People calling for m2m is comical

[br801]

On the straw man garbage scale, this post rates an 11.

"Zonies" -- oy vey... the hyperbole is getting thick in here.

This just cracked me up for some reason.

 

[Townie72]

Great. So if it takes less time to practice, it shouldn't be hard to develop a backup .

Read the book!

That time saved isn't available to add things that he doesn't feel we need. It gives him more time to practice the stuff we do need.

 

[Townie72]

He walked right into that one.

Yuk! Yuk! Yuk!

Another one that hasn't read the book , doesn't know all JB's reasons for it ... but is filled with opinions.

Chime back in when you have read the book and understand the complete rationale for the Zone and why JB is 100% zone period.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Read the book!

That time saved isn't available to add things that he doesn't feel we need. It gives him more time to practice the stuff we do need.

I have. Like I alluded to earlier, I wasn't impressed with his rational. I've always thought that while the zone is a great primary defense, abandoning any other defense after an exhibition loss was a bizarre, reactionary measure.

 

[retro44]

The way I look at it is if you go back to the last 60 games they played they are 33-27, so the zone is not really bringing in the wins any more:noidea:

Recruiting depth has gone south just like the stamina.

 

[sugrad68]

The end of regulation? That three resulted from over-rotation and Lydon not recognizing that he should have abandoned all thoughts of defending the paint. The zone is more than capable of defending that.

It should never have come down to a 3-pointer. Hopkins should have used his final time out before Richardson shot his 2nd free thrown and told the team to intentionally FOUL a player. Hopkins did okay as a coach for the nine games he was there but was not great. What I liked most about JB in the last game was he got in a player's face when a mistake was made. Hopkins would simply pat the player on the butt.

 

[sugrad68]

The way I look at it is if you go back to the last 60 games they played they are 33-27, so the zone is not really bringing in the wins any more:noidea:

Recruiting depth has gone south just like the stamina.

This team is the worst SU team I've ever seen at playing the zone. Terrible at defending the 3. Opposing guards penetrate the zone like I've never seen before. Forwards are coming up too high which leaves the back of the zone undefended. The only game I've seen where M-2-M would have been much more effective than the zone, assuming the players can play it., was the St. Johns game. The 2 Italian players shot the lights out because they were wide open. Unfortunately, this team is what it is. Limited talent. Especially in the middle.

 

[Townie72]

I have. Like I alluded to earlier, I wasn't impressed with his rational. I've always thought that while the zone is a great primary defense, abandoning any other defense after an exhibition loss was a bizarre, reactionary measure.

Bizarre?

Not impressed with his rationale? Seriously?

Not impressed?

Well, that about says it all.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Bizarre?

Not impressed with his rationale? Seriously?

Not impressed?

Well, that about says it all.

^as does this^

 

[two3zone]

ha nice. If the players did what they were supposed to, the zone would have been fine. Kenpom actually dedicated an article to the Syracuse zone's ability to hurt opposing teams' 3pt percentages.

So you're clearly not trying to argue that the zone results in a lot of open 3's. That would be a poor argument.

When the other teams needs a three with little time remaining, may I ask what the point is of having a man under the basket? That's absurd.

 

[pfister1]

Great. So if it takes less time to practice, it shouldn't be hard to develop a backup .

It's not like we don't run man in practice. At least I assume we have our guys play man defense when we are trying to prepare our offense to play against teams that play exclusively man defense. I mean I hope we don't have our offense practicing exclusively against zone defense....although that might explain why the guards have looked a bit overwhelmed by the defensive pressure they've been seeing in ACC play.

 

[dasher]

The way I look at it is if you go back to the last 60 games they played they are 33-27, so the zone is not really bringing in the wins any more:noidea:

Recruiting depth has gone south just like the stamina.

we have been ravaged by injuries over the last 60 games. Chris and DC. 2 high school all americans. Plus not just guys leaving early but guys we didn't expect to leave early. ennis and grant were both surprises.

 

[Brooky03]

When the other teams needs a three with little time remaining, may I ask what the point is of having a man under the basket? That's absurd.

In m2m, there would be a man under the basket anyway. An offense can't have all 5 guys outside the paint and expect anything good to happen.

 

[STEVEHOLT]

I dont understand our press this year. We literally have nobody back...at all. All the opposition has to do is lob the ball high and deep without even looking and its a dunk every time. Its not a legitimate "alternative". whatever time they spend in practicing it, practice something else...I dont care what..but something.

