Kent Syverud letter to Miner

[oldpinepoint]

Oh big deal. My wife teaches too and the benefits are nuts. If something can't continue, it won't. I don't expect the pension to be there in thirty years (she is 34).

The pension will be there, I would expect future state employees to have their benefits cut. My wife is a guidance counselor, her benefits better be there! I'm also pretty sure that the state pension is protected by the state consititution. The chances of it not being there in 30
Years is slim.

 

[CousCuse]

The pension will be there, I would expect future state employees to have their benefits cut. My wife is a guidance counselor, her benefits better be there! I'm also pretty sure that the state pension is protected by the state consititution. The chances of it not being there in 30
Years is slim.

200 TRILLION in unfunded liabilities is what the country is looking down the barrel at. So good luck with that pension.

 

[IthacaMatt]

So your response to that is, to get pissed off at the working people who still have the balls to stand up and fight for what they rightfully deserve instead of you fighting for your own? Sad man,sad...Oh Lord

BTW, you keep talking about public employees, not all Unions represent Public employees..there are all sorts of Unions out there...I happen to work with Healthcare workers...they are not public employees.

Yes, there are all kinds of unions. I've been a member of the Steelworkers Union and the Machinists Union. I am a lawyer for businesses, and I am aware of all sorts of stories of labor relations, pension funds and assorted matters.

I also interact with many different agencies of local and state government. I speak from firsthand experience, as a past union member and as a corporate lawyer. Many people in government jobs today do a lousy job and don't care about basic customer service.

Many agencies of state and local government don't give out contact information and put your interactions into anonymous government queues in Albany, without local people you can talk to to try to work out problems and issues for your clients.

I'm taking about databases of public information that lawyers and businesses depend on to do business being out of date and full of inaccurate information. I'm talking about employees in town courts and town halls all over CNY who don't have the time of day to help you if it interrupts their conversation they were having with a co-worker.

I'm talking about friends I have that work in all levels of government jobs. I know the stories they tell me over beers about general incompetence, indifference, and paying your dues until your turn comes around, which is the general attitude in almost every government job.

And don't get me started on how many holidays and vacations days they get. I have a friend who works for the county and is in his 50s, and at this point, he basically gets most of the summer off to hang out at his camp.

So, yeah, tell me how your union and your wife and your job are so much different than all the rest.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Great Leap Forward!

Or the Bridge to Nowhere. Remember the public tantrum that that guy Ted Stevens had on national TV?

 

[IthacaMatt]

Private jobs have eroded health benefits and retirement health benefits, so public sector jobs should too? Really? Unions have been weakened or are not existent in private, so they are evil when the stick up for their workers in the public sector? It's not the workers fault - almost all sectors have seen a productivity increase in the last 20 years.

Re-point your flame thrower at your employer, not at public sector employees.

If people don't want to pay the extra taxes to give public employees those benefits that nobody else gets, then yes, your benefit package should erode, too. No one is spared from the realities of the marketplace - except people who work for the government!

 

[IthacaMatt]

I was speaking more to the comment that public employees are lazy. I agree - there is a lot of pressure to destroy the benefits for public employees. I don't expect it to continue either.

A lot of public employees are terrible at their jobs. Just look at the tax deal Congel got for Destiny. They didn't even understand that he didn't have to do any of that fancy stuff he promised in order to get his 30 year tax break. They are that bad at their jobs. And it costs regular taxpayers who aren't connected to politicians thousands of dollars per capita every year in giveaways to "free market capitalists" who do all their economic development on the public tit.

 

[IthacaMatt]

A lot of public employees are terrible at their jobs. Just look at the tax deal Congel got for Destiny. They didn't even understand that he didn't have to do any of that fancy stuff he promised in order to get his 30 year tax break. They are that bad at their jobs. And it costs regular taxpayers who aren't connected to politicians thousands of dollars per capita every year in giveaways to "free market capitalists" who do all their economic development on the public tit.

And while we're at it, if our teachers are doing so damn great, why are our kids dumber and dumber and less prepared for the future? Why are they barely literate? Why can they not do basic math in their heads, or balance checkbooks or figure out tips?

