Brown opponent passer rating rankings

[AZOrange]

So they use the forum to make feel like they know something about the game. Not to have inclusive discussions about a team we all have passion for.

It’s a cute way of saying “I hate Fran brown!” While trying to hide it behind “I hope he works out great!”

 

[Millhouse]

Yes let’s justify calling people idiots

He wanted me to be forthcoming

 

[Millhouse]

So they use the forum to make themselves feel like they know something about the game. Not to have inclusive discussions about a team we all have passion for.

Or, hear me out, I'm just saying what I think. It is a dumb risk that of course isn't certain to fail. I'm sorry that az doesn't understand probabilities

 

[Millhouse]

Using unit rankings to determine how good he will be as a head coach is like us using Georgia championships to justify how good he will be

The smart people here think there is no correlation between being good at coaching a position and being good at coaching a team

A whole new world of coaching candidates has opened up to us. Think of all the subpar position coaches who have experience knowing what is like to coach and recruit here

 

[money3189]

Or, hear me out, I'm just saying what I think. It is a dumb risk that of course isn't certain to fail. I'm sorry that az doesn't understand probabilities

I know. We all just sayin what we feel

 

[TheCusian]

The smart people here think there is no correlation between being good at coaching a position and being good at coaching a team

A whole new world of coaching candidates has opened up to us. Think of all the subpar position coaches who have experience knowing what is like to coach and recruit here

There’s correlation. And he coaches at one of the best programs in all of CFB. And that HC, his players, beat writers, and the premier agent in the business all think he’s an elite coach.

There’s a problem with your numbers as multiple posters have pointed out.

You have a limited and faulty data set and are trying to extrapolate some big takeaway to say it’s too risky when everyone already agrees that it’s a risky hire.

The information you don’t have (leadership, organizational, communication ability, connections, CEO skills, whatever he shared w JW and the search team to demonstrate those things) is what you don’t know and might mitigate the risk to an acceptable level.

No one here is saying “we should always hire position coaches” or “this will for sure work out” or whatever else nonsense you’re attributing to ppl. Everyone agrees it’s sn out of the box hire with wide variance in outcomes - I think that’s fun.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

It seems to me that in FB, because of all of the layers of coaches between the HC and the players, you want to first hire a leader of men as your HC. He should have a vision of what he wants his subordinates to carry out for him, in terms of offense, defense, etc.
The HC should have great belief in himself and have an ability to identify and hire great teachers of the game.
He needs to be decisive and able to make decisions without fear of failure guiding his choices.
He needs to be able to delegate and trust the people under him to do their jobs.
He needs to be able to rally and galvanize his team to believe in him and each other and to carry out their jobs on the field to bring success.
Lastly, he needs to take all blame on behalf of his subordinates and to deflect all praise to those under him.

 

[Millhouse]

There’s correlation. And he coaches at one of the best programs in all of CFB. And that HC, his players, beat writers, and the premier agent in the business all think he’s an elite coach.

There’s a problem with your numbers as multiple posters have pointed out.

You have a limited and faulty data set and are trying to extrapolate some big takeaway to say it’s too risky when everyone already agrees that it’s a risky hire.

The information you don’t have (leadership, organizational, communication ability, connections, CEO skills, whatever he shared w JW and the search team to demonstrate those things) is what you don’t know and might mitigate the risk to an acceptable level.

No one here is saying “we should always hire position coaches” or “this will for sure work out” or whatever else nonsense you’re attributing to ppl. Everyone agrees it’s sn out of the box hire with wide variance in outcomes - I think that’s fun.

I mentioned it before, I don't know if you're a hockey fan (most people aren't), but this is very similar to Ralph Krueger. He was all about those attributes you mention. Coached in the NHL and the Premier League without really having any tangible skills in either because he supposedly had so many other out of the box managerial and motivational skills. I think you'd find his weird story interesting.

 

[TheCusian]

I mentioned it before, I don't know if you're a hockey fan (most people aren't), but this is very similar to Ralph Krueger. He was all about those attributes you mention. Coached in the NHL and the Premier League without really having any tangible skills in either because he supposedly had so many other out of the box managerial and motivational skills. I think you'd find his weird story interesting.

That’s just another weak data point (1 case) to say it’s risky. I get it. We’re at the point now where we get to see his coordinator hires that will have more data and styles to actually critic. Then we’ll see what he does with the roster. I’d also pay attention to movement on the NIL front. It needs to be built up to get where he wants to go.

 

[Millhouse]

That’s just another weak data point (1 case) to say it’s risky. I get it. We’re at the point now where we get to see his coordinator hires that will have more data and styles to actually critic. Then we’ll see what he does with the roster. I’d also pay attention to movement on the NIL front. It needs to be built up to get where he wants to go.

I'm not saying it's data, I'm saying you'd find it interesting. Aye yi yi.

I am very excited to try all the things for which there is no data to show that I'm bad at

 

[HOFCeluck]

Are two year windows at Baylor and Rutgers sufficient data points to show a difference being made? I honestly don’t know.

The other thing is…even if there was a direct 1:1 correlation of better defenses against passing I probably wouldn’t change my thinking much. It’s a high risk high reward hire regardless.

 

[CousCuse]

There are no data points that make any difference right now. The only thing that matters is his recruiting this first class. He has to make a tangible improvement with this first class. A sizable improvement.

 

[TheCusian]

I'm not saying it's data, I'm saying you'd find it interesting. Aye yi yi.

I am very excited to try all the things for which there is no data to show that I'm bad at

Fair.

I’m not in this to prove you right or wrong, don’t care

I can’t possibly be in it to prove myself right or wrong since I don’t have a clue what’s going to happen.

