Line up changes

[CuseFaninVT]

How does the team's offensive rebounding % compare to other years? Are we getting more offensive boards because we're better at rebounding or because we miss 700 shots per half?

Should PC and Oshae getting boards off their misses count in this equation?

 

[pearl31]

echoing other above, would love to see JB try the three-guard lineup with Tyus at the 3 and OB at the 4 - obv would be trial by fire for Washington but I think would still be worth a go

 

[NineOneSeven]

L

It is largely personnel, not coaching philosophy, and it is a consequence of having 3 first year players in our 6 man rotation (4 of 7 if you count Sidibe). Last season (how soon we forget), we had shooters, and the offense was very good in many ACC games once Gillon became the starter. Defense was not ok -- remember White, Gillon, Thompson, and the absence of a 7 ft rim protector?

How to fix the problem? Give the younger inside players (Dolezaj, Sidibe, Moyer) another year in the program; and let Chukwu make similar progress in his basketball IQ and S&C year over year. Howard is young for a junior -- can still get better, as can the 19 year old Brissett.
Mix in a new 3rd year (Hughes) and the 3 new frosh, and now we have an 8 man rotation, rather than 6. We will have an opportunity for 4 scorers on the floor. It becomes feasible to run more and press more. Maybe even have more than one player on the court who can create and pass for a teammate (now we have only Howard).

Last year's offense was not much better. We had a guy who made some unbelievably tough shots in White. We also had 4 guys on the court who could shoot the 3 (all 4 between 37-42% on the year).

Last year was maybe our best 3pt shooting team ever and the offense still had terrible movement. This year the team has a bunch of trouble with 3pt shooting and the offense still has terrible movement.

So now what?

 

[OrangeinBoston]

If the problem is not being able to shoot from the outside (which it is), and you don't have any shooters on the roster, then you can't solve the problem.

Look at Virginia, look at Kansas, guys standing 6 feet behind the 3 point line and nailing shots. We can't do that.

 

[Consigliere]

There are no options. Can you honestly see a scenario where Washington on the floor for ANYONE makes us better? Either starting guard at 50% is better than HW at 100% and a 3-guard line-up kills us defensively and on the boards - arguably our only two strengths. Best case for this year's team is if Marek can magically develop a mid range game where he can consistently make an open 15 foot jump shot. Then play him in the high post where he can draw a defender and use his passing skills to distribute and enhance ball movement. In that scenario Oshae could be rested 8 - 10 minutes a game, low post would open up for drivers to finish or dump downs to Chukwu / Sidibe or even Moyer, and we would at the very least present a challenge to opposing defenses other than stop the guy driving to the basket one-on-three. We have 6 healthy, ACC-caliber scholarship players on this roster and 3 of them have not proven to have the ability to score consistently. No system or line-up tweaks will change that.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

echoing other above, would love to see JB try the three-guard lineup with Tyus at the 3 and OB at the 4 - obv would be trial by fire for Washington but I think would still be worth a go

I love the idea of Howard and Oshae running the PNR. Especially if OB can get his shooting numbers up. The variation of pick and roll versus pick and pop would be great, plus Howard could drive, hope that PCs guy comes over to help, and pray pray pray that PC will catch and finish, or toss the ball out to Battle sliding into the corner. But we need PC to get out of the way. He's the worst possible guy to use in the PNR. Doesn't have the basketball experience to be able to understand the variations, and ends up just getting in the way.

 

[Madbiker]

It's not going to change this season because we don't have the personnel to be a good team. There is no PG. Frank is a combo guard with a weak handle trying to play point. He has made progress from last year but it's still a problem. We don't have good perimeter shooting and that will not change. We don't have scoring at the center and one forward spot. Moyer gives a some bulk and rebounding but has no offensive skills other than being able to dunk. Marek is getting knocked around like a bowling pin against ACC teams. We need a TALENT infusion. We get some next year...but will it be enough. We will again have Frank at PG because Carey is a scoring combo guard and also not a PG.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Offensive rebounds to FG misses ratio:
2017-18: 41.8%
2016-17: 34%
2015-16: 37.2%

 

[AZOrange]

It's not just Baz, Carey, and Hughes. It's a sophomore Brissett, Moyer, and Dolezaj. It's a Frank Howard who does not need to be 1/3 of the offense. This year's team has massive structural limitations (which have been obvious at least since Geno Thorpe left) that next year's won't.

