Future Campus Framework Presentation...

[jr4750]

This is simply the university making it seem they'll take the university employees complaints to heart. This is a done deal, and SU is doing damage control so they make it look like they are including the university community, before doing what they had planned on all along.

Not sure what side you are on here, and certainly not trying to stir the pot or diagree with you in particular, just want to offer my opinion. While the university certainly has made many mistakes, and most certainly will continue to do so, this project seems trivial for the the shakedown it is getting. At times I think leadership needs to make decisions. $6 million is not chump change, but it will fundamentally change the culture of the campus, creating a new meeting spot/smaller quad of sorts for students around the epicenter of Goldstein, Newhouse, and the library. Given the need to continue to attract high level students (I get that scholarships do that too, assuming this 6 million would have gone directly to that is crazy) stuff like this is needed.

I sat in on the original campus framework presentation last November and each small piece, like this promenade, is being weld into a final plan that will make the school more efficient, more modern, and present it better for future generations. Complacency is not an option for a small private NE college that charges a stupid amount based on where it is ranked. What got me is the lack of a "entryway to campus." No matter what direction you come from, SU is closed off. It doesn't present well to guests or future attendees. That stretch of concrete down university is a road too heavily regulated as it stands now. No one is truly allowed to drive down it anyway, so why does it need to stay that way. If money were a problem, then I guess I could see these student and employee concerns, but consolidating outdated and unneeded staff positions was essential after Nancy C. Bringing the masses into a open dialogue about where that saved money should be re-invested is a tough thing. Everyone is gonna have a different opinion, and then nothing will be accomplished.

Moral of my rant. I get that the issue of those protesting is bigger than the promenade, moreso about how the admin keeps everyone in the loop and happy. Definitely worth a discussion, but this project seems too small and is needed to enhance the school imo.

 

[jr4750]

Interesting project, but the student housing market in Syracuse has to be getting pretty close to saturated, right?

Also, does anyone know if Upstate still owns this apartment building on Townsend street that has been vacant for years? I believe I remember that they purchased this building along with the one to the left, with the intent of renovating them for med student housing. Only the building to the left was renovated though.

View attachment 64730

Two quick thoughts here. I like the idea of expanding the housing opportunities for students and opening up more retail space around the Marshall Street corridor. I am worried about the size of the building however, and it being a giant albatross that takes away from Whitman, and the view of HOL. I do think though that modern housing is not a bad thing to continue to invest in, especially as the university is trying to "close south," to non-athletes, etc. Plus, some of the housing and the shady landlords that make a living off SU students could use a little competition.

Great question about that building owned by upstate. I have asked several reporters about the latest there, and no one seems to know why that hasn't been renovated yet. Real interesting once a decision on I-81 gets made.

 

[bnoro]

Why do these students care about the changes? This literally won't affect them at all. They'll be off campus in 3 years at most!

Same with alumni. If I cared about how SU spent its money I'd earmark a donation FROM MYSELF to pay for what I wanted. Not complain about this. Absolutely ridiculous.

The faculty that wants a "shared governance" are out of their damn minds too. It's a private university and we have a board of governors. You don't like it, go teach arts & sciences at Oberlin.

People just want to whine and the PS knows this divides opinion so it's good for pageviews.

 

[1040su]

Interesting project, but the student housing market in Syracuse has to be getting pretty close to saturated, right?

Also, does anyone know if Upstate still owns this apartment building on Townsend street that has been vacant for years? I believe I remember that they purchased this building along with the one to the left, with the intent of renovating them for med student housing. Only the building to the left was renovated though.

View attachment 64730

Upstate still owns the building. Right now there are no set plans for renovation though. There's been no decision on what to use it for & $$$ issues are the main obstacles. SPD & SFD are using it for training exercises at this point. Once Geneva Towers opened, that freed up the existing dorm - Clark Tower on Elizabeth Blackwell St. for other stuff. There is a plan for major renovations to that building at this time. Probably because its part of the main campus footprint.

