Grantland - Top 12 NCAA Power Rankings | Syracusefan.com
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Grantland - Top 12 NCAA Power Rankings

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Entertaining read, and some interesting information:

http://grantland.com/features/tituss-top-12-ncaa-power-rankings/

2. Syracuse

The last couple minutes of the Cuse-Pitt game could serve as a perfect microcosm of Syracuse basketball. Tyler Ennis took over the game and made three of the biggest plays of his life down the stretch, yet I don’t think he so much as cracked a smile after leading his team to the win. Meanwhile, I’m pretty sure C.J. Fair, the best player in the ACC and one of the three or four best players in the country, has collected more rebounds than he has spoken words on the season. In my experience, Syracuse fans complain about not getting enough respect more than any fan base in college basketball. Well, I figured it out. You know why people forget to mention Jim Boeheim when listing the game’s best coaches? You know why Cuse gets picked on for weak scheduling even though other teams also play terrible schedules? It’s because their players are boring, most of them suck in the NBA, the Orange are the only team in America that refuses to play man-to-man defense, the Carrier Dome is a vapid football stadium, and the team nickname is a freaking color.

Don’t get mad, Syracuse fans. I’m not insulting your team. I said all those mean things so I could say this: Syracuse is like the San Antonio Spurs of college basketball. Do you realize that only two programs have both won an NCAA tournament game in each of the last five seasons and made multiple Sweet 16s in that span? Kansas is one of them and Syracuse is the other. Here’s what makes Syracuse unique, though: During that stretch, Kansas has had three one-and-done players on their roster (Xavier Henry, Josh Selby, Ben McLemore) while Syracuse has had zero. In fact, even though the most famous Syracuse basketball player of all time might be the most famous one-and-done player of all time (Carmelo Anthony), Donte Greene is the only Cuse player to be one-and-done since the NBA’s age minimum was put in place in 2006. Funny enough, in Greene’s lone season in college basketball, the Orange went to the NIT.

While basically every blue-blooded program has turned into an NBA day care center, Boeheim not only maintains a traditional approach to his team, he’s also in the midst of arguably the greatest stretch of his coaching career. Sure, Syracuse games aren’t particularly exciting. But to hell with exciting. Boeheim doesn’t want guys who want to be exciting. He wants guys who want to win his way, and he’s got a good crop of them this year. The Orange might not score a ton, their players won’t throw up loose butthole monocles when they hit 3s, and their names won’t show up in the top 10 of many mock drafts. But they’re 18-0, they’re playing as well as anybody in America right now, and they are a lock to win the ACC and get a 1-seed in the NCAA tournament. I’m pretty sure Cuse fans are OK with that.
 
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I find grantland writers to be clueless on sports. They are purely writing at an attempt to be funny. They generally are not. I am not butthurt or anything about the article and that's a more than fair ranking. But if Grant and Ennis aren't. Showing up on mock drafts I'm in Disneyland.
 
Fair enough - I'm in agreement for the most part. They definitely tend to strive too hard to be humorous at times, but I also thought it was a fair ranking.

But the article stated that they're not showing up in the top 10 of many mock drafts, which is an accurate statement. As of yesterday, Ford had them at 16 and 18 I believe.

But any article that uses the term "loose butthole" and isn't another Calipari bio gets thumbs up from me.
 
Fair enough - I'm in agreement for the most part. They definitely tend to strive too hard to be humorous at times, but I also thought it was a fair ranking.

But the article stated that they're not showing up in the top 10 of many mock drafts, which is an accurate statement. As of yesterday, Ford had them at 16 and 18 I believe.

But any article that uses the term "loose butthole" and isn't another Calipari bio gets thumbs up from me.
Ranking is definitely fair. And I clearly didn't read it well enough I just thought they said mock drafts not top ten. But I had my mind made up after I read grantland. But, this is me 90% of the time:

angry-cat.jpg


So I may not be a fair judge.
 
The most interesting thing out of that article is that I learned the pointer finger to the thumb with three outstretched remaining fingers is the symbol for "loose butthole". :confused:
 
"loose butthole monocles"

Newhouse students, take note. Its this type of dedication to the written word that will win you the pulitzer.
 
