Is the proverbial shoe about to drop on college basketball royalty?

[pfister1]

If the FBI comes to you a "facilitator" outside the program and says they want to see some financial records, you say "Oh ----"

If the NCAA comes to you a "facilitator" outside the program and says they want to see some financial records you laugh and say "Get the ---- Out"

The NCAA sometimes has to stick to the petty crap because they do not have the jurisdiction or tools to catch the stuff we know is going on at some schools.

This is undoubtedly true, but sometimes I think this is also a convenient excuse used to avoid opening up chitstorms they don't want have to deal with. They also don't have to prove things to the same degree that criminal investigators do and don't have to work within the same rules protecting their targets constitutional rights, so in some ways they should be able to get by with less.

 

[Newhouser]

You know what? Good.

I'm tired of programs cheating indiscriminately on a grand scale, and getting away with it. Time for the cheaters to get what they deserve.

I agree but I think everyone cheats to a certain level - what defines a grand scale?

 

[Newhouser]

I would be careful asserting there are black and white answers here (cheaters vs non-cheaters). I don't think you, RF20444, are, but the general "you".

I think the joke that has been high level D1 basketball in terms of NCAA rules adherence is finally unraveling. I think it's just where your team lands on the scale and who was caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

I love Syracuse basketball and football. But I've soured so much on college sports (especially college basketball) because the NCAA is just a joke of an institution (and the bball isn't all that great, tbh).

From the article:
So how bad could be it? In terms of NCAA rules, multiple sources told Yahoo Sports that the material obtained threatens the fundamental structure and integrity of the sport, as there’s potentially as many 50 college basketball programs that could end up compromised in some way.

BTW, if we're on the list, this should be obvious, but JB has to be gone immediately. I would think with the NCAA all over us for so long that this would have already broke, however.

As long as we insist that the players be called student-athletes at all tourney pressers - they system is fine ha.

 

[Newhouser]

I've said it a million times that it's no different than when Bud Selig was running baseball. They turned a million (or maybe it was a billion) blind eyes to the steroid issue until they couldn't stuff their pockets anymore. Eventually they were forced to do something about it but for many years they let the baseball flourish. They never should have let Selig into the HOF but they did. Eventually they will let Clemens and Bonds in as well.

With the help of the media who loved turning a blind eye when Sosa and Mark M played the Paul Bunyan and Chico Escuela routine. Everyone became much more concerned when Barry Bonds and his surly (Honest) attitude was taking over. Media knows this game has been going on forever too but watch them turn now that public opinion will turn too.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Just to be clear, fans of other schools are saying the same thing .. we don't do that, coach would never, etc. Even UK fans.

However, the rot is pervasive and this is not new. The problem for the NCAA and the schools is that someone outside the family has the dirt. I'm curious as to which organization is leaking this stuff to ESPN and Thamel. Is it the NCAA to warn schools that this information is going public or is it the FBI leaking stuff to get the NCAA to take it seriously?

 

[dan7800]

"It's not the mid-major programs who were trying to buy players to get to the top. It's the teams that are already there."

Please be Georgetown, please be Georgetown


Oh wait, I just read the "top" part. I misread it and thought it said sucks.

 

[elimunelson]

Agreed -- across the board.

I hope you guys are right. You know what's up usually so i take solace in that but I don't know if either of you have worked with basketball ops so who really knows.

 

[cuse10]

Pearl is definitely guilty. I also wonder about Gottfried at NC State, another Adidas school. Somehow they beat out everyone for Dennis Smith Jr. and they've had a lot of talent for a program of their stature. Too bad he couldn't coach or they might have actually won something

To be fair, they were on Dennis Smith before everyone else and when he tore his ACL, they remained committed to him. Loyalty is big, especially when you're at your lowest moment. You remember who was with you and who turned their backs.

 

[ssbriefcase]

Just to be clear, fans of other schools are saying the same thing .. we don't do that, coach would never, etc. Even UK fans.

However, the rot is pervasive and this is not new. The problem for the NCAA and the schools is that someone outside the family has the dirt. I'm curious as to which organization is leaking this stuff to ESPN and Thamel. Is it the NCAA to warn schools that this information is going public or is it the FBI leaking stuff to get the NCAA to take it seriously?

The feds usually leak nothing.

 

[tbonezone]

unless they have signed university checks good luck. if UNC escaped punishment then i don't know what guilty is.

 

[Jasoncuse]

I would be careful asserting there are black and white answers here (cheaters vs non-cheaters). I don't think you, RF20444, are, but the general "you".

I think the joke that has been high level D1 basketball in terms of NCAA rules adherence is finally unraveling. I think it's just where your team lands on the scale and who was caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

I love Syracuse basketball and football. But I've soured so much on college sports (especially college basketball) because the NCAA is just a joke of an institution (and the bball isn't all that great, tbh).

From the article:
So how bad could be it? In terms of NCAA rules, multiple sources told Yahoo Sports that the material obtained threatens the fundamental structure and integrity of the sport, as there’s potentially as many 50 college basketball programs that could end up compromised in some way.

BTW, if we're on the list, this should be obvious, but JB has to be gone immediately. I would think with the NCAA all over us for so long that this would have already broke, however.

"50 college basketball programs that could end up compromised in some way."

