Is JB willing/able to assemble a winning roster anymore? | Page 10 | Syracusefan.com

Is JB willing/able to assemble a winning roster anymore?

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I respect you but you couldn’t be further from the point being made.

Tom Brady would continue playing football if all he had to do was play the games.
The amount of work he takes on his craft and time that takes away from his other priorities.
Thus he is retiring.

Our HC is competitve as hell when the games start. He is not doing close to the same amount of work he did years ago and if you can’t see thaf then whatever.

We are the most predictable team in the nation. HC needs to either adapt and upgrade several positions or enjoy his life and let the program become what it is capable. A lot because of him but to not get the point and just make this comment ignores the macro issues.

"HC needs to either adapt and upgrade several positions"

And that's what he's doing.
 
Respect your contribution here overall Steve, but do you really think JB is capable of doing the same job he did 30 years ago? You’ve probably followed Syracuse closer than anyone so I’m sure you get where we are coming from.

I think it's hard for some to admit that sports figures they admire are flawed.

And JB has been here for 46+ years as the head coach. For many posters, he's been at the helm longer than they've been alive. It is very difficult to imagine Syracuse basketball without him -- and his accomplishments, records, achievements, etc. speak for themselves with respect to his HOF career.

I also think that some have gotten accustomed to JB always pulling a rabbit out of his hat with respect to team performance. So, while we might struggle through a lackluster regular season and barely make the tournament, we then go on to make a F4 run [like 2016], or knock off a heavily favored #3 seed like Tyus did, and it "offsets" the disappointment of the subpar regular season.

Let's face it -- until recently, JB has been nothing if not a model of consistency. His small handful of WORST seasons across those 4+ decades have been NIT teams; he's never had a losing record in a season... although that's certainly in jeopardy this year. So because of that, it seems that some always expect that in the end, JB will find a way.

Which is why this year, it's hard for some to accept that he might not be able to conjure some magic with this team. I also think that there's an element of orange blinders for some, who just aren't willing to acknowledge what many others see -- namely, that the program has slipped several notches, that it's been an extended period of decline, and that the HOF'er may have hung on a bit too long and just won't be able to turn things around this time.

They view it as an attack on the icon, instead of an honest acknowledgement of where the program currently is, and what the reasons for the decline are.
 
This team has exactly matched my pre-season expectation. People thinking this roster was going to get a 6 seed in the NCAA tournament have ZERO talent evaluation skills.

Also, in a specific sense, we're not a top 25 type of program anymore, and haven't been for nearly a decade. Thinking we're just going to suddenly and miraculously escape the 18-13 wormhole without major changes in the program = no grasp on reality.

It's shocking to me the number of people who are just now realizing what the program is. We are already 3 to 4 years behind what the schedule should have been; the brand has been and is being damaged. I am hopeful we can attract the same type of candidates that we would have several years ago, but I'm not sure if we will. I don't even know if we'll go outside for the next candidate, and I assure you that if coach has anything to say about it, we won't.

I am a tremendous fan of what coach Boeheim has accomplished in his career and have been a huge supporter of his for 30+ years. But it is possible to acknowledge him as being an all time great coach while simultaneously acknowledging the current state of the program and the current state of his decreasing acumen/performance as a coach. Bottom line for me is that I want this program to be great after he leaves, but I have a feeling that it is going to be a steep hill to climb.
Very well stated and I completely agree with all of that. The one difference I have is that I believe that JW will invest heavily in the program in terms of salary for the next HC. I will be shocked if his list of potential candidates does not include high caliber, national names looking to move up or take this challenge. Hopefully, the climb won’t be quite as steep as some think.

I am fortunate enough to have a little behind the scenes insight on how JW addressed the football staff. I am confident that he will apply the same type of big picture thinking to the basketball program, including spending what it takes to attract the right HC.
 
