Dome Pricing for Football

[Antz201]

I got two tix for this week's game game for $89 each, while the same tix would cost 49 each at uconn's new stadium.


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[MikeSU02]

Not 12 dollars to park! So expensive!

Hell, I'm a college student and when I go to pro games I'm willing to spend money to drive an hour to Fenway and 30 dollars to park... People are so unwilling to spend any money. And yes, I pay all my bills besides school-related.

I'm assuming two things by this post:

1) You don't have a family that you are the head of (still in college)
2) You are from a larger city or the metro area of a larger city.

Saying you pay your bills BESIDES school-related is kind of silly in relating it to real world costs for people that are not in school. I'm sure if the average Syracuse fan could just pay his bills for everything except the house and car payments, he or she wouldn't mind the cost of parking either.

And before you respond, I went to SU for both undergrad and grad. Paid my own way between loans/grants/scholarships and came from having very little money. I also live in Manhattan now with a wife and child.

A lot of people in Syracuse are living paycheck to paycheck or close to it. These costs like parking, etc add up. To dismiss it with a snarky comment is juvenile and doesn't help the discussion. And here is the thing, the only way that the Dome is going to fill up isn't with the diehards, it's with the fence sitters. You can fill Fenway with diehards. You can fill Giants stadium with diehards. We are never going to fill the Dome with diehards. My freshman year was McNabb's last year and we still weren't selling out the Dome.

So yes, even the cost of parking will be nitpicked. The cost of gas, concessions, etc will all be nitpicked. If you want Syracuse fans to spend their disposable income on Syracuse football with the current pricing structure of seating, the current costs of traveling and parking, with the moving of big games to the NYC metro area, with the team just turning it around in terms of success, and with the general economic malaise that has hit upstate NY, you should start with conceding the fact that $12 parking will impact a certain segment of those you are trying to recruit to come watch the game in person. Especially if they have families.

 

[JOC44]

I'm eagerly awaiting the annual post where someone says they should kick the "fat cats" out of the good seats and practically give them away to the "real fans" (a group loosely defined to be people like the author of the post). That annual post usually shows up on the hoops board, but maybe somebody will work it in here.

 

[kingottoiii]

MikeSU02

Why is this not a problem anywhere else in the country? Are people in Mississippi rich? Or many other areas of the country? Why is it not an issue for Cuse BBall? CNYers like to complain about things that really have nothing to do with showing up. It is all excuses. Bottomline is CNYers are poor FB fans. It is too bad, especially since an hour and a half to the West there are great FB fans.

 

[bnoro]

I'm assuming two things by this post:

1) You don't have a family that you are the head of (still in college)
2) You are from a larger city or the metro area of a larger city.

Saying you pay your bills BESIDES school-related is kind of silly in relating it to real world costs for people that are not in school. I'm sure if the average Syracuse fan could just pay his bills for everything except the house and car payments, he or she wouldn't mind the cost of parking either.

And before you respond, I went to SU for both undergrad and grad. Paid my own way between loans/grants/scholarships and came from having very little money. I also live in Manhattan now with a wife and child.

A lot of people in Syracuse are living paycheck to paycheck or close to it. These costs like parking, etc add up. To dismiss it with a snarky comment is juvenile and doesn't help the discussion. And here is the thing, the only way that the Dome is going to fill up isn't with the diehards, it's with the fence sitters. You can fill Fenway with diehards. You can fill Giants stadium with diehards. We are never going to fill the Dome with diehards. My freshman year was McNabb's last year and we still weren't selling out the Dome.

So yes, even the cost of parking will be nitpicked. The cost of gas, concessions, etc will all be nitpicked. If you want Syracuse fans to spend their disposable income on Syracuse football with the current pricing structure of seating, the current costs of traveling and parking, with the moving of big games to the NYC metro area, with the team just turning it around in terms of success, and with the general economic malaise that has hit upstate NY, you should start with conceding the fact that $12 parking will impact a certain segment of those you are trying to recruit to come watch the game in person. Especially if they have families.

While I see where you are coming from, I live paycheck to paycheck as well and pay my own bills. My parents/students loans/grants/scholarships cover my SU payments, which I will take over when I graduate in May. I pay for my car insurance, gas, phone, metrocard, as well as anything else I need. Currently, I'm doing an internship in NYC so I have to pay for food as well, and I make at maximum 250 a week, working 45-50 hours. My family is not rich by any means, we are a modest middle class family that has used our money wisely.

