Jimmy's Stubbornness...

[OrangeSky]

I can't begin to say if our bench guys are ready to contribute or not, but I do think our regular players are both mentally and physically tired. It's been a difficult stressful run. The beginning of the season was a fluke because the players weren't tired and the schedule was easier. Fool's gold.
Maybe not having a strong bench, especially this year, is why this team has been exposed late in the season and why we're really not a 1 seed level team after all.

 

[Briancuse]

Again .. all of our starters are already doing that.

But our only hope is that our starters break out of their funk and start hitting shots. We aren't winning big games with Johnson and Patterson.

 

[tbonezone]

He values winning over everything; will not jeopardize even an early season game by playing/developing bench. The guy who will soon win ROY in the NBA went full conference games without seeing the floor as a freshman. JB didn't trust to play him over those he trusted more. He will say it worked out great -- for Cuse and for MCW. A part of JB is fine with Roberson's shaky play as it validates his methods. He's not going to change.

as i've said before playing the bench isn't necessarily the same as "jeopardizing" a win. patterson could well be game mvp. it's all speculation.
you are right when you say JB barring circumstances (injury,fouls,suspension) will stick doggedly with his tried and true. he's not gonna change.

 

[djcon57]

Its not about rest right now, this team can't be tired, they had four days off before the Uva game, and last night if anyone should have been tired it was Gtech, they played on sunday night, and had to travel.

It's not about days off. It's about playing 30 games, playing 33-40 mins a game. Basically every game. Since the beginning of the season. Possibility of depth in March was sacrificed for a #1 ranking in early February. I disagreed with it all along and have said so.

 

[Briancuse]

It's not about days off. It's about playing 30 games, playing 33-40 mins a game. Basically every game. Since the beginning of the season. Possibility of depth in March was sacrificed for a #1 ranking in early February. I disagreed with it all along and have said so.

Everyone has played 30 games at this point in the season. I bet the Gt players have played similar minutes to this point. Jb knows his team, maybe he feels that those guys just aren't ready to play. A lot of good teams only have a 7 man rotation.

 

[djcon57]

Everyone has played 30 games at this point in the season. I bet the Gt players have played similar minutes to this point. Jb knows his team, maybe he feels that those guys just aren't ready to play. A lot of good teams only have a 7 man rotation.

Here's Mins Played in ACC games...Don't see any GT guys..also let me know where Duke and Virgina's guys are

1. Eric AtkinsNotre Dame 1181
2. Pat ConnaughtonNotre Dame 1151
3. C.J. FairSyracuse 1133
4. Olivier HanlanBoston College 1086
5. Marcus PaigeNorth Carolina 1066
6. Tyler EnnisSyracuse 1060
7. Rion BrownMiami (FL) 1053
8. T.J. WarrenNorth Carolina St. 1009
9. Devin WilsonVirginia Tech 1008
10. Garrius AdamsMiami (FL) 1003
11. Joe RahonBoston College 1000
12. Trevor CooneySyracuse 975
13. Lamar PattersonPittsburgh 967
14. K.J. McDanielsClemson 956
15. Jake LaymanMaryland 952
16. Rod HallClemson 951
17. Jarell EddieVirginia Tech 938
18. Rodney HoodDuke 937
19. Marcus Georges-HuntGeorgia Tech 929
20. Ryan AndersonBoston College 926

 

[SWC75]

How long was Southerland suspended? Like 6 games? Grant has been missing for about 2 so far. And the season isn't over. You are right. it's not really a comparison...

572-153 = 419 divide by 40 and you get 10+ games difference in their playing time. Grant was already playing far more than Roberson before Southerland was suspended- and playing much better.

