next years team is going to be sick

[SU_Fan_in_VA]

im pretty pessimistic usually as well, but I am with you on this one. We will be top 12 to start the year (assuming G comes back and McC stays)... and the sky is the limit. I have no doubt that if McC didnt get hurt, we would have seen G at the point a lot this year. I really think that down the stretch in games next year, we will have G/Cooney up top and Roberson/McC/Bryant down low. firepower.

I heard Bilas say during the Duke game that Gbinije may play the point next year. A little inside info?

 

[hoopsupstate]

Roberson has a lot of work to do if he plans on playing the three next year. He's no perimeter threat and he can't dribble. CM has a better chance of playing on the wing. Two reasons for G playing the point next year. Battles wants to play point (the following year) not the two and he gives some of our bigs chances to play more.

 

[Jack Hall]

Roberson has a lot of work to do if he plans on playing the three next year. He's no perimeter threat and he can't dribble. CM has a better chance of playing on the wing. Two reasons for G playing the point next year. Battles wants to play point (the following year) not the two and he gives some of our bigs chances to play more.

And it opens up a spot on the wing (3) for Malachi to get some mins (if you dint like TRob at the 3) to see what MR can do. I personally think on offense G is a 1, on Defense he is a 3. And imo MR can play 3 on offense but will be up top on D in the zone because G will be the better rebounder

 

[RF2044]

Roberson has a lot of work to do if he plans on playing the three next year. He's no perimeter threat and he can't dribble. CM has a better chance of playing on the wing. Two reasons for G playing the point next year. Battles wants to play point (the following year) not the two and he gives some of our bigs chances to play more.

Agreed on Roberson. I think it is far more likely that he stays at 4 and McCullough gets first crack at 5 [Coleman's recovery is no sure thing, maybe Bryant doesn't come here, etc.].

 

[jordoo]

Next year we could be THE absolute best team if all goes well or we could get another post season ban from the NCAA and see mass exodus and really struggle again.

The NCAA thing first needs to be announced officially before we get way into the debate IMO. I tend to think we are cleared for next year which would also mean Bryant winds up on the hill. If that's the case the next thing is Mike coming back because he will be special next season. He would take the pressure off of Kaleb and Howard even though I still see him in more of a point forward roll since he does his best work playing on the ball against other forwards.

Assuming Mike is back and Bryant comes to SU:
- we would be returning Kaleb, Trevor, Mike, Tyler and Chris who all have experience as starters.
- we would also have Coleman, Bryant, Diange, Obokoh and Chris to play the 5 so no depth issue there.
- we would have Kaleb, Howard and Mike to play PG so no depth issues there.
- we would have a full roster of scholarship players.
So we would have depth at our 2 thinnest positions this year, overall roster depth and loads of returning experience. I think we would be ranked in the top10 top start the year and be very good start to finish.

A couple of things people have been questioning:
-DC2, very valid as we just don't know. I expect him to be 100% healthy to start the season but even if he isn't improved he's still a legit rebounder who can give us 5 fouls and represents a post presence on offense who will at the very least draw fouls. Staying healthy all season has to remain a concern until we see him do it once.
-Kaleb's development. This is not a Josh Wright type of situation. Kaleb has shown some very good things and will at the very least be a reliable player to ferry the ball up and down the court next year and score more consistently. He must get better on defense! I think we see a very nice improvement all around from him next season (very common from frosh to soph) and then he really puts it together as a Junior.
-Chris should be 100% healthy and come back stronger from his injury. This is the norm now days. Strength was his biggest issue this year.

 

[jordoo]

And it opens up a spot on the wing (3) for Malachi to get some mins (if you dint like TRob at the 3) to see what MR can do. I personally think on offense G is a 1, on Defense he is a 3. And imo MR can play 3 on offense but will be up top on D in the zone because G will be the better rebounder

Its key for MikeG to be a 3 on defense because he is then being guarded by a forward. This is where he has made hay on offense, playing on the ball against forwards that he can easily take off the bounce.

 

[Jack Hall]

Its key for MikeG to be a 3 on defense because he is then being guarded by a forward. This is where he has made hay on offense, playing on the ball against forwards that he can easily take off the bounce.

You hit the nail on the head imo. bball is a game off matchups and mismatches. Melo got all the credit but i still believe the biggest reason we won it all in 2003 is that all the teams we played in ncaas just could not matchup to Hak and Melo, those two Together were a matchup nightmare. It doesnt hurt that Gmac hit all those 3s in 1st half against ku but still part of the reasons he got all those shots is the defense was so focused on our two future nba guys.

