Natural Light

[rrlbees]

That specific one (with the roof) was lifted from the engineer's website but the massing and connection to Archbold is identical to the one depicted in the Campus Framework plan that SU commissioned from Sasaki.

so that pic got everyone's hopes up when SU hadn't finalized everything, now some here are blaming SU that it doesn't look like that as if SU had said, here people, this is what we're building.

 

[OttoMets]

I think it's been made difficult because this is such a difficult job with lots of moving parts and a whole lot of other things to consider including the lack of space in the immediate area. I think a lot of thought is going into this and they want to get it right. as to making things public, if they do it too much before everything is done and signed, you see by these threads what we get. people complaining something isn't exactly what they had first hoped. any engineering effort like this is gong to go thru many changes.

It is an unusual job, and there's always the risk of people getting worked up over a rendering and then losing their minds when the design changes, I get you there. With permits in hand and concrete being poured, though, I would think SU would get the P-S a real rendering to use and send Sala armed with some figures (instead of falling back on "I think..." impressions). Maybe NJ could weigh in more knowledgeably about this.

 

[SUfaninAZ]

I just hope it doesn't look dreary on tv, like it does now.

 

[rrlbees]

It is an unusual job, and there's always the risk of people getting worked up over a rendering and then losing their minds when the design changes, I get you there. With permits in hand and concrete being poured, though, I would think SU would get the P-S a real rendering to use and send Sala armed with some figures (instead of falling back on "I think..." impressions). Maybe NJ could weigh in more knowledgeably about this.

where did the 2nd pic come from?

 

[GoCuse14]

Yup.

The ENTIRE benefit of the new roof (beyond safety) is all the things we can accomplish because it doesn’t need to be pressurized.

Literally (not the millennial use of literal) thats it. Scoreboard, sound, concourse improvements etc, are all made easier because of not having to deal with a pressurized bubble.

EDIT: Also keeping some level of the sun out will actually benefit any cool stuff they have planned for lighting intros, halftime etc. not to mention making scoreboard easier to see / read etc etc etc

Ding, ding ding

 

[GoCuse14]

serious question because i don't really remember since we've had so much discussion on this board with so many ideas and input, but was that first pic something SU put out or something someone leaked or someone here found on an engineering site?

I have never seen the top drawing...and I have looked and many many prints.

 

[OttoMets]

where did the 2nd pic come from?

In this morning's article? I only saw one (the "blue skies" pic below the headline), all the other art was ads.

 

[OttoMets]

I have never seen the top drawing...and I have looked and many many prints.

I think it was just some engineering firm's bid submission. They didn't win the bid.

 

[UelSU]

My takeway:

Pretty good job on the article, but it's lacking in specifics that would answer back-and-forths like what Wiseman and Tom are talking about, mostly because it relies on a lot of vague quotes from Sala and Wildspicer. "I think it will be as bright as it is today" doesn't offer anything in the way of objective explanation.

Someone mentioned SU's lack of public outreach about this project the other day. I can't disagree. They can't just put out a spec sheet on this job, comparing materials, what percentage of the roof covered with which materials, what percentage of the roof was covered with the old material, etc.?

The "power outage" quote was also weird. Sala won't sit at the scorer's table worrying about a power outage and delay in turning on the lights anymore? OK. But that's never happened at an SU basketball or football game, so it's probably not cause for concern.

My take from the article is that it's the same material as is being used now except it wont' be air supported and no openings in the walls are planned anytime soon.

 

[UelSU]

How do you know the amazing initial design wasn’t scrapped because we couldn’t engineer enough extra supporting structure outside of the current footprint because of space/logistics considerations.

Also maybe the original wasn’t possible after further due diligence because if we did it, then we would have sacrificed potential concourse improvements or other add-ons down the road.

There is a cost benefit trade off structure to everything and it’s not always about just money.

The article made is sound like the clear center section of the roof was done away with because of adverse affects for basketball. It also sounds like opening sections of the walls was never considered or will be ever done in the future...for whatever reason.

 

[PhatOrange]

so that pic got everyone's hopes up when SU hadn't finalized everything, now some here are blaming SU that it doesn't look like that as if SU had said, here people, this is what we're building.

lol that's correct. someone leaks artists conceptual rendering, prima donnas believe that to be the final stamped engineering set of plans.

 

[OrangeDW]

I’ll preface this by saying I am a season ticket holder and go to most games regardless.

However, the vast majority of attendees are “casual fans.” As such, the fan experience is vital. So in early September when it’s 75 and sunny out fans will weigh whether they want to be in the sun or be under a roof ala Carousel mall (probably a bad example as even the mall gets natural sunlight in.)

