Big East might be looking at a Grant of Rights...

[Jake]

Word is starting to leak out that if the Big East is to get a huge payday, it would involve a grant of rights signover similar to the big 12. That means once its signed, those teams are there for the duration of the contract.

If true, thats going to be a hard sell to the Lville's, UCONN's and Rutgers of the world. Especially Louisville...which is oh so close to an exit. Especially coming from a commissioner who just came from the TV side of things. I would think it would spark a few "who's side are you on, anyway" type of reactions.

It would also present an issue if ND were to stay. You know there is no way ND is signing that. Would have to think this could pave the way for ND to bolt to the ACC for all sports but football.

 

[orangepassion]

Interesting

 

[oldpinepoint]

Word is starting to leak out that if the Big East is to get a huge payday, it would involve a grant of rights signover similar to the big 12. That means once its signed, those teams are there for the duration of the contract.

If true, thats going to be a hard sell to the Lville's, UCONN's and Rutgers of the world. Especially Louisville...which is oh so close to an exit. Especially coming from a commissioner who just came from the TV side of things. I would think it would spark a few "who's side are you on, anyway" type of reactions.

It would also present an issue if ND were to stay. You know there is no way ND is signing that. Would have to think this could pave the way for ND to bolt to the ACC for all sports but football.

Could split the conference too between the Bball and Fball. No way the football schools sign it.

 

[qdawgg]

Could there be a separate part of the agreement that specifically caters to ND? Almost a, your all in this for the long haul whether you like it or not; except ND?

 

[Jake]

http://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/index.ssf/2012/08/mike_aresco_introduced_as_new.html

Read this article. A source is quoted regarding the grant of rights.

 

[TexanMark]

Word is starting to leak out that if the Big East is to get a huge payday, it would involve a grant of rights signover similar to the big 12. That means once its signed, those teams are there for the duration of the contract.

If true, thats going to be a hard sell to the Lville's, UCONN's and Rutgers of the world. Especially Louisville...which is oh so close to an exit. Especially coming from a commissioner who just came from the TV side of things. I would think it would spark a few "who's side are you on, anyway" type of reactions.

It would also present an issue if ND were to stay. You know there is no way ND is signing that. Would have to think this could pave the way for ND to bolt to the ACC for all sports but football.

It'll be all or nothing...I don't see a few going for it.
The ACC is rumored to be close to getting the ND deal hammered out.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

ND isn't going to sign away its rights (excluding football) and neither is Louisville or UCONN or Rutgers. I doubt even Boise State would agree to the GOR with prospects of the Big 12 and fantasies of the PAC in its future.

The same article that references the source also suggests that the BE might be able to triple its current per team take. That would give all-sports schools such as Temple, Memphis and UCF $18 million per year!!! Sure, and if you believe that you probably believe that Mike Slive is going to have second thoughts and will beg WVU to turn its back on Texas to come save the SEC.

 

[HtownOrange]

If the payday is sufficient, Louisville might sign, especially if it is for less than 10 years. A GOR has a declining value over time so granting something (GOR) for the first few years, really is nothing more than stating the obvious, Louisville (UConn, Rutgers, anyone else) is not going anywhere soon. If the Bevo 12 expands in a few years, and Louisville is selected, it would be easy enough to assume some kind of deal to assist Louisville would be in place.

A GOR is just a contract line stating mitigated damages. It will only be used as a starting point to negotiate an exit fee, nothing more.

The Bevo 12 will not expand unless they can get more money. As they are already getting paid for 12 teams and a championship game, it has been made clear to them that they will not get an increase on the current deal. ESPN holds the first tier rights until 2016(?), so expansion before then is probably not happening. Fox has made clear they will not increase payouts but will ensure an equal share for their side of the TV deal (second tier rights).

 

[44PRIDE]

Louisville is the one BE school that can actually absorb a GOR payout such as this.

 

[Orangello]

"adding superb institutions in football and basketball........"

 

[Orangello]

If Rutgers GOR was real estate

 

[kingottoiii]

We will see how ugly things get. If ESPN offers $10 million a year with no GOR while NBC offers $15 million but GOR, then we might see some internal fighting.

 

[baggerbob]

If they try for a GOR, Notre Dame leaves and takes someone with them. The Irish would blow up the league before signing.

 

[reedny]

Jake,

Word is starting to leak out that if the Big East is to get a huge payday, it would involve a grant of rights signover similar to the big 12. That means once its signed, those teams are there for the duration of the contract.

If true, thats going to be a hard sell to the Lville's, UCONN's and Rutgers of the world. Especially Louisville...which is oh so close to an exit. Especially coming from a commissioner who just came from the TV side of things. I would think it would spark a few "who's side are you on, anyway" type of reactions.

It would also present an issue if ND were to stay. You know there is no way ND is signing that. Would have to think this could pave the way for ND to bolt to the ACC for all sports but football.