I've made this point before, but Syracuse went through an almost identical down stretch (though without a Final Four!) in 2005-08. No tournament wins, missed the tournament twice, would have missed it for a third time but for Gerry's MSG miracle. In retrospect, we rightly see that as the result of some recruiting misses (the Messrs. Wright, the disappointing 03 class) and a little bad luck (Vermont, Gerry's injury, Nichols' slow development). But things turned around when the recruiting luck turned. And I think there's a lot of reason to think the recruiting luck has turned now. Not just that next year's class looks great on paper, but that this year's class has been way better than anyone could have reasonably anticipated.

Syracuse had the same coaches when it had the best offense in the country in 2010, the best team in the country in 2012, and a legit national title chance in 2013. None of that was very long ago! Even last year the offense was actually pretty good once everyone settled into their roles.

Maybe although even in the better years good offense seems like an aberration. For example, I don’t think our offensive system was “good” last year, rather I think we had some skilled players that could cover holes.

 

[Jasoncuse]

There are too many issues and lack of solutions for anything meaningful to change from here on out.

The only minor changes should be getting Washington more minutes and Sidibe, if healthy. Tyus can't play every minute like he is; he looks completely worn down. I'd play Frank off the ball a lot more too. He should be our starting 2G next year, so let's see if Washington at the point, or Tyus, can look any better.

Marek offers very little other than his hustle and defense. Playing him up top won't help, he'll get routinely beat off the dribble as he's not quick enough to handle guards there. I'd play Moyer the majority of the minutes at the 4, though neither really inspires much confidence currently.

 

[Jasoncuse]

It is largely personnel, not coaching philosophy, and it is a consequence of having 3 first year players in our 6 man rotation (4 of 7 if you count Sidibe). Last season (how soon we forget), we had shooters, and the offense was very good in many ACC games once Gillon became the starter. Defense was not ok -- remember White, Gillon, Thompson, and the absence of a 7 ft rim protector?

How to fix the problem? Give the younger inside players (Dolezaj, Sidibe, Moyer) another year in the program; and let Chukwu make similar progress in his basketball IQ and S&C year over year. Howard is young for a junior -- can still get better, as can the 19 year old Brissett.
Mix in a new 3rd year (Hughes) and the 3 new frosh, and now we have an 8 man rotation, rather than 6. We will have an opportunity for 4 scorers on the floor. It becomes feasible to run more and press more. Maybe even have more than one player on the court who can create and pass for a teammate (now we have only Howard).

If we don't have shooters again next year, we're going to see similar issues. Teams clog the lanes when they are less worried about their man being left for a wide open 3. If Hughes, Brissett (fingers crossed) and Bazley can be good shooters next year, it would open things up for Carey, Frank and Hughes. Maybe Buddy can contribute. Still, if we run this iso crap and don't have the ability to succeed, will anything really change?

 

[SoBristol]

If we don't have shooters again next year, we're going to see similar issues. Teams clog the lanes when they are less worried about their man being left for a wide open 3. If Hughes, Brissett (fingers crossed) and Bazley can be good shooters next year, it would open things up for Carey, Frank and Hughes. Maybe Buddy can contribute. Still, if we run this iso crap and don't have the ability to succeed, will anything really change?

People need just a little perspective. Virginia is the #3 team in the nation -- they have one of the better defensive teams in the country, and they have a couple of guys who shoot from NBA distance. And our guys hung in that game, battling to the end, with the difference coming down to a stretch of 3 or 4 long range 3s by U VA.

We run the iso stuff this season because that is what our trio of scorers can do best. It gives this team its best shot at success.

Next season -- well, you might consider that Bazley is the #10 recruit in the nation, is in the 6ft 8 in range, with offensive skills, can play either forward position. Carey is a combo guard. Buddy looks like a classic shooter -- good form. Add Hughes and it is a very good recruiting class. With a better combination of skills on the floor, why would you expect the offense to resemble what JB has to do this season, with only 3 scorers and no genuine options?

I wonder how much some posters have seen of SU's offense over the seasons, depending on whether we had a nice blend of talent (the Wes Johnson season with Andy Rautins, and two talented bench players), or strong guard play (MCW as a soph with Triche), or strong post offense (Rak's senior season). JB adjusts to what he has.

 

[Funk Doc]

It's not just Baz, Carey, and Hughes. It's a sophomore Brissett, Moyer, and Dolezaj. It's a Frank Howard who does not need to be 1/3 of the offense. This year's team has massive structural limitations (which have been obvious at least since Geno Thorpe left) that next year's won't.

