Bob Knight Rips John Wooden

[MSOrange]

He's not wrong. Good grief - now I'm agreeing with Bob Knight. What a day already!

Bob Knight slams legendary coach John Wooden, says UCLA cheated in recruiting

 

[CaptainJ]

Glad to see Imay be the first, but not the only person to mention Wooden in a thread title today. 32 views and no one with an answer yet to mine. Maybe I'll set an over/under on when I'll get an answer.

Hey, people slammed MLK Jr for cheating, and he has a national holiday and many streets named after him, so I don't see why John Wooden should be held in higher esteem. I mean, he made Bill Walton get a hair cut with threats of banning him from the team, so I dont consider him a deity or anything.

Of course if you look at his final team, it wasnt about mega recruits.

And more on the my media theme... what's the deal with the completely unrelated video above the article that accuses Bob Knight of groping chicks? What does that have to do with this story? It would be like having a video of Boeheim defending Bernie and/or calling Andy Capp an idiot above some article about completely unrelated controversial statements he made. If it wasnt purposeful, I'd say the media seems schizophrenic.

 

[721Comstock]

He's not wrong.

Wooden was a great coach, and a great leader and molder of men.

But - he would not have had the legendary results he did, had not ALL the best recruits been getting funneled to his program by boosters and bagmen.

As PayPal Cal has shown, getting great players alone isn't enough to win the 'ship every year -
but it certainly increases your odds of doing so.

 

[Newhouser]

Shocker. College hoops was dirty in the 60s. Don't get Knight's win with the comment. He's right but everyone knows it.

 

[Col. Bleep]

...calling Andy Capp an idiot...

Even Bobby Knight wouldn't call Andy Capp an idiot.

But his assessment of John Wooden is reasonably accurate.
Knight wasn't always so reasonable.
He still denies putting his hands on the IU student.
But that incident was just the last straw at IU.

And perhaps his biggest offense was his alleged broadcasting work.
Few people have put so little into a job.
If one of his players did that Bobby Knight might have resorted to something beyond belief...like choking him.

 

[dollarbill44]

So, Bob Knight didn't get any help from IU's boosters in getting recruits? Nobody's father woke up to a new tractor being delivered? I bet he has some nice views of other coaches in his glass house.

 

[MSOrange]

So, Bob Knight didn't get any help from IU's boosters in getting recruits? Nobody's father woke up to a new tractor being delivered? I bet he has some nice views of other coaches in his glass house.

I honestly don't think he did. Can't stand the guy but I think he is one of those guys who has a lot of integrity when it comes to recruiting and things like that but not much when it comes to other areas of his life.

 

[Oakland]

Bjorn Borg was far worse as an announcer, but english was his second or third language so he has an excuse.

Even Bobby Knight wouldn't call Andy Capp an idiot.

But his assessment of John Wooden is reasonably accurate.
Knight wasn't always so reasonable.
He still denies putting his hands on the IU student.
But that incident was just the last straw at IU.

And perhaps his biggest offense was his alleged broadcasting work.
Few people have put so little into a job.
If one of his players did that Bobby Knight might have resorted to something beyond belief...like choking him.

 

[dollarbill44]

I honestly don't think he did. Can't stand the guy but I think he is one of those guys who has a lot of integrity when it comes to recruiting and things like that but not much when it comes to other areas of his life.

I'm not saying he was actively involved in anything shady recruiting wise, just that it seems very unlikely that there weren't boosters and alums working behind the scenes to get recruits to Indiana who had access to coach Knight where information about recruits could have been discussed.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I think everything Knight said is correct and really there isn't a counter argument as far as I know. Wooden was a good guy and a good coach but Gilbert cheated like crazy to bring kids in. Many from NYC I might add. That is the reality. You can say things like, well everyone does it or whatever but that is just deflecting.

 

[Cowtown]

Big, bad Bobby Knight, talking trash on a dead guy. Is he trying to take some of sting out of his own fall from grace? If he really had any balls he'd have taken Wooden on while he was still alive. There was plenty of time over the years. But he didn't. Typical Knight bully job.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Big, bad Bobby Knight, talking trash on a dead guy. Is he trying to take some of sting out of his own fall from grace? If he really had any balls he'd have taken Wooden on while he was still alive. There was plenty of time over the years. But he didn't. Typical Knight bully job.

He was being interviewed and the lead in was UCLA and John Wooden. How is that bullying? He gave an honest answer that is supported by reality. He made the point he was a good coach and liked him as a person.

 

[Townie72]

Big, bad Bobby Knight, talking trash on a dead guy. Is he trying to take some of sting out of his own fall from grace? If he really had any balls he'd have taken Wooden on while he was still alive. There was plenty of time over the years. But he didn't. Typical Knight bully job.

Probably has something to do with this being in an interview in which a question was asked. No question? No Knight response.

"In an interview on "Undeniable with Joe Buck," which will air in its entirety on Wednesday night at 8 p.m. ET, Knight didn't mince words discussing his beef with Wooden and the way UCLA's program was grown through the assistance of notorious Bruins booster Sam Gilbert in recruiting.

"I have a lot of respect for Wooden as a coach, how he coached," Knight said. "He was a good coach. But from then on, and I don't mind saying it, I don't respect Wooden, because he allowed Sam Gilbert to do whatever it took to recruit kids."

Are you saying that Gilbert and UCLA were innocent/

Are you suggesting that Wooden didn't know what Gilbert was doing?

