Perspective On JB et al

[Shenexon]

Most of us grew up in an era where College Basketball was part of the American experience, full of tradition and history. The reality is that basketball has only been around since the 1890s and most of the colleges & universities that play the game were founded since the US Civil War, as our technological development required a high level of detailed specific knowledge.

As our educational levels increased so did our sports and athletic levels. College sports have been a good collaboration for both endeavors, but we're really only in the first several decades of the rapid growth of television, cable-based entertainment, and the internet that have fed a hungry audience appreciative of the display of talent. We're in the hey-day and need to appreciate that element.

Basketball is a game of runs and so is basketball tradition. There are a lot of pretenders to greatness in sports that had a few good seasons before returning to mediocrity, coaches and/or programs. However, most of the great programs traditionally have been built upon the run of a single great coach, i.e. Smith, Krzyzewski, Rupp, Knight, Wooden, and to my primary interest, Jim Boeheim.

Syracuse has become a pre-eminent national basketball program over the last 40 years largely due to JB's longevity and passion. We as fans may not agree with some of his decisions and tendencies, but this has been a historic era with a dedicated alumnus establishing SU as an elite program. The program is attracting the best of the best of the best and when he retires he'll be leaving SU in a very good place.

For those of you that have endured the paragraphs above, my point is simply this:

Savor every game and appreciate the moment, but especially thank JB for bringing us here.

 

[stuckinbig11]

I would sometimes make different game decisions than JB makes, but I never question the ones he does make. He is a basketball genius who sees and understands things that are happening that the majority of coaches miss. I suspect that is one reason that K has him on the Olympic coaching team. I suspect (and hope) that JB sees some of that genius in Mike Hopkins; if it is there, we will be a major power for a long time.

 

[Oakland]

Most of us grew up in an era where College Basketball was part of the American experience, full of tradition and history. The reality is that basketball has only been around since the 1890s and most of the colleges & universities that play the game were founded since the US Civil War, as our technological development required a high level of detailed specific knowledge.

As our educational levels increased so did our sports and athletic levels. College sports have been a good collaboration for both endeavors, but we're really only in the first several decades of the rapid growth of television, cable-based entertainment, and the internet that have fed a hungry audience appreciative of the display of talent. We're in the hey-day and need to appreciate that element.

Basketball is a game of runs and so is basketball tradition. There are a lot of pretenders to greatness in sports that had a few good seasons before returning to mediocrity, coaches and/or programs. However, most of the great programs traditionally have been built upon the run of a single great coach, i.e. Smith, Krzyzewski, Rupp, Knight, Wooden, and to my primary interest, Jim Boeheim.

Syracuse has become a pre-eminent national basketball program over the last 40 years largely due to JB's longevity and passion. We as fans may not agree with some of his decisions and tendencies, but this has been a historic era with a dedicated alumnus establishing SU as an elite program. The program is attracting the best of the best of the best and when he retires he'll be leaving SU in a very good place.

For those of you that have endured the paragraphs above, my point is simply this:

Savor every game and appreciate the moment, but especially thank JB for bringing us here.

Curious if you were making the same types of posts, 5-7 yrs ago, when SU's recruiting classes were bombing and SU had a first rd loss in the NCAA and two NIT appearances?

 

[orangecuse]

Curious if you were making the same types of posts, 5-7 yrs ago, when SU's recruiting classes were bombing and SU had a first rd loss in the NCAA and two NIT appearances?

Based upon your post, the OP's first sentence likely doesn't apply to you as wisdom generally comes with age. Moreover, comprehending the fact that a 5-7 year snippet is just that, and not the overall sampling/totality of what JB has built, his longevity, and historic iconic status relative to Syracuse University and its basketball.

 

[Shenexon]

Curious if you were making the same types of posts, 5-7 yrs ago, when SU's recruiting classes were bombing and SU had a first rd loss in the NCAA and two NIT appearances?

