Judgement day Friday, Feb. 8, 2013

[BlueCurtain]

This kind of nonsense just makes me wish all Div 1 schools would adopt their basketball/football program as professional farm team for the NFL/NBA. No more BS with the NCAA and academic integrity. Just suit up and play for a decent wage until you're ready to make the jump. I won't feel bad if a guy like Paul Harris or James Southerland may be deprived of learning about Aristotle and Socrates.

 

[CorduroyG]

That's nice...I'm 51 and an SU grad. I think playing for SU is a privilege, not a right. I also think if you cheat and get caught then you have to pay the price. And, having to cheat in HS (other than to just prove you can get away with it) is beyond ridiculous. With due respect, maybe you need to get some perspective on life lessons...just sayin...

then a 6 game suspension is paying the price.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Reading comprehension.

IF he cheated, he should be punished.

Where there's smoke, there's usually fire.

Not a single judgment at all.

That's all. If you people didn't see the kernel of truth, you wouldnt get so butthurt about my opinion. Just saying.

I think you are getting beat up pretty unfairly here, but you certainly could have phrased your original post a little better. The bashing you are getting contrasts pretty sharply to the response this board has when a rival runs into some trouble.

That said, even assuming he did get help on something, he has been punished. He's been suspended 6 games. That's roughly 20% of his senior season. A season which finally saw his hard work over the previous three years pay off. It is 6 fewer games for him to make a case for himself to get a paying job somewhere playing ball.

So unless he committed an egregious offense, I think he has been punished very harshly already.

 

[chlywtr]

You sound like the residents in Gatti's neighborhood who thought he was wonderful and you just had to overlook his "business" because he did nice things for them like having a big Fourth of July party.

Arturo Gatti???

 

[SarasotaPaul]

This kind of nonsense just makes me wish all Div 1 schools would adopt their basketball/football program as professional farm team for the NFL/NBA. No more BS with the NCAA and academic integrity. Just suit up and play for a decent wage until you're ready to make the jump. I won't feel bad if a guy like Paul Harris or James Southerland may be deprived of learning about Aristotle and Socrates.

I have not been feeling well and have been taking some prescription drugs, so that may be why. Haven't seen my psychiatrist in several years, is that it? Wondering of the Florida 80 degree weather and sun has fried my brain, hmmmm. Thinking of hitting the like button for BlueCurtain----- abject terror setting in ------

But fair is fair - go CJ --00ps train of thought here-----

I totally agree with you BlueCurtain.

Honey, get the Doctor on the phone and I mean right now!!!

 

[Orangello]

Arturo Gatti???

I think he meant John Gotti, the Dapper Don.

 

[chlywtr]

I think he meant John Gotti, the Dapper Don.

no way

 

[armory]

This is all just another symptom of the increasingly spreading trend in american society: belief in the "justice" = "fairness" fallacy. As old as dirt. A dog infinitely chasing its tail.

They try to pretend as if they treat athletes/students equally and "fairly", thus punishing athletes as if they were any student is "just". But justice is not treating collegiate athletes like just any student, because they aren't just any student. They weren't just any student when they breezed through admissions... they weren't just any student when they were given a full scholarship worth a quarter-million$+ while thousands of kids with infinitely better academic transcripts received nothing... they weren't just any student when they were told that their dream-job should be the only career in the country that comes with a mandatory year in college learning anything BUT knowledge relevant to said career ...

Break it all down and it is really just all a sick crusade by higher education to condescend, lecture the merits of its own virtue, and force people to accept that 'this is what everyone is supposed to do after high school'.

 

[OttoMets]

lol. for the record, im not a huge duke fan, but i did go to duke. And I like to see cheaters get punished. I MUST NOT BE A "TRUE" FAN!! But to each his own I guess.

Moral complacency is strong in this group. Sad.

Southerland is my favorite player on this team. I hope he returns.

But I get your point and it's astounding that anyone would disagree. Cheaters get expelled. That's the rule. Shouldn't be any different for a basketball player.

Can't believe the crap some of the rest of you spew when you don't agree with someone and feel threatened by his viewpoint.

 

[Cowtown]

Gee, there went 10 minutes of my life I'll never get back ...

 

[RoysRunts]

Moral complacency is strong in this group. Sad.

Southerland is my favorite player on this team. I hope he returns.

But I get your point and it's astounding that anyone would disagree. Cheaters get expelled. That's the rule. Shouldn't be any different for a basketball player.

Can't believe the crap some of the rest of you spew when you don't agree with someone and feel threatened by his viewpoint.

Cheaters get expelled, Unless your Joe Biden. Phoney Altrusium/Pragmatism vs Ethics/Rational thought

 

[RoysRunts]

Remember what Boeheim said at the onset of all this? "Their's a 50/50 chance James returns"

 

[Hoov50]

lets say melo cheated. you would have preferred him get suspended for the season as opposed to leading us to a championship?

