Elijah Hughes

[JazzNC]

Hey, remember, NCAA sanctions and a lame duck JB should be ignored, that had no impact on recruiting. Nope not one bit. And GMAC is a bum for losing Quade. No way a school like, say, Duke would let Cal and WWW swoop in and steal a prized recruit..

I think what's confusing for me, and perhaps for others too, is that when some of us point out that the program is descending because of the NCAA sanctions, "the lame duck JB" who is being negatively recruited against, and the change in recruiting staff, we are labeled as negative. But it's permissible for other posters to use these factors to defend the decline.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful at all, but merely point out that it's got to work both ways. I don't think the sanctions or lame duck JB should be ignored at all.

Syracuse, right now, faces serious challenges recruiting. I think we sometimes forget the common denominator in the equation: we are all Syracuse fans or we wouldn't be in this board. We all want the team to be successful. In the meantime, we're not very supportive of each other's opinions, ideas or solutions.

There's always two sides, no matter how thin, to each pancake. I guess what I'm saying is that I agree with you. They are all valid reasons for our recruiting difficulties. It's just that some of us don't see anyone stopping the negative recruiting strategies (they're working). And JB's age (unless someone knows how to lend him the fountain of youth) isn't going to start reversing itself.

 

[djorange1989]

I think what's confusing for me, and perhaps for others too, is that when some of us point out that the program is descending because of the NCAA sanctions, "the lame duck JB" who is being negatively recruited against, and the change in recruiting staff, we are labeled as negative. But it's permissible for other posters to use these factors to defend the decline.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful at all, but merely point out that it's got to work both ways. I don't think the sanctions or lame duck JB should be ignored at all.

Syracuse, right now, faces serious challenges recruiting. I think we sometimes forget the common denominator in the equation: we are all Syracuse fans or we wouldn't be in this board. We all want the team to be successful. In the meantime, we're not very supportive of each other's opinions, ideas or solutions.

There's always two sides, no matter how thin, to each pancake. I guess what I'm saying is that I agree with you. They are all valid reasons for our recruiting difficulties. It's just that some of us don't see anyone stopping the negative recruiting strategies (they're working). And JB's age (unless someone knows how to lend him the fountain of youth) isn't going to start reversing itself.

Excellent post

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[Sherman20]

I think what's confusing for me, and perhaps for others too, is that when some of us point out that the program is descending because of the NCAA sanctions, "the lame duck JB" who is being negatively recruited against, and the change in recruiting staff, we are labeled as negative. But it's permissible for other posters to use these factors to defend the decline.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful at all, but merely point out that it's got to work both ways. I don't think the sanctions or lame duck JB should be ignored at all.

Syracuse, right now, faces serious challenges recruiting. I think we sometimes forget the common denominator in the equation: we are all Syracuse fans or we wouldn't be in this board. We all want the team to be successful. In the meantime, we're not very supportive of each other's opinions, ideas or solutions.

There's always two sides, no matter how thin, to each pancake. I guess what I'm saying is that I agree with you. They are all valid reasons for our recruiting difficulties. It's just that some of us don't see anyone stopping the negative recruiting strategies (they're working). And JB's age (unless someone knows how to lend him the fountain of youth) isn't going to start reversing itself.

I think you're mostly reasonable and thoughtful in your criticisms. But I just disagree that these issues can't be overcome with a methodical approach, and JB knows better than anyone how to do it. I think we'll be fine and will even thrive. JB ain't going anywhere (unless he croaks). He's already outlasted so many of these supposedly hot young coaches and will continue to outlast them. I know you and others don't think so, and I totally understand your concerns. I have some of the same concerns myself (especially when it comes to JB's activity level on the recruiting trail and GMac's ability to recruit). But so much gets overblown. And we fans drive ourselves crazy because we're not in the know and aren't privy to the careful calculations of the staff.

