Cooney = Deshaun Williams in conference play as a 3 point shooter

[MikeSU02]

Meh. He's absolutely at the top of opposing scouting reports each game. The #1 priority is to not lose him in the half court...and pick him up as soon as he crosses mid court when he's off the ball on the break. His guy rarely doubles down and offers help to scrape when Rak has the ball. He's the one guy other teams don't want going off and getting into a rhythm.

Teams have chosen to double from Robersons defender or Gbinje...which is why both have gotten as many looks as they have. Gbinje gets a lot of baseline looks in the half court.

Would think teams may start rethinking the scrape from Gbinje's defender now...which should really free up Roberson...because almost no one is playing Rak straight up.

Cooney hasn't been able to get free, but to say he's not the top defensive assignment would be incorrect. The problem is that he is defendable if you spy him with an athletic defender with foot speed.

We are watching two different games then.

Cooney is not the #1 priority for scouting unless that report is letting everyone know that he is prone to keep shooting even if the apocalypse is upon us and allow him to shoot SU right out of each game. We have an AA candidate at center, the most depleted position in all of college basketball, and a wing that can shoot the three (over 50% in conference play) and put it on the deck.

He is defended by average defenders (some better than others) that can get in his grill and stick with him because he can't get separation, can't break anyone down with the dribble drive, can't post anyone up and he has real trouble throwing into the post. He is a chucker. This is on top of the fact that him running around like a homeless man's Ray Allen wears him down because he isn't a superhuman athlete.

In conference play, he is shooting 35% from the floor, overall. He is UNDER 40% from 2pt FGs. He is shooting 32% from 3pt FGs. And he still throws up almost 15 shots per game (again, in conference play).

Also, I don't understand this statement you made, "The problem is that he is defendable if you spy him with an athletic defender with foot speed". Foot speed? spying? He is guarded by his man or the man who has switched to him. Tony Allen is not guarding him. To make it seem like all-world defenders are coming at him night after night is not the case.

The guy's career FG% is under 38%. He is in his fourth year in the program. He has played with a number of good to great players. He is coached by a HoF coach. I just don't know how these excuses for him keep coming forth. He is our version of Ricky Davis. Good, bad, whatever. That is who he is for us.

TC is going to keep chucking and he'll have enough big games because he isn't shutting it down anytime soon so we'll always have the ND game or one or two others like it.

We can agree to disagree. But he has been shooting like this for a long enough period to know who he is. People just won't admit it. I'm not saying he's a bad player. I'm not saying I don't like him. But I am saying we know who he is and what he's going to do. And he's going to shoot. A lot. And not a great clip for the most part except from time to time.

 

[Ghost]

Eh, Cooney is what he is...

1. Teams gameplan for Cooney by guarding him tight. It's not much of plan - it's pretty much don't let the white kid on Syracuse get a shot off with his feet set. If he takes a tough look, he won't make a high percentage. Boom. I'm sure it's HEAVILY emphasized though leading up to our games.

2. Not having anyone capable of penetrating hurts him. It hurts everyone to be honest. If he played with a more dynamic point guard, a Flynn type, it would cause a bit more chaos and help out Cooney a bit. Ennis was good - but didn't exactly wreak havoc on the defense - he was just insanely under control.

3. Cooney is the worst post-passer in the history of the program. He could have helped himself in life by learning how to throw the ball into the post. We could give Joseph a bat and he could knock out everyone on the court except the guy guarding Cooney and there is a 75% chance he still reverses the ball instead of going inside.

Rak is picking up double teams like it's his job. He's also a capable passer out of the post. Even that second where his defender has to turn and make a decision on a double might be enough for Cooney to make a break and get a tiny bit of separation. Alas, Cooney can't pass for diddly-squat - especially into the post.

4. Cooney can't shoot very well if he's not set. Obviously.

5. A lot of Cooney fans love to laud him for the UNC game, but that's one of those where he think his weakness shines through. Kids loves to hunt shots. Games like that are where you start to see why he can be a problem in my mind, and should sit at times.

Somebody said before that G could use some more Cooney in him, and Cooney could use some more G. It's quite true. That game sort of highlights why...