I find grantland writers to be clueless on sports. They are purely writing at an attempt to be funny. They generally are not. I am not butthurt or anything about the article and that's a more than fair ranking. But if Grant and Ennis aren't. Showing up on mock drafts I'm in Disneyland.
the whole website reads like a high school kid trying to stretch an essay to the required length. get the freaking point.
 
The most interesting thing out of that article is that I learned the pointer finger to the thumb with three outstretched remaining fingers is the symbol for "loose butthole". :confused:

shocker2.png



Nothing beats a cheerleader doing a shocker on TV!
 
Entertaining read, and some interesting information:

http://grantland.com/features/tituss-top-12-ncaa-power-rankings/

While basically every blue-blooded program has turned into an NBA day care center, Boeheim not only maintains a traditional approach to his team, he’s also in the midst of arguably the greatest stretch of his coaching career.

You gotta lova how a traditional approach to the team means getting a player to stay for his sophmore year.
 
I find grantland writers to be clueless on sports. They are purely writing at an attempt to be funny. They generally are not. I am not butthurt or anything about the article and that's a more than fair ranking. But if Grant and Ennis aren't. Showing up on mock drafts I'm in Disneyland.
Mark Titus was a walk on for Ohio State and wrote an excellent book and blog on his time there. Not to mention he watches more college ball than any of the writers that have an AP vote...
 
Mark Titus was a walk on for Ohio State and wrote an excellent book and blog on his time there. Not to mention he watches more college ball than any of the writers that have an AP vote...
Is he a descendent of Titus Pullo?
 
Mark Titus was a walk on for Ohio State and wrote an excellent book and blog on his time there. Not to mention he watches more college ball than any of the writers that have an AP vote...
Maybe, but calling SU basketball boring (maybe this season) despite being a huge cheerleader for the B1G is kinda inconsistent. Pot--->Kettle

Also, the SU NBA players suck meme is getting tired as well. Seriously? Why aren't they giving Boeheim credit for winning with players that aren't necessarily NBA all-stars? Calipari "molds" NBA players in the same way that I "make" twinkies when I unwrap them and put them on nice plate.

Flynn, a 5'11 PG, IMO would still be in the NBA if not for his hip. MCW is going to win the NBA rookie of the year barring a complete collapse and Dion is sharing court time with an offensive black hole and a collection of stiffs that otherwise hate each other. Donte Greene was an undersized PF who couldn't do much other than take lots of 3 point shots. Wes Johnson is a SG that can't dribble and Fab Melo is a 7 footer with million dollar athleticism and a 10 cent head. Boeheim gets talented basketball players but, he's not getting top-20 recruits that are dripping with NBA potential.

Just for example, let's look at Thad Matta's NBA players (all six of them, none starting):
Mike Conley - (Rivals 2006 No. 3 PG/No. 18 overall)
Kousta Koufos - (ESPN 2007, No.2 C / No. 12 overall)
BJ Mullens - (ESPN 2008, No. 2 C / No. 5 overall)
Greg Oden - (Scout 2006, No. 1 C / No. 5 overall)
Jared Sullinger - (ESPN 2010 No. 1 PF / No. 2 overall)
Evan Turner - (ESPN 2007 No. 7 SG / No. 49 overall)

Compared to Boeheim's four
Carmelo - (Scout 2002 No. 1 SF / No. 3 overall)
Dion Waiters - (ESPN 2010 No. 2 SG / No. 15 overall)
MCW - (ESPN 2012 No. 4 PG / No. 21 overall)
Wes Johnson - (ESPN NR/NR)

And a couple of flameouts:
Donte Greene - (ESPN 2007 No. 3 PF / No. 17 overall)
Jonny Flynn - (ESPN 2007 No. 5 PG / No. 23 overall)
Fab Melo - (ESPN (2010 No. 1 C / No. 14 overall)

This is a case of not wanting to say something good so they compare Boeheim to an impossible standard.

Coach K (just a few of his 15 current NBA players):
JJ Reddick - (Scout 2002 No. 1 SG / No. 7 overall)
Mason Plumlee - (ESPN 2009 No. 2 PF / No. 10 overall)
Kyle Singler - (ESPN 2007 No. 1 SF / No. 4 overall)
Gerald Henderson - (Rivals 2006 No. 2 SG / No. 11 overall)
Kyrie Irving - (ESPN 2010 No. 1 PG / No. 2 overall)
etc.