People thinking this roster was going to get a 6 seed in the NCAA tournament have ZERO talent evaluation skills.
it was startling to see some of the preseason predictions here in addition to the commentary by the head coach. I went on the record saying if we flipped our current 3rd guard from this year vs last year, I don’t believe that team would have made the tourney last year. I just didnt/don’t believe in a Buddy/Joe back court. It’s never been good enough. And it’s not due to the individual players but as a sum of parts, they don’t fit. It’s really stunning that JB started that lineup for 3 years now.
 
This team has exactly matched my pre-season expectation. People thinking this roster was going to get a 6 seed in the NCAA tournament have ZERO talent evaluation skills.

Also, in a specific sense, we're not a top 25 type of program anymore, and haven't been for nearly a decade. Thinking we're just going to suddenly and miraculously escape the 18-13 wormhole without major changes in the program = no grasp on reality.

It's shocking to me the number of people who are just now realizing what the program is. We are already 3 to 4 years behind what the schedule should have been; the brand has been and is being damaged. I am hopeful we can attract the same type of candidates that we would have several years ago, but I'm not sure if we will. I don't even know if we'll go outside for the next candidate, and I assure you that if coach has anything to say about it, we won't.

I am a tremendous fan of what coach Boeheim has accomplished in his career and have been a huge supporter of his for 30+ years. But it is possible to acknowledge him as being an all time great coach while simultaneously acknowledging the current state of the program and the current state of his decreasing acumen/performance as a coach. Bottom line for me is that I want this program to be great after he leaves, but I have a feeling that it is going to be a steep hill to climb.


Great post.

And the bolded section above is EXACTLY why we can't afford to give an unproven in-house AC candidate 2-3 years as a courtesy to see whether they fail or turn things around. We might have been able to do that in 2018, but not anymore given the downward trend.

We've already declined to the point where a clean break from the status quo is required to "fix" the program.
 
Based on what we've seen this year, and his words last night on the radio, I'm afraid the answer is No.

I'm not sure if it comes down to the "willing" or the "able" - probably a combo of the two - but it's become clear that he can't/won't assemble the type of roster required to be relevant (compete to be in top of ACC, a non-bubble seed in NCAAT).

Obviously I'll wait to see what the roster for next year is actually comprised of before fully judging - but if it's the incoming freshmen (plus Mintz perhaps) minus the Boeheim bros and Swider, as JB indicated last night, that's roster malpractice - just as this season was/is roster malpractice.

It's sad and tiresome.
OK, if what you say is true fine, your opinion and getting to be mine. BUT, what can you do about it until JAB decides he has taught , developed, what have you? WAIT UNTIL HE LEAVES! It's the same story for us all.

This board is a wish Boeheim would retire so we can get someone great in here to recruit and play five stars and WIN but IMO it ain't going to be that easy and will take some time before the coach has who he wants and is able to win consistently, (with man of course). Better make that Hopkins, Gerry or Pitino call.
 
This team has exactly matched my pre-season expectation. People thinking this roster was going to get a 6 seed in the NCAA tournament have ZERO talent evaluation skills.

Also, in a specific sense, we're not a top 25 type of program anymore, and haven't been for nearly a decade. Thinking we're just going to suddenly and miraculously escape the 18-13 wormhole without major changes in the program = no grasp on reality.

It's shocking to me the number of people who are just now realizing what the program is. We are already 3 to 4 years behind what the schedule should have been; the brand has been and is being damaged. I am hopeful we can attract the same type of candidates that we would have several years ago, but I'm not sure if we will. I don't even know if we'll go outside for the next candidate, and I assure you that if coach has anything to say about it, we won't.

I am a tremendous fan of what coach Boeheim has accomplished in his career and have been a huge supporter of his for 30+ years. But it is possible to acknowledge him as being an all time great coach while simultaneously acknowledging the current state of the program and the current state of his decreasing acumen/performance as a coach. Bottom line for me is that I want this program to be great after he leaves, but I have a feeling that it is going to be a steep hill to climb.
AMEN
 
The 22 class, which has five players is ranked 25 nationally and 7th in the ACC.