 

[jr4750]

Upstate still owns the building. Right now there are no set plans for renovation though. There's been no decision on what to use it for & $$$ issues are the main obstacles. SPD & SFD are using it for training exercises at this point. Once Geneva Towers opened, that freed up the existing dorm - Clark Tower on Elizabeth Blackwell St. for other stuff. There is a plan for major renovations to that building at this time. Probably because its part of the main campus footprint.

Wonder if they are now awaiting the future of 81 to possibly sell the building to developers? OttoMets spoke of heavy interest over there assuming the blvd option comes to fruition.

Here's a cool website by a local grassroots organization that shows interactive plans for what a street level blvd and new construction could look like. The apartment building discussed is shown in the first image.

http://rethink81.org/vision/vision-images

 

[KellySyracuse]

Wonder if they are now awaiting the future of 81 to possibly sell the building to developers? OttoMets spoke of heavy interest over there assuming the blvd option comes to fruition.

Here's a cool website by a local grassroots organization that shows interactive plans for what a street level blvd and new construction could look like. The apartment building discussed is shown in the first image.

vision: images | ReThink81

love those comparison pictures, it's my hope the boulevard gets approved and Driscoll isn't swayed by political pressure to ram a wider viaduct through the center of the city. Did you catch the Syracuse.com map of buildings that would likely need to get leveled for a larger overpass?

 

[jr4750]

Yep, I saw that. Some interesting opinions on that in todays LTE to Syracuse.com. Did not even consider the lost revenues in terms of property tax, etc. Besides the historic buildings, newer and renovated facilities could possibly be in the way as well. It seems crazy to think that they could choose any other options besides the blvd, one. It would be a horrible waste of a great opportunity to generate new capital and change the look and feel of the city.

 

[OttoMets]

My quasi-educated guess is that the leadership transition at Upstate has delayed momentum toward renovation of the second Presidential Plaza building. There's always a struggle to get funds for this kind of thing, too (for a public school, Upstate gets a surprisingly small percentage of its budget from the state).

The building definitely has more value to Upstate than the potential asking price (from what I understand, the building's a total gut job), and they're not paying property taxes, so they'll hold the thing for the long haul. It's like a 2 acre parcel right across the street from their main campus, so they're going to want to redevelop it efficiently. With the viaduct directly next to the property, they're in no hurry to build - regardless of what happens, they're looking at some heavy demolition next door.

 

[CuseLegacy]

 

[FrancoPizza]

Did you catch the Syracuse.com map of buildings that would likely need to get leveled for a larger overpass?

. Unless they're talking about tearing down Crowne plaza, every other demolition in that area would be addition by subtraction. All those "plans" are just artistic renderings. We're just as likely to wind up with Erie blvd 2.0, complete with overgrown weeds. Guess whose job it is to maintain the new boulevard? Hint: it's no longer the state's responsibility. The city certainly does a fine job upkeeping its roads from what I see.

 

[xc84]

. Unless they're talking about tearing down Crowne plaza, every other demolition in that area would be addition by subtraction. All those "plans" are just artistic renderings. We're just as likely to wind up with Erie blvd 2.0, complete with overgrown weeds. Guess whose job it is to maintain the new boulevard? Hint: it's no longer the state's responsibility. The city certainly does a fine job upkeeping its roads from what I see.

It would be a state highway but I am not sure who would be responsible for maintaining. Understand too that there are already streets below 81 that need to be maintained by the city. This would not really add it to it but the street would be better planned and look nicer.

 

[FrancoPizza]

It would be a state highway but I am not sure who would be responsible for maintaining.

If it's no longer an interstate wouldn't the state wash their hands and say good riddance? Just dig a tunnel and give both sides what they want. Plus, it would be a perfect excuse to redo the underground infrastructure in that strip. If that means I pay an extra $100 in taxes every year for the next 20 years, so be it... at least it would be spent on something I could benefit from.

 

[jr4750]

If it's no longer an interstate wouldn't the state wash their hands and say good riddance? Just dig a tunnel and give both sides what they want. Plus, it would be a perfect excuse to redo the underground infrastructure in that strip. If that means I pay an extra $100 in taxes every year for the next 20 years, so be it... at least it would be spent on something I could benefit from.