Who would have thought that basketball players coming out of highscool ranked #1 or #2 at their position nationally, would turn into good NBA players? But Boeheim doesn't churn out NBA players like K or Calipari... so stupid.
 
Maybe, but calling SU basketball boring (maybe this season) despite being a huge cheerleader for the B1G is kinda inconsistent. Pot--->Kettle

Also, the SU NBA players suck meme is getting tired as well. Seriously? Why aren't they giving Boeheim credit for winning with players that aren't necessarily NBA all-stars? Calipari "molds" NBA players in the same way that I "make" twinkies when I unwrap them and put them on nice plate.

Flynn, a 5'11 PG, IMO would still be in the NBA if not for his hip. MCW is going to win the NBA rookie of the year barring a complete collapse and Dion is sharing court time with an offensive black hole and a collection of stiffs that otherwise hate each other. Donte Greene was an undersized PF who couldn't do much other than take lots of 3 point shots. Wes Johnson is a SG that can't dribble and Fab Melo is a 7 footer with million dollar athleticism and a 10 cent head. Boeheim gets talented basketball players but, he's not getting top-20 recruits that are dripping with NBA potential.

Just for example, let's look at Thad Matta's NBA players (all six of them, none starting):
Mike Conley - (Rivals 2006 No. 3 PG/No. 18 overall)
Kousta Koufos - (ESPN 2007, No.2 C / No. 12 overall)
BJ Mullens - (ESPN 2008, No. 2 C / No. 5 overall)
Greg Oden - (Scout 2006, No. 1 C / No. 5 overall)
Jared Sullinger - (ESPN 2010 No. 1 PF / No. 2 overall)
Evan Turner - (ESPN 2007 No. 7 SG / No. 49 overall)

Compared to Boeheim's four
Carmelo - (Scout 2002 No. 1 SF / No. 3 overall)
Dion Waiters - (ESPN 2010 No. 2 SG / No. 15 overall)
MCW - (ESPN 2012 No. 4 PG / No. 21 overall)
Wes Johnson - (ESPN NR/NR)

Usually you're right on point, but you lost me when you were complaining about Thad Matta's NBA Players. Know your stuff. Out of the six "non starting" NBA players you referenced that went to OSU:

Mike Conley's a top 5 PG in the league, so is clearly starting, Sullinger is starting and having a nice season, and Evan Turner is definitely starting and just scored a season high 34 points recently and is averaging almost 20 a game.

Pretty good for 3 "non-starting" players :crazy:
 
Maybe, but calling SU basketball boring (maybe this season) despite being a huge cheerleader for the B1G is kinda inconsistent. Pot--->Kettle

Also, the SU NBA players suck meme is getting tired as well. Seriously? Why aren't they giving Boeheim credit for winning with players that aren't necessarily NBA all-stars? Calipari "molds" NBA players in the same way that I "make" twinkies when I unwrap them and put them on nice plate.

Who would have thought that basketball players coming out of highscool ranked #1 or #2 at their position nationally, would turn into good NBA players? But Boeheim doesn't churn out NBA players like K or Calipari... so stupid.

Well...he's not wrong. Other than Melo and MCW, who is doing well in the league? Why be upset over something that's true?

It's not like it has affected SU's play on the court the last 5 years...but yes, they do need to get more players making bigger impacts in the league. That is undeniable.
 
Well...he's not wrong. Other than Melo and MCW, who is doing well in the league? Why be upset over something that's true?

It's not like it has affected SU's play on the court the last 5 years...but yes, they do need to get more players making bigger impacts in the league. That is undeniable.

Dion is having a solid sophomore year and Wes is getting minutes and playing ok. Plus you had guys like Etan, Hak, and Jason Hart all carve out nearly 10 year careers in the NBA. That ain't bad in my book. They all can't be superstars. As long as you stick around for awhile and are moderately productive then I would call that doing well.
 
Well...he's not wrong. Other than Melo and MCW, who is doing well in the league? Why be upset over something that's true?