Jake, if you're referring to 3d tier rights, some comparison/background information might be helpful. Our existing BE contract conveys 1st and 2nd tier rights to ESPN and ESPN regional. 3d tier rights are retained by individual schools -- that's why SU can sell its coaching programs to TW, along with BB/FB games not picked up by ESPN regional (2nd tier).

The ACC recently inked a similar deal. Although there is some confusion about the third tier rights, it looks like SU will still be able to make money (i.e., retain the 3d tier rights to) its coaching programs and some FB/BB games that are not picked up by ESPN or ESPN regional.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm...rights-and-why-theyre-killing-the-conference/

If the BE's new comish wants schools to give up those 3d tier rights in favor of a big payout, then schools will have an individual calculation to make. Schools with a big fan base like ND, that make lots of money selling 3d tier programming, will probably say no. Schools like L'vill and UConn .. not so sure -- remember that they'll be comparing $6M + (maybe $1M 3d tier rights), to 15 million or more. So I'm not sure that a grant of rights would automatically detonate the league -- it'll just put pressure on schools like ND to S...t or get off the pot.

Solidifying the BE is going to take some brinksmanship, and this new guy might be able to pull it off with minimal defections if he plays it right. Personally, I hope ND is left twisting in the wind...it's snub of ESPN's 1.2 B offer is the reason that the BE is without Pitt and SU and in its current predicament.

 

[44PRIDE]

It wouldn't surprise me to see a football/b-ball split happen. Separate once and for all.

 

[MadNY3]

It wouldn't surprise me to see a football/b-ball split happen. Separate once and for all.

It also would not surprise me for this to be one of the shorter commissioner stints either.

 

[Chip]

I assume Rutgers is taking the Texas Longhorn approach. If we go, the league dies with our exit, so therefore signing the GOR is meaningless.

You know this is being typed right now on one of their boards.

 

[HtownOrange]

Jake,

Jake, if you're referring to 3d tier rights, some comparison/background information might be helpful. Our existing BE contract conveys 1st and 2nd tier rights to ESPN and ESPN regional. 3d tier rights are retained by individual schools -- that's why SU can sell its coaching programs to TW, along with BB/FB games not picked up by ESPN regional (2nd tier).

The ACC recently inked a similar deal. Although there is some confusion about the third tier rights, it looks like SU will still be able to make money (i.e., retain the 3d tier rights to) its coaching programs and some FB/BB games that are not picked up by ESPN or ESPN regional.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm...rights-and-why-theyre-killing-the-conference/

If the BE's new comish wants schools to give up those 3d tier rights in favor of a big payout, then schools will have an individual calculation to make. Schools with a big fan base like ND, that make lots of money selling 3d tier programming, will probably say no. Schools like L'vill and UConn .. not so sure -- remember that they'll be comparing $6M + (maybe $1M 3d tier rights), to 15 million or more. So I'm not sure that a grant of rights would automatically detonate the league -- it'll just put pressure on schools like ND to S...t or get off the pot.

Solidifying the BE is going to take some brinksmanship, and this new guy might be able to pull it off with minimal defections if he plays it right. Personally, I hope ND is left twisting in the wind...it's snub of ESPN's 1.2 B offer is the reason that the BE is without Pitt and SU and in its current predicament.

Good analysis, but the figures are off. UConn gets $8MM ($80MM over 10 years, they get around $1MM for their SNY deal alone) for 3rd tier. Louisville does well, too. ND's rights are presumably much more. I agree that the value of the deal will really dictate how the schools will react to a GOR. If the deal is north of $10MM/school, then the GOR comes more into play. The better the deal, the more likely a GOR is in play.

In comparison, FSU gets $6.5MM for their 3rd tier rights (radio, coaches shows, etc.) though ESPN gets the actual games. NCState just signed for $6MM, I think. Syracuse should do well enough, too.

 

[baggerbob]

Don't you think the head of the expansion committee figured this was going to happen, and now has a legitimate excuse to abandon ship? I've felt all along with the adding of teams, which made no sense from a logistics standpoint, was an attempt to be able to say we did everything we could, but it just didn't work.

 

[SmilinBob]

Just say that the football split from the hoops schools, how would it take for them to play in the NCAA's and what bowl deals could they get?
Another thing is they would HAVE to do this GOR thing if they do separate but would they even be attractive without Nova, GT, Marquette, ND and St.Johns? Would NBC or ESPN pay 15m? I still see teams wanting to get out at the first sign of a conference opening, especially Louisville who I think is the best choice out there outside of ND. ND and Louisville to the ACC would just be the thing that gives the ACC the best of all worlds, one very good private school and one below average academic school but both choices would help ease the little tension the ACC has right now regarding the Academic/Football school debate. To me, a great compromise.

 

[SUinNYC]

Just say that the football split from the hoops schools, how would it take for them to play in the NCAA's and what bowl deals could they get?
Another thing is they would HAVE to do this GOR thing if they do separate but would they even be attractive without Nova, GT, Marquette, ND and St.Johns? Would NBC or ESPN pay 15m? I still see teams wanting to get out at the first sign of a conference opening, especially Louisville who I think is the best choice out there outside of ND. ND and Louisville to the ACC would just be the thing that gives the ACC the best of all worlds, one very good private school and one below average academic school but both choices would help ease the little tension the ACC has right now regarding the Academic/Football school debate. To me, a great compromise.

