Is Syracuse Football A Lost Cause?

[Blanko97]

I can't believe anybody can say the program is in good shape after watching 8 consecutive blowouts, the worst team in major college football since September 28. It's more than just losing Angeli. The Oline and defense were a mess. Again the injuries with no depth which seems to happen most years no matter who the head coach or strength and conditioning coach are. Good programs find ways to be competitive when a starting QB goes down. This program failed miserably. 6 wins next year, anything less and end this risky HCFB experiment.

You’re looking at it this through a micro lens where I think others are looking at it through a Macro one. Is Syracuse in a good place right now after that mess of a season? Of course not. But are they in such a bad place as an athletics department that they should drop to the FCS level? Thats ridiculous. We don’t have the money to consistently compete for national championships (neither do 50 of the other teams in the P4) but we have enough to consistently perform well, make bowl games and make money on the program.

 

[bnoro]

in the portal age, building a program over even a 3-year period is obsolete. You should be able to flip a program in a year. The clock is ticking Fran Brown.

I think more programs fail at flipping a program than succeed. You just see the extreme examples of success like Indiana and don't look at all the attempts that didn't work out.

 

[baggerbob]

Yeah, I think that is way too premature. We can fix our problems with good players and he can get us good players. That doesn't mean he doesn't have a lot to learn. We knew that when we hired him. Because the likelihood is if we follow your plan, we are firing and hiring another coach in 3 years.

Actually after the last 8 games with an Offense that was completely dead. Nixon has a lot to prove. Was it Meeks, OG, Allen, and McCord who made that great offense?
Until Nixon proves he can do great things without those guys Fran has a problem.

 

[sufandu]

Actually after the last 8 games with an Offense that was completely dead. Nixon has a lot to prove. Was it Meeks, OG, Allen, and McCord who made that great offense?
Until Nixon proves he can do great things without those guys Fran has a problem.

The offense was decent and improving before Angeli went down.

 

[bnoro]

The offense was decent and improving before Angeli went down.

But it also shouldn't be completely and utterly useless when you have to play the backup QB.

 

[JeremyCuse]

I think more programs fail at flipping a program than succeed. You just see the extreme examples of success like Indiana and don't look at all the attempts that didn't work out.

This, people remember the teams who did it but forget about those who struggled or were a complete disaster. Miami has finally broken through but they've been ready to have this year for about 15 years straight. Va Tech is on about reboot 4, Rutgers is still that great QB away and this is absolutely the year Schiano breaks through, Florida is now on the Miami plan with "this is definitely the year" stuff etc.

 

[OrangePA]

I go back to when Coach Mac was first hired. There was talk before the Carrier Dome was built that we should drop down. No one knew then that we would build up the football program like we did. My point is, you never know until either you do it or you don't.

Not to belabor this, but, again, the “de-emphasis” issue was addressed and resolved in 1970.

When the Corbally Study concluded against de-emphasis, the move to the new stadium began.

A Michigan coach was hired as HC.

Coyne Field was built. Weight room facilities were enhanced.

Jake, a football man, was named AD.

By the time Mac was hired the investment in big time football was well underway..

 

[dasher]

Not to belabor this, but, again, the “de-emphasis” issue was addressed and resolved in 1970.

When the Corbally Study concluded against de-emphasis, the move to the new stadium began.

A Michigan coach was hired as HC.

Coyne Field was built. Weight room facilities were enhanced.

Jake, a football man, was named AD.

By the time Mac was hired the investment in big time football was well underway..

There was a lot of talk after the Michigan ass't, who I believe wasn't a coordinator, was going to be fired to drop down. I am glad that didn't happen but to say that it wasn't talked about would be incorrect. And it wasn't like Jake was a football guy from Oklahoma or Nebraska. He came from Dartmouth. As you know.

 

[SuFTW]

Actually after the last 8 games with an Offense that was completely dead. Nixon has a lot to prove. Was it Meeks, OG, Allen, and McCord who made that great offense?
Until Nixon proves he can do great things without those guys Fran has a problem.

If Fran thought he had a problem with Nixon he would have gotten rid of him. It’s trying to rewrite history to take credit away from Nixon for the 2024 season.

 

[SuFTW]

But it also shouldn't be completely and utterly useless when you have to play the backup QB.

Well as long as we don’t miss on QB2 and QB3 this year that shouldn’t be a problem.

 

[bnoro]

Well as long as we don’t miss on QB2 and QB3 this year that shouldn’t be a problem.

Most OCs can make some semblance of an offense work, even if their QB isn't the best. I was really disappointed with what I saw from Nixon once Angeli went down. He didn't even try to play to Rickie's strengths (I know there weren't many, but come on).