 

[Scotch]

I dont understand our press this year. We literally have nobody back...at all. All the opposition has to do is lob the ball high and deep without even looking and its a dunk every time. Its not a legitimate "alternative". whatever time they spend in practicing it, practice something else...I dont care what..but something.

It's the worst press in the country, and has been for 20 years. Complete sellout on the first trap and then an automatic dunk on the other end.

 

[FrancoPizza]

It's the worst press in the country, and has been for 20 years. Complete sellout on the first trap and then an automatic dunk on the other end.

I hope hop will introduce some modern full court pressing tactics.

 

[Cusefan0307]

It's the worst press in the country, and has been for 20 years. Complete sellout on the first trap and then an automatic dunk on the other end.

Twenty years? Please. It looked good against Georgetown, it almost got us back in the game. It looked ok at the end against Clemson, Cooney stole the ball and we got a look to win.

It looked great in 2003 when McNeil was swatting shots like crazy.

We don't have a Center shot blocker this year, that's why it's not as good,

 

[Scotch]

Twenty years? Please. It looked good against Georgetown, it almost got us back in the game. It looked ok at the end against Clemson, Cooney stole the ball and we got a look to win.

It looked great in 2003 when McNeil was swatting shots like crazy.

We don't have a Center shot blocker this year, that's why it's not as good,

It's simple and desperate. Other coaches design presses that have multiple trapping opportunities at multiple points on the floor. We sell out once and then it's a track meet the other way. Yea, it occasionally works, but pressing is not a strength of Jimmy B.

 

[Kowbelkat]

we will not do it. Adjustments are made in the zone

Haven't seen an adjustment yet, UNC adjusted and shot 90% the second half

 

[orangecuse]

^as does this^

What I don't understand, and I'd wish someone could explain it to me like I'm a 6 year old is, if JB's rationale is so superior, impressive, genius, whatever...why hasn't there been more nc in 40 years? Moreover, why doesn't any other coach, let alone elite, play zone exclusively? Just curious...as a 6 year old...

 

[CuseFaninVT]

What I don't understand, and I'd wish someone could explain it to me like I'm a 6 year old is, if JB's rationale is so superior, impressive, genius, whatever...why hasn't there been more nc in 40 years? Moreover, why doesn't any other coach, let alone elite, play zone exclusively? Just curious...as a 6 year old...

I think this is a very fair question. If the king of m2m, Coach K himself, is able to evolve over time and incorporate zone based on circumstances and players, why can't JB (or the many folks on here who seem so snarky about this discussion) even consider it?

 

[HOFCeluck]

What I don't understand, and I'd wish someone could explain it to me like I'm a 6 year old is, if JB's rationale is so superior, impressive, genius, whatever...why hasn't there been more nc in 40 years? Moreover, why doesn't any other coach, let alone elite, play zone exclusively? Just curious...as a 6 year old...

If we played ONLY M2M, I'd question why we didn't mix in some zone occasionally.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Twenty years? Please. It looked good against Georgetown, it almost got us back in the game. It looked ok at the end against Clemson, Cooney stole the ball and we got a look to win.

It looked great in 2003 when McNeil was swatting shots like crazy.

We don't have a Center shot blocker this year, that's why it's not as good,

The goal of a press should be to a) force a turnover, b) wear the other team down, c) give them less time to get into their halfcourt sets. When McNeil entered the equation, it means the press failed to do its job. Just because the opponent is stupid enough to get their shots rejected doesn't mean the press works. It just means the other team is not disciplined enough to pull out and kill clock. We benefited from a lot of stupidity in 2003.

 

[cuseinseattle]

\Shock value?

Let's see. Just about every team plays M2M themselves. They practice against every week but one, just about. They play 30 games against M2M during the season.

And they are shocked and discombobulated when the Orange start playing it?

I was just thinking that. Maybe the other team gets confused and thinks they are playing Clemson or Tennessee or something.

 

[cuseinseattle]

The goal of a press should be to a) force a turnover, b) wear the other team down, c) give them less time to get into their halfcourt sets. When McNeil entered the equation, it means the press failed to do its job. Just because the opponent is stupid enough to get their shots rejected doesn't mean the press works. It just means the other team is not disciplined enough to pull out and kill clock. We benefited from a lot of stupidity in 2003.

Sometimes you press if you want to speed up the tempo of the game.