Going Into Year 8, I Still Don't Know What To Think of Dino | Syracusefan.com

Going Into Year 8, I Still Don't Know What To Think of Dino

LeMoyneCuse said:
I was thinking about this yesterday and tried to write out some thoughts. It felt more like a blog than a message board post, so I asked TNIAAM to publish it.

Curious what you all think.
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Completely agree with your thoughts. It really seems to come down to if Dino doesn’t succeed here… then who will? I think they have done a good job of getting Dino a really good staff so he can focus on being CEO. Recruiting seems to be picking up Dino is playing the portal game pretty well.

I see three issue ls that are repeated year after year: o-line sucks, too many pre-snap penalties, really really questionable time management and play calling relative to in game situation. I would love to see all three of those addressed this year.
 
I am very conflicted too. There is only one season where I think he did a terrible job and that was 2019, one of the most disappointing, frustrating and unlikeable teams we have had in football and he and the entire program pissed away the momentum we should have had after 2018. 2016 and 2017 were understandable 4-8 seasons based on having to completely overhaul the program. 2020 was pretty understandable because of the Covid restrictions in NY along with breaking in two new coordinators, the OL dropping like flies etc. 2021 was better but his in game management was terrible, we saw more of that last year particularly against Clemson. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that with JW opening up the pocketbook that he is making much better staff hires now, but no matter what the budget, hiring guys like Gilbert and Martin was inexcusable. He has a much better staff now and JW has made it clear that making a bowl every year is the minimum expectation here. So, let’s see if he can go back to back. Let’s face it, the fact that he is well liked and the school was too cheap to buy him out definitely saved him after 2021 and so far it is paying some dividends. It’s definitely a complicated thing!
 
The good: He's a high-character person. He represents the University well. He's a cool players-coach. He led us to our best season in 17 years in 2018. He led us to our best start since 1987 in 2022. And the Dome has been packed multiple times under his tenure for the first time in a long time. He maintains his cool under pressure.

The bad: He's bad at clock management. He makes bizarre and frustrating decisions related to down and distance, timeout usage, when to kick a field goal vs. when go for it, year after year. He is extremely bad at teaching discipline related to not committing penalties. We were 130th out of 130 in penalties per game last year.

Conclusion: I want him to be our coach, I like continuity. But he has to deliver more bowl games. This year, October is brutal, but the rest of the schedule isn't bad. 2024 is the easiest non-conference schedule we have ever had in the Dome era -- 4-0 plus two ACC wins should be a layup.
 
OrangeFoo said:
Completely agree with your thoughts. It really seems to come down to if Dino doesn’t succeed here… then who will? I think they have done a good job of getting Dino a really good staff so he can focus on being CEO. Recruiting seems to be picking up Dino is playing the portal game pretty well.

I see three issue ls that are repeated year after year: o-line sucks, too many pre-snap penalties, really really questionable time management and play calling relative to in game situation. I would love to see all three of those addressed this year.
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I've seen this (for lack of a better word) defeatist type sentiment spewed here over the years in the various Dino threads. Personally, I think it's a bunch of malarkey.

Dino has never been a proven (consistently) winning coach at the P5 level. He also has never been a proven (consistently) winning coach at the sub (G5, etc.) level either. He had very short (one hit wonder type) stints at both N. Illinois and Bowling Green before arriving at SU.

That being the case, the whole 'if Dino doesn't succeed here than who will' type mantra has very little to no merit, from my perspective/opinion.
 
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Eric15 said:
The good: He's a high-character person. He represents the University well. He's a cool players-coach. He led us to our best season in 17 years in 2018. He led us to our best start since 1987 in 2022. And the Dome has been packed multiple times under his tenure for the first time in a long time. He maintains his cool under pressure.

The bad: He's bad at clock management. He makes bizarre and frustrating decisions related to down and distance, timeout usage, when to kick a field goal vs. when go for it, year after year. He is extremely bad at teaching discipline related to not committing penalties. We were 130th out of 130 in penalties per game last year.

Conclusion: I want him to be our coach, I like continuity. But he has to deliver more bowl games. This year, October is brutal, but the rest of the schedule isn't bad. 2024 is the easiest non-conference schedule we have ever had in the Dome era -- 4-0 plus two ACC wins should be a layup.
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Great summary
 
orangecuse said:
I've seen this (for lack of a better word) defeatist type sentiment spewed here over the years in the various Dino threads. Personally, I think it's a bunch of malarkey.

Dino has never been a proven winning coach at the P5 level. He also has never been a proven winning coach at the sub (G5, etc.) level either. He had very short (one hint wonder type) stints at both N. Illinois and Bowling Green before arriving at SU.

That being the case, the whole 'if Dino doesn't succeed here than who will' type mantra has very little to no merit, from my perspective/opinion.
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I agree 100% with the defeatist thing, no one with a brain in their head thinks Syracuse should be Georgia. But why the hell can’t we be Wake Forest who makes bowls every year and plays fun and exciting football? The overall craptastic football we have seen since McNabb left is inexcusable.
 
orangecuse said:
Dino has never been a proven winning coach at the P5 level. He also has never been a proven winning coach at the sub (G5, etc.) level either. He had very short (one hint wonder type) stints at both N. Illinois and Bowling Green before arriving at SU.
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1) Syracuse doesn't have the budget to pry away a successful P5 coach from another school.
2) Coaches try to climb the ladder quickly so their star doesn't fade (Seth Littrell at North Texas is the poster child for this).
3) Two long-tenured G5 coaches who would be great fits at Syracuse are Chris Creighton from Eastern Michigan and Jeff Monken from Army. You think the message board is going to lose their mind with glee over the coach from a perennial 7-5 in the MAC (at one of the hardest jobs in the country) or a team that people see run the traditional triple option every year?
 