Well, I've been an SU fan since the early 1970s and JB has always been there. He's been MY coach and I've lived my life with him as a point of stability in a world that erupts with change. I've basked in the same successes and suffered through the same torments as he and the program have. I've pulled for his success throughout and hoped he'd ultimately accomplish what he has. I've been disappointed at various times in how things were going especially during NIT seasons, but JB is a serious human and I admire most people I know that are serious and passionate, even if I don't share their passions. In short, I've been sold on JB since Derrick Coleman but can more easily tout his resume and impact now than I could during the years you reference. It doesn't make it any more or less true than it was then, but it's certainly easier to promote.

 

[Flacusian]

There will never be a coach like Jim Boeheim again. Essentially, Syracuse's rise to becoming an elite program was highly unlikely. It was a combination of circumstances which won't again be duplicated. It was actually a quirk in fate that got Jimmy B. the coaching job at Syracuse in the first place. He is the classic example of when preparation meets opportunity it gives rise to good fortune.

Jim's career was also paralleled by the emergence and development of the Big East Conference and it's impact on TV coverage. Coach also had a commitment to developing and perfecting his version of the zone defense that is often copied but never duplicated. Also unlikely was that unlike many other coaches who achieve a certain degree of success and notariety, Coach didn't give in to the temptations of greener pastures, whether they be another program or the NBA.


One can only hope that Hopkins will have continued success leading the program ahead after Jimmy B coaches his final game. He will have to find his own blend of experience, leadership, recruiting, motivational skills and though they may have been forged while working as an assistant to Jimmy B., in the end he will have to find his own style. Meanwhile, I agree with the original post and I am extreemly appreciative of all that James Boeheim has brought to Syracuse University and all it's fans. To have a guy who will finish 2nd in all time wins is truely a blessing and to think that we may be in the midst of what may be his greatest season ever is incredibly exciting.

 

[newmexicuse]

I think Jimmy's coaching has improved with age. It has taken a long time, but I think it is really only the last few years that he has started recruiting players to his system rather than just trying to recruit talent irrespective of how it might fit in.

I think this is a big reason why our Zone now appears to be much better and why the M v Z debates have subsided.

Yes, I am still in the corner of an occaisional need to play some man just to disrupt game flows, but our Zone has improved so much over the last few years that this is much less of an issue in my mind. It certainly doesn't override the excellence Jimmy has brought to the table.

 

[moqui]

Curious if you were making the same types of posts, 5-7 yrs ago, when SU's recruiting classes were bombing and SU had a first rd loss in the NCAA and two NIT appearances?

I can't speak for Shenexon, but there were plenty of us who were defending his legacy even during the darkest years.

For me, Syracuse basketball is Boeheim basketball. I grew up with it and with him; they are fused. As I am not an alum and I am no longer a local, I question whether I will even follow the team with the same interest once JB is gone.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

There are really only 2 knocks on JB, right? Too many NCAA disappointments and not being the dominant Big East top-dog team all that often. There seemingly was always someone better in the conference, but no one as consistently good as JB's teams.

Being consistently very good but rarely great isn't a bad thing to be remembered as.

 

[Townie72]

When thinking about JB seems to me that you have to consider his entire "body of work". From that standpoint there are few that can approach him. 880 wins in the Big East. An NC, etc, etc.

Reminds me of an interview of Mick Jagger by Charlie Rose about the Stone's claim to being the "Worlds Greatest Rock and Roll Band". When you consider the complete body of work --- the longevity, the overall quality --- it becomes inarguable.

The problem with recognizing JB for all these accomplishments is that those nit-picking his decisions look increasingly silly.

The fact that got me was that he is 26 and 4 in OT games in the last 17 years.

 

[Oakland]

Based upon your post, the OP's first sentence likely doesn't apply to you as wisdom generally comes with age. Moreover, comprehending the fact that a 5-7 year snippet is just that, and not the overall sampling/totality of what JB has built, his longevity, and historic iconic status relative to Syracuse University and its basketball.

Based on your post, I assume you are young.