These kids mostly can't even look you in the eye any more. Sure, a lot of that is on the parents, but these kids don't know anything about history, the arts, other countries, other languages, math and science.

I mean, we were, by objectively measured standards, far more accomplished students than this generation, not even taking into account rampant grade inflation for self-esteem and credential purposes.

 

[oldpinepoint]

200 TRILLION in unfunded liabilities is what the country is looking down the barrel at. So good luck with that pension.

How does this affect the state pension? The state pension money cannot be raided to pay for other items. It's protected

 

[Crusty]

How does this affect the state pension? The state pension money cannot be raided to pay for other items. It's protected

Ask the Detroit pensioners.

 

[oldpinepoint]

Ask the Detroit pensioners.

Understandable they got screwed

 

[Crusty]

Understandable they got screwed

The more likely thing will be give-backs, which have happened in many cases.

 

[Crusty]

These defined benefit plans only remain in the public sector. Businesses started replacing them with defined contribution plans starting back in the late 60's and early seventies. They really need to go away.

 

[oldpinepoint]

These defined benefit plans only remain in the public sector. Businesses started replacing them with defined contribution plans starting back in the late 60's and early seventies. They really need to go away.

I agree although I support the pensions for some of the professions like teachers, cops, fire fighters, my wife, etc

 

[CINYer]

Yes, there are all kinds of unions. I've been a member of the Steelworkers Union and the Machinists Union. I am a lawyer for businesses, and I am aware of all sorts of stories of labor relations, pension funds and assorted matters.

I also interact with many different agencies of local and state government. I speak from firsthand experience, as a past union member and as a corporate lawyer. Many people in government jobs today do a lousy job and don't care about basic customer service.

Many agencies of state and local government don't give out contact information and put your interactions into anonymous government queues in Albany, without local people you can talk to to try to work out problems and issues for your clients.

I'm taking about databases of public information that lawyers and businesses depend on to do business being out of date and full of inaccurate information. I'm talking about employees in town courts and town halls all over CNY who don't have the time of day to help you if it interrupts their conversation they were having with a co-worker.

I'm talking about friends I have that work in all levels of government jobs. I know the stories they tell me over beers about general incompetence, indifference, and paying your dues until your turn comes around, which is the general attitude in almost every government job.

And don't get me started on how many holidays and vacations days they get. I have a friend who works for the county and is in his 50s, and at this point, he basically gets most of the summer off to hang out at his camp.

So, yeah, tell me how your union and your wife and your job are so much different than all the rest.

Ok...still not talking about the Union I am affiliated with...but it's cool. Just a question though, what makes a coporate lawyer any different than the Unions and the politicians that you dislike so much? If not for the lack of empathy and out-right greed, Unions would probably fade away without much noise. It's the greed of corporations that keep Unions in business. Perhaps your friends are part of that lazy incompetent crowd, I don't know, but I seriously don't understand the hate for working people and the organizations that represent them. Overkill, why use a hatchet, when only a scapel was needed. Funny, this board tells you alot about people and how they REALLY feel. Sad:noidea:Oh Lord

 

[TheCusian]

And while we're at it, if our teachers are doing so damn great, why are our kids dumber and dumber and less prepared for the future? Why are they barely literate? Why can they not do basic math in their heads, or balance checkbooks or figure out tips? These kids mostly can't even look you in the eye any more. Sure, a lot of that is on the parents, but these kids don't know anything about history, the arts, other countries, other languages, math and science. I mean, we were, by objectively measured standards, far more accomplished students than this generation, not even taking into account rampant grade inflation for self-esteem and credential purposes.

You paint everyone with that big damn brush.

Did a government official kill you grandma or something? I can't imagine a fellow fan treating someone's wife with such disrespect.

My wife is someone you'd feel honored to come in contact with. Best of the best in school and choose to give back to college kids.

But go ahead - clearly your agenda doesn't include thinking about people in the public sector as people.

Keep it classy.

 

[alphaorange]

You paint everyone with that big damn brush.

Did a government official kill you grandma or something? I can't imagine a fellow fan treating someone's wife with such disrespect.

My wife is someone you'd feel honored to come in contact with. Best of the best in school and choose to give back to college kids.