Like the sales manager said to their #1 salesperson at the end of January: "Yeah, that was last year. What have you done for me lately?" My opinion depends entirely on making a bowl THIS year (which I think he will).

(Representing the University well, being respected by the players, running a clean program are givens.)
 
LeMoyneCuse said:
1) Syracuse doesn't have the budget to pry away a successful P5 coach from another school.
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Why does Syracuse have to pry away a successful P5 coach from another school? Couldn't that coach come from a prior successful P5 stint or other? Look what Mora has done for UConn in one season! Uconn!!! With all of those forceful trade winds blowing in their face. So, IMO, the "budget" whoa is SU type garb doesn't cut it for me.

LeMoyneCuse said:
2) Coaches try to climb the ladder quickly so their star doesn't fade (Seth Littrell at North Texas is the poster child for this).
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Okay.

8 years later and a 19-39 ACC conference record, Babers' star has long faded and is black hole-esque at this stage, IMO.

LeMoyneCuse said:
3) Two long-tenured G5 coaches who would be great fits at Syracuse are Chris Creighton from Eastern Michigan and Jeff Monken from Army. You think the message board is going to lose their mind with glee over the coach from a perennial 7-5 in the MAC (at one of the hardest jobs in the country) or a team that people see run the traditional triple option every year?
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Your opinion regarding "great fits." And, perhaps a perennial (consistent) winner in the MAC could have equal to perhaps even better results with all of the other luxuries, benefits, $$$, etc. a P5 school has at its fingertips vs. that of lessor G5 types? Who knows? But yeah, if you are one of those "if Dino can't do it here than no else or who can types" that's right up your sentiment alley.
 
It comes down to recruiting and building the roster through jucos and transfers if. basic recruiting leaves gaps.

Time management and play calling -transitory nits and nats. Fans can get excited about time management but that is not what builds a roster.
 
My take is that the athletic department has invested enough at this point to say if the team is bad it's squarely on Dino and no excuses. I really like him and think he runs a good program off-the-field. If he gets out of his own finally and makes better in-game decisions he'll be fine.

I've said this before, those of us who grew up playing video games are better decision makers sometimes. Assume your defense won't get a stop, controlling the ball on offense is controlling the clock. Aggression is rewarded.
 
cusefan88 said:
My take is that the athletic department has invested enough at this point to say if the team is bad it's squarely on Dino and no excuses. I really like him and think he runs a good program off-the-field. If he gets out of his own finally and makes better in-game decisions he'll be fine.

I've said this before, those of us who grew up playing video games are better decision makers sometimes. Assume your defense won't get a stop, controlling the ball on offense is controlling the clock. Aggression is rewarded.
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The 4th and 1 48-yard field goal attempt down 3 with like a minute or so left vs. Clemson in 2021 is still one of the most mind-boggling things I've ever seen. I would have went for that if I had Justin Tucker.
 
orangecuse said:
I've seen this (for lack of a better word) defeatist type sentiment spewed here over the years in the various Dino threads. Personally, I think it's a bunch of malarkey.

Dino has never been a proven (consistently) winning coach at the P5 level. He also has never been a proven (consistently) winning coach at the sub (G5, etc.) level either. He had very short (one hint wonder type) stints at both N. Illinois and Bowling Green before arriving at SU.

That being the case, the whole 'if Dino doesn't succeed here than who will' type mantra has very little to no merit, from my perspective/opinion.
Expand...
Then why is he still here if the admin does not believe he is the best man for job? If they had a legitimate alternative why is he/she not here?
 
OrangeFoo said:
Then why is he still here if the admin does not believe he is the best man for job? If they had a legitimate alternative why is he/she not here?
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Maybe the university feels they cant do any better and Dino does well in other areas
 
Eric15 said:
The good: He's a high-character person. He represents the University well. He's a cool players-coach. He led us to our best season in 17 years in 2018. He led us to our best start since 1987 in 2022. And the Dome has been packed multiple times under his tenure for the first time in a long time. He maintains his cool under pressure.

The bad: He's bad at clock management. He makes bizarre and frustrating decisions related to down and distance, timeout usage, when to kick a field goal vs. when go for it, year after year. He is extremely bad at teaching discipline related to not committing penalties. We were 130th out of 130 in penalties per game last year.

Conclusion: I want him to be our coach, I like continuity. But he has to deliver more bowl games. This year, October is brutal, but the rest of the schedule isn't bad. 2024 is the easiest non-conference schedule we have ever had in the Dome era -- 4-0 plus two ACC wins should be a layup.
Expand...
Really good points here Eric15 I think your 1st paragraph is especially meaningful relative to how DB is viewed by the AD, Chancellor, and big donors. He has a very long leash. On top of that, DB's genuinely personable, nice guy nature also plays very well with the media. He is a sound bite machine when things are going well. Because of this, I think the media, in general, wants to see him/SU do well. Cinderella Story. We saw this during the 2018 season, and again during the 6-0 start last year.

But, I agree with you. Dino needs to deliver...now more than ever.
 
SoBristol said:
It comes down to recruiting and building the roster through jucos and transfers if. basic recruiting leaves gaps.

Time management and play calling -transitory nits and nats. Fans can get excited about time management but that is not what builds a roster.
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I think the new portal single handedly has made cuse a better team. It’s been a game changer for our roster depth. This is the first year where truly I feel we improved greatly by transfers. I feel very good about roster management going forward as long as we stay bowling consistently. I think we can be a winning program with occasional great years where we are a top 25 team to finish the year.
 
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