G had two shots against Duke from three that he should have taken, but hesitated in the second half. Cooney takes those, and probably makes those. G probably makes those as well. Yet, he hesitates. G goes off for 19 in the first half, the defense adjusts their game, and so does he. Cooney has no such restraint. G helped give us a lead, and he's patient going forward - probes the defense, adjusts...Just because you got us the lead doesn't mean it's your lead to blow.

That being said, Cooney hits a couple shots against UNC, and says, "Trevor, you my man, are on fire......game on, b*tches!!!!" And then it's a **** show. That's sort of how he plays.

In the second half against UNC, Christmas is 5/6 from the field and getting to the line as well. He also assisted on one of Cooney's makes. His only miss was his first shot of the half (he did miss a three at the end of the game that I'm not counting). Cooney is 4/14 and one of his makes came during Rakeem Christmas 3 point shooting party-time.

One of Trevor's shots in the second half came with 1 second on the shot clock. Almost all of the rest were within the first 15 seconds of the shot clock. He hunts shots - and a lot of those were iffy shots (at least as I recall). People are okay with them because "who else is going to score," but that seems like a lot of nonsense. I didn't even think that game was a particularly horrible example of him taking a ton of bad shots overall, but I do think it gets referenced a bit as a great Trevor game. If anything, his second half all but took us out of the game.

 

[Ghost]

Which is why it makes no sense when we don't put cooney and rak on the same side of the court together every possession

It wouldn't help.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Eh, Cooney is what he is...

1. Teams gameplan for Cooney by guarding him tight. It's not much of plan - it's pretty much don't let the white kid on Syracuse get a shot off with his feet set. If he takes a tough look, he won't make a high percentage. Boom. I'm sure it's HEAVILY emphasized though leading up to our games.

2. Not having anyone capable of penetrating hurts him. It hurts everyone to be honest. If he played with a more dynamic point guard, a Flynn type, it would cause a bit more chaos and help out Cooney a bit. Ennis was good - but didn't exactly wreak havoc on the defense - he was just insanely under control.

3. Cooney is the worst post-passer in the history of the program. He could have helped himself in life by learning how to throw the ball into the post. We could give Joseph a bat and he could knock out everyone on the court except the guy guarding Cooney and there is a 75% chance he still reverses the ball instead of going inside.

Rak is picking up double teams like it's his job. He's also a capable passer out of the post. Even that second where his defender has to turn and make a decision on a double might be enough for Cooney to make a break and get a tiny bit of separation. Alas, Cooney can't pass for diddly-squat - especially into the post.

4. Cooney can't shoot very well if he's not set. Obviously.

5. A lot of Cooney fans love to laud him for the UNC game, but that's one of those where he think his weakness shines through. Kids loves to hunt shots. Games like that are where you start to see why he can be a problem in my mind, and should sit at times.

Somebody said before that G could use some more Cooney in him, and Cooney could use some more G. It's quite true. That game sort of highlights why...

G had two shots against Duke from three that he should have taken, but hesitated. Cooney takes those, and probably makes those. G probably makes those as well. Yet, he hesitates. G goes off for 19 in the first half, the defense adjusts their game, and so does he. Cooney has no such restraint. G helped give us a lead, and he's patient going forward. No reason to go crazy and single-handedly give it back. Just because you got us the lead doesn't mean it's your lead to blow.

That being said, Cooney hits a couple shots against UNC, and says, "Trevor, you my man, are on fire...game on, b*tches!!!!" And then it's a **** show. That's sort of how he's always played.

In the second half against UNC, Christmas is 5/6 from the field and getting to the line as well. He also assisted on one of Cooney's makes. His only miss was his first shot of the half (he did miss a three at the end of the game that I'm not counting). Cooney is 4/14 and one of his makes came during Rakeem Christmas 3 point shooting party-time.

One of his shots in the second half came with 1 second on the shot clock. Almost all of the rest were within the first 15 seconds of the shot clock. He hunts shots - and a lot of those were iffy shots (at least as I recall). People are okay with them because "who else is going to score," but that seems like a lot of nonsense. I didn't even think that game was a particularly horrible example of him taking a ton of bad shots overall, but I do think it gets referenced a bit as a great Trevor game.