I realize how expensive it is to see a team play, but at the cost of tickets SU offers, it's really second to none for the level of the sport and the quality of the seats/product. If parking was a pro stadium cost, such as 30-40 dollars, I understand a complaint. But if you're coming with some friends and they can't pitch in 4 bucks a piece then they should find new jobs. And I guarantee you the fans that live in Alabama make less than Syracusians and don't give a second thought to anything cost related.

 

[dollarbill44]

MikeSU02

Why is this not a problem anywhere else in the country? Are people in Mississippi rich? Or many other areas of the country? Why is it not an issue for Cuse BBall? CNYers like to complain about things that really have nothing to do with showing up. It is all excuses. Bottomline is CNYers are poor FB fans. It is too bad, especially since an hour and a half to the West there are great FB fans.

I think because those people elsewhere have an appreciation that free parking comes at a cost, such as a longer walk.

 

[MikeSU02]

MikeSU02

Why is this not a problem anywhere else in the country? Are people in Mississippi rich? Or many other areas of the country? Why is it not an issue for Cuse BBall? CNYers like to complain about things that really have nothing to do with showing up. It is all excuses. Bottomline is CNYers are poor FB fans. It is too bad, especially since an hour and a half to the West there are great FB fans.

Football is prioritized much differently in the south and in other parts of the country. My sister lives in Austin, TX and her kids go to Lake Travis HS. Football in that area is third behind God and family and that may be underestimating its place. Football is not life or death in CNY.

Re Cuse BBall, which is a fair argument, imo is a few things:
1) We are an elite program. People are watching an elite product. Look at the views coming from a soon-to-be conference brethren's comments between our bball and fball programs. We are elite, respected and have a HoF coach.
2) We get to see other elite programs come to the dome (Conn, Pitt, etc). And, with the move to the ACC, can you imagine Duke and UNC?
3) The time needed to consume the product is less as well. 2 hour games versus three or three and a half hours.
4) The Dome is unique in how we consume college basketball. The experience is unlike most other venues. With football, it means that there really isn't a bad seat in the house, but you are basically still watching a football game just like you would in the corresponding seats in another football venue. For basketball, it feels more important because of the space and number of fans.

I want to be clear - I'm not saying that the cost of parking isn't fair in terms of price (I don't know what normal CNY prices are having lived in the city for a while now). What I am saying is that to mock concerns for parking and concessions, etc is to basically be part of the problem and not the solution. I live in NYC and have enjoyed single drinks that cost upwards of $20 and $30, but I don't then make fun of my friends who complain about a $10 beer at a stadium.

 

[syracuse95]

They might need to compress the hi-rent sections and relocate those people accordingly. You may also need to provide them with some more perqs.

The vacated "A&B" seats could become the new "C&D" seats.

This will free up some seats that can be sold for "more reasonable" prices at a new "E" level. I suspect there are plenty of current season ticket holders that would love to occupy some of those seats but may not be able to fork over the necessary ducats to make that a reality.

Simply giving away tickets for the unsold seats in the hi-rent areas is not going to go over well with those that paid a $10k just for the right to buy a high priced seat at that location. But it's clear that something needs to be done.

I've sent this suggestion to the proper people at Manley, hopefully they have something like this (or better) in the works.

They've been doing this over the course of the past 10 years, but they haven't been able to stay ahead of the continually shrinking market for tickets. The preferred seating sections are much smaller than they were in 2002. I also don't think, until 4 or 5 years ago, that they sold single game preferred seats. Today they do, but right now there are dozens of B, C, and D level seats available on Ticketmaster for any of the upcoming games.

Right now the price points are out of balance with the market for the product. Maybe if the team wins more consistently, then more people will shell out $300-$800/seat for preferred seats. Maybe no matter how many wins we get, there is not a large enough market at that price point. Today, there are games being played with empty $800 seats that could probably be sold for some non-zero amount under $800. Ditto the $400 seats, and so on. The $100 "Food Stamp" tickets are selling. The $800 Preferred Seats are not. The advantage of getting preferred seats filled now is that, when and if demand improves, those people will probably be willing to shell out for a price increase to avoid losing those seats.

As a side note, I don't know how much money was invested in Club 44, but it never seems very full at the games I attend.