 

[SWC75]

Here's Mins Played in ACC games...Don't see any GT guys..also let me know where Duke and Virgina's guys are

1. Eric AtkinsNotre Dame 1181
2. Pat ConnaughtonNotre Dame 1151
3. C.J. FairSyracuse 1133
4. Olivier HanlanBoston College 1086
5. Marcus PaigeNorth Carolina 1066
6. Tyler EnnisSyracuse 1060
7. Rion BrownMiami (FL) 1053
8. T.J. WarrenNorth Carolina St. 1009
9. Devin WilsonVirginia Tech 1008
10. Garrius AdamsMiami (FL) 1003
11. Joe RahonBoston College 1000
12. Trevor CooneySyracuse 975
13. Lamar PattersonPittsburgh 967
14. K.J. McDanielsClemson 956
15. Jake LaymanMaryland 952
16. Rod HallClemson 951
17. Jarell EddieVirginia Tech 938
18. Rodney HoodDuke 937
19. Marcus Georges-HuntGeorgia Tech 929
20. Ryan AndersonBoston College 926

It seems like the best players for a lot of teams are playing a lot.

 

[djcon57]

It seems like the best players for a lot of teams are playing a lot.

Where's Jabari Parker? Why is he only playing 30 mins a game and not 35 or 37?

He's clearly the best player on Duke...weird.

 

[tbonezone]

grant was top 5 before his injury. in fact we had 4 of the top 13. and i don't see jabari (#1 draft pick )parker.

 

[CuseCPT]

Let's play our starters until they foul out or get hurt. They are the best players on the team right? All about maximizing the chance to win.

 

[two3zone]

Where's Jabari Parker? Why is he only playing 30 mins a game and not 35 or 37? He's clearly the best player on Duke...weird.

I'm sure if we had some blowouts In our favor he would be further down the list. And the drop off from Parker and the guy behind him probably isn't as drastic as Fair and Roberson.

 

[Van111]

He has his methods. They have produced amazing year in and year out success for the program.

However, we had great teams that didn't get very far when AO went down and Melo didn't qualify. Why- because the entire season was spent not developing anybody. Last season, JB got lucky when Southerland had his issues; otherwise, Grant would not have been at all developed.

This year, it was SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO obvious that the mojo was lost after the first Duke game. Our play just gradually declined even before the first loss came. To me, the slump was inevitable, though I certainly did not think it would get this bad.

There is simply no excuse to have the talent we have sitting on the bench not playing at all. How can Patterson and/or BJ not even get a look when Trevor has played this poorly and it is obvious that Mike G can't score ??? Why is Trevor such a golden boy ?? He is allowed and even encouraged to shoot at every opportunity even when he is only hitting 25% or less. Mike G has his role, but his role should be on the bench when the team is struggling to score as much as it has struggled. All season long Fair and Grant played with their tongues hanging out and heaven forbid that Roberson got more than a minute here or there.

Finally, Roberson gets a chance, mixed reviews on how he played. Point is - he has the FRIGGIN talent. If the talent was developed all season long he could have been ready and stepped in nicely for Jerami. He still might if Jerami stays sidelined. There was another thread saying that Jimmy threw the kid under the bus. Hope it wasn't true, but if it was - simply awful by the coach.

Yes, I am frustrated. I am frustrated by what has been obvious to me and to some others on this forum all season long. I am frustrated because we have a team in crisis mode, and not a team that is getting better and stronger as the season has progressed. This team was #1. It showed what it's capability is, there is no excuse for this level of deterioration.

Yes, I have officially melted down.

The writing was on the wall after the Duke game at Syracuse. The team gave their all and it showed aginst ND were it not for a red hot Coon that evening, we may have started losing then. The team is spent and have been parked in the zone all season, then they are supposed to come out and full court press? How does that help already tired legs shoot is beyound me. Then we play pretty much 6 guys all nigh and expect Roberson to just come off the bench and start. It was obvious the kid was rusty and quite frankly tentative when the shot was available. He is a shooter and needs to let it go. Again, Fair had to pretty much do it all with Tyler backing him. IMO, and I am no coach, Tyler should have been placed in a sixth man position, not started at this point. We lost our opportunity 12 games ago to start getting some guys some PT. Not a great time to shake up the line up at seasons end and tournament time. No answers or suggestions from me, just reality, Coach JB molded this team 6-7 deep, and we have 2 guys hobbled out of that group. We pretty much live and die with what we have and hope for the best. Face it guys, in the last 5 games, JB has been out coached in most of them. Go back and look at the tape, watch the empty possessions and the same basic attacking of the zone teams have implemented against us. I want to be proven wrong here, but the more I watch the less I see our chances in turning this around. If Duke or Virginia get the 1 seed, it will be in the East, and that puts SU most likely as a 4/5 seed in the West unless they win out. I believe if we win out, we may not get the #1 in the East, but will stay in the East as a #2. Truth is, I think we play better against very good teams, and that doesn't Bode well for us in the tounament at least early on. Coach JB needs to stop calling out players and put it on his shoulders here on out, regardless.