This is supposed to be evidence that JB can still get it done on the trail?
 
I think it's hard for some to admit that sports figures they admire are flawed.

And JB has been here for 46+ years as the head coach. For many posters, he's been at the helm longer than they've been alive. It is very difficult to imagine Syracuse basketball without him -- and his accomplishments, records, achievements, etc. speak for themselves with respect to his HOF career.

I also think that some have gotten accustomed to JB always pulling a rabbit out of his hat with respect to team performance. So, while we might struggle through a lackluster regular season and barely make the tournament, we then go on to make a F4 run [like 2016], or knock off a heavily favored #3 seed like Tyus did, and it "offsets" the disappointment of the subpar regular season.

Let's face it -- until recently, JB has been nothing if not a model of consistency. His small handful of WORST seasons across those 4+ decades have been NIT teams; he's never had a losing record in a season... although that's certainly in jeopardy this year. So because of that, it seems that some always expect that in the end, JB will find a way.

Which is why this year, it's hard for some to accept that he might not be able to conjure some magic with this team. I also think that there's an element of orange blinders for some, who just aren't willing to acknowledge what many others see -- namely, that the program has slipped several notches, that it's been an extended period of decline, and that the HOF'er may have hung on a bit too long and just won't be able to turn things around this time.

They view it as an attack on the icon, instead of an honest acknowledgement of where the program currently is, and what the reasons for the decline are.
Great post.

I have been folowing this program since 1962 this is my opinion and I think most people here who have been JB supporters have or haven't realized how poorly the NCAA sanction, the paper that was written and all the things involved damaged our recruiting for years. JB and his staff got caught with their flies unzipped. If you think they didn't know what was happening you're naive.

The HC in every high major school knows what's happening with his program. And what transpired at Syracuse University has sourly affected this program. It is why parents and the athletes themselves aren't on our roster consistently since that happened.

Whether when JB retires and a new coach is hired the program will change for the better allowiing the 5 stars to think - HMMM, maybe Syracuse is a decent school for basketball after all, maybe I should give it my all. Or are we stuck in the quicksand of the past unable to move forward?
 
The 22 class, which has five players is ranked 25 nationally and 7th in the ACC.

This is supposed to be evidence that JB can still get it done on the trail?
SO? What are you saying? That it sucks that we don't have all 5 stars aren't ranked among the top five nationally and in the top two of the ACC.

It's going to be awhile before this program gets to the NCAA's again with the class coming in. And the class after that.
 
The HC in every high major school knows what's happening with his program. And what transpired at Syracuse University has sourly affected this program. It is why parents and the athletes themselves aren't on our roster consistently since that happened.
So why is Arizona among others still getting top recruits despite getting caught.
 
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SO? What are you saying? That it sucks that we don't have all 5 stars aren't ranked among the top five nationally and in the top two of the ACC.

This is a strawman I’m not asking for a Kentucky or Duke caliber roster and no one else is. But The current class coming in is hardly better (or worse) than how we’ve done the last 4-5 seasons. It’s hardly evidence that JB is upgrading the roster. Simply pointing to the fact that he got five kids to sign LOIs is not gonna cut it to prove he can get it done like he has in the past.
 
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it was startling to see some of the preseason predictions here in addition to the commentary by the head coach. I went on the record saying if we flipped our current 3rd guard from this year vs last year, I don’t believe that team would have made the tourney last year. I just didnt/don’t believe in a Buddy/Joe back court. It’s never been good enough. And it’s not due to the individual players but as a sum of parts, they don’t fit. It’s really stunning that JB started that lineup for 3 years now.
I mean I pounded this message all offseason it was clear as day.
Buddy wasn’t going to be March Buddy the entire season.

The idea smart people think our recruiting class for next year is going to lead to a turn around is just amazing.

Talent wins. I appreciate JB but he knows how to spin with the best of them.

He has featured his kid for 3 years now. I think this season being what it is why their is no question that either son is coming back.
 
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