 

[sufandu]

But it also shouldn't be completely and utterly useless when you have to play the backup QB.

I agree, but I don't think most of that fault is on the OC, at least in regards to running the offense. The primary failure was having a competent 2nd string QB available. I don't know how much of scouting and landing QBs is the responsibility of our OC. I also think having a terrible oline really hamstrings the OC when you have to gameplan around a terrible QB. If you're QB can't successfully throw the ball to his teammates and the oline can't block for the RBs, there isn't much else. Maybe he could have game planned a more creative running game, but can you do that if you know your oline blocking is incompetent?

 

[SuFTW]

Most OCs can make some semblance of an offense work, even if their QB isn't the best. I was really disappointed with what I saw from Nixon once Angeli went down. He didn't even try to play to Rickie's strengths (I know there weren't many, but come on).

The thing is Rickie looks okay until all of a sudden he doesn’t. I didn’t see a consistent pattern of failure on his part besides the generalities of not seeing the field well and not reading defenses. Granted those are big, but he could execute for limited periods of time.

 

[MamesJungro]

Actually after the last 8 games with an Offense that was completely dead. Nixon has a lot to prove. Was it Meeks, OG, Allen, and McCord who made that great offense?
Until Nixon proves he can do great things without those guys Fran has a problem.

I definitely understood it at the time, but looking back, we were incredibly dependent on winning individual matchups. Think about that LQA run against UNLV - he simply refused to go down. Regardless of our overall talent level, it’s rare to have a core older players like McCord, Allen, and Meeks, guys who are above-average athletes but ten times the competitors. That maturity and competitive edge matters, and you can’t replace it like a widget.

 

[721Comstock]

I definitely understood it at the time, but looking back, we were incredibly dependent on winning individual matchups. Think about that LQA run against UNLV - he simply refused to go down. Regardless of our overall talent level, it’s rare to have a core older players like McCord, Allen, and Meeks, guys who are above-average athletes but ten times the competitors. That maturity and competitive edge matters, and you can’t replace it like a widget.

Well - we literally replaced 2 of your 3 examples, “like a widget”.


But otherwise…

 

[OrangePA]

There was a lot of talk after the Michigan ass't, who I believe wasn't a coordinator, was going to be fired to drop down. I am glad that didn't happen but to say that it wasn't talked about would be incorrect. And it wasn't like Jake was a football guy from Oklahoma or Nebraska. He came from Dartmouth. As you know.

I just don’t think that’s correct.

 

[FrancoPizza]

But it also shouldn't be completely and utterly useless when you have to play the backup QB.

I think it was more a case of having completely useless QBs, but we shall see if this was an outlier soon enough.

 

[dasher]

I just don’t think that’s correct.

well, I think we were both around at that time. We must have heard different things.

 

[CooperCuse]

Posting ten win seasons every 7-10 years, with rock bottom mediocrity in between, is pretty much the definition of a lost cause. But college football ain't what it used to be anyway. Mercenary players and mega-greedy conferences have ruined the natural landscape of the sport. As a fan, I find myself asking how much I really care anymore.

 

[OrangePA]

well, I think we were both around at that time. We must have heard different things.

Yes, I was around.

 

[bnoro]

The thing is Rickie looks okay until all of a sudden he doesn’t. I didn’t see a consistent pattern of failure on his part besides the generalities of not seeing the field well and not reading defenses. Granted those are big, but he could execute for limited periods of time.

Correct. But that's where the right OC could have maybe created a game plan to win us 2 or 3 of those last 8.

 

[walsh2012]

this is idiotic

 

[MamesJungro]

Well - we literally replaced 2 of your 3 examples, “like a widget”.


But otherwise…

Meeks had more yards in 24 than Gill and Cook had combined. LQA would have also been our leading receiver this year. Their first QB pick was the worst P5 QB I’ve ever seen

Seems that they weren’t replaceable!

 

[orangemass]

Yes

 

[Archbold44]

Meeks had more yards in 24 than Gill and Cook had combined. LQA would have also been our leading receiver this year. Their first QB pick was the worst P5 QB I’ve ever seen

Seems that they weren’t replaceable!

Rickie wasn't even the worst P5 QB you saw on Syracuse this year. And there is no P5 anymore. The Pac is now equivalent to the American and vice-versa. High level G6.

I get that Rickie could not do what McCord and Angeli did. But it is up to the OC to find things that work. We did not see a screen pass until late November. Why? No trick plays? No wildcat just to shake things up. We could have tried it against Pitt--a close game. Might have been better to use Filardi or Carney like Marrone did with Nassib--bring them in for a few plays, rather than drives or entire games. It just seemed lazy and ill-conceived all during that 8 game stretch. If it was the pros, it would have clearly been tanking for a higher draft pick.