But go ahead - clearly your agenda doesn't include thinking about people in the public sector as people.

Keep it classy.

Your wife is most likely a wonderful woman. She is also likely overpaid compared for her skill level. You simply cannot have two tiers of workers...Public and Private. Public workers should be (for the most part) working for comparable wages and benefits. Who do you think is paying their wages? It's the schmucks who are not lucky enough to be in the golden tier. And don't get me started on teachers...I met a woman who taught 5th grade in Amsterdam NY for 20 years and was making 80k+. For ten months a year plus a ridiculous amount of time off during the school year. 5th grade!

 

[alphaorange]

Ok...still not talking about the Union I am affiliated with...but it's cool. Just a question though, what makes a coporate lawyer any different than the Unions and the politicians that you dislike so much? If not for the lack of empathy and out-right greed, Unions would probably fade away without much noise. It's the greed of corporations that keep Unions in business. Perhaps your friends are part of that lazy incompetent crowd, I don't know, but I seriously don't understand the hate for working people and the organizations that represent them. Overkill, why use a hatchet, when only a scapel was needed. Funny, this board tells you alot about people and how they REALLY feel. Sad:noidea:Oh Lord

Blame free trade. There are far more skilled workers here than there are jobs. Too much competition for jobs equals wages bottoming out. Yes, I can buy tons of things cheap. Except cars, housing, and food. Perot was right about that sucking sound...

Greed of corporations? Maybe. I am the owner of a small corporation and I can't compete with foreign competition. It simply is not possible to compete with China, Mexico, Indonesia, etc. If the field was level, my employees would be paid much more. it isn't, so they aren't. Our gov't is facilitating this...

 

[alphaorange]

I agree although I support the pensions for some of the professions like teachers, cops, fire fighters, my wife, etc

Of course you do. You have a vested interest. Kind of shades your opinion, don't you think.

 

[Tcuse]

Or the Bridge to Nowhere. Remember the public tantrum that that guy Ted Stevens had on national TV?

Don't forget that Ithaca has its own Bridge to Nowhere, Rt 13 south of Ithaca, just past Home Depot.

 

[CINYer]

Blame free trade. There are far more skilled workers here than there are jobs. Too much competition for jobs equals wages bottoming out. Yes, I can buy tons of things cheap. Except cars, housing, and food. Perot was right about that sucking sound...

Greed of corporations? Maybe. I am the owner of a small corporation and I can't compete with foreign competition. It simply is not possible to compete with China, Mexico, Indonesia, etc. If the field was level, my employees would be paid much more. it isn't, so they aren't. Our gov't is facilitating this...

It's amazing people only hear/see/comprehend what they want/suits their arguement. I didn't blame anyone, what I said was, what's makes a Coporate lawyer any different than the people he mentioned. I did say if Corporations (not all, some good ones out there) weren't so greedy and showed any empathy at all, that Unions would probably fade away without much noise. People came into this conversation with their own agenda...cool, that's the way you feel, don't make it truth though!!!

 

[TheCusian]

Your wife is most likely a wonderful woman. She is also likely overpaid compared for her skill level. You simply cannot have two tiers of workers...Public and Private. Public workers should be (for the most part) working for comparable wages and benefits. Who do you think is paying their wages? It's the schmucks who are not lucky enough to be in the golden tier. And don't get me started on teachers...I met a woman who taught 5th grade in Amsterdam NY for 20 years and was making 80k+. For ten months a year plus a ridiculous amount of time off during the school year. 5th grade!

Not really. Grad degree. Top of class. 35k.

There are overpaid public sector jobs. But you guys keep using a big brush. Too much Fox News.

 

[JackBauer44]

Your wife is most likely a wonderful woman. She is also likely overpaid compared for her skill level. You simply cannot have two tiers of workers...Public and Private. Public workers should be (for the most part) working for comparable wages and benefits. Who do you think is paying their wages? It's the schmucks who are not lucky enough to be in the golden tier. And don't get me started on teachers...I met a woman who taught 5th grade in Amsterdam NY for 20 years and was making 80k+. For ten months a year plus a ridiculous amount of time off during the school year. 5th grade!