I was ready to make the transition to the Hopkins era, because I thought it needed to get started (pull off the Band Aid and all). But now that he's gone, the potential messy transition gets pushed back indefinitely. JB is saying publicly that he wants to stay on for 5-6 more years, which is exactly what recruits need to hear. We should be back on top of the ACC soon. And in 4-5 years, they'll quietly lure Hop back and announce it simultaneously along with JB's retirement. Hop will be a proven coach at that point with the track record of turning around the UW program and making them relevant. And JB will hand off a top 5-10 recruiting class to Hop to start off the new era with a bang. How's that for lunatic optimism?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[TinyManInside]

I was ready to make the transition to the Hopkins era, because I thought it needed to get started (pull off the Band Aid and all). But now that he's gone, the potential messy transition gets pushed back indefinitely. JB is saying publicly that he wants to stay on for 5-6 more years, which is exactly what recruits need to hear. We should be back on top of the ACC soon. And in 4-5 years, they'll quietly lure Hop back and announce it simultaneously along with JB's retirement. Hop will be a proven coach at that point with the track record of turning around the UW program and making them relevant. And JB will hand off a top 5-10 recruiting class to Hop to start off the new era with a bang. How's that for lunatic optimism?

None of this scenario is going to happen.

 

[JazzNC]

I think you're mostly reasonable and thoughtful in your criticisms. But I just disagree that these issues can't be overcome with a methodical approach, and JB knows better than anyone how to do it. I think we'll be fine and will even thrive. JB ain't going anywhere (unless he croaks). He's already outlasted so many of these supposedly hot young coaches and will continue to outlast them. I know you and others don't think so, and I totally understand your concerns. I have some of the same concerns myself (especially when it comes to JB's activity level on the recruiting trail and GMac's ability to recruit). But so much gets overblown. And we fans drive ourselves crazy because we're not in the know and aren't privy to the careful calculations of the staff.

I was ready to make the transition to the Hopkins era, because I thought it needed to get started (pull off the Band Aid and all). But now that he's gone, the potential messy transition gets pushed back indefinitely. JB is saying publicly that he wants to stay on for 5-6 more years, which is exactly what recruits need to hear. We should be back on top of the ACC soon. And in 4-5 years, they'll quietly lure Hop back and announce it simultaneously along with JB's retirement. Hop will be a proven coach at that point with the track record of turning around the UW program and making them relevant. And JB will hand off a top 5-10 recruiting class to Hop to start off the new era with a bang. How's that for lunatic optimism?

I like your optimism, and I would love for you to be right. If Hop can turn around Washington, then he'd be the perfect choice to replace JB at that time. Thank you for your thoughtful response.

 

[jr4750]

None of this scenario is going to happen.

As someone who knows recruiting and the program well, I'm not pleased to see you be so negative. What do you see happening in the next few years? I'm thinking a consistent mid-tier ACC program, but one that struggles to break into top 5-6.

 

[cuseguy]

So Hughes is coming and Tucker isn't.

Got it.

 

[jordoo]

So Hughes is coming and Tucker isn't.

Got it.

Give me Thorpe, Tucker ( if not which is likely, Sid the kid, if not Sid then Euro dude, and then Hughes makes a lot of sense to replace Battle and spot the 3.

 

[JLine]

I know I've said it a lot, but I really like this kid. Carey, him, and Swider would be great. No matter what, we have a lot of options that play the 2/3 in 2018. Carey is the key. I'm so bored of talking about this stuff, but not really. We just need something to happen. I keep repeating myself as we wait.

 

[Sherman20]

I like your optimism, and I would love for you to be right. If Hop can turn around Washington, then he'd be the perfect choice to replace JB at that time. Thank you for your thoughtful response.

Thanks. And my post was meant to be somewhat ironic. It's my pie-in-the-my hope for the future, but god knows how it will all play out. I imagine JB would prefer this kind of scenario so he knows the program/everything he built stays in good hands.

 

[Sherman20]

As someone who knows recruiting and the program well, I'm not pleased to see you be so negative. What do you see happening in the next few years? I'm thinking a consistent mid-tier ACC program, but one that struggles to break into top 5-6.

