Beyond the Orange Glasses

[Shenexon]

Putting down my orange glasses, I see a team that isn’t on a Clemson level yet, with a number of issues. However, I don’t see a program in crisis, either. The stats don’t look good, but SU is 1-2 early in the season with a new team in many ways, two games on the road, and a game against #1.

I think it unwise to read too much into that start. Let the season play out and avoid a comparison between Dino and Shafer. Did Shafer ever have a sellout or stimulate the sales of 9000 new season tickets? We may have set our expectations a tad high, but even that is uncertain. Many folks thought Maryland would be a tough game and it got out of hand. Clemson is a great team. Two losses do not a season make...

 

[AAM62]

we're going to end the season 9-4 or 10-3 and this same poster will start a Dino to UCLA thread...

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Dino's obviously not going anywhere and there's plenty of season left but expected a heck of alot more at this point. To be fair this entire board minus a few were convinced that Shafer needed to go. I won't argue that but we need to hold Dino to similar standards. There is plenty of time for improvement but hoping we get better is exactly that, just hoping. Until we see otherwise here is the current reality.

Current Rank Total Offense: 115

Current Rank Total Defense: 123

119 avg. Those are Gerg levels of futility.

Clemson...This year's beating equaled the worst beating of Shafer's career and that was in year 1 of his tenure. At no point did Shafer's meathead offense fail to score a TD against the Tigers. Let that sink in. This is year 4 for Dino and the best we could muster is 2 FGs with an offensive mastermind for a coach.

Maryland? Not a top 25 team. We got our doors blown off by a mediocre team ala GT 2013. Again that was Shafer's first year as a HC anywhere. This is Dino's 8th year as a HC and 4th year here. That shouldn't happen to a program on the rise.

As for last year. The majority of the key players were in fact Shafer recruits. Not sure Shafer could have done with them what Dino did, not sure that he couldn't either. We will never know. What I do know is that we had leadership, all over the field last year. There is no leadership on this team. Shafer recruited captains, it paid off when they became Seniors. Dino has lost recruiting battles left and right over the past year after his amazing season. If we finish 6-6 or worse this year then what? The fact is if we finish below .500 this year and based on what we've seen, there isn't much reason to think that's improbable, then last year looks like a fluke season on the back of Shafer's guys.

I don't blame Dino for Devito's struggles. Devito is still young and could still be great. I do blame Dino for the complete lack of OL and size/speed on the outside. Where are the WRs? Why do we have no running game at all? Why is Devito running for his life after every snap? It's year 4.

Where do you believe the rankings will land when the season is over?

 

[TheCusian]

First off, SS never approached a win as large as #18 VaTech in year 1, #4 Clemson in year 2, #20 WVU in year 3.

#119 after 3 games average this year is kind of a weird metric - I mean can I pluck 3 games from Shafer's last year and get there? Yeah, but I'm not sure what it will prove.

In year 3, Shafer was a combined #109 on the year (including the power house Rhode Island) - which is horrible.

 

[PAcuse]

Yikes Shafer and GROB reference.
Dino beat Clemson

Those other clowns almost destroyed this program
Hot take is a hot dump

 

[kuethstheman]

These are thoughts/observations that might occur to you. You keep them in your head, if you like, as you watch the season play out. You don't speak or write them down. What you write down, if anything, is "We're off to a bad start, aren't we."

 

[P Vasiloff]

I did, I said I'm not sure that Shafer could get those same recruits to the place we were last year, also said I'm not sure he couldn't either, we will never know.

Then your argument has to say that Shafer's only winning season was done with Marrone's recruits?

 

[djorange1989]

Then your argument has to say that Shafer's only winning season was done with Marrone's recruits?

And he was on staff for 4 years so theoretically half the roster(defense) were his guys, and he still sucked

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

Team sucks right now. They look unfocused. University is providing Babers with advantages no coach before him ever had. Right now, he's part of the problem. He spews platitudes and coach-speak BS as well as anybody. It's a new season. He needs to do better. (No, his seat is not even remotely warm, nor should it be).

 

[Trueblue25]

This is all i’ll say.

G Rob plummeted our program to depths that rivaled where Uconn’s at. We were not only awful, but laughable.

Marrone brought us back to near consistent competitiveness, but not quite relevance.