G would (if he returns which i assume he will) be a match up problem for many many teams next yr, just as he was for Duk this yr. with our improved depth we could be legit top ten next year if we develop one more mismatch. Could it be Malachi, Bryant or Cole? I dont know probably not. The other top mismatch candidate would be an athletic Stronger McC at 6 11 matched up against 6 7 and 6 9 guys. But he needs to get that knee healthy and needs to get much stronger. Big ifs

 

[jordoo]

You hit the nail on the head imo. bball is a game off matchups and mismatches. Melo got all the credit but i still believe the biggest reason we won it all in 2003 is that all the teams we played in ncaas just could not matchup to Hak and Melo, those two Together were a matchup nightmare. It doesnt hurt that Gmac hit all those 3s in 1st half against ku but still part of the reasons he got all those shots is the defense was so focused on our two future nba guys.

G would (if he returns which i assume he will) be a match up problem for many many teams next yr, just as he was for Duk this yr. with our i proved depth we could be legit top ten next year if we develop one more mismatch. Could it be Malachi, Bryant or Cole? I dont know probably not. The other top mismatch candidate would be an athletic Stronger McC at 6 11 matched up against 6 7 and 6 9 guys. But he needs to get that knee healthy and needs to get much stronger. Big ifs

Matchups are especially important in college because teams usually just do not have the roster flexibility offensively and defensively to counter specific matchups like most NBA teams can.

I think you had this lineup early in the thread but its the one that has me really excited
Trev
Mal
Mike
Chris
Bryant/DC2/Diange (anyone who is commanding a legit low post threat)
How do you guard that lineup? I also feel that Kaleb and Tyler will be very important players for us next year and they aren't even in that lineup. But like you say its matchups and beyond that, its possible combinations and next years squad (if all goes well) looks to be able to field multiple effective lineups of different strengths and types.

 

[Jack Hall]

Matchups are especially important in college because teams usually just do not have the roster flexibility offensively and defensively to counter specific matchups like most NBA teams can.

I think you had this lineup early in the thread but its the one that has me really excited
Trev
Mal
Mike
Chris
Bryant/DC2/Diange (anyone who is commanding a legit low post threat)
How do you guard that lineup? I also feel that Kaleb and Tyler will be very important players for us next year and they aren't even in that lineup. But like you say its matchups and beyond that, its possible combinations and next years squad (if all goes well) looks to be able to field multiple effective lineups of different strengths and types.

I am not trying to slight TRob or even saying that Mal will be better than TRob next year. But there is a trend in college bball- put three legit 3 pt shooters out there and spread the court. Duke is excelling at it this year and imo its why Uconn won it all last yr (Napier, Boat and Giffey could all shoot it and Nap and Boat were great drivers). helps if those 3 shooters can drive it also but when was the last time SU could put out 3 really good shooters w good handle? Seriously? If Malachi can shoot it as he is advertized (he is also supposed to have a good handle) and he actually plays D, a combo of G, TC, and MR would really spread the court. Give room for McC and our C to operate. Imagine if Rak was surrounded by 3 shooters this yr. you saw what happened that one single game against BC when BJ , G, and TC all hit multiple 3s. It was our only blowout and Rak didnt even do much. But BJ isnt quite ready against the top teams like Duk.

 

[jordoo]

I am not trying to slight TRob or even saying that Mal will be better than TRob next year. But there is a trend in college bball- put three legit 3 pt shooters out there and spread the court. Duke is excelling at it this year and imo its why Uconn won it all last yr. helps if those 3 shooters can drive it also but when was the last time SU could put out 3 really good shooters w good handle? Seriously? If Malachi can shoot it as he is advertized (he is also supposed to have a good handle) and he actually plays D, a combo of G, TC, and MR would really spread the court. Give room for McC and our C to operate. Imagine if Rak was surrounded by 3 shooters this yr. you saw what happened that one single game against BC when BJ , G, and TC all hit multiple 3s. It was our only blowout and Rak didnt even do much. But BJ isnt quite ready against the top teams like Duk.

Sadly a lot of it is tied to the NCAA looking like a WWF match in the paint and when guys try to drive the ball. This is why we have seen a greater need for multiple shooters. Every game I watch I think What with the officiating, no wonder all these kids leave early, they actual want to play basketball the way it was intended. LOL. The NBA always has multiple shooters, very few guys cannot score when left alone in the NBA but that's not the case in this watered down talent pool that college bball operates in so teams that can do that have an extremely easier road than those that do not.

 

[OttoMets]

I just don't see next year being much better. We lose Rak which is a massive loss.

Bryant - Not sure we even get him.