 

[MikeSU02]

While I see where you are coming from, I live paycheck to paycheck as well and pay my own bills. My parents/students loans/grants/scholarships cover my SU payments, which I will take over when I graduate in May. I pay for my car insurance, gas, phone, metrocard, as well as anything else I need. Currently, I'm doing an internship in NYC so I have to pay for food as well, and I make at maximum 250 a week, working 45-50 hours. My family is not rich by any means, we are a modest middle class family that has used our money wisely.

I realize how expensive it is to see a team play, but at the cost of tickets SU offers, it's really second to none for the level of the sport and the quality of the seats/product. If parking was a pro stadium cost, such as 30-40 dollars, I understand a complaint. But if you're coming with some friends and they can't pitch in 4 bucks a piece then they should find new jobs. And I guarantee you the fans that live in Alabama make less than Syracusians and don't give a second thought to anything cost related.

Your argument is fair. And your overall point is accurate, imo. And I didn't mean to imply that I thought you were spoiled by any means. I just think that the tone that is taken in dismissing the costs associated with attending a game is one that has manifested itself, or so it seems, within the athletic department.

Cuse football is a great deal, and I'm not saying to just cut the costs across the board, but not being aware of the concerns that the costs have on the populace of Syracuse that they are trying to get to come, makes it seem like the AD is ignorant, at least partially, to reality.

The biggest slap in the face, if I were an upstate NY resident, would be moving the games to NYC. I get that some can be or even do a 1-1-1, but it feels like every big game is just going to be moved out of Syracuse. I bet more people would be willing to pay for parking if we were playing USC in the dome rather than Wake Forest. And maybe that USC game is the one that hooks them.

 

[MikeSU02]

They've been doing this over the course of the past 10 years, but they haven't been able to stay ahead of the continually shrinking market for tickets. The preferred seating sections are much smaller than they were in 2002. I also don't think, until 4 or 5 years ago, that they sold single game preferred seats. Today they do, but right now there are dozens of B, C, and D level seats available on Ticketmaster for any of the upcoming games.

Right now the price points are out of balance with the market for the product. Maybe if the team wins more consistently, then more people will shell out $300-$800/seat for preferred seats. Maybe no matter how many wins we get, there is not a large enough market at that price point. Today, there are games being played with empty $800 seats that could probably be sold for some non-zero amount under $800. Ditto the $400 seats, and so on. The $100 "Food Stamp" tickets are selling. The $800 Preferred Seats are not. The advantage of getting preferred seats filled now is that, when and if demand improves, those people will probably be willing to shell out for a price increase to avoid losing those seats.

As a side note, I don't know how much money was invested in Club 44, but it never seems very full at the games I attend.

Do you or does anyone else know about how much revenue we need from tickets, parking, concessions etc to make a profit on game days?

 

[Czar]

You know, the per capita income in Tuscaloosa is ing 19k. So the living paycheck to paycheck thing is ing bullshit.

 

[Czar]

Also, wanna know why USC isn't going to be in the dome? Because fans won't go to the games against "weaker" opponents as well. Self fulfilling prophecy.

 

[Bayside44]

Your argument is fair. And your overall point is accurate, imo. And I didn't mean to imply that I thought you were spoiled by any means. I just think that the tone that is taken in dismissing the costs associated with attending a game is one that has manifested itself, or so it seems, within the athletic department.

Cuse football is a great deal, and I'm not saying to just cut the costs across the board, but not being aware of the concerns that the costs have on the populace of Syracuse that they are trying to get to come, makes it seem like the AD is ignorant, at least partially, to reality.

The biggest slap in the face, if I were an upstate NY resident, would be moving the games to NYC. I get that some can be or even do a 1-1-1, but it feels like every big game is just going to be moved out of Syracuse. I bet more people would be willing to pay for parking if we were playing USC in the dome rather than Wake Forest. And maybe that USC game is the one that hooks them.

I keep harping on this, but I don't like the term "moved." That assumes these (as yet scheduled) games were first in Syracuse but now are going someplace else (although I do understand that is the case with USC).

My understanding is the Giants Stadium games are "home games" that we would not have gotten otherwise. Who knows, with our conference upgrade, maybe they won't be as needed. Personally I would hate for those games to be conference games, which would blow that explanation to bits.

 

[MCuse44]

I dont think the majority of alumni/people realize that residents of syracuse and the surrounding area could care less about the university, especially related to sports and even more so football. All im trying to say is if someone who has no real connection beyond "community pride and spirit" is being asking to pluck down $35 (ticket times 2 for most people) +12 (parking) + 15 (concessions) + gas + 5 hours of game plus cattle herding and parking (cant the university afford to finish their projects in the summer???)