Or is Wooden somehow beyond criticism?

 

[Cowtown]

Probably has something to do with this being in an interview in which a question was asked. No question? No Knight response.

"In an interview on "Undeniable with Joe Buck," which will air in its entirety on Wednesday night at 8 p.m. ET, Knight didn't mince words discussing his beef with Wooden and the way UCLA's program was grown through the assistance of notorious Bruins booster Sam Gilbert in recruiting.

"I have a lot of respect for Wooden as a coach, how he coached," Knight said. "He was a good coach. But from then on, and I don't mind saying it, I don't respect Wooden, because he allowed Sam Gilbert to do whatever it took to recruit kids."

Are you saying that Gilbert and UCLA were innocent/

Are you suggesting that Wooden didn't know what Gilbert was doing?

Or is Wooden somehow beyond criticism?

Nowhere did I defend Wooden. But Bob Knight is a miserable POS. Just IMHO, of course.

 

[DCCuse]

So, Bob Knight didn't get any help from IU's boosters in getting recruits? Nobody's father woke up to a new tractor being delivered? I bet he has some nice views of other coaches in his glass house.

Ding, ding, ding. For all the perception of Knight running a clean program, things happen everywhere. High school friend of mine transferred into IU and worked at a local shoe store. Widely known that hoops players could come in and pick out whatever they wanted by just signing their name.

 

[Townie72]

Nowhere did I defend Wooden. But Bob Knight is a miserable POS. Just IMHO, of course.

So, therefore, anything he says is wrong, objectionable and just further proof he is a POS? Have I got that about right?

Seems to me that Wooden is probably guilty as charged.

Now as to Knight being the one to point that out, that's a problem. He's controversial enough as it it. People just don't want to hear the unvarnished truth from Bobby Knight and they don't like heroes being knocked off their pedestals even if it is the truth (or is likely to be the truth).

 

[DoctorBombay]

Bjorn Borg was far worse as an announcer, but english was his second or third language so he has an excuse.

By far, the worst attempt at “athlete-to-announcer” was Eric Dickerson. SNL even did a sketch on him, it was so bad:

 

[Townie72]

Ding, ding, ding. For all the perception of Knight running a clean program, things happen everywhere. High school friend of mine transferred into IU and worked at a local shoe store. Widely known that hoops players could come in and pick out whatever they wanted by just signing their name.

Shoes are one thing. Bags of cash are another. There are degrees of this. A coach can't easily control what a shoe store does. But a guy like Gilbert doing what he was doing at the level he was doing it is a different matter.

 

[RMH44]

He's not wrong.

Wooden was a great coach, and a great leader and molder of men.

But - he would not have had the legendary results he did, had not ALL the best recruits been getting funneled to his program by boosters and bagmen.

As PayPal Cal has shown, getting great players alone isn't enough to win the 'ship every year -
but it certainly increases your odds of doing so.

It was back then! Not as many (if any) developmental camps or AAU tournaments to scout. The talent pool was significantly shallower back in the day.

 

[dasher]

Ding, ding, ding. For all the perception of Knight running a clean program, things happen everywhere. High school friend of mine transferred into IU and worked at a local shoe store. Widely known that hoops players could come in and pick out whatever they wanted by just signing their name.

I had a client that was a member of his '76 title team. He told me straight out that while there was no money to go to IU, once you were there, the boosters took care of you. Big money for your game tickets. That sort of thing.

 

[cuse10]

UCLA was the second highest paid team in LA behind the Lakers at one point.

 

[Cowtown]

So, therefore, anything he says is wrong, objectionable and just further proof he is a POS? Have I got that about right?

Seems to me that Wooden is probably guilty as charged.

Now as to Knight being the one to point that out, that's a problem. He's controversial enough as it it. People just don't want to hear the unvarnished truth from Bobby Knight and they don't like heroes being knocked off their pedestals even if it is the truth (or is likely to be the truth).

Wooden is not really a hero to me. I know UCLA benefited during his tenure from what are today egregious recruiting violations. However I learned a lot from him about how to coach a bball team, about how to think about what you're doing or need to adjust to. Even winning with dignity (that said, it's easy to be calm, cool and collected when you're kicking everyone's ass every year). Nevertheless, nobody cheered harder against UCLA during their fabled run than I did, especially in the Elvin Hayes game in the Astrodome. But the only thing I learned from Bobby Knight is how not to behave.

 

[Cowtown]

Shoes are one thing. Bags of cash are another. There are degrees of this. A coach can't easily control what a shoe store does. But a guy like Gilbert doing what he was doing at the level he was doing it is a different matter.

Surely you know those shoes turned into cash within an hour, don't you? Do you think a control freak like Knight didn't know that was happening?

 

[Townie72]

Surely you know those shoes turned into cash within an hour, don't you? Do you think a control freak like Knight didn't know that was happening?

How many pairs of shoes would you have to get and then resell to get $10,000?

You don't seem to be grasping the concept of scale.

In the 60's it was an open secret that SU football players had jobs at a local car dealership that were not generally available to the general public. But it was, by the standards of the day, small time stuff.

 

[dasher]

How many pairs of shoes would you have to get and then resell to get $10,000?

You don't seem to be grasping the concept of scale.

In the 60's it was an open secret that SU football players had jobs at a local car dealership that were not generally available to the general public. But it was, by the standards of the day, small time stuff.

You're not getting it. The sneakers didn't sell for face value.