 

[two3zone]

What is the downside? They miss shots? Our starters are already doing that. We lose? Again our starters are already doing that.

I don't disagree with you, but that's where the zone defense limits the number of people we have in our rotation. If we played man I have no doubt we would have seen more of the freshman this season but the zone defense is going to keep them on the bench.

 

[Van111]

I'm sure if we had some blowouts In our favor he would be further down the list. And the drop off from Parker and the guy behind him probably isn't as drastic as Fair and Roberson.

Its a long season, smart on Coach K's part to give hime some blows. Why didn't we do that?

 

[two3zone]

Its a long season, smart on Coach K's part to give hime some blows. Why didn't we do that?

We didn't have any blowouts.

 

[anomander]

JB has his ways, but 1 thing I have always been critical of is his refusal to develop a bench. Now I know everyone will say he is a HOF coach with 900+ wins...so on and so forth...However can anyone deny that with the talent we have consistently had since the mid 80's that he should have far more then 1 NC and 4 FF's? I do. I don't think it's a coincidence we are famous for our March flame outs. Every year going back to whenever we start our red hot, but we run our starters into the ground, and the inevitable cold streak happens in February. You can pretty much take it to the bank it's going to happen. Is it also a coincidence that Gmac, AO, Triche, and Grant have all experienced late season injuries (and not talking about sprains or breaks)? Talk to any team trainer and they will tell you they get worried about the grind of the season and the increased probability of injuries occurring with the excessive wear and tear.

All I know is we have underachieved over the years and if i had to put my finger on 1 reason it is because of the refusal to develop a bench.

 

[newmexicuse]

The writing was on the wall after the Duke game at Syracuse. The team gave their all and it showed aginst ND were it not for a red hot Coon that evening, we may have started losing then. The team is spent and have been parked in the zone all season, then they are supposed to come out and full court press? How does that help already tired legs shoot is beyound me. Then we play pretty much 6 guys all nigh and expect Roberson to just come off the bench and start. It was obvious the kid was rusty and quite frankly tentative when the shot was available. He is a shooter and needs to let it go. Again, Fair had to pretty much do it all with Tyler backing him. IMO, and I am no coach, Tyler should have been placed in a sixth man position, not started at this point. We lost our opportunity 12 games ago to start getting some guys some PT. Not a great time to shake up the line up at seasons end and tournament time. No answers or suggestions from me, just reality, Coach JB molded this team 6-7 deep, and we have 2 guys hobbled out of that group. We pretty much live and die with what we have and hope for the best. Face it guys, in the last 5 games, JB has been out coached in most of them. Go back and look at the tape, watch the empty possessions and the same basic attacking of the zone teams have implemented against us. I want to be proven wrong here, but the more I watch the less I see our chances in turning this around. If Duke or Virginia get the 1 seed, it will be in the East, and that puts SU most likely as a 4/5 seed in the West unless they win out. I believe if we win out, we may not get the #1 in the East, but will stay in the East as a #2. Truth is, I think we play better against very good teams, and that doesn't Bode well for us in the tounament at least early on. Coach JB needs to stop calling out players and put it on his shoulders here on out, regardless.

Nice post - I agree with most of your thoughts except that it is never too late to shake things up if what we are doing now isn't working. Worse case - we have one more regular season game plus the ACC tourney - continue to start Roberson (unless Grant is able to play) & get in some run for Patterson and Johnson. Even if they can't improve on what we have right now it helps in two ways:

1. Sends a message to the guys who are getting the minutes and not performing
2. Gets the other guys more rested & fresh for a Dance run.