I've made this point before, but Syracuse went through an almost identical down stretch (though without a Final Four!) in 2005-08. No tournament wins, missed the tournament twice, would have missed it for a third time but for Gerry's MSG miracle. In retrospect, we rightly see that as the result of some recruiting misses (the Messrs. Wright, the disappointing 03 class) and a little bad luck (Vermont, Gerry's injury, Nichols' slow development). But things turned around when the recruiting luck turned. And I think there's a lot of reason to think the recruiting luck has turned now. Not just that next year's class looks great on paper, but that this year's class has been way better than anyone could have reasonably anticipated.

Syracuse had the same coaches when it had the best offense in the country in 2010, the best team in the country in 2012, and a legit national title chance in 2013. None of that was very long ago! Even last year the offense was actually pretty good once everyone settled into their roles.

Love this post...but I completely disagree with your very last sentence. AWIII bailed us out by hitting contested shot after contested shot. Our offense was just as bad as this year, but we were packed with reliable outside shooters...AW being the best of that bunch.

 

[Funk Doc]

Has HW really played terrible in the 2 minutes/game he’s been getting for everyone to say it would be a terrible idea for him to be out there? He is flat out the best PG on this team. Isn’t a compliment to him as much as it is a statement about Frank as a PG(love Frank off the ball, hate him as our PG). Our ball movement has been so much better with HW on the floor. Dude still continues to call plays and direct the defense from the bench! He doesn’t need serious minutes, but he should be gettin like 8 minutes a half...4 for each guard. Let them have some rest!

 

[Consigliere]

Has HW really played terrible in the 2 minutes/game he’s been getting for everyone to say it would be a terrible idea for him to be out there? He is flat out the best PG on this team. Isn’t a compliment to him as much as it is a statement about Frank as a PG(love Frank off the ball, hate him as our PG). Our ball movement has been so much better with HW on the floor. Dude still continues to call plays and direct the defense from the bench! He doesn’t need serious minutes, but he should be gettin like 8 minutes a half...4 for each guard. Let them have some rest!

Don’t know how you can evaluate Frank’s playmaking skills when there is virtually no movement on offense and at least 2 of the players on the floor with him are offensive liabilities. Remember as a freshman many were lauding him for his vision and ability to run the offense.

 

[tbonezone]

" Baz, Carey, buddy and Hughes can’t fix this problem by themselves..."

buddy b. will redshirt guaranteed. if for no other reason than JB refuses to let go of the program.

 

[newmexicuse]

Many people here calling for more HW. I have been a big HW proponent in terms of recruiting him.

However, I must say, that he hasn't impressed me in the least in his cameos. He stands around. He doesn't try to score, he doesn't try to penetrate. He is smaller than FH and TB at the top of the zone. He doesn't look particularly quick.

Now it is possible that HW feels pressure not to make mistakes when he is out there & that is the reason for his passive play.

It may well be that if he felt he was part of a rotation that he would play more assertively. However, knowing Jimmy, HW will have to pro-actively earn minutes when he gets his opportunities. Jimmy will not just give him those minutes and that is how it should be.

As others have stated in this thread, this squad simply lacks weapons. The team is playing hard.

However, that being said, the team needs to play smarter. Moyer is good enough to score at the rack when given opportunities. Chuk is improving fast. These two have to be looked for more frequently, especially when double teams come to our big three. The high post is a freakin FT shot. Neither Marek or Moyer are horrible FT shooters. Neither is great, but they are not horrid. Either one of those should be able to make open looks from there with reasonable consistency. If one of them is at high post either they either get the open look or somebody else should have a good shot available. Marek, especially, has court vision and should be effective from there. They have to take & make enough of them to keep D's honest and to open up room for our big three. Our big three have had terrible shooting percentages recently. They need to move the ball more and get better shots and increase their shooting percentage. Last game they only combined for 33%. There is no excuse for them to not make 40% plus. Frankly (no pun intended). if they can't hit 40% plus then there is really no hope for the O.

Yes, our tools are limited. There is not an easy answer on the bench, but that does not mean that it is hopeless. We need to play better and smarter and move the ball more.

 

[jncuse]

This is like the baseball fan who thinks making a change to the batting order can make a 70 win team a playoff team.

 

[Orange2389]

Our strength this year is defense and rebounding. We don't offer much else

 

[pfister1]

Personally, I'd like to see us go with a smaller lineup and try to score a bit more. Give Washington the point duties. Let Frank be the 2G as he's our best shooter now. Battle will be our 3 and Oshae the 4. With Chukwu in the middle. Our zone would be quicker than with Moyer out there. Rotate in MD and Moyer for Oshae and Battle depending on how they are doing.