Why would Melo have needed to cheat? In order to stay eligible what would have he needed to earn 12 credits?! It wouldn't matter if he attended a single class the second semester since he was a shoe in to go pro. Passing four 100 level courses as a college freshman wouldn't have been hard to do. Show up once in a while and he would have earned the necessary credits.

 

[Orangello]

no way

Way

Defying Fireworks Ban, Gotti Party Erupts
By JAMES C. McKINLEY Jr
Published: July 05, 1989

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Nobody at the Fourth of July block party outside the Bergin Hunt and Fish Club in Ozone Park seemed to care that John Gotti was footing the bill.
All day long, hot dogs and hamburgers sizzled on barbecue grills. Children, with dripping ice-cream cones and sticky cotton candy, darted through the maze of grown-up legs. The Kiddie Kastle moon walk shook with bounding, squealing children. American flags flew from the well-kept brick-and-frame row houses on the side streets.
For 20 years, Mr. Gotti, the reputed head of the Gambino organized-crime family, has given a free party for the Queens neighborhood on 101st Avenue between 98th and 99th Street every Independence Day. Every year, the party ended with blazing skies of fireworks. A Street Drama
This year, the party was more than a party. It was a street drama. Defying strict police orders not to use fireworks, men on rooftops lighted up the skies with rockets and starbursts. Below them, 3,000 people chanted and cheered. And when Mr. Gotti emerged from the heavily guarded club at 9:45 P.M. and waved to the crowd, the cheers got louder.

 

[Hoov50]

IF james cheated, he should be punished.

Where there's smoke, there's usually fire.

I don't know if he cheated or not. I think it's unlikely they don't have pretty good evidence he did.

Some of you people need to take your heads out of the sand. Or don't, ignorance is bliss for some.

By most accounts this entire issue is based on a single paragraph. If any other student at SU handed in a paper and a single paragraph was cut and pasted or written by another student, what would the punishment be? That is the issue most people (there are the select "special" few who think rules shouldn't apply to athletes) have with this whole mess. Would an average SU student in the same situation be treated this same way? Or is it different because he is an athlete and someone wants to make an example out of him (which in my opinion is a type of discrimination)?

Granted, no one, myself, you or any other poster on this board knows for certain all the details so we are all giving our opinions based on various rumors.

 

[cusetown1]

By most accounts this entire issue is based on a single paragraph. If any other student at SU handed in a paper and a single paragraph was cut and pasted or written by another student, what would the punishment be? That is the issue most people (there are the select "special" few who think rules shouldn't apply to athletes) have with this whole mess. Would an average SU student in the same situation be treated this same way? Or is it different because he is an athlete and someone wants to make an example out of him (which in my opinion is a type of discrimination)?

Granted, no one, myself, you or any other poster on this board knows for certain all the details so we are all giving our opinions based on various rumors.

I think he Lawyered up.

 

[orangecuse]

lol. im amazed some people cant even read a contrasting opinion without their head exploding. Its like a bunch of 12 year olds.

I find your rhetoric somewhat amusing. Interesting to have such a strong closed opinion on something such as this when it's likely that you yourself somewhere along the way received some type of 'assistance' towards, and in attaining, your Duke education & degree. But never mind about that, that's certainly just a 'different' set of circumstances I'm sure based upon your own life experiences...

 

[pearl31]

Remember what Boeheim said at the onset of all this? "Their's a 50/50 chance James returns"

Jake said that on here but I don't think JB ever actually said that

 

[Hoov50]

This is all just another symptom of the increasingly spreading trend in american society: belief in the "justice" = "fairness" fallacy. As old as dirt. A dog infinitely chasing its tail.

They try to pretend as if they treat athletes/students equally and "fairly", thus punishing athletes as if they were any student is "just". But justice is not treating collegiate athletes like just any student, because they aren't just any student. They weren't just any student when they breezed through admissions... they weren't just any student when they were given a full scholarship worth a quarter-million$+ while thousands of kids with infinitely better academic transcripts received nothing... they weren't just any student when they were told that their dream-job should be the only career in the country that comes with a mandatory year in college learning anything BUT knowledge relevant to said career ...

Break it all down and it is really just all a sick crusade by higher education to condescend, lecture the merits of its own virtue, and force people to accept that 'this is what everyone is supposed to do after high school'.

When I was at SU I took Spanish IV as a freshman, which was a mistake due to the workload, even though I had taken six years of Spanish in high school. Toward the middle of the semester I became good friends with a fellow freshman from Puerto Rico. He helped me, didn't do them for me, but helped me with a lot of my papers. So halfway through the semester my work became better. Instead of making a huge deal about it and accusing me of cheating the professor came to me one on one and gave me a chance to explain myself. When I told my story, which was the truth, we both went on our way.