I'm sick of the "who else is going to score". We have a guy in rak and a guy in G who are putting up all ACC numbers in conference play while playing 40 minutes. "We don't have other shooting threats". Except that guy who is shooting close to 50% from there. "He has to take those shots.". No he doesn't- green light doesn't mean shot selection isn't important (said this many times). "Cooney can't sit because who will come in?". A few minutes of G, Xmas, Roberson, buss, and kaleb will kill us? I understand the skepticism because buss just...wow that shot. But honestly, were talking a couple minutes.

And even after all that- I still consider myself to be a cooney "defender", no pun intended, because I recognize his importance to our team and the tough role he has. However, the last few games have consisted of a lot of inefficiency and forced shots.

 

[Ghost]

I'm sick of the "who else is going to score". We have a guy in rak and a guy in G who are putting up all ACC numbers in conference play while playing 40 minutes. "We don't have other shooting threats". Except that guy who is shooting close to 50% from there. "He has to take those shots.". No he doesn't- green light doesn't mean shot selection isn't important (said this many times). "Cooney can't sit because who will come in?". A few minutes of G, Xmas, Roberson, buss, and kaleb will kill us? I understand the skepticism because buss just...wow that shot. But honestly, were talking a couple minutes.

And even after all that- I still consider myself to be a cooney "defender", no pun intended, because I recognize his importance to our team and the tough role he has. However, the last few games have consisted of a lot of inefficiency and forced shots.

I really don't even care that he forces shots. Rak forces shots. G could stand to force some more shots. Cooney just forces shots at strange times - I just always wonder about his decision making at certain times. :noidea:

 

[NineOneSeven]

I really don't even care that he forces shots. Rak forces shots. G could stand to force some more shots. Cooney just forces shots at strange times - I just always wonder about his decision making at certain times. :noidea:

A forced shot from the paint has a significantly higher chance of either going in or leading to a foul than step back jumpers, though.

Although I can't say I don't love the coondog sexual predator smirk and head nod after making a long/tough shot. And thug Trevor cooney is still a legend Twitter account. We have to account for all variables here.

 

[Millhouse]

you purposely chose Williams, because he is an unpopular figure. You could have chosen, say, Brandon Triche, who shot a career .307 from three in conference play. But Triche is a popular player, and that does not suit your apparent narrative.

Again, Cooney is not above critique and his shooting percentage is certainly fair game. But deceptive posts are not above critique, either.

i chose williams because I thought he was a worse shooter than triche. but thank you for pointing out that triche was also terrible at shooting. i think triche is incredibly overrated. i would love to have shooting guards that can shoot someday.

there's nothing deceptive about looking at every conference game. your definition of deceptive is strange. if i pick only some games, you'd tell me it's cherry picking. i pick all of them and it's deceptive

very weird bunch of posts. give it a rest

 

[STEVEHOLT]

by using career averages, you have very cleverly (and intentionally) hidden the fact that DeShaun's shooting was on a declining scale, while Cooney's is on the upswing

Williams' conference 3 pt percentage by Season
99-00 .442
00-01 .269
01-02 .245

Cooney's conference 3 pt percentage by season
12-13 .216
13-14 .309
14-15 .324

has he been a great shooter? not by any stretch of the imagination, and it is very easy to be critical of his offensive play . . . but this is pretty piss poor trolling, Millhouse

so you want to give credit to cooney for shooting 21.6 percent his first year BECAUSE his percentage went up the next year? Well no it went up, the bar was so low there was nowhere else to go. And williams shooting at 44 percent had nowhere to go but down.

 

[STEVEHOLT]

Meh. He's absolutely at the top of opposing scouting reports each game. The #1 priority is to not lose him in the half court...and pick him up as soon as he crosses mid court when he's off the ball on the break. His guy rarely doubles down and offers help to scrape when Rak has the ball. He's the one guy other teams don't want going off and getting into a rhythm.

Teams have chosen to double from Robersons defender or Gbinje...which is why both have gotten as many looks as they have. Gbinje gets a lot of baseline looks in the half court.

Would think teams may start rethinking the scrape from Gbinje's defender now...which should really free up Roberson...because almost no one is playing Rak straight up.

