Derrick Coleman was much skinnier than McCullough

[KevMonstah]

DC was not skinnier than McCullough, because I just don't see how that would be possible.

He did play with an extreme attitude and sure loved to rebound, and that attitude was definitely part of it. I don't know of too many players who do have that going for them. As an earlier post in this thread said, 6'10" guys now want to handle the ball and play the perimeter. The Harry Giles kid who SU is after, that's what DC would've been had he been a perimeter guy, instead of a low post guy.

And guys gotta give Donte Greene a break. I'm sure the gameplan recruiting him was something along the lines of "ok, our two best outside shooters (both juniors, and the only upperclassmen on the team) will tear their ACLs and have to miss the year, leaving us with a lineup of Flynn, Jackson, Jardine (all freshmen), Kristoff (JC transfer), Onuaku, and Harris, none of whom can shoot from outside the lane, so Donte, you're going to be the sole consistent outside threat on the team, so you're going to have to take 275 3pt shots." That team's results are far different if either Rautins or Devendorf plays the entire year. His 17 & 8 that year, given what that team had to work with, was pretty good. Was it ideal, no, but out of your choices of Harris, Flynn, Jardine, and Kristoff, who else on that team would you have wanted taking 3s?

Kev

 

[jordoo]

DC was not skinnier than McCullough, because I just don't see how that would be possible.

He did play with an extreme attitude and sure loved to rebound, and that attitude was definitely part of it. I don't know of too many players who do have that going for them. As an earlier post in this thread said, 6'10" guys now want to handle the ball and play the perimeter. The Harry Giles kid who SU is after, that's what DC would've been had he been a perimeter guy, instead of a low post guy.

And guys gotta give Donte Greene a break. I'm sure the gameplan recruiting him was something along the lines of "ok, our two best outside shooters (both juniors, and the only upperclassmen on the team) will tear their ACLs and have to miss the year, leaving us with a lineup of Flynn, Jackson, Jardine (all freshmen), Kristoff (JC transfer), Onuaku, and Harris, none of whom can shoot from outside the lane, so Donte, you're going to be the sole consistent outside threat on the team, so you're going to have to take 275 3pt shots." That team's results are far different if either Rautins or Devendorf plays the entire year. His 17 & 8 that year, given what that team had to work with, was pretty good. Was it ideal, no, but out of your choices of Harris, Flynn, Jardine, and Kristoff, who else on that team would you have wanted taking 3s?

Kev

I actually Remember Kristoff getting stuck with the ball late in the shot clock once behind the 3pt line. It was comical because the defender stood 5' away from him daring him to shoot. Kristoff looked at him twice and then kOnged one brutally off the side rim from deep.

Spot on with Donte!

 

[alphaorange]

DC did not have a polished offensive game as a freshman by any stretch of the imagination. He was a rebounding machine though - best weak side rebounder ever imo, and scored a ton off put backs and taps.

I think you are incredibly wrong. DC was a great passer, decent handle, and a very good shooter. He could also score down low. He used to practice left handed jump shots for giggles as a frosh...which put a frown on JB's face. JB rarely featured freshman on offense.

 

[Antiprodigy]

DC would be a one and done in this day and age. Thank goodness, things used to be different, and we got to enjoy the greatness for so long.

 

[jordoo]

DC would be a one and done in this day and age. Thank goodness, things used to be different, and we got to enjoy the greatness for so long.

Which is one of the reasons I think JB has such a hard time with the one and done stuff. He has had so many guys who were more ready as freshman than the kids today stay into their Junior and Senior seasons because that's what players did back then. Its got to be hard to keep a straight face when Jerami Grant tells you he's considering entering the draft. I do think JB is trying to give these kids the best advice for them but he's also old school and simply been around long enough to call it like he sees it.

 

[Noexcuse]

I think you are incredibly wrong. DC was a great passer, decent handle, and a very good shooter. He could also score down low. He used to practice left handed jump shots for giggles as a frosh...which put a frown on JB's face. JB rarely featured freshman on offense.

Maybe it was his role on the team then, but I remember him being more of a rebounder put back guy as a freshman than the go to offensive threat. Of course the team was more run and gun in those days and I remember a lot of Coleman rebounds and outlet passes leading to fast break layups.

 

[kuethstheman]

DC was not skinnier than McCullough, because I just don't see how that would be possible

Agree. There aren't many living human beings who are "much skinnier" than McCullough.

 

[two3zone]

Agree. There aren't many living human beings who are "much skinnier" than McCullough.

Don't have to look far down the bench, BJ is far far skinner than McCullough.

 

[Noexcuse]

Don't have to look far down the bench, BJ is far far skinner than McCullough.

Or Tony Scott (from the Coleman era)

 

[kuethstheman]

Don't have to look far down the bench, BJ is far far skinner than McCullough.

OK.

http://cuse.com/galleries/default.aspx?image=99038

 

[RMH44]

Agree. There aren't many living human beings who are "much skinnier" than McCullough.

It's not just a matter of being skinny...Chris plays soft. DC played with attitude, almost violently. Slow twitch -vs- fast twitch.

The one thing that stands out to me watching Chris is his lack of explosiveness. I think some of this can be attributed to his lack of strength but I also think he believes he's a 3 trapped in a 4's body. Far too much finesse and not enough grit...yet.