Coleman - glad to see him returning, I just don't expect much out of him. He wasn't really good when when he was playing and being almost 2 years from live action along with 3 knee injuries and 2 surgeries I'm not optimistic he can give us 10-15 minutes a game next year. I can't count on much from him.

Diagne - With McCullough and Roberson manning the 4 his shot is going to be able to play the 5. When was the last time a freshman came in and gave us solid minutes from the 5? I don't know but it's been a long t long time.

McCullough - if he comes back I'll be happy. Most upside on next years roster, hope he ends up what we think he's capable of, that will take a lot of heat off everybody else.

Roberson - If he can be a consistent 8 points and 8 rebound guy I'd be happy, not sure he even sees the minutes that he's been playing next year though.

Cooney & G - Great players, expect pretty much the same as we're seeing now.

Richardson - I don't doubt he's the jewel of this class but where do the minutes come from? Cooney and G are going to be playing 30+, you're high if you think otherwise. Will probably get 15-20 minutes a game before ACC play but I'd say he sees about 10 a game when conference season starts.

Joseph - I see something in him, I do like how he pushes the ball, I think his mid range jumper is there and can be deadly with the right squad around him. I'm sure G will still see the backup point minutes which will allow Richardson to get his minutes.

Buss and BJ - I honestly can say I see a ton of DNPs from them. Buss has been recruited over and BJ has far too many guys ahead of them. I'd be shocked to see then average 5-7 minutes a game next season. I hate to see guys leave, but I hate even worse to see guys buried on the bench with little chance to get off, might be best for them to transfer if they want pt in the future.

Howard and Lydon - both will have solid futures with is, hope Lydon takes a shirt with the guys in front of him, Howard could get an opportunity next year if Joseph doesn't improve, but Howard isn't a point guard yet and will probably have the same problems Joseph has had this year. I don't think they're much of factors next year.

All this said, nothing about any of this screams top 15 to me, if it all comes together sure, but even with Bryant I don't think we sniff top 5 all year.

Great points. Though I expect more out of Roberson.

One more thought: defense. Freshmen won't play it as well as Boeheim wants. And unless they're doing Carmelo Anthony things to make up for that failing, Boeheim's going to find someone who can defend as well as he wants.

Every year we get high school kids who are great shooters, incredible dunkers, multi-skilled offensive players. Then they play for Syracuse, where the coach has expectations and rules, and they're not as effective. None of that will change next season.

 

[Jasoncuse]

What makes anyone think Coleman or the frosh will be impact players? Hopefully Malachi is but I'm not going to bank on him or any of the others as 1st year players. I can't believe so many of you see this roster as a top 10 type...

Without Xmas and probably G, how will this team score? Will McCullough be ready to go in November (if he's back) after missing a ton of key development time?

I think next year could be as bad, maybe worse, as this year, especially if G leaves. If Bryant comes, G returns, McCullough is 100% and much stronger/improved, coleman can give some minutes and the Malachi/Diagne contribute, we still might not be all that good. The ceiling will be there but there will be growing pains. PG play, guard play in the zone and scoring/shooting will all be major question marks.

 

[Jasoncuse]

Who plays the 5 next year?

Is Bryant definitely a center in the zone? Is he even going to come here?
Counting on Coleman isn't something the staff should expect.
Chris is too skinny and a much better fit on the wing. He can get minutes at the 5 though.
Diagne will be a freshman big man, how much can he be expected to contribute? I don't know if he'll be ready to man the middle in high leverage situations.
Obokoh unfortunely doesn't look like he belongs at this level.

Tons of question marks for maybe the most important position in our D. If Cooney and KJ play a ton up top, we're going to need someone that is ready to rock inside.

 

[RF2044]

What makes anyone think Coleman or the frosh will be impact players? Hopefully Malachi is but I'm not going to bank on him or any of the others as 1st year players. I can't believe so many of you see this roster as a top 10 type...

With Xmas and probably G, how will this team score? Will McCullough be ready to go in November (if he's back) after missing a ton of key development time?

I think next year could be as bad, maybe worse, as this year, especially if G leaves. If Bryant comes, G returns, McCullough is 100% and much stronger/improved, coleman can give some minutes and the Malachi/Diagne contribute, we still might not be all that good. The ceiling will be there but there will be growing pains. PG play, guard play in the zone and scoring/shooting will all be major question marks.

"Probably G"

Based upon what? A couple of posters speculating that he should go pro?

Bunk.

 

[Orangezoo]

Didn't read through all pages so forgive any repetition but i think next year could be really good based on how close we have come this year despite an iron men lineup. We have led or been in the game to the final minutes in most of our losses amidst a really tough schedule. You have legitimate senior leadership coming back paired with young talent. We also go from a really thin bench to the polar opposite (on paper).