Cooney hasn't been able to get free, but to say he's not the top defensive assignment would be incorrect. The problem is that he is defendable if you spy him with an athletic defender with foot speed.

Which is pretty much every starting two guard in the ACC

 

[Eagles20]

Cooney being the focal point of each defense each game just isn't true.

It looks like he's harassed all game long because he can't get separation from his man and he doesn't have the ability to break people down off the dribble so his man can get in his grill.

Believe me, with his percentages, coaches should want him to continue to take high volume of shots.

I think he gets a lot more attention than those like to admit. He is face guarded pretty heavily. I specifically remember a pick n roll last game between RAK and Mike on the left side of the court in the second half and cooney was on the right wing more towards the baseline. I believe it was Jones who was guarding cooney and literally had his back to the play and was just guarding cooney like nothing else was going on. In a normal guarding situation when you are two passes away you are sagging of your man and almost having a foot in the paint. Jones was not even worried about help defense. I know this is just one situation and one game but I haven noticed this a lot the past two years. Teams will not allow him to get comfortable.

 

[Millhouse]

so you want to give credit to cooney for shooting 21.6 percent his first year BECAUSE his percentage went up the next year? Well no . . . . it went up, the bar was so low there was nowhere else to go. And williams shooting at 44 percent had nowhere to go but down.

he criticizes me for picking williams as a comparison even though their conf shooting % are 2 tenths of a percent different and chides me for not picking a guy who shot a better

and he accuses me of being deceptive by not pointing out that williams's performance went down over time even though the guy he thinks I should've used had numbers that WAIT FOR IT went down over time

triche had far fewer 3 attempts in more conference games. so at least he had some self awareness about how much he should shoot given his percentages.

these stats are for his soph to sr year, don't have the freshman numbers handy - couldn't have been too many shots http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/brandon-triche-1.html

 

[Millhouse]

I think he gets a lot more attention than those like to admit. He is face guarded pretty heavily. I specifically remember a pick n roll last game between RAK and Mike on the left side of the court in the second half and cooney was on the right wing more towards the baseline. I believe it was Jones who was guarding cooney and literally had his back to the play and was just guarding cooney like nothing else was going on. In a normal guarding situation when you are two passes away you are sagging of your man and almost having a foot in the paint. Jones was not even worried about help defense. I know this is just one situation and one game but I haven noticed this a lot the past two years. Teams will not allow him to get comfortable.

if cooney wasn't so prone to taking so many bad shots, they might not pursue this strategy as much.

part of it is you don't want to be in the 10% of games where he goes crazy, but part of it is you know he'll still shoot it. maybe he should just get out of the way and let the other guys play 4 on 4 if they're going to shadow him

 

[ORANGEsPHK]

I tend to shy away from responding to posts like this (the OP's post, that is) because there is no real rational reason for comparing the two players other than to get under the skin of some folks. Consider my skin gotten under. And kudos for bringing up a topic for much discussion - to that you have my respect for instigating such discussions.

Deshaun was a cancer. Cooney, as much as folks want to dissect, is nothing like Deshaun ever was to a team oriented sport like basketball. Cancer. Me-first attitude.

Say what you want, but the faults of this team does not fall on Cooney's shoulders alone. At least Cooney tries to make plays. Yes, I agree that he tries for contested and tough shots, and that he (remarkably) thinks he can finish on a fast break and, then, is surprised, as he flails his arms, that he didn't get fouled. But he gives effort on a team that has little other options. I will even complain that he goes under screens and doesn't challenge shooters as much as he should. He fails as much as we wish to nitpick his game. But let's not unsee what he brings to the table - the opposing D game plans against Cooney and that should open up other team mates. Gbinije has take advantage of this lately. Who else has? Christmas is getting double/triple teamed and he passes it out to ... who? The forwards have not executed, as much as I wish they would, and any other guard not named Gbinije has not exactly played up to the standard that the Syracuse zone or offense needs. No. The blame falls on the how the pieces of this team has failed to execute as a team. The fact that Cooney and Rak are the focal point of defenses, and why Gbinije has gotten opportunities (which he has taken full advantage of), speaks to, IMO, that the other components of this team has not lived up the the execution that is required for this year's team to execute well down the stretch.