 

[Oakland]

Well, I've been an SU fan since the early 1970s and JB has always been there. He's been MY coach and I've lived my life with him as a point of stability in a world that erupts with change. I've basked in the same successes and suffered through the same torments as he and the program have. I've pulled for his success throughout and hoped he'd ultimately accomplish what he has. I've been disappointed at various times in how things were going especially during NIT seasons, but JB is a serious human and I admire most people I know that are serious and passionate, even if I don't share their passions. In short, I've been sold on JB since Derrick Coleman but can more easily tout his resume and impact now than I could during the years you reference. It doesn't make it any more or less true than it was then, but it's certainly easier to promote.

I'll take that as a 'no'.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

There are really only 2 knocks on JB, right? Too many NCAA disappointments and not being the dominant Big East top-dog team all that often. There seemingly was always someone better in the conference, but no one as consistently good as JB's teams.

Being consistently very good but rarely great isn't a bad thing to be remembered as.

It ain't over yet...could be the best is yet to come. He just helped dust off the Pitino/Dixon losing monkeys.

Take 2 out of 3, or 3 out of 4 of the last Big East titles and call this decade ours. Then when people look back at the old BE glory days, when Pitt, UConn, Georgetown, and SU were in it, there will be no real debate over who the best in the conference was. People will remember we left while on top and when they compare overall records the numbers will show we dominated.

Then just some regular Final Four visits with a title or two and the legacy will be complete.

But I think JB is looking for more than that. He is grooming Hop, moreso than any other coach I can remember. Looks like he wants the program to continue, powerhouse style.

 

[jordoo]

When thinking about JB seems to me that you have to consider his entire "body of work". From that standpoint there are few that can approach him. 880 wins in the Big East. An
The fact that got me was that he is 26 and 4 in OT games in the last 17 years.

See but he JB would have just played more m2m in those 30 games we could have stayed out of OT in at least 15 of them . . . . . . of course we probably lose half in OT then

 

[orangecuse]

Based on your post, I assume you are young.

I am...young at heart. Your insight is incredibly astounding...just as your input is to this thread.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

Seems like only yesterday that the announcement was made that Jim Bow-heem was taking over from Roy Danforth. Those who remember that time will recall that JB's hiring was questioned by many, if not most, fans and was far from celebrated in the sports media of the era. Plenty of folks who had gotten a taste of the big time with the Final Four appearance of Roy's Runts in 1974/75 were demanding a "name" head coach. I was a defender of the hiring from day one -- I don't even know why. 36 years later who among us -- regardless of what we thought of the hire -- could have envisioned Syracuse's run under JAB?

 

[AZOrange]

One thing I always wonder is how SU history would be different if Keith Smart had clanged that jumper.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

or we made some free throws :-(

 

[NKR1978]

There are so many things that JB has done that no one in his profession has ever done. I want him to get that 2nd championship so bad so that there are no doubts about his greatness as a coach.

 

[DallasCuse]

Curious if you were making the same types of posts, 5-7 yrs ago, when SU's recruiting classes were bombing and SU had a first rd loss in the NCAA and two NIT appearances?

I would bet 98% of 'Cuse nation were posting mostly positive and hopeful things during a "down?" stretch.

In the 80's, I cussed at JB for being what I perceived as stubborn and under achieving. Then in the 90's, I began to grow immense respect for him as a coach, and when he took that gang in '95-96 to the finals, I was absolutely forever sold.

He's a friggin legend. Crotchety at times, so what, we all are. What a great run he's had with my beloved 'Cuse, and my friends and family here in Dallas are all 100% huge fans of his forever.

 

[br801]

Most of us grew up in an era where College Basketball was part of the American experience, full of tradition and history. The reality is that basketball has only been around since the 1890s and most of the colleges & universities that play the game were founded since the US Civil War, as our technological development required a high level of detailed specific knowledge.

As our educational levels increased so did our sports and athletic levels. College sports have been a good collaboration for both endeavors, but we're really only in the first several decades of the rapid growth of television, cable-based entertainment, and the internet that have fed a hungry audience appreciative of the display of talent. We're in the hey-day and need to appreciate that element.

Basketball is a game of runs and so is basketball tradition. There are a lot of pretenders to greatness in sports that had a few good seasons before returning to mediocrity, coaches and/or programs. However, most of the great programs traditionally have been built upon the run of a single great coach, i.e. Smith, Krzyzewski, Rupp, Knight, Wooden, and to my primary interest, Jim Boeheim.