It's not like it has affected SU's play on the court the last 5 years...but yes, they do need to get more players making bigger impacts in the league. That is undeniable.
You're missing the point. It's an illustration that most good NBA players were fantastic high school recruits and ranked No. 1 or 2 at their position to begin with. Syracuse and Boeheim don't get a lot of them compared to schools that do (e.g. Calipari, Coach K, etc.). Using a random coach from the B1G, Thad Matta's best NBA players were nearly all No. 1 or 2 at their position coming out of high school (excepting Evan Turner).

This is like the baseball draft, NBA talent level drops off severely after the top 10-12 players. There are still diamonds in the rough (guys who can do 1 or 2 things at an elite level, but aren't total packages). Look at who Boeheim is winning with. I don't think its fair to ding Boeheim for failing to turn recruits who were marginal NBA prospects into legitimate NBA players when there are few, if any, coaches who do. If there are coaches that routinely take recruits ranked 20-70 and turn them into NBA players, point them out. Titus should show his work.

The non-starter thing is my fault, I was just glancing at the numbers that I thought were MPG, but they were PPG and didn't look too far past that (even though it surprised me a bit).
 
Dion is having a solid sophomore year and Wes is getting minutes and playing ok. Plus you had guys like Etan, Hak, and Jason Hart all carve out nearly 10 year careers in the NBA. That ain't bad in my book. They all can't be superstars. As long as you stick around for awhile and are moderately productive then I would call that doing well.

I agree with you. I would say that between Sherman Douglas, DC, Rony, etc, along with guys like Etan, J-Wallace, etc, we had a pretty good run in the 90s.

But in the 00's, it's been pretty bare except for Melo and Hak.
 
You're missing the point. It's an illustration that most good NBA players were fantastic high school recruits and ranked No. 1 or 2 at their position to begin with. Syracuse and Boeheim don't get a lot of them compared to schools that do (e.g. Calipari, Coach K, etc.). Using a random coach from the B1G, Thad Matta's best NBA players were nearly all No. 1 or 2 at their position coming out of high school (excepting Evan Turner).

This is like the baseball draft, NBA talent level drops off severely after the top 10-12 players. There are still diamonds in the rough (guys who can do 1 or 2 things at an elite level, but aren't total packages). Look at who Boeheim is winning with. I don't think its fair to ding Boeheim for failing to turn recruits who were marginal NBA prospects into legitimate NBA players when there are few, if any, coaches who do. If there are coaches that routinely take recruits ranked 20-70 and turn them into NBA players, point them out. Titus should show his work.

The non-starter thing is my fault, I was just glancing at the numbers that I thought were MPG, but they were PPG and didn't look too far past that (even though it surprised me a bit).

I'm aware of everything that you posted. I also agree, but will say that it's fair to say that Syracuse hasn't had BIG time NBA talent other than Melo, at least recently. I love Hak, and he carved out a good NBA career, but he's not elite like the Mike Conleys and Evan Turners of the world.

Nobody cares that a 20-70 recruit makes the NBA. Hell, that happens all the time. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't James Harden pretty under-valued at ASU? That's just one example, and IMO that has MUCH more to do with the player and the coach.

Now if you said that Boeheim gets MORE out of his TALENT than many other college coaches, I completely agree. But that's completely different than what you said in regards to players going to the NBA.

Two different things.
 
I find grantland writers to be clueless on sports. They are purely writing at an attempt to be funny. They generally are not. I am not butthurt or anything about the article and that's a more than fair ranking. But if Grant and Ennis aren't. Showing up on mock drafts I'm in Disneyland.

Mark Titus was a walk on for Ohio State and wrote an excellent book and blog on his time there. Not to mention he watches more college ball than any of the writers that have an AP vote...

Clueless & failing at being funny is pretty accurate though with the exception of Bill Barnwell. AP voters is setting the bar awfully low.
Although the time he wrote "Evan Turner and I combined for 32pts & 8 boards" made me laugh.
 
... that it's fair to say that Syracuse hasn't had BIG time NBA talent other than Melo, at least recently.
...

Now if you said that Boeheim gets MORE out of his TALENT than many other college coaches, I completely agree. But that's completely different than what you said in regards to players going to the NBA.