Makes it almost sound like some programs involved may be based on some peripheral figures, not the main figures like head coaches or assistants. I could see JB and the staff not involved, but SU getting named because some back channel, under the radar people get into something they shouldn't (boosters, shoes execs, AAU coaches, etc) pushing kids towards specific schools, even without anybody at that school knowing about it.

 

[DoctorBombay]

I agree but I think everyone cheats to a certain level - what defines a grand scale?

 

[SWC75]

"50 college basketball programs that could end up compromised in some way."

Makes it almost sound like some programs involved may be based on some peripheral figures, not the main figures like head coaches or assistants. I could see JB and the staff not involved, but SU getting named because some back channel, under the radar people get into something they shouldn't (boosters, shoes execs, AAU coaches, etc) pushing kids towards specific schools, even without anybody at that school knowing about it.

Will we hear the name "Rob Johnson" again?

 

[richmondcuse03]

Boeheim's about as hands off as it gets when it comes to what goes on off the court. The concern would be if there were things going on that he didn't know about (or didn't intervene with). The few contacts I still have are pretty adamant that JB doesn't knowingly pay players.

Agree with this point of view. He should be blamed for the nonsense that goes on off the court given he treats the kids like adults and expects them to be adults...but I don't think he'd knowingly pay players. The issue would be boosters or others connected...or rogue assistants.

 

[Ryand877]

I said it jokingly weeks ago earlier in the thread, but being serious this time, does anyone know if the NCAA itself is being investigated at all by the FBI for any corruptness? At one point I vaguely remember seeing or reading something, but am not sure and could not even begin to remember where and when.

 

[richmondcuse03]

all of this just begs the point that the ncaa needs to be revamped or broken down, and a new system built. The concept of amateur players is idiotic these days. Let's change the rules and pay the players off their likeness or something. The stipends don't help at all and neither do the rules where we have to treat college basketball players the same as swimmers and divers. It's a big-time money entertainment business and to expect that people won't cheat, bend rules, etc. is idiotic. More moronic is expecting that the people paid handsomely at the NCAA to actually self police the situation and piss away money.

 

[oli44]

The feds usually leak nothing.

Is that sarcasm ?

 

[OttoMets]

It would be great if threads like this came with some kind of editorial subtitle, letting the reader know if there's any news after the second page or if Pages 3 through 7 are just people whining about the NCAA. Not sure if I should press on or skip to the end.

 

[OttoMets]

What they're saying about Rakeem Christmas committing to Syracuse University

Here's why I wouldn't worry about Rakeem:

Even if something inappropriate happened (and I'm cynical enough to think that something inappropriate happens in the recruitment of two-thirds of every decent program's recruits, if not with direct school involvement, then via intermediaries or shoe companies), this was a very long time ago. That is, before the bulk of the NCAA's investigation that led to sanctions. If the NCAA investigated as thoroughly as is assumed around these parts, and if something fishy happened with Rakeem, it's likely that this was discovered years ago.

I'm in complete agreement with Mason regarding the sweeping of the most serious dirt under the rug by mutual understanding of the school and NCAA during the pre-sanctions process. So even if something was bad here (no certainty), the NCAA probably knew about it in 2013. I don't know how they handle double-jeopardy, but I'm guessing they're not going to punish Syracuse for something that both parties agreed wouldn't be punished under an earlier round of sanctions.

 

[Fly Rodder]

but I don't think he'd knowingly pay players.

I don't think any coach knowingly pays players. They have a firewall for a reason. Any coach who directly pays players won't last more than a season or three. It's all about plausible deniability.

It doesn't make it right, though or the university somehow innocent of engaging in a corrupt practice.

 

[Ryand877]

Here's why I wouldn't worry about Rakeem:

Even if something inappropriate happened (and I'm cynical enough to think that something inappropriate happens in the recruitment of two-thirds of every decent program's recruits, if not with direct school involvement, then via intermediaries or shoe companies), this was a very long time ago. That is, before the bulk of the NCAA's investigation that led to sanctions. If the NCAA investigated as thoroughly as is assumed around these parts, and if something fishy happened with Rakeem, it's likely that this was discovered years ago.

I'm in complete agreement with Mason regarding the sweeping of the most serious dirt under the rug by mutual understanding of the school and NCAA during the pre-sanctions process. So even if something was bad here (no certainty), the NCAA probably knew about it in 2013. I don't know how they handle double-jeopardy, but I'm guessing they're not going to punish Syracuse for something that both parties agreed wouldn't be punished under an earlier round of sanctions.

Do we know how far back this goes, the investigation?

 

[FrancoPizza]

Will we hear the name "Rob Johnson" again?

Or Bill Rapp.

 

[OttoMets]

Do we know how far back this goes, the investigation?

SU's old one, or the FBI?

Sounded to me like the SU NCAA investigation covered 2004-2013, give or take. So Rakeem's 2010 recruitment, I would have to assume, got attention if it deserved attention.

 

[Ryand877]

SU's old one, or the FBI?

Sounded to me like the SU NCAA investigation covered 2004-2013, give or take. So Rakeem's 2010 recruitment, I would have to assume, got attention if it deserved attention.

Specifically the FBI investigation.

 

[CuseInNOLA]

Not always a bag. Parents end up with new jobs. Light bills are paid. And it’s pervaisive.