I hate to see posts trashing our players

IthacaBarrel

Shaky Potatoes
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,073
Like
11,218
Just to add context...

There were five guys who played 30 or more minutes against Penn State: Girard, Dolezaj, Guerrier, Boeheim and Hughes.

Coincidentally, ten years ago this week SU played a second game of a tournament in NYC. Four guys played 30 or more minutes in that game: Wes Johnson, Arinze Onauku, Andy Rautins and Kris Joseph.

No one besides Hughes would see as many as 10 minutes if they were on that team from 10 years ago.

the drop in talent over the past 10 years is staggering, its' been slowly going down over the past 10-12 and then I happened to be watching some you tube stuff of the team you refer to and I was just blown away how e have fallen off, it really is mind blowing.
 

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
2,130
Like
4,040
If only some of our marginal nba guys had stayed
Tyus and Oshae both could have stayed. Those two (both hopefully improved) plus Hughes, Buddy, Girard and Guerrier is easily a top 4-5 ACC team.
 
Last edited:

two3zone

RIP Shark58
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
14,530
Like
19,570
There is one player on this team who is getting the kind of minutes he should. Hughes. That’s it, that’s the list.

Every other player is playing more minutes, in some cases farrrrrr more minutes, than they should be.

Why? Because our recruiting hasn’t been nearly good enough for several years running. So freshmen are playing before they’re truly ready, and upperclassmen who should be role players are getting starters minutes.

So maybe instead of trashing players who are in a no-win situation, some people should train their fire elsewhere.
What do you think of coach trashing players to the press?
 

Zelda Zonk

Hollywood Liberal Elite Globalist
Joined
Sep 1, 2011
Messages
7,189
Like
12,752
There is one player on this team who is getting the kind of minutes he should. Hughes. That’s it, that’s the list.

Every other player is playing more minutes, in some cases farrrrrr more minutes, than they should be.

Why? Because our recruiting hasn’t been nearly good enough for several years running. So freshmen are playing before they’re truly ready, and upperclassmen who should be role players are getting starters minutes.

So maybe instead of trashing players who are in a no-win situation, some people should train their fire elsewhere.
Preaching to the choir, chum.
 

rrlbees

2017 ESPN Tourney Challenge Winner
Staff member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
72,546
Like
97,538
We only have 1 starter who would start for other ACC teams.
I call bull. You’re saying there are 70 ACC starters all who are better than our 2nd best player?
 

Capt. Tuttle

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 22, 2011
Messages
17,486
Like
20,537
Tyus and Oshae both could have stayed. Those two (both hopefully improved) plus Hughes, Buddy, Girard and Guerrier is easily a top 4-5 ACC team.
What in either player's career arc gives you any real reason to think they would have improved?
 

moqui

i just can't even ...
Joined
Aug 25, 2011
Messages
11,398
Like
23,020
What in either player's career arc gives you any real reason to think they would have improved?
oshae was a 20 year old soph last season. do you really think he was a finished product?

let's ruminate on the fact that he's earned a partial roster spot on the defending nba champs & current owners of the 3rd best record in the association
 

djcon57

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
7,757
Like
11,268
Tyus and Oshae both could have stayed. Those two (both hopefully improved) plus Hughes, Buddy, Girard and Guerrier is easily a top 4-5 ACC team.
Do all the other ACC teams get to keep their marginal NBA players or only us?
 

billsin01

All American
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
4,751
Like
5,756
Then JB needs to be pushed out. This is a Big time basketball school playing the ACC . This team wouldn’t even win the A10 . Malpractice don’t know what else to call it . There is a reason kids are not coming here and it starts and ends with the head coach
I think this is way harder than people think. You're not talking about firing a coach who's underperforming. You're talking about firing a coach that has won 1000+ games and a title and essentially built your entire program. The whole reason we are frustrated is because of the standard the coach in question established. Firing the guy who built and led your program for 40 years is not as easy as it sounds.

And by the way, this isn't a defense of JB or the state of the program. It's a simple reality that we face.
 

billsin01

All American
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
4,751
Like
5,756
But our recruiting class is full of hidden gems!!