You really think we'll struggle to break into the top 5-6? That is very surprising to hear. Who is gonna stay ahead of us? I have my doubts about Tony Bennett's ability to keep UVA consistently in the top 3 (top 5-6 is more realistic but this year showed they will take a step back some years). What puts Louisville and UNC in a much better position than us with both facing potentially crippling sanctions? Coach K isn't getting any younger, but yes Duke is Duke. Buzz will only be able to take Va Tech so far and will likely leave for a top job in Texas or the South. Wake has limitations even if Manning can grow into a good coach. NC State has a high ceiling but has a long history of struggles in the shadow of Duke and UNC. Keats had a nice run at UNC Wilmington but he hasn't really proven anything major yet. Notre Dame and Mike Brey will continue to compete for a top 5-6 spot and I'm bullish on them, but I think their system always has a ceiling because their defense is never elite (remains to be seen if that can improve as their recruiting continues to rise). Syracuse has inherent advantages with Boeheim, the Dome, the Melo Center, our history, and being closest to the rich recruiting grounds in the Northeast (many guys and their families ultimately want to be within driving distance of home so their families can see them play regularly).

 

[jr4750]

You really think we'll struggle to break into the top 5-6? That is very surprising to hear. Who is gonna stay ahead of us? I have my doubts about Tony Bennett's ability to keep UVA consistently in the top 3 (top 5-6 is more realistic but this year showed they will take a step back some years). What puts Louisville and UNC in a much better position than us with both facing potentially crippling sanctions? Coach K isn't getting any younger, but yes Duke is Duke. Buzz will only be able to take Va Tech so far and will likely leave for a top job in Texas or the South. Wake has limitations even if Manning can grow into a good coach. NC State has a high ceiling but has a long history of struggles in the shadow of Duke and UNC. Keats had a nice run at UNC Wilmington but he hasn't really proven anything major yet. Notre Dame and Mike Brey will continue to compete for a top 5-6 spot and I'm bullish on them, but I think their system always has a ceiling because their defense is never elite (remains to be seen if that can improve as their recruiting continues to rise). Syracuse has inherent advantages with Boeheim, the Dome, the Melo Center, our history, and being closest to the rich recruiting grounds in the Northeast (many guys and their families ultimately want to be within driving distance of home so their families can see them play regularly).

Fair argument. I'm worried, like others, that a 72 year old coach will not have the energy or desire to fight for the top guys against the aggressive 40 year old coaches. I think we've seen that. I'm also worried you can't out scheme the top teams with average talent or young guys on a yearly basis. Yes we get NBA players but they leave us too soon. However, I agree that when we come off sanctions we will be in a much better position. I actually was asking Mason who has way more knowledge than I do, why he thought this way. But just for fun, here's who I think is above us in the pecking order at this time, despite all the perks we have, of which you listed. I don't see this list changing that much for the foreseeable future.

1. Duke - blue blood. May take a step back when k retires, but will have the money and power to hire whomever they want. Don't see K leaving before JB either.

2. UNC - blue blood. Don't think they actually ever really see sanctions that hurt them badly. Just won a ship. Actually are winning without their caliber recruit. ESPN article on it recently talked about their "struggle," on the recruiting front. Their players seem to stay while ours leave early. Ugh

3. UL - Pitino, rabid fan base. History. Don't know why, but I think they'll always be good. Too much on their side. Great stadium, tons of donors, UK rivalry. Heck, Billy Donovan will probably be their next coach. They win without getting top talent too. Great coach.

4. UVA. Bennett is great. I disagree with you. They will continue to win a lot of games. Maybe not make great tourney runs but it's a great school in proximity to a fertile area (DMV).

5. ND - system system. They win, every year. Something like 4 straight sweet 16 trips or better. If we could get Cooney back we'd beat them. He owned them.

Then I think you have these teams in very close order, FSU, Miami, Cuse, NCSU, Wake, VT. Strange not to include Pitt but when Dixon left they died, at least for a while.

So basically, I'm not confident we will break into that top group with any regularity, in order to not be seen as a very middle tier program. Too much parity in the middle and I don't believe we are going to get the top guys to beat the top 3 on the regular. Gosh I hope I eat crow though. Truly.

What do I know though. Want to hear TinyManInside thoughts.

 

[Sherman20]

Fair argument. I'm worried, like others, that a 72 year old coach will not have the energy or desire to fight for the top guys against the aggressive 40 year old coaches. I think we've seen that. I'm also worried you can't out scheme the top teams with average talent or young guys on a yearly basis. Yes we get NBA players but they leave us too soon. However, I agree that when we come off sanctions we will be in a much better position. I actually was asking Mason who has way more knowledge than I do, why he thought this way. But just for fun, here's who I think is above us in the pecking order at this time, despite all the perks we have, of which you listed. I don't see this list changing that much for the foreseeable future.