 

[Col. Bleep]

A better comparison for McCullough may be Louis Orr.
Not fair to compare almost any freshman to DC because he was a singular talent.

 

[jordoo]

A better comparison for McCullough may be Louis Orr.
Not fair to compare almost any freshman to DC because he was a singular talent.

Coleman was the #1 pick in the draft back when guys played 3 to 4 years of college and you really knew what you were getting. In other words he came in hyped as one of the best players in his class and proved that he was the best 4 years in a row. You just cannot compare it accurately as you stated.

 

[cuseguy]

on a team that was 10x better than this current squad. DC on this squad is 20-10 guy easy. Comparing DC to Chris is like comparing Melo to Donte Green an insult to comparisons.

Oh, I wasn't taking a shot at Coleman. He was 5x better than Chris as a freshman.

Chris isn't averaging 12 and 9 this year. He'll go pro if he does, but he won't.

 

[BludOrange]

Chris is trapped in JB's offense. He's the 3rd or 4th option. He's still learning to adjust to not being the focal point in an offense. It's encouraging to see him follow through with a play and notice it's the right decision. Rather than the ball stopping at him and forcing up a tough contested shot. Just needs to speed up that decision making as it will continue to help the team's offensive flow and put him and his teammates in better positions to be successful.

 

[Dave85]

DC would be a one and done in this day and age. Thank goodness, things used to be different, and we got to enjoy the greatness for so long.

So the question each player of this caliber talent has to ask is if they think they are capable of being an NBA legend or are they capable of being a CBB legend for a particular school. Here's my test. Out of these two players, which player will have a longer lasting memory in your mind:

1. Derrick Coleman
2. Tyler Ennis

 

[Antiprodigy]

So the question each player of this caliber talent has to ask is if they think they are capable of being an NBA legend or are they capable of being a CBB legend for a particular school. Here's my test. Out of these two players, which player will have a longer lasting memory in your mind:

1. Derrick Coleman
2. Tyler Ennis

View attachment 32450

Tyler who?

 

[alphaorange]

Maybe it was his role on the team then, but I remember him being more of a rebounder put back guy as a freshman than the go to offensive threat. Of course the team was more run and gun in those days and I remember a lot of Coleman rebounds and outlet passes leading to fast break layups.

I think that's exactly it. He was truly a monster on the boards...especially during the final 4 run as a frosh. Believe he had 19 against UNC and the same against Indiana?

 

[RF2044]

Oh, I wasn't taking a shot at Coleman. He was 5x better than Chris as a freshman.

Chris isn't averaging 12 and 9 this year. He'll go pro if he does, but he won't.

Perhaps not the 9 rebounds, but he could easily average 12.

Easy to kick him while he's down and not playing well.

 

[OrangeDW]

I realize Chris is struggling lately, but wow. Even at his best he's not like Derrick Coleman in any way other than playing the same position. But in terms of style of play they are not even all that similar. And there's a good argument for Coleman being our best player ever(he's top 5 at minimum), so big deal if he's not as good as DC!

How many of our guys or anyone else's have played with the level of toughness and the chip on their shoulder that Coleman did at Cuse? That doesn't just happen very often. Coleman was a special player, there's a reason he's our only guy to be drafted #1 overall.

McCullough reminds me a bit of Andray Blatche in terms of his style of play, skills, athleticism. He's not going to magically be a fast twitch, explosive, 19 rebounds in a game, tough guy maniac. He's not that guy. He is very skilled, he's a good player, he's still got good pro potential, and I think very soon he will play much better ball than he is playing right now. Relax!

A few weeks ago it was Roberson who could do nothing right at all, now people think he's better than McCullough.

Cooney was a scrub who brought nothing to the table if the 3's weren't falling, now he's going to the hole, handling the ball...and the shots are going in and he's looking like the heart of our team.

Joseph was a combination of Michael Edwards and Josh Wright at their worst...now he's dishing out bunches of assists and cutting way down on the turnovers and the criticism is dying down.

It's a long season with ups and downs(moreso with freshmen)...relax!

 

[SWC75]

Derrick doesn't look skinny in this clip:

He's not bulky but not skinny, either. I agree that the attitude he played with was as much a part of his strength as his muscles.

I checked my old yearbooks and Derrick was listed as 6-9 215 as a freshman and 6-10 230 as a senior. This year's yearbook says McCullough is 6-10 220.

Interesting graphic: We were 21-0 when scoring 80 points or more, 1-5 when scoring less than 80 points. Those were the days...

 

[Shark58]

Derrick doesn't look skinny in this clip:

He's not bulky but not skinny, either. I agree that the attitude he played with was as much a part of his strength as his muscles.

I checked my old yearbooks and Derrick was listed as 6-9 215 as a freshman and 6-10 230 as a senior. This year's yearbook says McCullough is 6-10 220.

Interesting graphic: We were 21-0 when scoring 80 points or more, 1-5 when scoring less than 80 points. Those were the days...

that vid brought a tear to my eye

 

[STEVEHOLT]

People are making the mistake of equating looks with strength. Some skinny dudes are just giant cords of muscle despite lacking in bulk. DC was one of those spring loaded fast twitch dudes. He was much stronger as a Frosh than C MC is. Its not just attitude.