Syracuse has become a pre-eminent national basketball program over the last 40 years largely due to JB's longevity and passion. We as fans may not agree with some of his decisions and tendencies, but this has been a historic era with a dedicated alumnus establishing SU as an elite program. The program is attracting the best of the best of the best and when he retires he'll be leaving SU in a very good place.

For those of you that have endured the paragraphs above, my point is simply this:

Savor every game and appreciate the moment, but especially thank JB for bringing us here.

Beautiful post.

In the event the current team doesn't win a championship and this board inevitably melts down, please re-post this.

 

[br801]

There are so many things that JB has done that no one in his profession has ever done. I want him to get that 2nd championship so bad so that there are no doubts about his greatness as a coach.

Anyone who doubts his greatness as a coach just doesn't get it.

 

[LennX6]

It ain't over yet...could be the best is yet to come. He just helped dust off the Pitino/Dixon losing monkeys.

Take 2 out of 3, or 3 out of 4 of the last Big East titles and call this decade ours. Then when people look back at the old BE glory days, when Pitt, UConn, Georgetown, and SU were in it, there will be no real debate over who the best in the conference was. People will remember we left while on top and when they compare overall records the numbers will show we dominated.

Then just some regular Final Four visits with a title or two and the legacy will be complete.

But I think JB is looking for more than that. He is grooming Hop, moreso than any other coach I can remember. Looks like he wants the program to continue, powerhouse style.

I believe we are about to embark on a Golden Age. Perhaps even a string of Final Fours and a mini-string of Titles. Where I see that is in the recruiting. We seemed to get a "sexier" look out there after the 6 OT game, then we followed it up with a flashy 29-4 team, then the last two years. We have moved into the No Carolina, Duke, neighborhood as "Selector" schools, now. We choose who we want, not the other way around. Sam Perkins and Kenny Anderson aside, JB did say recently if we want someone, we get them. Recently Tony Wroten wanted to come here, we did not recruit, and rumour has it Shabazz Muhammed wanted here but is not on our list.
My cracked crystal ball sees a FF this year, maybe not a title, but 2-3 FF in a Row after that. We have more good days ahead than bad. Real good days!

 

[HarrisonJBounel]

One thing I always wonder is how SU history would be different if Keith Smart had clanged that jumper.

Or if AO didn't wreck his knee his senior year.

Or if Sparty didn't make every three pointer in sight in 2000 to wipe out our 14-pt lead.

Or if the refs had called Walter McCarty for using JB Reafsnyder as a stepladder in getting that missed free throw with us down by one in the 1997 final.

In other words, another title would really cement JB's status in history.

 

[LennX6]

Seems like only yesterday that the announcement was made that Jim Bow-heem was taking over from Roy Danforth. Those who remember that time will recall that JB's hiring was questioned by many, if not most, fans and was far from celebrated in the sports media of the era. Plenty of folks who had gotten a taste of the big time with the Final Four appearance of Roy's Runts in 1974/75 were demanding a "name" head coach. I was a defender of the hiring from day one -- I don't even know why. 36 years later who among us -- regardless of what we thought of the hire -- could have envisioned Syracuse's run under JAB?

Thing is after the Final Four appearance , even us diehard fans, knew that was an aberration, we shouldn't have been there. Good grief we beat a team with Phil Ford , Walter Davis, and Mitch Kupchak. A coach pulling off what Danforth did in' 75 today, gets a much better gig than Tulane. The new Era had its seeds planted when JB came on board along with Bouie and Louie. Then Shackleford. Then Schayes. Then Red Bruin and Santifer. JB's entrance coincided with recruiting blue-chippers not necessarily confined to the Northeast. The 70's in hoops was dear to me as is was really great watching us grow from a small regional team that I listened to on transistor radio with aluminum foil and coat hangers to pull in the reception from 50 miles away after 8pm. It is still surreal today watching us on the national stage when my first 10 yrs as a fan, most the games were "dark matches" .