I am on the opposite side of this train of thought. I think if this was just any other student (and it really is based on ONE paragraph of a long term paper) the student would be asked to rewrite the paper and be graded on a lowered grading scale. They wouldn't be going through a long appeals process to prove or determine their innocence or guilt. The problem becomes when people in positions of power decide to treat athletes more harshly than "regular" students. This seems to happen quite frequently. I don't want SU athletes given special privileges, I want them to be treated the SAME as all other SU students. Bringing in money to the University shouldn't make a difference. Like it or not they agreed to serve that role when they accepted a $120,000 education for free.

 

[tee1222]

When I was at SU I took Spanish IV as a freshman, which was a mistake due to the workload, even though I had taken six years of Spanish in high school. Toward the middle of the semester I became good friends with a fellow freshman from Puerto Rico. He helped me, didn't do them for me, but helped me with a lot of my papers. So halfway through the semester my work became better. Instead of making a huge deal about it and accusing me of cheating the professor came to me one on one and gave me a chance to explain myself. When I told my story, which was the truth, we both went on our way.

I am on the opposite side of this train of thought. I think if this was just any other student (and it really is based on ONE paragraph of a long term paper) the student would be asked to rewrite the paper and be graded on a lowered grading scale. They wouldn't be going through a long appeals process to prove or determine their innocence or guilt. The problem becomes when people in positions of power decide to treat athletes more harshly than "regular" students. This seems to happen quite frequently. I don't want SU athletes given special privileges, I want them to be treated the SAME as all other SU students. Bringing in money to the University shouldn't make a difference. Like it or not they agreed to serve that role when they accepted a $120,000 education for free.

You bring up a great point, but in all fairness to both arguments, this might or might not be. It's somewhat speculation in that we do not know what is going on with the rest of the student body, ie, is the percentage of athletes questioned more about this business than the percentage of students that have not obtained a scholarship?

I am not trying to press buttons here, it just seems that we don't know if this is true or not. The problem is, almost all of us only get to see the student athlete's side as we're fans of the best basketball program in the country.

Either way, I agree if what you are saying is true in that if it is skewed far too one side, not fair to throw the book at them just because they have a scholarship based on their physical merits.

 

[OttoMets]

Cheaters get expelled, Unless your Joe Biden. Phoney Altrusium/Pragmatism vs Ethics/Rational thought

You have to be in school to be expelled from school.

Foolish post.

 

[OttoMets]

By most accounts this entire issue is based on a single paragraph. If any other student at SU handed in a paper and a single paragraph was cut and pasted or written by another student, what would the punishment be? That is the issue most people (there are the select "special" few who think rules shouldn't apply to athletes) have with this whole mess. Would an average SU student in the same situation be treated this same way? Or is it different because he is an athlete and someone wants to make an example out of him (which in my opinion is a type of discrimination)?

Granted, no one, myself, you or any other poster on this board knows for certain all the details so we are all giving our opinions based on various rumors.

Expulsion is the penalty for plagiarism.

Discrimination shouldn't even be mentioned here.

 

[armory]

Jake said that on here but I don't think JB ever actually said that

JB is Jake!

Jake is JB!

Einhorn is Finkle!

 

[realorange]

Arturo Gatti???

Whoops, spelling!
Gottti

 

[orangecuse]

When I was at SU I took Spanish IV as a freshman, which was a mistake due to the workload, even though I had taken six years of Spanish in high school. Toward the middle of the semester I became good friends with a fellow freshman from Puerto Rico. He helped me, didn't do them for me, but helped me with a lot of my papers. So halfway through the semester my work became better. Instead of making a huge deal about it and accusing me of cheating the professor came to me one on one and gave me a chance to explain myself. When I told my story, which was the truth, we both went on our way.

I am on the opposite side of this train of thought. I think if this was just any other student (and it really is based on ONE paragraph of a long term paper) the student would be asked to rewrite the paper and be graded on a lowered grading scale. They wouldn't be going through a long appeals process to prove or determine their innocence or guilt. The problem becomes when people in positions of power decide to treat athletes more harshly than "regular" students. This seems to happen quite frequently. I don't want SU athletes given special privileges, I want them to be treated the SAME as all other SU students. Bringing in money to the University shouldn't make a difference. Like it or not they agreed to serve that role when they accepted a $120,000 education for free.

I think too often in our society we get fixated on certain words or labels, etc. I guess one could certainly conclude that your Puerto Rican friend and good fortune benefited you in some capacity. Others who may not have had this betterment, could, I guess, say it wasn't fair and that you had a definite advantage. Maybe some could intrepret that as a form of cheating? Or, maybe, it's just an acceptable form of some societal assistance? Whatever the intrepretation, one thing is certain (by your own admission) you gained an advantage that otherwise you would not have had...just as in life and one's life experiences...