Marrone leaving killed us, and we flopped and made HCSS our HC. He was a players coach but woefully in over his head not only on the field but off. We recruited MAC size for a newly ACC program. We were back to borderline laughable with no improvement in sight.

Dino beat VTech his first year, then Clemson his second year and gave us 10 wins his third.


There may have been 8 wins over a 2 year period but we took stepping stones to relevance to lay the foundation to a return to the top 25. Now we’re experiencing the GROWING PAINS of maintaining relevance. We will be ok. Theres still a light in the tunnel, not just at the end. The improvement is still visible.

 

[qdawgg]

Wow, this feels like the first couple years of the Shafer reign. Not allowed to question anything the staff was doing without a full on attack.

Being in the 100’s in offense and defense is terrible. People can spin it and fall back on last years record if they want but I think Pyle has made some fair points and didn’t write anything in a trolling way. It’s kind of embarrassing nobody can have a mature conversation and are coming off so angry anyone would question the current staff.

 

[Trueblue25]

Wow, this feels like the first couple years of the Shafer reign. Not allowed to question anything the staff was doing without a full on attack.

Being in the 100’s in offense and defense is terrible. People can spin it and fall back on last years record if they want but I think Pyle has made some fair points and didn’t write anything in a trolling way. It’s kind of embarrassing nobody can have a mature conversation and are coming off so angry anyone would question the current staff.

That’ll happen when you win the camping world bowl in year 3, return the program to the top 25, sell out a game and represent our program the way Dino’s done.

He’s earned our trust imo, at least enough trust to buy him a chance to straighten things out after a 1-2 start. Im less concerned about the offense and defense rankings. We started off on a two game road trip and came back to the dome vs the number 1 team in the nation. It’ll happen.

 

[qdawgg]

That’ll happen when you win the camping world bowl in year 3, return the program to the top 25, sell out a game and represent our program the way Dino’s done.

He’s earned our trust imo, at least enough trust to buy him a chance to straighten things out after a 1-2 start. Im less concerned about the offense and defense rankings. We started off on a two game road trip and came back to the dome vs the number 1 team in the nation. It’ll happen.

I don’t disagree with any of this at all.

Recruiting scares me a little because that’s an area that rears it’s head 2-3 yrs from now. Especially a program like ours that doesn’t get a lot of instant starters.

But you’re right, he deserves the right to get things back on track.

 

[Trueblue25]

I don’t disagree with any of this at all.

Recruiting scares me a little because that’s an area that rears it’s head 2-3 yrs from now. Especially a program like ours that doesn’t get a lot of instant starters.

But you’re right, he deserves the right to get things back on track.

Recruiting scares me too. I do not think we’ve recruited impressively, rather realistically.

Most of these highschool kids have only seen Syracuse ranked once in their lives, or relevant once in their lives. We are not a name. Dino’s gotta recreate the wheel we broke.

It’s going to take more than a 10 win season and a genuine well meaning coach. I consider this season a success if we return to a bowl and win it. That’s the reasonable goal.

We have to rebuild the Syracuse brand back to a winning brand before we can expect any significant uptick in recruiting outside of the occasional big wins like Mikel Jones and Trill

 

[Comstock44]

This is all i’ll say.

G Rob plummeted our program to depths that rivaled where Uconn’s at. We were not only awful, but laughable.

Marrone brought us back to near consistent competitiveness, but not quite relevance.

Marrone leaving killed us, and we flopped and made HCSS our HC. He was a players coach but woefully in over his head not only on the field but off. We recruited MAC size for a newly ACC program. We were back to borderline laughable with no improvement in sight.

Dino beat VTech his first year, then Clemson his second year and gave us 10 wins his third.


There may have been 8 wins over a 2 year period but we took stepping stones to relevance to lay the foundation to a return to the top 25. Now we’re experiencing the GROWING PAINS of maintaining relevance. We will be ok. Theres still a light in the tunnel, not just at the end. The improvement is still visible.

GRob didn't plummet our program, Nancy Cantor did.

Exhibit 1A: Cantor rescinding GRob's scholarship offer to Colt Brennan

Colt, We Never Got The Chance To Know Ye

OK, the guy did something very wrong and very stupid on the night of Jan. 28, 2004, when -- uninvited, and in a drunken state -- he entered the dorm room of a female student at the University of Colorado...

www.syracuse.com

 

[Scooch]

“Expected a heck of a lot more”...