So I think it’s a wasted opportunity given the fan experience benefits it can add. If you do t believe me, just look at the positive feedback the Vikings stadium has received.

I mean...you said to put sunglasses on the basketball team, and that Boeheim should leave because you won’t get to experience enough natural light at a football game. And you’re comparing us to the Vikings. You’ve gotta be more realistic.

 

[JeffCuse]

This is really unfortunate. I was really hoping we could get some natural light in the Dome.
End of the world, no. But would have been nice.

 

[UnknownOrange]

This is really unfortunate. I was really hoping we could get some natural light in the Dome.
End of the world, no. But would have been nice.

You still can - it's just not coming in through the roof

 

[FrancoPizza]

There’s other ways to let in natural light. If they widen the concourses, the exterior walls can all be clear glass.

One can dream.

 

[FrancoPizza]

No. The use of ETFE on the inner section of the roof. That was the initial concept and part of the initial proposal. Along the way it was switched. Expense was part of it but I believe now more than ever that it was concern over lighting during the 2-3 day basketball games they have a year there

All this talk about natural light concerns. Couldn't they just hang the blue curtain from the roof to block out the sun during basketball games?

The fabric, not the person.

 

[texascpa]

Public outreach might not be the right term, but it's common for institutions to offer simple, specific capital improvements pages like this: About the NVRC - OVMA – Syracuse University

What they gain is an informed group of consumers. And this communication serves to obviate the need for dumb questions from the wannabe engineers.

Or open the doors to a stream of complaints by the wannabe engineers. Honestly, it was bound to upset some people regardless what happened.

 

[DoubleDee]

Is there plans at all to add windows around perimeter above the 300 level, or replace the wall vents with windows. That would be a nice touch and allow a little air flow as well.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Is there plans at all to add windows around perimeter above the 300 level, or replace the wall vents with windows. That would be a nice touch and allow a little air flow as well.

At this point, no. My guess - if they ever do anything above the 300s it will be luxury boxes but not anytime soon. And that would require elevator support and blowing out those endzone walls.

 

[RandomGuy]

Well, on the bright side(pun intended) it looks like ETFE has up to a 70% absorption of acoustic noise... I'd definitely take it louder, than brighter.

"Its acoustic properties can reduce excessive interior noise. No one notices acoustics done right, but when it’s wrong, it’s a problem for players, spectators and broadcasters. ETFE film has 70 percent acoustic absorption/transmittance, which dramatically reduces reverberations and creates more comfortable spaces. But it can also let exterior sounds – especially noise from rain falling on a roof – into the facility, so it’s important to carefully study the potential for both positive and negative acoustic effects when considering an ETFE system. Once the effects are understood, designers can take a number of different measures to “tune” the acoustics to mitigate unwanted noise."

 

[rrlbees]

At this point, no. My guess - if they ever do anything above the 300s it will be luxury boxes but not anytime soon. And that would require elevator support and blowing out those endzone walls.

and none of that has ever been in the initial phase.

 

[FrancoPizza]

and none of that has ever been in the initial phase.

Yep. But I do know they have an interest in boxes as a revenue generator. I can't see the 200-level patrons going quietly into the night being asked to move. The only other option would be to add above the 300s.

 

[Sudano]

For the past 40 years, fans have trekked through the worst weather any metro area in United States experiences, to watch football and basketball teams (sometimes not good ones) play in a concrete tomb shrouded with a parachute, while sitting on locker room quality benches.

Now people want to piss and moan about natural light and draw negative comparisons with the Minnesota Vikings (who play in the most prestigious league in the world, have a billionaire owner, represent an entire State, and are situated in a metro area of 3.6 million people)?

I'm not entirely sure, but am mostly sure, that when the renovation is done, the "Dome" will be better, and the gameday experience will be better.

Dude chill out. We are not pissing and moaning. We are joyfully just discussing some changes that we'd like to see in a new environment since they are already renovating the stadium. I find it confusing why you are so incredibly mis-characterizing the discussion. If you'd rather not participate that's fine but let the rest of us dream, suggest, and recommend some changes we'd like to see. I find it interesting and inspiring.

 

[Sudano]

lol that's correct. someone leaks artists conceptual rendering, prima donnas believe that to be the final stamped engineering set of plans.

What surprises me most are people believing the first drawing they see will be the final way it will look years later. Don't most people know how major stadium renovations or building process works. They announce it, put out a rendering for promotional, marketing, fund raising, public encouragement, then they work through the hundreds of issues to final plan.

 

[#FRANchise]

I'd be interested to see what the current design would look like with louvers installed on the truss system. Or even down to ground level, similar to Metlife. This would allow light to be projected into the louvers and give the building a nice aesthetic from the outside.