 

[RF2044]

Who plays the 5 next year?

Is Bryant definitely a center in the zone? Is he even going to come here?
Counting on Coleman isn't something the staff should expect.
Chris is too skinny and a much better fit on the wing. He can get minutes at the 5 though.
Diagne will be a freshman big man, how much can he be expected to contribute? I don't know if he'll be ready to man the middle in high leverage situations.
Obokoh unfortunely doesn't look like he belongs at this level.

Tons of question marks for maybe the most important position in our D. If Cooney and KJ play a ton up top, we're going to need someone that is ready to rock inside.

We'll see. Worst case scenario, probably McCullough. Lots of question makes otherwise.

BUT, that doesn't mean that one [or more] of those questions doesn't get answered positively. Coleman is a lot closer to being fully recovered than he is not making it back--that is based upon inside reports from practice, where he is going at Rak full speed / and more than holding his own. Encouraging, if nothing else.

Bryant could very well end up here. I'm not guaranteeing he will, but we are the odds on favorites.

What happens if both of those things connect? It sure is going to render all of this talk about the 5 being a glaring weakness irrelevant. Heck, even if one of those things comes to pass, we should be all right. Especially with McCullough's return, and continued physical development from him.

 

[Orangezoo]

I think the key piece next year is PG play. We need Kaleb to be able to be 2nd half vs BC on a more regular basis as well as get some minutes for Howard. Then allowing G as the 3 and roberson the 4. What happens with Cmac and Thomas Bryant will be the really interesting part. For now though we should hopefully have a really solid core (assuming Kalebs improvement ) with TR TC MG and KJ where the other pieces can fall around those 4 and give us that extra gear and additional threat.

 

[Jasoncuse]

"Probably G"

Based upon what? A couple of posters speculating that he should go pro?

Bunk.

I don't know what exactly has been said but it's hard to see what favors him returning. To be the BMOC? IF he finishes as strong as he's played in ACC play, I expect him to strike while his iron is hot. The kid turns 23 in a few months, and should be ready to graduate. How much better could he theoretically play next year, especially if we don't have a legit interior scoring threat to draw attention? Is he an NBA prospect? If not, why not take your degree and go start making money overseas? Athletes have limited earning periods, especially ones turning 23 before earnig a cent.

His game is pretty good and well-rounded now, so I'm not sure how much he improves staying another year here.

I'm not sure why that is so out there. This isn't some 19 year old coming into his own.

 

[Jasoncuse]

We'll see. Worst case scenario, probably McCullough. Lots of question makes otherwise.

BUT, that doesn't mean that one [or more] of those questions doesn't get answered positively. Coleman is a lot closer to being fully recovered than he is not making it back--that is based upon inside reports from practice, where he is going at Rak full speed / and more than holding his own. Encouraging, if nothing else.

Bryant could very well end up here. I'm not guaranteeing he will, but we are the odds on favorites.

What happens if both of those things connect? It sure is going to render all of this talk about the 5 being a glaring weakness irrelevant. Heck, even if one of those things comes to pass, we should be all right. Especially with McCullough's return, and continued physical development from him.

Well there will be a lot of options, just a TON of question marks. I'm sure one or two will work out but if not, we are going to be hurting on D inside.

 

[RF2044]

Well there will be a lot of options, just a TON of question marks. I'm sure one or two will work out but if not, we are going to be hurting on D inside.

That seems overly pessimistic to me. Sorry, it does. I expect Gbinije back, and expect him to form as good of a perimeter nucleus with Cooney and Joseph as any in college hoops next year. That's a LOT of returning firepower. I expect Joseph to make the sophomore leap. I think that both Joseph and Roberson will be better as a function of having been thrown to the wolves this year. And I expect McCullough to bounce back next season and benefit from an additional year of physical maturity.

Are there question marks? Sure. Every team has question marks every year in college basketball as a function of attrition. But reading through this thread, I get the impression that as frustrating as this team has been, that many posters don't appreciate how close they are to being pretty darn good. And that's with virtually zero depth, no backup center, no backup PG, etc.

We don't need any of the frosh to be world beaters. We only need one of two of them to be contributing caliber for many of this year's team's warts to be mitigated. And if a guy like Richardson--a McDonald's all american, no less--can provide a little more than just token contributions, then our offense could be much more diversified next year. And if a guy like Coleman--another McDonald's all american--can bounce back, then a lot of uncertainty at center gets neutralized. And if a prospect like Bryant comes here--yet another McDonald's all american--then even sans Rak, center could remain a relative position of strength.