When you can do the same thing at home but less money and time.

Yes I think your asking a lot.

 

[MikeSU02]

I dont think the majority of alumni/people realize that residents of syracuse and the surrounding area could care less about the university, especially related to sports and even more so football. All im trying to say is if someone who has no real connection beyond "community pride and spirit" is being asking to pluck down $35 (ticket times 2 for most people) +12 (parking) + 15 (concessions) + gas + 5 hours of game plus cattle herding and parking (cant the university afford to finish their projects in the summer???)

When you can do the same thing at home but less money and time.

Yes I think your asking a lot.

You framed it much better than I did.

 

[Cusefan95]

So yes, even the cost of parking will be nitpicked. The cost of gas, concessions, etc will all be nitpicked. If you want Syracuse fans to spend their disposable income on Syracuse football with the current pricing structure of seating, the current costs of traveling and parking, with the moving of big games to the NYC metro area, with the team just turning it around in terms of success, and with the general economic malaise that has hit upstate NY, you should start with conceding the fact that $12 parking will impact a certain segment of those you are trying to recruit to come watch the game in person. Especially if they have families.

your original post was about people driving from 2+ hours away having to pay $12 for parking. now it's about locals that can't pay $12 for parking. I'll concede that there is a market segment that can't or won't pay $12 for parking if you'll concede that it's pointless for Syracuse to chase that market segment. Season ticket packages at $100 bucks are too much, parking at $12 is too much... Honestly Syracuse needs to hold pricing where it is, hopefully in a few years they're competing for ACC championships - and they can re-evaluate then. For whatever reason, CNY fans are terrible football fans that won't show up and will always find a reason not to. It's too nice outside, don't want to walk to the Dome in the rain, parking isn't free, decided to get a life, whatever.

let's face it, we - as a fan base - suck.

 

[MikeSU02]

You know, the per capita income in Tuscaloosa is ******* 19k. So the living paycheck to paycheck thing is ******* bullshit.

The importance of football in Tuscaloosa compared to Syracuse is comically different. Two separate worlds different.

 

[MikeSU02]

your original post was about people driving from 2+ hours away having to pay $12 for parking. now it's about locals that can't pay $12 for parking. I'll concede that there is a market segment that can't or won't pay $12 for parking if you'll concede that it's pointless for Syracuse to chase that market segment. Season ticket packages at $100 bucks are too much, parking at $12 is too much... Honestly Syracuse needs to hold pricing where it is, hopefully in a few years they're competing for ACC championships - and they can re-evaluate then. For whatever reason, CNY fans are terrible football fans that won't show up and will always find a reason not to. It's too nice outside, don't want to walk to the Dome in the rain, parking isn't free, decided to get a life, whatever.

let's face it, we - as a fan base - suck.

If it's not financially smart to chase those people, then fine. I can't say that for sure. But I'll assume that the ROI isn't there to support this endeavor. I'll concede that point.

I don't think we "suck" necessarily. I just think that the culture of football isn't what it is in other parts of the country so we are going have loads of bandwagon fans.

Also, if we hold prices where they are, we are reducing costs if they aren't chained to inflation (or some other measurement).

 

[Cusefan95]

The importance of football in Tuscaloosa compared to Syracuse is comically different. Two separate worlds different.

True. And fans won't show up until Syracuse is competing for championships like Alabama. Which isn't going to happen, since the money to invest in facilities - at least the part that comes from ticket sales - doesn't exist since the fans aren't coming to games. I really think Syracuse is in an impossible situation, the basketball program has set a standard the football program cannot possibly live up to...yet it's the unrealistic standard the local fans insist on holding the program to. Rather than admit that, they are coming up with bogus reason for not coming like wanting to look at the pretty leaves in the fall when the discussion comes up. Syracuse trying to address any of the bull sheet reasons people are giving them isn't going to fix anything, since most of the people I know that aren't going to games won't start going until Syracuse is in the top 5...and still probably won't show unless they're playing a top 10 opponent. And in the unlikely event that happens, they'll be bitching to me on Monday about having to pay $12 for parking...

 

[kingottoiii]

The importance of football in Tuscaloosa compared to Syracuse is comically different. Two separate worlds different.