I'm not a big HW fan, but this is the only change that really buys you anything...and it only buys you something if you assume giving him some run allows him to get confidence and bring something on offense rather than simply exposing what JB must be seeing in practice that is keeping him from using him.

 

[pfister1]

It’s not inexperience that is the problem.
Kentucky and Duke are loaded with freshman.
Our problem is we don’t recruit the highest offensive skill we can our recruiting is tailored to the zone.
We sacrifice skill for length.
Brissett will get better but he isn’t here longer than next year.
Jonny Flynn wouldn’t be recruited nowadays because he would be too small for the zone.

Kentucky and Duke are always going to be a bad example. They recruit 5 star freshman that are ready to step in and play at close to an all conference level. So call it experience, talent, wrong skill sets but I think the point is that the guys we have recruited aren't expected to be able to come in and lead the team as freshman or sophomores, but that is what they have been forced to try to do. If they were Duke / Kentucky level talents we'd have a different result. If we had a few guys who developed in the program (think senior year Southerland, Kris Joseph or CJ Fair at forward instead of Moyer/Dolezaj) to mix in we'd also likely have a different result.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Many people here calling for more HW. I have been a big HW proponent in terms of recruiting him.

However, I must say, that he hasn't impressed me in the least in his cameos. He stands around. He doesn't try to score, he doesn't try to penetrate. He is smaller than FH and TB at the top of the zone. He doesn't look particularly quick.

Now it is possible that HW feels pressure not to make mistakes when he is out there & that is the reason for his passive play.

It may well be that if he felt he was part of a rotation that he would play more assertively. However, knowing Jimmy, HW will have to pro-actively earn minutes when he gets his opportunities. Jimmy will not just give him those minutes and that is how it should be.

Again, I'm so sick of this narrative. You are essentially faulting the kid for doing exactly what JB is telling him. We all saw the lightning quick yank he got when he took a wide open three too early in the shot clock. So it's crystal clear that JB has told him he is not allowed to shoot. Which you now designate as "passive play." What the frack do you want him to do? Blow off the coach's instructions and sit?

Say things like he needs to play better in practice and you'll be closer to what actually needs to happen.

 

[newmexicuse]

Again, I'm so sick of this narrative. You are essentially faulting the kid for doing exactly what JB is telling him. We all saw the lightning quick yank he got when he took a wide open three too early in the shot clock. So it's crystal clear that JB has told him he is not allowed to shoot. Which you now designate as "passive play." What the frack do you want him to do? Blow off the coach's instructions and sit?

Say things like he needs to play better in practice and you'll be closer to what actually needs to happen.

That is not crystal clear to me. I do remember the shot you are alluding to; however, I do not remember the context. Was somebody else wide open for a better shot underneath ? Had Howard made a D faux pas right before or right after the shot ? Was something else going on that caused the yank ?

I do not believe that Jimmy is putting kids in them game and telling them to just stand around. Maybe, Howard had done too much standing around in the first place, and Jimmy was just frustrated by a missed shot - good or bad.

You can have your opinion, I agree opportunities have been scarce for Howard, but i also think. HW did not get a Syracuse university basketball scholarship to do nothing on the court.When he does get chances he needs to assert and try to make plays. Better he shows effort and gets pulled for messing up a play then that he just stands there and does nothing in the first place.

 

[Zepharus]

Not sure how putting Tyus at the point solves anything. He never passes.

He's adept at dishing it to the other team! Especially in crunch time

 

[CuseFaninVT]

That is not crystal clear to me. I do remember the shot you are alluding to; however, I do not remember the context. Was somebody else wide open for a better shot underneath ? Had Howard made a D faux pas right before or right after the shot ? Was something else going on that caused the yank ?

I do not believe that Jimmy is putting kids in them game and telling them to just stand around. Maybe, Howard had done too much standing around in the first place, and Jimmy was just frustrated by a missed shot - good or bad.

You can have your opinion, I agree opportunities have been scarce for Howard, but i also think. HW did not get a Syracuse university basketball scholarship to do nothing on the court.When he does get chances he needs to assert and try to make plays. Better he shows effort and gets pulled for messing up a play then that he just stands there and does nothing in the first place.

No, he had just gotten into the game. No other mistakes. He had a wide open shot, with a great pic from Frank to free him up. He took the shot, then he was immediately subbed out. He missed badly, but getting open looks is kind of the point of running an offense. JB just didn't like who got the open look.

I don't see him standing around, ever. Even without the ball he's directing other players on where to go.