Two different things.
That IS the point. They are two different things and that's exactly what I was illustrating. Titus writes that Boeheim's "players mostly suck in the NBA". No . They mostly weren't NBA prospects to begin with. That's not a negative against Boeheim's coaching ability. The players he did recruit that had NBA talent have tended to have decent careers just like 99% of other coaches. Izzo is widely regarded as one of the very best college coaches. He doesn't get much in the way of NBA success. Shouldn't he be dinged for that? Thad Matta's best NBA players were, not surprisingly, no. 1 or 2 at their position. How many did he coach up to be NBA stars? James Harden was a 21st ranked recruit nationally. Was Herb Sendak instrumental in turning him into an NBA star? How many others has he turned into stars?

If they're going to knock Boeheim for his lack of NBA stars (which is what Titus is doing), they should knock other coaches as well. You can say he hasn't recruited NBA talent as well (or as much) as 2 or 3 other coaches (Calipari, K, Self), but that's not the same as saying he can't produce NBA players that don't suck.
 
Maybe, but calling SU basketball boring (maybe this season) despite being a huge cheerleader for the B1G is kinda inconsistent. Pot--->Kettle

Also, the SU NBA players suck meme is getting tired as well. Seriously? Why aren't they giving Boeheim credit for winning with players that aren't necessarily NBA all-stars? Calipari "molds" NBA players in the same way that I "make" twinkies when I unwrap them and put them on nice plate.

Flynn, a 5'11 PG, IMO would still be in the NBA if not for his hip. MCW is going to win the NBA rookie of the year barring a complete collapse and Dion is sharing court time with an offensive black hole and a collection of stiffs that otherwise hate each other. Donte Greene was an undersized PF who couldn't do much other than take lots of 3 point shots. Wes Johnson is a SG that can't dribble and Fab Melo is a 7 footer with million dollar athleticism and a 10 cent head. Boeheim gets talented basketball players but, he's not getting top-20 recruits that are dripping with NBA potential.

Just for example, let's look at Thad Matta's NBA players (all six of them, none starting):
Mike Conley - (Rivals 2006 No. 3 PG/No. 18 overall)
Kousta Koufos - (ESPN 2007, No.2 C / No. 12 overall)
BJ Mullens - (ESPN 2008, No. 2 C / No. 5 overall)
Greg Oden - (Scout 2006, No. 1 C / No. 5 overall)
Jared Sullinger - (ESPN 2010 No. 1 PF / No. 2 overall)
Evan Turner - (ESPN 2007 No. 7 SG / No. 49 overall)

Compared to Boeheim's four
Carmelo - (Scout 2002 No. 1 SF / No. 3 overall)
Dion Waiters - (ESPN 2010 No. 2 SG / No. 15 overall)
MCW - (ESPN 2012 No. 4 PG / No. 21 overall)
Wes Johnson - (ESPN NR/NR)

And a couple of flameouts:
Donte Greene - (ESPN 2007 No. 3 PF / No. 17 overall)
Jonny Flynn - (ESPN 2007 No. 5 PG / No. 23 overall)
Fab Melo - (ESPN (2010 No. 1 C / No. 14 overall)

This is a case of not wanting to say something good so they compare Boeheim to an impossible standard.

Coach K (just a few of his 15 current NBA players):
JJ Reddick - (Scout 2002 No. 1 SG / No. 7 overall)
Mason Plumlee - (ESPN 2009 No. 2 PF / No. 10 overall)
Kyle Singler - (ESPN 2007 No. 1 SF / No. 4 overall)
Gerald Henderson - (Rivals 2006 No. 2 SG / No. 11 overall)
Kyrie Irving - (ESPN 2010 No. 1 PG / No. 2 overall)
etc.

Who would have thought that basketball players coming out of highscool ranked #1 or #2 at their position nationally, would turn into good NBA players? But Boeheim doesn't churn out NBA players like K or Calipari... so stupid.

Its a little disingenuous to list Wes Johnson. Boeheim didn't recruit one-star high school player Wes. He recruited Big XII All-Rookie Wes.

Overall I think all your doing is proving Titus' point about Syracuse fans and their inferiority complexes spot-on.
 

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