It’s going to be interesting, that much is absolutely true

 

[money3189]

I'm not saying it's data, I'm saying you'd find it interesting. Aye yi yi.

I am very excited to try all the things for which there is no data to show that I'm bad at

If you want a research project. Look up how well coaches did at the P5 level who had similar resume's as Fran. I know Shane Beamer is a recent example that pops in my head. Im curious to know

 

[boog7]

There’s correlation. And he coaches at one of the best programs in all of CFB. And that HC, his players, beat writers, and the premier agent in the business all think he’s an elite coach.

There’s a problem with your numbers as multiple posters have pointed out.

You have a limited and faulty data set and are trying to extrapolate some big takeaway to say it’s too risky when everyone already agrees that it’s a risky hire.

The information you don’t have (leadership, organizational, communication ability, connections, CEO skills, whatever he shared w JW and the search team to demonstrate those things) is what you don’t know and might mitigate the risk to an acceptable level.

No one here is saying “we should always hire position coaches” or “this will for sure work out” or whatever else nonsense you’re attributing to ppl. Everyone agrees it’s sn out of the box hire with wide variance in outcomes - I think that’s fun.

1000%. Very well said.

 

[PhatOrange]

If you want a research project. Look up how well coaches did at the P5 level who had similar resume's as Fran. I know Shane Beamer is a recent example that pops in my head. Im curious to know

The Texas Tech guy Joe McGuire is another example. He's even only been in the college game for 7 years. Lifer HS coach. 14-11 two seasons in.

Coaching career (HC unless noted)
1995–1996	Crowley HS (TX) (DL)
1997–2002	Cedar Hill HS (TX) (DB)
2003–2016	Cedar Hill HS (TX)
2017–2018	Baylor (TE)
2019	Baylor (assoc. HC/DE)
2020–2021	Baylor (assoc. HC/OLB)
2022–present	Texas Tech

I'd be interested in the data.

 

[Millhouse]

Are two year windows at Baylor and Rutgers sufficient data points to show a difference being made? I honestly don’t know.

The other thing is…even if there was a direct 1:1 correlation of better defenses against passing I probably wouldn’t change my thinking much. It’s a high risk high reward hire regardless.

He has had good secondary play along the way, if I were out to prove he stinks, I wouldn't have posted this. There are good years in there.

Can't wait to hear who the OC is. It would be very important if any of this were important.

 

[Millhouse]

If you want a research project. Look up how well coaches did at the P5 level who had similar resume's as Fran. I know Shane Beamer is a recent example that pops in my head. Im curious to know

Part of that project is even identifying who those people are. There can't be many position coaches with no coordinator or HC experience being a p5 job

I'm all for it but that's a lot of googling

 

[money3189]

Part of that project is even identifying who those people are. There can't be many position coaches with no coordinator or HC experience being a p5 job

I'm all for it but that's a lot of googling

Well I gave you one Shane Beamer. Dabo is another. In 2019 Fran was co DC. They were ranked 51th in total defense. The following year without him they were 111th.

 

[Millhouse]

Well I gave you one Shane Beamer. Dabo is another. In 2019 Fran was co DC. They were ranked 51th in total defense. The following year without him they were 111th.

Swinney was at least an interim HC and fired rob Spence immediately and went 4-3

So at least they knew he could run a team

And he was a position coach there, you have better knowledge with your own

Beamer is a good example. He's 10-14 in conference fwiw. 20-18

 

[money3189]

Swinney was at least an interim HC and fired rob Spence immediately and went 4-3

So at least they knew he could run a team

And he was a position coach there, you have better knowledge with your own

Beamer is a good example. He's 10-14 in conference fwiw. 20-18

Yeah but 4-3 is not blowing the doors off. A lot of unknowns. They took a chance on him. Knowing his personality traits, leadership skills etc.. Not knowing how he will recruit, hire, develop and operate a team. Lots of continiity hires fail.

With the exception of Spurier. S Carolina is traditionally a 5-6 win program.

 

[djcon57]

I mentioned it before, I don't know if you're a hockey fan (most people aren't), but this is very similar to Ralph Krueger. He was all about those attributes you mention. Coached in the NHL and the Premier League without really having any tangible skills in either because he supposedly had so many other out of the box managerial and motivational skills. I think you'd find his weird story interesting.

He never coached in the Premier League, fwiw. He was a director.

 

[Millhouse]

Yeah but 4-3 is not blowing the doors off. A lot of unknowns. They took a chance on him. Knowing his personality traits, leadership skills etc.. Not knowing how he will recruit, hire, develop and operate a team. Lots of continiity hires fail.

With the exception of Spurier. S Carolina is traditionally a 5-6 win program.

You do learn something internally during that time. If they could've had Gerg as an interim, I really doubt they would've hired him

It's not the same

 

[money3189]

You do learn something internally during that time. If they could've had Gerg as an interim, I really doubt they would've hired him

It's not the same

I like the fact he was an assistant head coach for Rhule, a DC for Carey and coached under a national championship program. Those are things Dabo didnt experience prior to taking over as IC. IC just keeps someone's else work flowing until the end of the season. Thats like giving Nunz the HC job because he did will keeping the ship from sinking.

 

[CousCuse]

I like the fact he was an assistant head coach for Rhule, a DC for Carey and coached under a national championship program. Those are things Dabo didnt experience prior to taking over as IC. IC just keeps someone's else work flowing until the end of the season. Thats like giving Nunz the HC job because he did will keeping the ship from sinking.

Brown gives me the feeling a totally solid guy and Dino never did. And I'll say this about Nunz, for me, he had the best game presence of any coach at SU outside of Doug. He just has "it". It was just 1 game, but I could see it. It blew me away. Fran needs to recruit a class this year, like in the mid 40's. That could help him get some time to build out.