Cole Swider Transferring from Nova to Syracuse

[MikeSU02]

Nah, expecting 14 & 8 from Cole is - "get used to disappointment meme here".

He averaged 2.5 boards in 16 mins/game at Nova for his *career.
* closer to 3 boards / game in 18 mins/game his last 2 years.

But something like 14 & 6? Sure.

He had better counting stats two years ago but got more efficient last year (and didn't fall off the counting stats too much).

I'm less worried about him being at 6 or 8 rebounds, specifically, and more about being able to translate that efficiency last year in less than 20 mins a game to still being efficient if he gets like 30 mpg.

Now, maybe he's only getting 20 with the rotation, I dunno. If that's the case, then there is no way we should expect him to be 14/8 or even 14/6. Not fair to him. His per/40s from last year would basically be 12/6.

This dude would have been (out of the guys that played a lot) last year if he were on our team:
2nd in TS%, 1st in eFG% and 2nd in BPM. His PER would have been 6th, but it was still over 15.

Not sure how JB will use him, but if this guy can get clean looks in our system, and that will be a HUGE question, he won't need a ton of touches to be valuable for us.

BTW, none of the above is an argument as to who is better, Q or Cole. It's water under the bridge now. But there is a space for Cole to come in an be valuable without needing a high volume of touches.

 

[two3zone]

He had better counting stats two years ago but got more efficient last year (and didn't fall off the counting stats too much).

I'm less worried about him being at 6 or 8 rebounds, specifically, and more about being able to translate that efficiency last year in less than 20 mins a game to still being efficient if he gets like 30 mpg.

Now, maybe he's only getting 20 with the rotation, I dunno. If that's the case, then there is no way we should expect him to be 14/8 or even 14/6. Not fair to him. His per/40s from last year would basically be 12/6.

This dude would have been (out of the guys that played a lot) last year if he were on our team:
2nd in TS%, 1st in eFG% and 2nd in BPM. His PER would have been 6th, but it was still over 15.

Not sure how JB will use him, but if this guy can get clean looks in our system, and that will be a HUGE question, he won't need a ton of touches to be valuable for us.

BTW, none of the above is an argument as to who is better, Q or Cole. It's water under the bridge now. But there is a space for Cole to come in an be valuable without needing a high volume of touches.

If he gets 20 then that’s 30 from Benny and JB Jr.

 

[MSOrange]

He had better counting stats two years ago but got more efficient last year (and didn't fall off the counting stats too much).

I'm less worried about him being at 6 or 8 rebounds, specifically, and more about being able to translate that efficiency last year in less than 20 mins a game to still being efficient if he gets like 30 mpg.

Now, maybe he's only getting 20 with the rotation, I dunno. If that's the case, then there is no way we should expect him to be 14/8 or even 14/6. Not fair to him. His per/40s from last year would basically be 12/6.

This dude would have been (out of the guys that played a lot) last year if he were on our team:
2nd in TS%, 1st in eFG% and 2nd in BPM. His PER would have been 6th, but it was still over 15.

Not sure how JB will use him, but if this guy can get clean looks in our system, and that will be a HUGE question, he won't need a ton of touches to be valuable for us.

BTW, none of the above is an argument as to who is better, Q or Cole. It's water under the bridge now. But there is a space for Cole to come in an be valuable without needing a high volume of touches.

That was kinda my concern with Alan Griffin moving from 20 mpg per game at Illinois to the minutes he played here for the majority of the season.

 

[Orangezoo]

He had better counting stats two years ago but got more efficient last year (and didn't fall off the counting stats too much).

I'm less worried about him being at 6 or 8 rebounds, specifically, and more about being able to translate that efficiency last year in less than 20 mins a game to still being efficient if he gets like 30 mpg.

Now, maybe he's only getting 20 with the rotation, I dunno. If that's the case, then there is no way we should expect him to be 14/8 or even 14/6. Not fair to him. His per/40s from last year would basically be 12/6.

This dude would have been (out of the guys that played a lot) last year if he were on our team:
2nd in TS%, 1st in eFG% and 2nd in BPM. His PER would have been 6th, but it was still over 15.

Not sure how JB will use him, but if this guy can get clean looks in our system, and that will be a HUGE question, he won't need a ton of touches to be valuable for us.

