man it absolutely unequivocally is a 9 season slide. The 2014-15 season (perhaps even the end of the 2013-14 season) is precisely when we stopped playing conference games as a ranked team and started finishing at or below .500 every single year in conference play. The data couldn't be more straightforward.

‘16 was a final four team. ‘18 was a 23 win Sweet 16.

Counting the slide before ‘18 is unreasonable and biased, imo.

 

[kcsu]

The school has also been very loyal to him. We went on probation not once but twice and there was never any talk about him getting fired. Both sides have been loyal. Jb is a wealthy man because of this arrangement.

One caveat. The chancellor only retained Jim after the second sanction based on JB agreeing to the succession plan. Hop was named coach in waiting, there was a date and Jim schemed his way out of it.
Jim hates Syv. He was never going to allow the succession plan to work.
EVER. Anyone who believes the bull about Hop at the last second passing on the SU job is delusional.
Jim has always been about Jim. Nothing wrong with that. But please realize the only reason Jim stayed at SU was because it suited his needs. Not some altruistic, i love my school crap. It was and continues to be about himself.

 

[OrangeDW]

‘16 was a final four team. ‘18 was a 23 win Sweet 16.

Counting the slide before ‘18 is unreasonable and biased, imo.

‘18 team was playing a walk on in a tourney win, and won because the other team couldn’t make a shot. We weren’t “good” that year.

‘21 team actually could’ve been “good” if it was handled right. Team underachieved though, as did 2019. When he couldn’t get right with either one of those teams, that’s when it really became obvious that it wasn’t going to happen again.

And obviously what has happened since that Houston loss in 21 has just been a train wreck of epic proportions.

 

[Eric15]

‘16 was a final four team.

You have to compartmentalize the excitement of 2016 with the reality of 2016.

We went 19-13 (9-9) prior to the tourney -- that is a mediocre season over a 32-game sample size. We were all shocked when we made the field and double shocked that we somehow avoided a play-in game. The dominos lined up incredibly in that we drew a 7 seed, 15 seed and 11 seed prior to the Elite 8. 6-7 minutes of magical Malachi Richardson basketball doesn't negate the prior 4 months of mediocre basketball if you're evaluating the reality of that season in an honest way.

(I literally ran a lap around my house after we beat Virginia. It was amazing.)

 

[RF2044]

You have to compartmentalize the excitement of 2016 with the reality of 2016.

We went 19-13 (9-9) prior to the tourney -- that is a mediocre season over a 32-game sample size. We were all shocked when we made the field and double shocked that we somehow avoided a play-in game. The dominos lined up incredibly in that we drew a 7 seed, 15 seed and 11 seed prior to the Elite 8. 6-7 minutes of magical Malachi Richardson basketball doesn't negate the prior 4 months of mediocre basketball if you're evaluating the reality of that season in an honest way.

(I literally ran a lap around my house after we beat Virginia. It was amazing.)

A couple of postseason runs temporarily masked the extent of the decline.

But I think most people are eyes wide open with respect to how the program is performing now.

 

[Eric15]

A couple of postseason runs temporarily masked the extent of the decline.

But I think most people are eyes wide open with respect to how the program is performing now.

It would be like evaluating someone in the NBA three point shooting contest based only on whether they made the moneyball at the end and ignoring their results in the rest of the rack.

 

[Brooky03]

You have to compartmentalize the excitement of 2016 with the reality of 2016.

We went 19-13 (9-9) prior to the tourney -- that is a mediocre season over a 32-game sample size. We were all shocked when we made the field and double shocked that we somehow avoided a play-in game. The dominos lined up incredibly in that we drew a 7 seed, 15 seed and 11 seed prior to the Elite 8. 6-7 minutes of magical Malachi Richardson basketball doesn't negate the prior 4 months of mediocre basketball if you're evaluating the reality of that season in an honest way.

(I literally ran a lap around my house after we beat Virginia. It was amazing.)

For me to get into the context of why I think ‘16 and ‘18 don’t count as bad (and ‘17 counts as a normal periodic down year), I’d have to get into another line of thought that brings with it even more controversy.

Some nights I have the energy to fight the whole board, some nights I don’t, so I’m bowing out.

To put it succinctly, as the JB Stan I’ve been labeled as, 2019 was the first time “maybe JB should hang it up” popped into my head for even a moment. If anybody is looking for a reason why I am/was a staunch defender of his it’s because this has been a few seasons of trash, for me, not a decade’s worth.

 

[Eric15]

2019 was the first time “maybe JB should hang it up” popped into my head for even a moment.

2019 was our best team of the past 9 years (only team to safely make the tourney with room to spare). That feels like the least logical year to be doubtful out of the nine. But if you’re bowing out fair enough. Have a good night.

 

[20plus]

irrefutable evidence is dismissed to make way for the next delusion, just so a loser and/or his minions can delay, deflect, & deny, just to forestall the inevitable.
The old saying " denial ain't just a river in Egypt" is apropos for these people, and they're not about to change.

I’d like to borrow this part! I can give you credit as this is top notch

 

[cuseinseattle]

One caveat. The chancellor only retained Jim after the second sanction based on JB agreeing to the succession plan. Hop was named coach in waiting, there was a date and Jim schemed his way out of it.
Jim hates Syv. He was never going to allow the succession plan to work.
EVER. Anyone who believes the bull about Hop at the last second passing on the SU job is delusional.
Jim has always been about Jim. Nothing wrong with that. But please realize the only reason Jim stayed at SU was because it suited his needs. Not some altruistic, i love my school crap. It was and continues to be about himself.

Syv only retained him because? JB has more power than Syv. That is why he used Hop to try and force JB hand. Anyone who met JB for 15 minutes could have told you how that would go. After Hop refused to be involved and bolted for Washington then Svd lost