FWIW. J Roethstein syas

[RF2044]

I like to call Cooney, Bambi.

We're an elite program now.

We have great recruits, and a great transfer. We have players who could potentially be great now (MG and Bus)..

I see no reason for a Cooney project part 2.

Always nice to see when one of our posters espouses an irrational, negative agenda against one of our players. I don't think I'll ever understand why some feel the need to trash young players, as if frosh performance is indicative of long term potential or how careers will unfold. You call him "Bambi?" Is that a !@#$ joke? Because if not, its a pathetic show of support for our team.

Here's hoping Cooney proves you wrong. And that has nothing to do with Gbinije, GJ, or Bus.

 

[Gabjon]

Always great when one of our posters has a negative agenda against one of our players. I don't think I'll ever understand why some feel the need to throw our players under the bus. You call him "Bambi?" !@#$ pathetic.

Here's hoping Cooney proves you wrong. And that has nothing to do with Gbinije, GJ, or Bus.

Agreed! I'm as hard as anyone on Cooney the basketball player, but by all accounts he's a good kids and teammate, which in the big picture is more important.

 

[br801]

One of the reasons for the small sample size though, is that he played so poorly that he didn't warrant time. He also played scared, like he was overwhelmed. He had a lot of bad misses. Showed no ability to drive. But did hustle on D.

I don't hate Cooney. I want to see the guy succeed. I just don't want to think he is the best SU can put in that spot next year. Sure guys improve but he has too far to go IMO. I would hope that if MG were available last year that he would have been seeing time over TC. TC was the worst third guard we have had in years.

It's not hate, but hope. I hope we have a better player for that spot than TC. Even extrapolating an improved TC is not enough.

To your bolded points:

He didn't warrant more time because the differential in experience (Triche) and talent level (MCW and Triche) was enormous, and JB almost always coaches to win the game at hand and uses practices to develop his players. When Cooney was on the court, he often seemed to be trying too hard to make something positive happen; I wouldn't call that "scared" or "overwhelmed," but to each his own.

And I don't know how you (or anyone) can say even extrapolating an improved TC will not be enough until we have seen him on court as a sophomore. I sure as hell don't think the coaching staff is taking that approach.

 

[br801]

Meh. It's not that small a sample.

I agree with you though that it's too soon to pass judgment on what kind of shooting he'll provide over his career.

In regards to next season though, I'm more confident in Gbinije being effective in the minutes he gets.

I think 400+ sporadic minutes is too small a sample to draw any conclusions about Cooney.
After MCW had played about 400 minutes as a sophomore last December, I recall a few posts on this board proclaiming MCW was the best guard in school history and comparing him to Magic Johnson.

 

[Trueblue25]

Always nice to see when one of our posters espouses an irrational, negative agenda against one of our players. I don't think I'll ever understand why some feel the need to trash young players, as if frosh performance is indicative of long term potential or how careers will unfold. You call him "Bambi?" Is that a !@#$ joke? Because if not, its a pathetic show of support for our team.

Here's hoping Cooney proves you wrong. And that has nothing to do with Gbinije, GJ, or Bus.

I wish him all the luck, but unless he improves ten fold I see no reason for him to stay. Had the Orange had a consistent offense last year (Had Brandon Triche been a stable talent) I don't think Cooney would've seen the floor.

I don't hate the kid, I just think he's lost playing for a program like Syracuse. He'd be magnificent for a team with less pressure.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

See, I don't get all the Cooney love.

The cynic could say people like him because we want to believe in white guys that look like white guys (ie, not Devo).

My Personal Reasons:
1. He plays hard.
2. From all reports, he is a fantastic shooter — in practices.
3. He's a madman (in a good way) on D.
4. It's easy to see why he missed so many gameday jumpers.
5. The kid does not lack confidence, and even when he struggled, he didn't shy away from an opportunity. There's 'character' and 'heart' in there.

I imagine #4 will be corrected during the off-season, and next year, he'll be what he is supposed to be. Southerland wasn't Southerland until late in his college career. It takes a little time for the 'click' to happen, and it's sometimes tough to fix things during a season.

Also, for all of those who proclaim Jimmy to be The Great Seer, shouldn't you give Trevor the benefit of doubt based on JB's recruitment of him?

That all said, i still expect MG to start over TC... MG looks like a young Dwyane Wade in his highlight clips. He's going to be fun. But, Trevor's shotmaking is going to be critical, next year and after MG is gone. I hope he gets enough minutes to keep him happy.

 

[moqui]

I like to call Cooney, Bambi.

is that supposed to be an ironic nickname? Because Bambi wouldn't play defense and hustle after loose balls like Cooney did. He reminded me a lot more of young Mike Hopkins than Bambi.

and this whole meme out there that his confidence was shattered, yada yada yada. He never suffered from lack of confidence. He always came in ready to play and willing to shoot. They just didn't drop. It happens. DNic hit less than 25% his freshman and soph years combined, but he still became one of the best deep shooters we've ever had.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

My Personal Reasons:
1. He plays hard.
2. From all reports, he is a fantastic shooter — in practices.
3. He's a madman (in a good way) on D.
4. It's easy to see why he missed so many gameday jumpers.
5. The kid does not lack confidence, and even when he struggled, he didn't shy away from an opportunity. There's 'character' and 'heart' in there.

Devil's advocate:
1. Do we really want to give credit for playing hard? That's the expectation for any player at this level, but especially one coming off the bench.
2. Ok, I guess. So what?
3. I think we may be confusing madman with didn't suck.
4. I don't know. He had a lot of bad misses. Some of the makes weren't exactly works of art either.
5. He's probably also white "gritty," "heady" and a "student of the game."