Holy crap. If I was TheCusian I'd probably be coming out firing right now. You think people who work in the public sector or people who work in education do it for the money? Are you the same type of person that makes the argument, "well Joe Schmo in NYC abuses his welfare check, so the system must be flawed, welfare isn't needed"? There are SO many people who go work in the public sector because they enjoy helping, they enjoy giving back, and they want to leave this world better than it was when they find it. By the way, if you think teachers really only work 10 months a year, you're living in insanity. Sure, there are some teachers who have been around for a long time, and biding out their time; but that is the exception, NOT the majority. Yep, I decided to work in the field of higher education because I love the benefits and HUGE paycheck. Overpaid compared to skills? Yeah, I busted my butt through undergrad and graduate school and for sure don't have the skills necessary to earn my paycheck. But I guess that's the way the world thinks now.

Do you have kids? If so, start this conversation with your child's teacher. I'm sure it will go over great.

 

[TheCusian]

Holy crap. If I was TheCusian I'd probably be coming out firing right now. You think people who work in the public sector or people who work in education do it for the money? Are you the same type of person that makes the argument, "well Joe Schmo in NYC abuses his welfare check, so the system must be flawed, welfare isn't needed"? There are SO many people who go work in the public sector because they enjoy helping, they enjoy giving back, and they want to leave this world better than it was when they find it. By the way, if you think teachers really only work 10 months a year, you're living in insanity. Sure, there are some teachers who have been around for a long time, and biding out their time; but that is the exception, NOT the majority. Yep, I decided to work in the field of higher education because I love the benefits and HUGE paycheck. Overpaid compared to skills? Yeah, I busted my butt through undergrad and graduate school and for sure don't have the skills necessary to earn my paycheck. But I guess that's the way the world thinks now. Do you have kids? If so, start this conversation with your child's teacher. I'm sure it will go over great.

Thanks. I had a post that I deleted because I don't want to get banned. Guy is obviously only aware of some deranged view on public workers. Usually this kind of vile comes from politics.

Had those comments been to my face...

 

[JackBauer44]

Thanks. I had a post that I deleted because I don't want to get banned. Guy is obviously only aware of some deranged view on public workers. Usually this kind of vile comes from politics.

Had those comments been to my face...

Truth. I head to edit my post because I'm sure I would have gotten banned. It's one thing to have a view, but to make a judgement on someone's wife like that is out of line. It's funny, because I know so many teachers and public workers who would intellectually smack the crap out of 95% of this world. Very frustrating. I teach college freshmen, and I still see it all the time as well.

 

[alphaorange]

Holy crap. If I was TheCusian I'd probably be coming out firing right now. You think people who work in the public sector or people who work in education do it for the money? Are you the same type of person that makes the argument, "well Joe Schmo in NYC abuses his welfare check, so the system must be flawed, welfare isn't needed"? There are SO many people who go work in the public sector because they enjoy helping, they enjoy giving back, and they want to leave this world better than it was when they find it. By the way, if you think teachers really only work 10 months a year, you're living in insanity. Sure, there are some teachers who have been around for a long time, and biding out their time; but that is the exception, NOT the majority. Yep, I decided to work in the field of higher education because I love the benefits and HUGE paycheck. Overpaid compared to skills? Yeah, I busted my butt through undergrad and graduate school and for sure don't have the skills necessary to earn my paycheck. But I guess that's the way the world thinks now.

Do you have kids? If so, start this conversation with your child's teacher. I'm sure it will go over great.

At what point did I question anyone's motives for working in the public sector? You accuse me of generalizing about people, which I did not do at any point. I made mention of compensation. Sorry, but everything you wrote had nothing to do with what I wrote. Nothing. And, by the way, not all grad degrees are equal. Surely you know that. I am not ignorant to teachers work requirements. Maybe you need to go back to school. Break my post down as far as what I wrote, and how you comprehended it.

Thanks. I had a post that I deleted because I don't want to get banned. Guy is obviously only aware of some deranged view on public workers. Usually this kind of vile comes from politics.

Had those comments been to my face...

I would have no problem saying that to you face. If I wouldn't, I wouldn't have written it.