1. Duke - blue blood. May take a step back when k retires, but will have the money and power to hire whomever they want. Don't see K leaving before JB either.

2. UNC - blue blood. Don't think they actually ever really see sanctions that hurt them badly. Just won a ship. Actually are winning without their caliber recruit. ESPN article on it recently talked about their "struggle," on the recruiting front. Their players seem to stay while ours leave early. Ugh

3. UL - Pitino, rabid fan base. History. Don't know why, but I think they'll always be good. Too much on their side. Great stadium, tons of donors, UK rivalry. Heck, Billy Donovan will probably be their next coach. They win without getting top talent too. Great coach.

4. UVA. Bennett is great. I disagree with you. They will continue to win a lot of games. Maybe not make great tourney runs but it's a great school in proximity to a fertile area (DMV).

5. ND - system system. They win, every year. Something like 4 straight sweet 16 trips or better. If we could get Cooney back we'd beat them. He owned them.

Then I think you have these teams in very close order, FSU, Miami, Cuse, NCSU, Wake, VT. Strange not to include Pitt but when Dixon left they died, at least for a while.

So basically, I'm not confident we will break into that top group with any regularity, in order to not be seen as a very middle tier program. Too much parity in the middle and I don't believe we are going to get the top guys to beat the top 3 on the regular. Gosh I hope I eat crow though. Truly.

What do I know though. Want to hear TinyManInside thoughts.

I feel largely the same about your list of programs and coaches. Agree on Bennett. Didn't mean to disparage him. I just think the jury is out on whether or not he's the next Coach K or the next Mike Brey or Bo Ryan (good coaches who know how to win consistently with a highly specific system). We don't know where he'll stack up in the end. But yes I expect UVA to be in the top half of the conference most years.

As for Cuse's place, we're right there with Louisville, probably just below. But they and UNC could take steps back in the next few years because of recruiting and scholarship sanctions (just like we have), and those will be coming down at some point. Brey has built a nice program at ND, but they're not on our level. They got lucky because they mostly get program guys who don't go pro early/stay all 4 years. Whereas we've had a string of guys leave for the NBA earlier than we expected, while the sanctions hurt us with building depth.

I'm sorry but FSU (Hamilton is a good recruiter, below average coach), Miami (Larranaga is good but they have bad facilities and a bad fan base), Wake (solid history and fan base, but in the shadow of Duke and UNC), and Va Tech (Buzz will be gone soon) aren't anywhere near our level. Just because a few of those programs had a couple of years on the upswing means nothing. You have to look at a larger sample size. Pitt has great potential to be in the top 5-6, as Dixon proved for a long time. Not sure what the Stallings hire will mean for them long term but he's in the middle of a complete rebuild.

NC State has a strong fan base and very good facilities and history, so they can get closer to Louisville and Cuse's level with the right coach. But they're hurt always being in the shadow of UNC and Duke.

I'm not sure why you and others are down on Cuse's future, just because a couple of challenging years due to sanctions and the uncertainty surrounding JB's retirement and Hop taking over. We have a Hall of Fame coach and some of the best bball facilities in the country to go along with a rabid fan base, a rich history, and fertile recruiting areas close by, etc. JB ain't going nowhere and is more of a proven winner than any of these up and coming coaches. If we don't reel in a good class for '18, then I'll start worrying.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Apparently we have offered...

 

[jr4750]

I feel largely the same about your list of programs and coaches. Agree on Bennett. Didn't mean to disparage him. I just think the jury is out on whether or not he's the next Coach K or the next Mike Brey or Bo Ryan (good coaches who know how to win consistently with a highly specific system). We don't know where he'll stack up in the end. But yes I expect UVA to be in the top half of the conference most years.

As for Cuse's place, we're right there with Louisville, probably just below. But they and UNC could take steps back in the next few years because of recruiting and scholarship sanctions (just like we have), and those will be coming down at some point. Brey has built a nice program at ND, but they're not on our level. They got lucky because they mostly get program guys who don't go pro early/stay all 4 years. Whereas we've had a string of guys leave for the NBA earlier than we expected, while the sanctions hurt us with building depth.