But that is the issue. People don't care about FB and that is why they do not show. It is not the price of (insert here) that people use as an excuse. IMO lowering the prices really won't do a thing. People don't show because they don't care about FB. Nothing will change that. Sure if we are a 10 W team year in and year out we will see a bump. But even then we will never sell out. Outside of major cities, I think the Syracuse area is the only area of the country that has no interest in football.

As to the other post above how people don't care about SU, I call BS. Go around Syracuse and its surrounding areas and you will see a ton of people wearing SU gear, even on non gamedays. Go to the bars and see what is on the walls. Look at SU's merchandise sales. There is a huge connection to SU. However that connection is BBall only for whatever reason.

SU should put real seating in its preferred sections. Let there be some value to the extra money people pay. Plus no more silver for empty seats.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Agree Syracuse residents for the most part care about Syracuse sports, granted mostly basketball but they still care. Football support can and will get better with more wins and a better conference and schedule, but CNY residents don't care about any of the teams minus WVU on the home schedule this year and lets face it, it's been about a 10 year slide.

We need some dynaimic players that the community considers a household name as well

 

[Millhouse]

Agree Syracuse residents for the most part care about Syracuse sports, granted mostly basketball but they still care. Football support can and will get better with more wins and a better conference and schedule, but CNY residents don't care about any of the teams minus WVU on the home schedule this year and lets face it, it's been about a 10 year slide.

We need some dynaimic players that the community considers a household name as well

not really a response to you but...

From 2005 through last year, SU scored 15 ppg against teams from BCS conferences in Dome games.

Meatheads might deride casual fans for only caring about offense but my god, that is completely pitiful. I know, newsflash, right.

How many years in a row do you expect some casual guy to keep showing up? How many people trudge out saying "not again.." everyone of you thought, god this sucks why am i here at some point.

And you can't pin that all on Robinson, last year they averaged less than 12 at home in BCS games last year (they avg 15 overall for Marrone's tenure at home against BCS)

I would love to know the attendance at other schools that were that bad on offense at home during that timeframe - if any such school exists.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

not really a response to you but...

From 2005 through last year, SU scored 15 ppg against teams from BCS conferences in Dome games.

Meatheads might deride casual fans for only caring about offense but my god, that is completely pitiful. I know, newsflash, right.

How many years in a row do you expect some casual guy to keep showing up? How many people trudge out saying "not again.." everyone of you thought, god this sucks why am i here at some point.

And you can't pin that all on Robinson, last year they averaged less than 12 at home in BCS games last year (they avg 15 overall for Marrone's tenure at home against BCS)

I would love to know the attendance at other schools that were that bad on offense at home during that timeframe - if any such school exists.

Agree, and that is what I don't get about people bitching terribly about the O Saturday, certainly a not a thing of beauty but we did score 30 points in regulation, not that bad. IN addition, some of the most explosive offenses in the country are run based offenses, Syracuse needs balanace on O to score points at this point.

All I know, is that West looks like a taleneted guy, big athletic but people here say he can't play, I don't get that either. Like I said, yesterday, Harbaugh wasn't handing out schollies to kids that couldn't play especially his last two years

 

[OttoMets]

Your argument is fair. And your overall point is accurate, imo. And I didn't mean to imply that I thought you were spoiled by any means. I just think that the tone that is taken in dismissing the costs associated with attending a game is one that has manifested itself, or so it seems, within the athletic department.

This, I think, is where you're wrong. Neither paying for parking nor paying for concessions is necessarily a cost associated with attending a game. There is ample free parking within a 15-minute walk of the Dome, and one doesn't need to buy a $6 beer or $3.50 Dome Dog from the concession stands to attend the game.

These things are superfluities - luxuries, for those who are really struggling to get by - not tied to the cost of getting into the Dome to see a football game. If someone insists upon paying $12 to park at Skytop or dropping $20 on a bite and a beer in the Dome, fine, but inability or unwillingness to do so hasn't got a thing to do with someone's ability to get into the building and watch a football game.

And I think the earlier point still stands - the economy in Central New York is doing fine, especially compared to some areas. The average Central New Yorker is not worse off than the average resident of, say, Gainesville or Tuscaloosa.

 

[OttoMets]

The importance of football in Tuscaloosa compared to Syracuse is comically different. Two separate worlds different.

But you're claiming that $12 is prohibitive. It doesn't matter if someone worships a football team in Tuscaloosa or is curious about a football team in Syracuse - if $12 is too much money, it's too much money.