BTW, prepare to be surprised by how solid Diagne is, and how he'll likely contribute as a reserve big even as a frosh. Next year has a lot of the right ingredients for our team to bounce back from this year's subpar results. We are honestly knocking on the door this year. Michigan, Villanova, UNC, Pitt, Duke -- all winnable games that we just couldn't quite eek out. Several of those were road games against very good teams. A couple of those games were against top 10 teams that we went toe-to-toe with right down to the wire. We are what our record says we are, but we're also an eyelash away from being a pretty damn good team, despite all of our depth constraints, general lack of offensive capabilities, and relatively poor [by our standards] defensive play. Imagine if either of those factors turns around next season--it isn't difficult to expect a jump in performance. Especially because our returning perimeter talent is so strong comparatively.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I don't know what exactly has been said but it's hard to see what favors him returning. To be the BMOC? IF he finishes as strong as he's played in ACC play, I expect him to strike while his iron is hot. The kid turns 23 in a few months, and should be ready to graduate. How much better could he theoretically play next year, especially if we don't have a legit interior scoring threat to draw attention? Is he an NBA prospect? If not, why not take your degree and go start making money overseas? Athletes have limited earning periods, especially ones turning 23 before earnig a cent.

His game is pretty good and well-rounded now, so I'm not sure how much he improves staying another year here.

I'm not sure why that is so out there. This isn't some 19 year old coming into his own.

I really don't understand the people who thing Gbinije is leaving especially when he could come back and have a legit chance to go to the NBA. We have had 2 people leave early to go pro in Europe and they were essentially forced out.

Why are our own fans starting rumors that Gbinije is going to leave, because that is what they are just rumors? I get following mock drafts and making educated assumptions, but the Gbinije rumor isn't even that.

We are getting to the point where now some of our own fans are creating rumors to say our players are leaving, which hasn't been publicized anywhere.

When I read these posts I shake my head. These rumor mongering posts come off as, I need to make sure people realize things are really BAD around here, i want to be RIGHt that they are BAD, and there is no reason to be optimistic.

 

[HOFCeluck]

I really don't understand the people who thing Gbinije is leaving especially when he could come back and have a legit chance to go to the NBA. We have had 2 people leave early to go pro in Europe and they were essentially forced out.

Why are our own fans starting rumors that Gbinije is going to leave, because that is what they are just rumors? I get following mock drafts and making educated assumptions, but the Gbinije rumor isn't even that.

We are getting to the point where now some of our own fans are creating rumors to say our players are leaving, which hasn't been publicized anywhere.

When I read these posts I shake my head. These rumor mongering posts come off as, I need to make sure people realize things are really BAD around here, i want to be RIGHt that they are BAD, and there is no reason to be optimistic.

Don't think anyone is starring rumors. I just think there is a non zero percent chance he leaves. don't think that take is unreasonable. Certainly no les reasonable than believing well be top ten next year.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Don't think anyone is starring rumors. I just think there is a non zero percent chance he leaves. don't think that take is unreasonable. Certainly no les reasonable than believing well be top ten next year.

If someone can find him on a draft board somewhere, or the NCAA tells us we are banned next year I will believe he may leave. Until then it's nothing more than rumors/thoughts created by people who post here, nowhere else.

 

[HOFCeluck]

If someone can find him on a draft board somewhere, or the NCAA tells us we are banned next year I will believe he may leave. Until then it's nothing more than rumors/thoughts created by people who post here, nowhere else.

oh cool. Well hopefully you're right.

 

[Jasoncuse]

I really don't understand the people who thing Gbinije is leaving especially when he could come back and have a legit chance to go to the NBA. We have had 2 people leave early to go pro in Europe and they were essentially forced out.

Why are our own fans starting rumors that Gbinije is going to leave, because that is what they are just rumors? I get following mock drafts and making educated assumptions, but the Gbinije rumor isn't even that.

We are getting to the point where now some of our own fans are creating rumors to say our players are leaving, which hasn't been publicized anywhere.

When I read these posts I shake my head. These rumor mongering posts come off as, I need to make sure people realize things are really BAD around here, i want to be RIGHt that they are BAD, and there is no reason to be optimistic.

Not sure how my opinion is starting a rumor? I'm not going out and saying he's gone blah blah blah based on sources blah blah blah. I have zero inside info, nor do I care to have any. I just believe that it's more likely G leaves than he stays based on his circumstances (hot play, age, graduating). I'm sorry you don't agree but to say myself, or others, are simply stirring the rumor pot is ridiculous.

How exactly is me voicing my opinion different than claiming next year's team is stacked and will be top 10? Because you don't agree?