Now, having said that, I'm not so harsh on Joseph, Roberson, Patterson or BJ. Mainly because it seems clear to me that they just don't understand yet what they need to do. We've all seen the potential in each (except maybe Patterson), but they haven't realized it, but they will with experience. That's the way JB's teams work. There is little outside of experience that allows a player at SU to excel. The only exception to this I see is when a player's offensive game transcends the defensive mistakes (like Carmelo or even GMAC) that the balance of their offensive floor play outweighs any defensive liabilities. In the end, you want to have components of a team on the floor that can win games and its not just one player that defines a team, even a Carmelo lead team. Cooney's more a team oriented player, asked to what other players can't do (even if he can't do it - at least he tries) to give his team a possibility to win.

I'd take Cooney over Deshaun any day ... every day.

 

[billsin01]

my point was that most people would wrongly assume that cooney is clearly a better shooter than deyawn which would make all the other character related stuff moot

the fact that we need to even bother pointing out that williams was a worse teammate shows just how bad cooney's shooting is in conference play

james thues in conference play at SU was 33%.

cooney can be a good teammate without shooting 9 or 10 3s a game

I don't think there's any doubt that the above statement is true. I haven't read the rest of the thread and I've generally avoided most of the discussion here this year, but I really think there's a simple bottom line on Cooney. It is this: He is a good player, probably a better all-around player than most will give him credit for. BUT, he's playing WAY too large a role. Cooney at 20-25 mpg, shooting when open, playing solid defense, continuing to develop a bit here and there as a creator? Great. Cooney playing 40 mpg and shooting a ton of shots and being the top offensive weapon? Not good for the bottom line. He is a jump shooter who uses a ton of legs -- he is going to fatigue, especially since teams are going to pay attention to him b/c who else are they guarding? KJ? Roberson? BJ Patterson (or whoever those guys are who occasionally wander onto the court and fire up bricks)?

I honestly am not sure why there is all that much debate on the subject.

 

[billsin01]

if cooney wasn't so prone to taking so many bad shots, they might not pursue this strategy as much.

part of it is you don't want to be in the 10% of games where he goes crazy, but part of it is you know he'll still shoot it. maybe he should just get out of the way and let the other guys play 4 on 4 if they're going to shadow him

To be fair, that should read 3-on-4 if he takes himself out of the set.

 

[Millhouse]

I tend to shy away from responding to posts like this (the OP's post, that is) because there is no real rational reason for comparing the two players other than to get under the skin of some folks. Consider my skin gotten under. And kudos for bringing up a topic for much discussion - to that you have my respect for instigating such discussions.

Deshaun was a cancer. Cooney, as much as folks want to dissect, is nothing like Deshaun ever was to a team oriented sport like basketball. Cancer. Me-first attitude.

Say what you want, but the faults of this team does not fall on Cooney's shoulders alone. At least Cooney tries to make plays. Yes, I agree that he tries for contested and tough shots, and that he (remarkably) thinks he can finish on a fast break and, then, is surprised, as he flails his arms, that he didn't get fouled. But he gives effort on a team that has little other options. I will even complain that he goes under screens and doesn't challenge shooters as much as he should. He fails as much as we wish to nitpick his game. But let's not unsee what he brings to the table - the opposing D game plans against Cooney and that should open up other team mates. Gbinije has take advantage of this lately. Who else has? Christmas is getting double/triple teamed and he passes it out to ... who? The forwards have not executed, as much as I wish they would, and any other guard not named Gbinije has not exactly played up to the standard that the Syracuse zone or offense needs. No. The blame falls on the how the pieces of this team has failed to execute as a team. The fact that Cooney and Rak are the focal point of defenses, and why Gbinije has gotten opportunities (which he has taken full advantage of), speaks to, IMO, that the other components of this team has not lived up the the execution that is required for this year's team to execute well down the stretch.