 

[-jk-]

Man, y'all obviously don't read DBR! Our fans say the exact same stuff. It's legendary! K shortens his bench. Damnit.

"1) Koaching Koncerns
a) Krzyzewski’s management of the rotation will bite us/has bitten us in the backside.
b) We have no bench.
c) [Player X who transferred away] sure would help us right now. (Related to a.)
d) I’m worried that [player] will transfer. (Related to a.)
e) Krzyzewski’s management of the clock (AKA stall ball) will bite us/has bitten us in the backside."

Been there. Done that. I guess K and JB are really made for each other.

-jk

 

[jmm29]

Typical board meltdown...will NOT be tolerated

 

[CU44SE]

Everyone keeps saying play your best guys, blah blah blah. College kids don't get tired. You know what would be an interesting concept?

Develop a bench during the season and keep everyone rested. Then when the tournament rolls around you shorten your bench. Players will be fresher. That's the time to shorten your bench. Everyone on this team is worn down. I don't disagree the best players should play in the tournament, that's when it's win or go home but it doesn't need to be like that during the regular season. Ya winning conference championships and only losing 3 games in a year is nice but people don't tend to remember that if you flame out in March. People remember National Championships and that is what every season should be based on. Developing a team for that final title run, not running your team into the ground to win 27 games and lose in the sweet 16 or second round.

 

[retro44]

Since when Bernie has left who has been coaching the big men as we are getting pounded by other teams big men on a regular basis. Have we really seen any progress the last few years with our 4 and 5 star kids or has our staff along with the recruiting sites bombed out?

 

[two3zone]

Since when Bernie has left who has been coaching the big men as we are getting pounded by other teams big men on a regular basis. Have we really seen any progress the last few years with our 4 and 5 star kids or has our staff along with the recruiting sites bombed out?

Roberts, Watkins, Forth. He didn't do much with them. If you say Fab, I'll say BMK. Fab had a remarkable turnaround but BMK was the same the next season. I personally thought Fine lost his touch in the early 00s.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Here's a thought: If Kevin Ware played for the CUSE under JB's philosophy, no way we win a NC after he breaks his leg. There would've been no experienced backup in the rotation, and since he was playing, it would've just meant that some talented frosh/soph was riding the pine.

 

[cuserulesall]

He has his methods. They have produced amazing year in and year out success for the program.

However, we had great teams that didn't get very far when AO went down and Melo didn't qualify. Why- because the entire season was spent not developing anybody. Last season, JB got lucky when Southerland had his issues; otherwise, Grant would not have been at all developed.

This year, it was SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO obvious that the mojo was lost after the first Duke game. Our play just gradually declined even before the first loss came. To me, the slump was inevitable, though I certainly did not think it would get this bad.

There is simply no excuse to have the talent we have sitting on the bench not playing at all. How can Patterson and/or BJ not even get a look when Trevor has played this poorly and it is obvious that Mike G can't score ??? Why is Trevor such a golden boy ?? He is allowed and even encouraged to shoot at every opportunity even when he is only hitting 25% or less. Mike G has his role, but his role should be on the bench when the team is struggling to score as much as it has struggled. All season long Fair and Grant played with their tongues hanging out and heaven forbid that Roberson got more than a minute here or there.

Finally, Roberson gets a chance, mixed reviews on how he played. Point is - he has the FRIGGIN talent. If the talent was developed all season long he could have been ready and stepped in nicely for Jerami. He still might if Jerami stays sidelined. There was another thread saying that Jimmy threw the kid under the bus. Hope it wasn't true, but if it was - simply awful by the coach.

Yes, I am frustrated. I am frustrated by what has been obvious to me and to some others on this forum all season long. I am frustrated because we have a team in crisis mode, and not a team that is getting better and stronger as the season has progressed. This team was #1. It showed what it's capability is, there is no excuse for this level of deterioration.

Yes, I have officially melted down.

I'm pissed and I said in the past month repeatedly jb use your bench . he beat are starting 5 to death . I never even got one like . you got 15 , i'm pissed ! LOL