BTW, none of the above is an argument as to who is better, Q or Cole. It's water under the bridge now. But there is a space for Cole to come in an be valuable without needing a high volume of touches.

My basis for 14/8 is based on an offensive driven, higher possessions per game team and a player who doesn't need to get a lot of looks to get points. 2/3 triples, 2-3 inside buckets and a couple FTs. On a team with potential to be closer to 80 a game and with Buddy most likely getting even more attention, it's not far from what we will need.

If Jimmy Jr comes in and is extremely effective and they put up 24/12 or so combined then so be it. It's hard to project what JJ will give us at this point.

Looking at the math and reasonable numbers-

BS/JE/Frank combined 14/13 a game
Benny - 13/6 a game
Cole 14/7 a game (adjusted down)
Jimmy Jr 10/5 a game
Buddy - 18/game
Joe- 9/ game
Symir 5/ game

For next year's team I think that would be a stat set that would be good. Subtract another 4 pts a game wherever and it's still above our scoring average last year and in ok territory so maybe you roll with Cole going 10/7 or 10/6 a game - play with the numbers. Gotta get good production out of Jimmy Jr if Cole is at that level.

 

[MikeSU02]

If he gets 20 then that’s 30 from Benny and JB Jr.

I'm not saying it's what *I* would do, necessarily. Just saying who knows what the rotation will be.

 

[SWC75]

All I know is that we're gonna be taller.

 

[oTTo113445]

Given what we get at center, I can't see any of our forwards with 8rpgs. Not even QG if he did come back. And that is good news.

 

[Cusesky8214]

 

[ORANGE OATH]

I think trying to extrapolate production for CS from the Nova System, and foretell the Syracuse System result is more difficult than what it may first appear. We all know this, they are two very different systems. I believe that time will prove that the Syracuse System is more favorable for CS.
I am very high on this young man, and believe our system will utilize him more effectively, and he will shine well beyond what the Nova System allowed him to do.

 

[ORANGE OATH]

Orange Oath said,
"...time will prove that the Syracuse System is more favorable for CS."

I think the Reader's Digest version of the above is, JAB will put CS in a position to succeed.

 

[orangefog]

Orange Oath said,
"...time will prove that the Syracuse System is more favorable for CS."

I think the Reader's Digest version of the above is, JAB WILL PUT CS IN A POSITION TO SUCCEED.

FIFY

 

[TexanMark]

Big Deal

I can do that all day on a 8' feet rim...well until my knees scream.

It was fun progressing as a kid dunking on a legit rim first with tennis balls then a red rubber kick ball...full size basketball not so much...only did that a few times

 

[hoopsupstate]

Swider is a well built kid. He’s more athletic than people give him credit.

 

[SUFan44]

Swider is a well built kid. He’s more athletic than people give him credit.

I hope so. I think he will rebound fine. Just worried about the ground he will need to cover.

However, with a true center in the middle, hopefully it won't be as big a deal.

 

[Jake]

I hope so. I think he will rebound fine. Just worried about the ground he will need to cover.

However, with a true center in the middle, hopefully it won't be as big a deal.

Yeah. Agreed on the defensive rotations.

 

[ORANGE OATH]

Cole is a big kid that can bang, we have all begged for more meat at the #4 and especially at the #5. Well Cole won’t play the #5, he will eat space on the floor as a #4.
I saw this apparently very early photo of Karim and had to step back a moment.
I had forgotten just how slim Karim was at UCLA and during his early NBA days.
I’m not suggesting this is a good sign for our fortunes at the #5 this year, but it does say you can be very effective without bulging muscles.
Of course Karim had skills that few will ever be privy too. Also, the game is now played by larger much more physical young men, so the time shift has obviously changed the college game significantly from Karim’s era. Add the 3 point line and Karim’s early career era is dramatically changed from what we have now.
Yet, I will try to hang onto the hope that a 3 headed #5 (15 fouls) can be very imposing, muscles or not.
Time will tell

 

[Orangezoo]

Yeah. Agreed on the defensive rotations.

I wonder if they will keep Benny and Joe on the same side and Buddy/Cole on the other. For both defense and offense to reduce the rotation concerns, which should be helped by a real Center and because offensively it's likely Buddy/Cole play off each other a lot too.