Now, having said that, I'm not so harsh on Joseph, Roberson, Patterson or BJ. Mainly because it seems clear to me that they just don't understand yet what they need to do. We've all seen the potential in each (except maybe Patterson), but they haven't realized it, but they will with experience. That's the way JB's teams work. There is little outside of experience that allows a player at SU to excel. The only exception to this I see is when a player's offensive game transcends the defensive mistakes (like Carmelo or even GMAC) that the balance of their offensive floor play outweighs any defensive liabilities. In the end, you want to have components of a team on the floor that can win games and its not just one player that defines a team, even a Carmelo lead team. Cooney's more a team oriented player, asked to what other players can't do (even if he can't do it - at least he tries) to give his team a possibility to win.

I'd take Cooney over Deshaun any day ... every day.

the point of the original post was that we all know deshaun williams was bad at shooting the ball

this yeah but cancer stuff is not what i was going for

 

[ORANGEsPHK]

Well, to be honest, I didn't read all the posts here (except to note that there were a lot of posts). I get that Cooney's doesn't have the best 3pt percentage nor that he has been clutch. I guess I'm just a little peeved that a single player is called out when its clear to me that we are missing critical components to this year's team that is forcing some players into making the plays ... and when they fail at trying they are the goat for all the team's failures this year.

My bad that I didn't read through this or recognize what the original intent of the post was. Its late, had some beers talking about work re-org stuff and just had a bad taste in my mouth about blaming something (anything) for a situation that has way too many variables than one thing can account for.

 

[Alsacs]

We are watching two different games then.

Cooney is not the #1 priority for scouting unless that report is letting everyone know that he is prone to keep shooting even if the apocalypse is upon us and allow him to shoot SU right out of each game. We have an AA candidate at center, the most depleted position in all of college basketball, and a wing that can shoot the three (over 50% in conference play) and put it on the deck.

He is defended by average defenders (some better than others) that can get in his grill and stick with him because he can't get separation, can't break anyone down with the dribble drive, can't post anyone up and he has real trouble throwing into the post. He is a chucker. This is on top of the fact that him running around like a homeless man's Ray Allen wears him down because he isn't a superhuman athlete.

In conference play, he is shooting 35% from the floor, overall. He is UNDER 40% from 2pt FGs. He is shooting 32% from 3pt FGs. And he still throws up almost 15 shots per game (again, in conference play).

Also, I don't understand this statement you made, "The problem is that he is defendable if you spy him with an athletic defender with foot speed". Foot speed? spying? He is guarded by his man or the man who has switched to him. Tony Allen is not guarding him. To make it seem like all-world defenders are coming at him night after night is not the case.

The guy's career FG% is under 38%. He is in his fourth year in the program. He has played with a number of good to great players. He is coached by a HoF coach. I just don't know how these excuses for him keep coming forth. He is our version of Ricky Davis. Good, bad, whatever. That is who he is for us.

TC is going to keep chucking and he'll have enough big games because he isn't shutting it down anytime soon so we'll always have the ND game or one or two others like it.

We can agree to disagree. But he has been shooting like this for a long enough period to know who he is. People just won't admit it. I'm not saying he's a bad player. I'm not saying I don't like him. But I am saying we know who he is and what he's going to do. And he's going to shoot. A lot. And not a great clip for the most part except from time to time.

This post can't be more fair. All you need is an BCS level athletic guard and stick him in Cooney's grill and he doesn't get anything easy. Cooney is not the focal point of the defense it is Christmas. Now he was focal point two before Gbinije has gone off. G as a 4th Junior has more in his game than Cooney has in his game. Cooney to me is a 6'2" version of James Southerland. Southerland was money in catch and shoot situations but had very little else to his offensive game.
Cooney has to play this year as I don't want to see Patterson and Joseph this year. I suggested it in November and will say JB was right not to do it. However Cooney is not Brady Heslip from Baylor his shooting is not elite.

 

[Millhouse]

Well, to be honest, I didn't read all the posts here (except to note that there were a lot of posts). I get that Cooney's doesn't have the best 3pt percentage nor that he has been clutch. I guess I'm just a little peeved that a single player is called out when its clear to me that we are missing critical components to this year's team that is forcing some players into making the plays ... and when they fail at trying they are the goat for all the team's failures this year.

My bad that I didn't read through this or recognize what the original intent of the post was. Its late, had some beers talking about work re-org stuff and just had a bad taste in my mouth about blaming something (anything) for a situation that has way too many variables than one thing can account for.

our disagreement is over whether cooney is forced into shooting this much. i don't think he is. i'd like to see him cut his threes by 1/3 or 1/2.