Louisville would be great from an athletics point of view for the ACC, but I just don't see it happening. Academics are still very important to many members.

 

[SmilinBob]

Louisville would be great from an athletics point of view for the ACC, but I just don't see it happening. Academics are still very important to many members.

Agreed but now is the time to add them and get the FSU's, Clemson's and VT's on board 100%. UNC is having their little academic scandal so this compromise could be the thing that has those "football" schools look the other way when Swofford gives UNC a free pass. If this ND thing really does have any legs I'd like to strike before the Big 12 goes after UL and this should keep FSU or Clemson out of the Big 12 and hopefully the SEC as well. Plus, Louisville will keep that southern feel many desire in the ACC and will help their travel coasts as well unlike any other choice out there.

The only downfall is that Rick Pitino will turn down the offer for Louisville to leave.

 

[reedny]

Good analysis, but the figures are off. UConn gets $8MM ($80MM over 10 years, they get around $1MM for their SNY deal alone) for 3rd tier. Louisville does well, too. ND's rights are presumably much more. I agree that the value of the deal will really dictate how the schools will react to a GOR. If the deal is north of $10MM/school, then the GOR comes more into play. The better the deal, the more likely a GOR is in play.

In comparison, FSU gets $6.5MM for their 3rd tier rights (radio, coaches shows, etc.) though ESPN gets the actual games. NCState just signed for $6MM, I think. Syracuse should do well enough, too.

Ok, thank you -- I'm familiar with the concepts but my figures were just estimates, so I appreciate you filling in a few blanks.

Even with your figures, however, if UConn makes 8M for 3d tier (I underestimated this), they will still have a choice to make if a new BE deal is offered at ... 15 million or greater, even with a GOR.

We don't know what the offer will be, but it's likely to be less than the ACC's deal of 17M per school for 1st and 2nd tier rights, with no GOR. That leaves 3d tier rights available, and for a school like SU, this could be lucrative. In the BE, I think our 3d tier income came mostly from TW .. in the ACC, the 3d tier provider will probably be different .. (Raycom?).

At any rate, a GOR offer in the BE won't necessarily send schools fleeing to other leagues -- unless (as before) ND becomes the proverbial wrench in the works. If you remember a couple of years ago it was ND that turned down ESPN's offer (reportedly 1.2B) causing SU and Pitt to baulk. It seemed like ND used a "veto" to say no -- suggesting a voting system under which any member school can scuttle a deal. If this is still true, it makes league consensus a bit harder to achieve, as Jake is suggesting.

 

[SUinNYC]

Agreed but now is the time to add them and get the FSU's, Clemson's and VT's on board 100%. UNC is having their little academic scandal so this compromise could be the thing that has those "football" schools look the other way when Swofford gives UNC a free pass. If this ND thing really does have any legs I'd like to strike before the Big 12 goes after UL and this should keep FSU or Clemson out of the Big 12 and hopefully the SEC as well. Plus, Louisville will keep that southern feel many desire in the ACC and will help their travel coasts as well unlike any other choice out there.

The only downfall is that Rick Pitino will turn down the offer for Louisville to leave.

Would love it if it happened. Think Louisville is a great program. Really like playing them in both hoops and football.

 

[kingottoiii]

Would love it if it happened. Think Louisville is a great program. Really like playing them in both hoops and football.

I would like to see the ACC add ND, Navy, Louisville, and Rutgers for all sports. That gives the ACC a FB power, a BBall power, and completes the Eastern seaboard. So the ACC would be at 18 teams.

For BBall you play everyone once and your rival a second time for 18 games. Navy BBall stinks but with all the other BBall schools it will be nice to have one cupcake a year. Also with a move to the ACC maybe they become better. Air Force is able to be decent, why can't Navy become the Providence of the ACC?

For FB you split into three divisions like so:

North- ND, Pitt, SU, BC, RU, Navy
Atlantic- Clemson, VT, UVA, UNC, NC St, Duke
South- FSU, Miami, GA Tech, MD, Louisville, Wake

So you play your 5 division mates, and then rotate games vs the rest of the teams for an 8 game schedule. Teams in other divisions you play once every four years. This wouldn't be ideal for ND but should keep them happy enough. Their division is relatively easy. They get to play Pitt, BC, and Navy every year. Then SU and RU allow for NYC area games. Playing 8 ACC games still allows for USC, Stanford, and two more OOC games. I am sure they would like to add cupcakes for those but that means they have to give up games vs the B1G (Purdue, Michigan, Mich St). As to the ACC Championship, I don't see why the NCAA wouldn't allow for a 3 team playoff. That means ONE team and only ONE team has an extra game to play. If not then just take the highest two ranked division winners for the ACC CG. Which again is an advantage for ND being in a weaker group.