With a true center we had less times where you had guards rotating under the hoop and essentially everyone rotating constantly which further exposed certain guys. It was really noticeable when Jesse got minutes. Guys didn't have to move out of their assignment area often at all.

 

[RF2044]

Cole is a big kid that can bang, we have all begged for more meat at the #4 and especially at the #5. Well Cole won’t play the #5, he will eat space on the floor as a #4.
I saw this apparently very early photo of Karim and had to step back a moment.
I had forgotten just how slim Karim was at UCLA and during his early NBA days.
I’m not suggesting this is a good sign for our fortunes at the #5 this year, but it does say you can be very effective without bulging muscles.
Of course Karim had skills that few will ever be privy too. Also, the game is now played by larger much more physical young men, so the time shift has obviously changed the college game significantly from Karim’s era. Add the 3 point line and Karim’s early career era is dramatically changed from what we have now.
Yet, I will try to hang onto the hope that a 3 headed #5 (15 fouls) can be very imposing, muscles or not.
Time will tell

Really? I think Swider has a very good chance of starting at the 4, but I could see him playing a lot of 5 [a la Lydon]. Especially if Jimmy Jr. produces.

 

[Orangezoo]

Really? I think Swider has a very good chance of starting at the 4, but I could see him playing a lot of 5 [a la Lydon]. Especially if Jimmy Jr. produces.

There is a lot of interesting possibilities here for sure. I hope Jesse is so good it makes that a hard move but I also think Coles size and athleticism would provide him the tools to be successful in that role like Lydon was if needed.

 

[orangefog]

Really? I think Swider has a very good chance of starting at the 4, but I could see him playing a lot of 5 [a la Lydon]. Especially if Jimmy Jr. produces.

Despite the lack of numbers, we have quite a bit of versatility. We can throw some really interesting lineups on the floor. Joe, Buddy, Benny, Cole and Jimmy would be 5 guys that can really shoot. They sound like a group that would struggle defensively, but who knows. The one guy I can’t wait to see more of, is Frank. I think he is going to stand out with his athleticism. He will be hard to keep off the floor.

 

[Orangezoo]

Despite the lack of numbers, we have quite a bit of versatility. We can throw some really interesting lineups on the floor. Joe, Buddy, Benny, Cole and Jimmy would be 5 guys that can really shoot. They sound like a group that would struggle defensively, but who knows. The one guy I can’t wait to see more of, is Frank. I think he is going to stand out with his athleticism. He will be hard to keep off the floor.

Frank is a big time athlete. How well can he figure out where to be on both ends and simply being a basketball player in addition to athlete will be key for him. Some guys have the lightbulb go off quickly. Others it takes a while.

 

[ORANGE OATH]

Really? I think Swider has a very good chance of starting at the 4, but I could see him playing a lot of 5 [a la Lydon]. Especially if Jimmy Jr. produces.

I hope you are wrong because Center doesn’t seem to be a spot in need of more bodies at the moment.
But I’m willing to admit, JAB used MD at center, so what you speak of is more than possible based on past performance.

 

[illestcuse]

 

[AZOrange]

I hope so. I think he will rebound fine. Just worried about the ground he will need to cover.

However, with a true center in the middle, hopefully it won't be as big a deal.

Hey if it keeps the wings back more and not out of position I’m all for it

 

[two3zone]

Cole is a big kid that can bang, we have all begged for more meat at the #4 and especially at the #5. Well Cole won’t play the #5, he will eat space on the floor as a #4.
I saw this apparently very early photo of Karim and had to step back a moment.
I had forgotten just how slim Karim was at UCLA and during his early NBA days.
I’m not suggesting this is a good sign for our fortunes at the #5 this year, but it does say you can be very effective without bulging muscles.
Of course Karim had skills that few will ever be privy too. Also, the game is now played by larger much more physical young men, so the time shift has obviously changed the college game significantly from Karim’s era. Add the 3 point line and Karim’s early career era is dramatically changed from what we have now.
Yet, I will try to hang onto the hope that a 3 headed #5 (15 fouls) can be very imposing, muscles or not.
Time will tell

When has he ever banged down low?