 

[Millhouse]

47 games. there's been one shot a game that should never leave his hands, i think most people can agree on that. (i know he makes some of them but there is probably more than one a game so we'll just settle on one per)

Take out his worst miss from each game. Shots that everyone cringes when he shoots it. his shooting percentage would be 36%. that's fine.

just rein him in a little, that's all

 

[TinyManInside]

Teams stick a guy in his jock because of 3 things: 1) opposing coaches know that he is going to take a handful of really bad shots each game if/when he gets frustrated, 2) any good coach who has done his due diligence in scouting knows that he doesn't create much for others so you don't have to worry about freeing up passing angles by overplaying him, and 3) he's not very effective putting the ball on the floor to create his own offense. I don't know if he's really the focal point of opposing defenses, so much as he's just an easy player to gameplan for...

 

[OttoinGrotto]

2) any good coach who has done his due diligence in scouting knows that he doesn't create much for others so you don't have to worry about freeing up passing angles by overplaying him

That's it right there.

 

[Millhouse]

he really struggles on the road for whatever reason

for his career he's shooting 37%... from inside the 3 point line. 28% outside it

this year he's shooting 30% from 2 on the road and 32% from 3.

but he still takes 14 shots a game on the road

Gbinije is shooting 55% from 2 on the road and 48% from 3

he shoots 11 times per game on the road.

MORE GBINIJE LESS COONEY

 

[STEVEHOLT]

Has anyone in the history of SU been reigned in once they have been given the proverbial Chuckers Green Light ?

 

[Millhouse]

Has anyone in the history of SU been reigned in once they have been given the proverbial Chuckers Green Light ?

are you counting transfers? (i don't want that)

 

[Cusefan0307]

We are watching two different games then.

Cooney is not the #1 priority for scouting unless that report is letting everyone know that he is prone to keep shooting even if the apocalypse is upon us and allow him to shoot SU right out of each game. We have an AA candidate at center, the most depleted position in all of college basketball, and a wing that can shoot the three (over 50% in conference play) and put it on the deck.

He is defended by average defenders (some better than others) that can get in his grill and stick with him because he can't get separation, can't break anyone down with the dribble drive, can't post anyone up and he has real trouble throwing into the post. He is a chucker. This is on top of the fact that him running around like a homeless man's Ray Allen wears him down because he isn't a superhuman athlete.

In conference play, he is shooting 35% from the floor, overall. He is UNDER 40% from 2pt FGs. He is shooting 32% from 3pt FGs. And he still throws up almost 15 shots per game (again, in conference play).

Also, I don't understand this statement you made, "The problem is that he is defendable if you spy him with an athletic defender with foot speed". Foot speed? spying? He is guarded by his man or the man who has switched to him. Tony Allen is not guarding him. To make it seem like all-world defenders are coming at him night after night is not the case.

The guy's career FG% is under 38%. He is in his fourth year in the program. He has played with a number of good to great players. He is coached by a HoF coach. I just don't know how these excuses for him keep coming forth. He is our version of Ricky Davis. Good, bad, whatever. That is who he is for us.

TC is going to keep chucking and he'll have enough big games because he isn't shutting it down anytime soon so we'll always have the ND game or one or two others like it.

We can agree to disagree. But he has been shooting like this for a long enough period to know who he is. People just won't admit it. I'm not saying he's a bad player. I'm not saying I don't like him. But I am saying we know who he is and what he's going to do. And he's going to shoot. A lot. And not a great clip for the most part except from time to time.

I'm going to disagree with one point you make here. Just because he hasn't performed to some peoples expectations so far in his career, does not mean he won't in the future. He could have 45 games left in Orange. At this point in Andy Rautins career,late conference season 2009, he was very similar to Cooney. He was really not a playmaker until his senior year and he was shooting 35 percent or so from three.

Rautins had yet to have his big 6 overtime game, and solid finish to the the end of his junior season that lead to his big Senior Season. I don't know why, but some people think guys don't improve late in their careers. You would think after watching Rak this year people would learn. I still think Cooney will get better before he finally graduates, especially since everyone says he works as hard as he does.