Anyway, I'm just messin' with you above. Cooney was a victim of being overhyped. It's pretty much working against him that he had a rep as a shooter, because you look at the numbers and can think the kid's a mess, whereas if we get what Cooney gave us out of Buss next season we'd probably think he's a pretty good player with a bright future that just couldn't get his shot to fall.

My expectations for Cooney are a lot lower now, though. I thought he might end up 2nd on our all-time 3s list. He still might, but he's going to have a fight for PT coming up. I am glad he had that big game in the BE tourney though. That's something to build off of.

 

[moqui]

Cooney was a victim of being overhyped.

what's funny is I was not a Cooney fan coming into the season . . . I didn't think he'd have the athleticism to play at the high D1 level, especially on the defensive end (and make no mistake, you need athleticism to play this decade's version of the Orange zone). I figured he'd be a one dimensional shooter and a fan fave just because he is white. It is only after seeing him on the court, and all the things he brings besides shooting, that I have become a fan.

Do we really want to give credit for playing hard? That's the expectation for any player at this level, but especially one coming off the bench.

compare him to Mookie Jones, who definitely could shoot the trey, but couldn't get off the bench because he didn't play hard at the other aspects of the game. So, yeah - give Cooney credit for the effort.

 

[pearl31]

I like to call Cooney, Bambi.

You're a clever one, aren't you?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

what's funny is I was not a Cooney fan coming into the season . . . I didn't think he'd have the athleticism to play at the high D1 level, especially on the defensive end (and make no mistake, you need athleticism to play this decade's version of the Orange zone). I figured he'd be a one dimensional shooter and a fan fave just because he is white. It is only after seeing him on the court, and all the things he brings besides shooting, that I have become a fan.


compare him to Mookie Jones, who definitely could shoot the trey, but couldn't get off the bench because he didn't play hard at the other aspects of the game. So, yeah - give Cooney credit for the effort.

Fair 'nuf.

 

[Trueblue25]

is that supposed to be an ironic nickname? Because Bambi wouldn't play defense and hustle after loose balls like Cooney did. He reminded me a lot more of young Mike Hopkins than Bambi.

and this whole meme out there that his confidence was shattered, yada yada yada. He never suffered from lack of confidence. He always came in ready to play and willing to shoot. They just didn't drop. It happens. DNic hit less than 25% his freshman and soph years combined, but he still became one of the best deep shooters we've ever had.

Watch Scrubs.

No one said his confidence was shattered, at least I didn't.

Demetrius Nichols is a 6'8 freak athlete forward. Cooney's a what? 6'4 shooter? I really don't see the rationality of comparing those two.

I think a better comparison would be with Rautins or Triche.

Andy was 15-46 .326 from 3 his freshman year. Considering he only got 8 minutes per game and 46 three point attempts...that's not bad.

Brandon Triche shot 50% from the field and 32-80 from 3 at 40%.

Brandon Triche may not be a good comparison because he played to his hype and had a great/successful freshman year, not saying Rautins disappointed.

Cooney shot 28 for 105 from 3, 27%. and 32% from the field. Cooney averaged 3 more minutes per game than Rautins.

28/105
15/46

Looking purely at the numbers I'd say confidence may be a massive issue for cooney, its not shattered, but an issue.

The one thing that gives me hope with Cooney is his aggressiveness and his so far, decent free throw shooting.

If he can move the Fg % up to 40, his 3 to 35% and keep his ft % between 72% and 80% I guess I'd be ok with him sharing time.

 

[moqui]

Demetrius Nichols is a 6'8 freak athlete forward. Cooney's a what? 6'4 shooter? I really don't see the rationality of comparing those two.

I wasn't comparing their skill sets (obviously), I was pointed out that one bad shooting season does not necessarily predict future efforts

Looking purely at the numbers I'd say confidence may be a massive issue for cooney, its not shattered, but an issue.

I don't believe shooting percentage necessarily tells you anything about confidence . . . but these numbers might:

.241
.211
.126
.085

those are the three point attempts per minute by our three most prolific shooters . . . in order, Cooney, Southerland, Triche and MCW. It is hard for me to reconcile how the team's most eager shooter suffered from confidence problems. Seems to me the numbers should run in the opposite direction.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don't believe shooting percentage necessarily tells you anything about confidence . . . but these numbers might:

.241
.211
.126
.085

those are the three point attempts per minute by our three most prolific shooters . . . in order, Cooney, Southerland, Triche and MCW. It is hard for me to reconcile how the team's most eager shooter suffered from confidence problems. Seems to me the numbers should run in the opposite direction.

It still blows my mind that Cooney averaged more shot attempts per game than Rak.

 

[Trueblue25]

I wasn't comparing their skill sets (obviously), I was pointed out that one bad shooting season does not necessarily predict future efforts


I don't believe shooting percentage necessarily tells you anything about confidence . . . but these numbers might:

.241
.211
.126
.085

those are the three point attempts per minute by our three most prolific shooters . . . in order, Cooney, Southerland, Triche and MCW. It is hard for me to reconcile how the team's most eager shooter suffered from confidence problems. Seems to me the numbers should run in the opposite direction.

One can shoot to gain confidence too. You really think they put him out on the floor just for his defense? G Mac and Jim knew he was having issues so they did the best thing they could, put him out there and tell him to shoot. That is what I'd at least like to believe. There's nothing wrong with that.

Also I may be mistaken, correct me if I am, but I remember Nichols developing a 3 point shot and approach throughout his college career. Cooney came in supposedly as lights out, had a year to gain size and practice with the team, then shot poorly.

This may actually just be his shot adjust to the size he put on while he redshirted. That's what I'm hoping as it's a common problem shooters face.