I wish more people were as sound in judgement as you. Syracuse needs a win in this endeavor, not a rebuild of something that fundamentally will stump progress and development, oh... and force the destruction of historic buildings that are inhabited and provide jobs, which in case I missed a new report, are critical for the city. With all the new housing being developed, the city needs new industry to come in badly. It's happening, but slowly. Anything that can jumpstart that progress is a must.

 

[SU68]

Would a boulevard still have interstate designation? How would this not become a permanent traffic jam? I like the concept, but all of the cross streets make me shudder.

 

[xc84]

Would a boulevard still have interstate designation? How would this not become a permanent traffic jam? I like the concept, but all of the cross streets make me shudder.

Why would it cause a perm. traffic jam since 81 is rerouted to where 481 is?

The proposal would designate the current 81 through the city to be a state highway but not 81. There are also 2 parts to this "former 81". One is that most will remain a "highway" until it gets to downtown where it will let out as a grade-level boulevard where current streets exist. Better configuration and organization of all streets will result in improved downtown traffic flow due to increased capacity.

Here is a good link: I-81 : Virtual Public Meeting

 

[xc84]

If it's no longer an interstate wouldn't the state wash their hands and say good riddance? Just dig a tunnel and give both sides what they want. Plus, it would be a perfect excuse to redo the underground infrastructure in that strip. If that means I pay an extra $100 in taxes every year for the next 20 years, so be it... at least it would be spent on something I could benefit from.

Does the state wash its hands and say good riddance to roads designated as state highways?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[KellySyracuse]

. Unless they're talking about tearing down Crowne plaza, every other demolition in that area would be addition by subtraction. All those "plans" are just artistic renderings. We're just as likely to wind up with Erie blvd 2.0, complete with overgrown weeds. Guess whose job it is to maintain the new boulevard? Hint: it's no longer the state's responsibility. The city certainly does a fine job upkeeping its roads from what I see.

building a tunnel would require demolition of more buildings than the other two choices from what I've read about the project. The artist renderings are based on what has been released about the project so far, the building owners have already been contacted by the DOT to attend meetings about it last week.

I'm afraid the decision will likely come down to whoever applies the most political pressure on Driscoll

 

[xc84]

building a tunnel would require demolition of more buildings than the other two choices from what I've read about the project. The artist renderings are based on what has been released about the project so far, the building owners have already been contacted by the DOT to attend meetings about it last week.

I'm afraid the decision will likely come down to whoever applies the most political pressure on Driscoll

Building a tunnel is too costly...probably double the Boulevard.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Building a tunnel is too costly...probably double the Boulevard.

Sometimes the right decisions are the most expensive.

 

[CuseOnly]

Sometimes the right decisions are the most expensive.

It has already pretty much been shot down and it would cost too much. They are "considering" it just like they are "considering" just maintaining the current viaduct.

From what I have read, a tunnel will almost be triple what the boulevard would be.

 

[longtimefan]

It has already pretty much been shot down and it would cost too much. They are "considering" it just like they are "considering" just maintaining the current viaduct.

From what I have read, a tunnel will almost be triple what the boulevard would be.

Wasn't there also something about ongoing maintenance costs due to contacting the local water table?

 

[CuseOnly]

Wasn't there also something about ongoing maintenance costs due to contacting the local water table?

I have been keeping an eye on this. IMO the only real option is the Boulevard, both for cost and for how it will impact the city from a culture and financial perspective.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I have been keeping an eye on this. IMO the only real option is the Boulevard, both for cost and for how it will impact the city from a culture and financial perspective.

If the blvd wins out, the big losers will be commuters living in the southwestern suburbs (e.g. Onondaga Hill) who have to cross through the city to get to their jobs. If the western bypass existed, I think the boulevard would be a no-brainer.

 

[ssmorol]

I have been keeping an eye on this. IMO the only real option is the Boulevard, both for cost and for how it will impact the city from a culture and financial perspective.

Agreed...It will be a shame if they go ahead with rebuilding the viaduct. I'm in favor of renaming 481 to 81, or even the proposed sections of 481 to 690 becoming 81 so that Destiny will still be right off of 81.