I'm sorry but FSU (Hamilton is a good recruiter, below average coach), Miami (Larranaga is good but they have bad facilities and a bad fan base), Wake (solid history and fan base, but in the shadow of Duke and UNC), and Va Tech (Buzz will be gone soon) aren't anywhere near our level. Just because a few of those programs had a couple of years on the upswing means nothing. You have to look at a larger sample size. Pitt has great potential to be in the top 5-6, as Dixon proved for a long time. Not sure what the Stallings hire will mean for them long term but he's in the middle of a complete rebuild.

NC State has a strong fan base and very good facilities and history, so they can get closer to Louisville and Cuse's level with the right coach. But they're hurt always being in the shadow of UNC and Duke.

I'm not sure why you and others are down on Cuse's future, just because a couple of challenging years due to sanctions and the uncertainty surrounding JB's retirement and Hop taking over. We have a Hall of Fame coach and some of the best bball facilities in the country to go along with a rabid fan base, a rich history, and fertile recruiting areas close by, etc. JB ain't going nowhere and is more of a proven winner than any of these up and coming coaches. If we don't reel in a good class for '18, then I'll start worrying.

Good response. I agree Cuse has more going for it than some of the programs I have linked them with above. Definitely didn't want to imply that I thought we were on Wakes or FSUs level historically, however, was simply stating I saw us linked with them over the next several years more so than I do with the Dukes and UNCs. Certainly would like to be proven wrong.

 

[jdubs30]

I assume there is no way this kid leaves without committing, right?

 

[Cusesky8214]

I assume there is no way this kid leaves without committing, right?

I would have to think he couldn't say yes fast enough...then again...

 

[Deano]

I assume there is no way this kid leaves without committing, right?

I'm going to say yes, especially if his parents aren't here or needs time to go home and think about it for a day or two.

 

[djorange1989]

I would have to think he couldn't say yes fast enough...then again...

Unless World Wide Wes calls him I would expect a commit in the next couple of days

 

[CuseMan4]

If he doesn't commit by the next of the visit he will within a week of the visit. Fully expect to get this kid.

 

[AZOrange]

Oh yeah? Like Chino, Buss, and Kaleb were plenty good enough?

A year ago, our staff, and the STAFFS OF LITERALLY EVERY P5 PROGRAM didn't even bother to offer him.

But after his stellar year of production at ECU, now he's this incredible diamond in the rough?
Please.

G's shooting stroke actually worked - this kid's, not so much.
G was a Top 50 recruit, hence why he went to Duke initially.
And even G didn't become a solid shooter until his 4th and 5th years in college - can we really afford to wait that long?

Especially when we need players NOW?
G came on board when we had the full allotment of 13 scholarships.

Eh Steph Curry played at Davidson. It happens.

 

[AZOrange]

I think you're mostly reasonable and thoughtful in your criticisms. But I just disagree that these issues can't be overcome with a methodical approach, and JB knows better than anyone how to do it. I think we'll be fine and will even thrive. JB ain't going anywhere (unless he croaks). He's already outlasted so many of these supposedly hot young coaches and will continue to outlast them. I know you and others don't think so, and I totally understand your concerns. I have some of the same concerns myself (especially when it comes to JB's activity level on the recruiting trail and GMac's ability to recruit). But so much gets overblown. And we fans drive ourselves crazy because we're not in the know and aren't privy to the careful calculations of the staff.

I was ready to make the transition to the Hopkins era, because I thought it needed to get started (pull off the Band Aid and all). But now that he's gone, the potential messy transition gets pushed back indefinitely. JB is saying publicly that he wants to stay on for 5-6 more years, which is exactly what recruits need to hear. We should be back on top of the ACC soon. And in 4-5 years, they'll quietly lure Hop back and announce it simultaneously along with JB's retirement. Hop will be a proven coach at that point with the track record of turning around the UW program and making them relevant. And JB will hand off a top 5-10 recruiting class to Hop to start off the new era with a bang. How's that for lunatic optimism?

That isn't "exactly" how JB put it.

Hop isn't coming back.

 

[JLine]

Glad to see we offered. Hopefully we hear good news today, or soon.