I expected to be 2-1 right now. We’re 1-2. Let’s play the next 9 games and see if we can make up that 1 game.

The Shafer comparisons are ludicrous on their face.

 

[qdawgg]

Recruiting scares me too. I do not think we’ve recruited impressively, rather realistically.

Most of these highschool kids have only seen Syracuse ranked once in their lives, or relevant once in their lives. We are not a name. Dino’s gotta recreate the wheel we broke.

It’s going to take more than a 10 win season and a genuine well meaning coach. I consider this season a success if we return to a bowl and win it. That’s the reasonable goal.

We have to rebuild the Syracuse brand back to a winning brand before we can expect any significant uptick in recruiting outside of the occasional big wins like Mikel Jones and Trill

I’m happy with a bowl too, i didn’t expect a miracle season this year. Two bowl years in a row and I’ll be ecstatic.

I feel like recruiting has gotta “break” for
us at some point. We’re doing all the right things. But massive changes don’t happen instantly. Stick to the plan and it’ll work out.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Wow, this feels like the first couple years of the Shafer reign. Not allowed to question anything the staff was doing without a full on attack.

Being in the 100’s in offense and defense is terrible. People can spin it and fall back on last years record if they want but I think Pyle has made some fair points and didn’t write anything in a trolling way. It’s kind of embarrassing nobody can have a mature conversation and are coming off so angry anyone would question the current staff.

But do you think we're going to stay in the 100s?

 

[qdawgg]

But do you think we're going to stay in the 100s?

Definitely not. But I’m worried we might end up in the 60-80 range and I’m not really sure what that would mean, if that makes sense. I don’t think we’ll be in the 80’s the more I think about it. I think we’re going to be disappointed with the offense this year, overall. And I really hope I’m just being super pessimistic

 

[MadNY3]

I said look beyond the glasses. You didn't. Babers didn't get 10 wins with his own recruits. We stopped being relevant in week 2 and many questioned our relevancy after week 1. We haven't performed this poorly on both sides of the ball in a very long time.

Shafer didn't get 10 wins with his own recruits. But that Villanova trick play to win was killer.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Get a grip.

 

[OrangePA]

well, that's sporting of you, sounds like you are hoping we do struggle. No one on here is saying everything is great this year, things are awesome. the team has played terribly, and we will see what happens. the point is that Babers has done 1000X more for this program in his first 3 years than Shafer and shouldn't be compared to that meathead because we are off to a bad start this year.

Shaffer is hardly a meathead.

 

[djorange1989]

Wow, this feels like the first couple years of the Shafer reign. Not allowed to question anything the staff was doing without a full on attack.

Being in the 100’s in offense and defense is terrible. People can spin it and fall back on last years record if they want but I think Pyle has made some fair points and didn’t write anything in a trolling way. It’s kind of embarrassing nobody can have a mature conversation and are coming off so angry anyone would question the current staff.

It’s a full on attack because he was comparing the 1-2 start to Shafer’s entire garbage resume. Questioning is fine, hyperbole will get a deserved kick in the arse

 

[syrBossHogg]

Shaffer is hardly a meathead.

He was absolutely a meathead

 

[dollarbill44]

I should have looked deeper and I will concede this point about the recruits. I will say whatever special blend of spices he cooked up last year is absolutely incomplete without Custis, Dungey, Strickland, most of the OL, Pierce(yes I know he was a Dino recruit, I'm conceding remember), etc. Why is that? What is lacking in our recruiting that as soon as Shafer's guys leave the building our team looks like it just doesn't care anymore.

Now you're just making things up to fit your narrative. You say you are looking "beyond the orange glasses". What you're really doing is massaging facts to try to show that Dino isn't a very good coach (i.e. comparable to Shafer).
You failed to establish that Shafer could coach at all. Claiming he was better against Clemson because his teams never failed to score a TD is a ludicrous point. He also never beat Clemson or came within a breath of beating them a second time. You also failed to point out that Clemson then was not the equal to Clemson while Dino has been coach. FSU was top dog then. How did Shafers teams do against FSU? I'll save you the trouble, they were AWFUL.
If you're going to pretend to put forth an impartial argument, you should at least try to use impartial facts.