No Top 50 players on the team. Why is anyone surprised by the results?

Boeheim was always the guy that got talent. Coleman, Owens, Carmelo, Flynn, Greene, Waiters, Fab Melo, Christmas, MCW - all Top 25 talent. Even Joseph, Jackson, Fair, Cooney (!) & Scoop were Top 50-70ish.

Goodine is the only Top 100 player that is healthy enough to play. And he barely snuck in there. Carey is clearly not a Top 50 guy at this point. Everyone else is a “hidden gem” or foreign.

Talent overcomes a lot of deficiencies.
I don't disagree with this but we've also done a nice job developing players through the years and we don't seem to be doing that much these days. Guys like CJ Fair and Shumpert and Hak and Onuaku, etc. weren't top 100 guys but they developed into really, really good players. Even guys like Fab were unplayable as frosh but turned into really, really good players.

I'm OK with far fewer top 50 guys, to be honest, but you've got to get the guys you have to improve. Not sure we do that well enough. Might be splitting hairs, but I think it's relevant.
 

AZOrange

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
13,910
Like
17,858
Ky Bowman, Naz Little, Ty Jerome, Kyle Guy, Jaylen Hoard from Wake, Alexander-Walker for VA Tech, Kabengele for Fla State, Dewan Hernandez for Miami.
Other than the UVA guys (and UVA is already ahead of us) none of those dudes was The equal of OB and TB
 

Red Holzman

Walk On
Joined
Mar 26, 2019
Messages
147
Like
340
I think this is way harder than people think. You're not talking about firing a coach who's underperforming. You're talking about firing a coach that has won 1000+ games and a title and essentially built your entire program. The whole reason we are frustrated is because of the standard the coach in question established. Firing the guy who built and led your program for 40 years is not as easy as it sounds.

And by the way, this isn't a defense of JB or the state of the program. It's a simple reality that we face.
JB has earned the right to coach his son thru graduation, and to retire on his own terms.
My concern is the trend the program is in while awaiting his decision, and the potential that while JB exercises this right the current trend continues or declines further, damaging the great legacy JB has built at SU.

Hope JB and his staff will get the ship righted -but who knows.
Just along for the ride, hoping for the best regarding turning the program's current trend around ASAP.
 

djcon57

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
7,757
Like
11,268
Other than the UVA guys (and UVA is already ahead of us) none of those dudes was The equal of OB and TB
You also have to take into account the current rosters.

Duke, UNC, Va Tech, UVA, Louisville, Fla State, arguably Miami and Wake with the added players could be better than us with Tyus and Oshea

Also, if you want to be accurate for the hypothetical, we’d need to go back 2, 3 years as well.

Basically, every single big boy D1 team deals with early entries. Every team would be better with good players coming back. We were lucky to have Tyus back last year and still had a mediocre season.
 

jncuse

Living Legend
Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
11,873
Like
16,940
I tend not to criticize college athletes in general unless they did something wrong off the court. (And that does not include somebody who chose not to come to Syracuse or who transferred). Although I can't say I have never done it either.

Pro athletes and coaches are a different story.
 

Gotothehole

2nd String
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
827
Like
872
When people say "other ACC teams" they only mean UVA, Duke and UNC. Come on bees you know that
Those are the only teams who do matter. Add Louisville. No too long ago we were in the mix for conference championships, and ranked in the top 10
 

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
2,130
Like
4,040
What in either player's career arc gives you any real reason to think they would have improved?
They dealt with an injured PG for most of the season. A healthy Frank would have helped both those guys.
 

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
2,130
Like
4,040
oshae was a 20 year old soph last season. do you really think he was a finished product?

let's ruminate on the fact that he's earned a partial roster spot on the defending nba champs & current owners of the 3rd best record in the association
I’m not saying our recruiting hasn’t faltered. But people don’t want to face facts—Tyus and Oshae both would have made this team better and both would have been better last season with a healthy PG.
 

Online statistics

Members online
58
Guests online
281
Total visitors
339

Top Bottom