Class of 2023 PF Jerry Deng (NY / GA) Portal to NC State

[CuseSaint26]

Several insiders said over the winter that if we’re relying on Kiyan to play a major role this season, we won’t be very good. I consider the 6th and 7th men to be key roles. You have to have solid bench players, and Deng would have given us a proven guy in that key sub role. Kiyan seems to have played well in the all star tourneys, and is a smooth player with a good jumper, and maybe he’ll be ready to go from day 1 like Moten was back in the day, but I’m concerned that he will struggle as will the othe freshman. I still don’t think we have enough talent to be a tourney team. I hope I’m wrong.

I think this is a great point, mostly everyone is happy with the roster so far.

Legit point guard (George), legit shooter (Kingz), retained two best players from last year (Starling, Freeman), legit center for how we want to play (Kyle), and a good bench piece (Souare) but to be a tournament team, there is a missing piece.

The missing piece is a 6th man, likely a wing player, that can play starter minutes depending on matchup. Until we get that piece, we aren’t definitively a tournament team but are much improved.

 

[Orangezoo]

Several insiders said over the winter that if we’re relying on Kiyan to play a major role this season, we won’t be very good. I consider the 6th and 7th men to be key roles. You have to have solid bench players, and Deng would have given us a proven guy in that key sub role. Kiyan seems to have played well in the all star tourneys, and is a smooth player with a good jumper, and maybe he’ll be ready to go from day 1 like Moten was back in the day, but I’m concerned that he will struggle as will the other freshman. I still don’t think we have enough talent to be a tourney team. I hope I’m wrong.

Just my take but I don’t think we have any issues from a talent perspective. The top 3 freshmen come in having as much preparation as you could hope and necessary skill sets to complement the rest of the team.

Kiyan looks nothing like your typical nervous freshman and neither does Sadiq. Fennell has a lot going for him coming through the Aussie leagues and being 6-6 as a lead guard. Also - neither Sadiq or Kiyan should have roles that are beyond what is fair in todays game to ask of a top 40 recruit. They will have the opportunity to push for bigger roles but the starting 5 is much more talented this year and will be expected to do the heavy lifting, as they should.

Asking the freshmen to come in and start and play 25 plus mins a game is where it’s just asking for failure in my opinion.

If we can land Bristow I think that would be an excellent get when you see the guys like Deng and Valencia chasing big minutes in the P4. Bristow is not there in his production yet to be demanding a starting spot at this level. Someone like Agee would be an even bigger get but I wonder if a kid like that in his final year is looking to be a featured guy like the others.

 

[Niastri]

Several insiders said over the winter that if we’re relying on Kiyan to play a major role this season, we won’t be very good. I consider the 6th and 7th men to be key roles. You have to have solid bench players, and Deng would have given us a proven guy in that key sub role. Kiyan seems to have played well in the all star tourneys, and is a smooth player with a good jumper, and maybe he’ll be ready to go from day 1 like Moten was back in the day, but I’m concerned that he will struggle as will the other freshman. I still don’t think we have enough talent to be a tourney team. I hope I’m wrong.

Regarding the bolded statement, I think your concern is already handled. The top 7, at this moment, appears to be (in my internal order of importance) Freeman, George, Starling, Kingz, Kyle, White and Souare. Anthony and Fennell are the 8-9th players. Womack and Zephir are 10-11th. That top7 group is talented and experienced. 3 seniors, a junior and a sophomore. White and Souare are bouncy and White is very athletic. White is a top30 recruit, and Souare played 510 minutes on an ACC team last year.

Additionally, it is looking increasingly like Anthony is a very good player, who we’re going to want to see get minutes on a regular basis.

I would love another big to compete with Souare for minutes, and the recent misses on transfers Deng and Valencia still remains to be resolved. They will almost certainly try to find another tall, long armed athlete to be big man depth. We just don’t know where they are looking. Souare and Kyle scare me a little as our center duo.

We aren’t currently counting on Anthony or Fennell to be much more than limited minutes players. Fennell and Zephir are competing to be George’s backup, but Starling played a lot of point last year, and George played 36 minutes. One of the three backups to George at point just has to not hurt us.

We are loaded at wing and forward, with Freeman, Starling, Kingz, Anthony and White all options at the 2-4. Womack and Fennell are depth here. I see Freeman, Starling, and Kingz all getting big minutes 2-4, leaving spot minutes for everybody else to share.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

We aren’t getting another center. Thats pretty evident. The freshmen are coming off the bench. If they are as good as some think we really shouldn’t need anyone else as a rotational piece.

If we were to sign someone else at their position to replace them in the rotation there’s a possibility one of them decommits. That’s what happened at multiple other schools. It’s why Acaden Lewis asked out of UK and Adam’s asked out of UConn.

And not for nothing we have the 3rd best newcomer class in the conference as of today when you combine recruits and transfers. If we don’t win this year the blame lies with Autrys coaching.

Question: Can they de-commit if the portal is closed: a) prior to summer sessions, assuming they attend, b) after commencement of summer sessions, assuming they attend, or c) prior to fall attendance, if no summer session attendance.
Is the de-commitment a gentleman’s agreement to let them out of the NLI (is there still a NLI)?

 

[Cusefan0307]

Several insiders said over the winter that if we’re relying on Kiyan to play a major role this season, we won’t be very good. I consider the 6th and 7th men to be key roles. You have to have solid bench players, and Deng would have given us a proven guy in that key sub role. Kiyan seems to have played well in the all star tourneys, and is a smooth player with a good jumper, and maybe he’ll be ready to go from day 1 like Moten was back in the day, but I’m concerned that he will struggle as will the other freshman. I still don’t think we have enough talent to be a tourney team. I hope I’m wrong.

Do we need to rely on insiders for anything on Kiyan? He’s played on national television a bunch for us to use our own eyes. He should be able to Play 10-15 mpg next year based on what I’ve seen.

That said Jerry Deng likely made a good decision for himself to go to NC State. They don’t have Donnie Freeman at his position. We do. He will start there. He wouldn’t here.

 

[RF2044]

It feels like we’re falling short despite being told we have significantly more NIL (nearly $10 million, including settlement money). I’d love to see us land another shooter at the wing or forward spot and another center. Other historically peer programs seem to be landing more players and have more experience among their top 7. I’m concerned about playing freshman heavy minutes in key bench roles. But hopefully Kiyan, Sadiq and Fennell will be ready to contribute right away.

A big part of that IMO is the poor performance over the past few seasons, coupled with coaching uncertainty. Good players generally have multiple options -- and we aren't as attractive of a destination right now as we used to be.

That said, we did land some quality players [George and Kings in particular]. Hope it's enough.

 

[SimonSays]

It feels like we’re falling short despite being told we have significantly more NIL (nearly $10 million, including settlement money). I’d love to see us land another shooter at the wing or forward spot and another center. Other historically peer programs seem to be landing more players and have more experience among their top 7. I’m concerned about playing freshman heavy minutes in key bench roles. But hopefully Kiyan, Sadiq and Fennell will be ready to contribute right away.

Sadiq is a high floor type of guy - defense and rebounding translate really well to any level. So I would expect him to be fine but Kiyan the pace of the game and competitiveness from HS to college is insane. although im way more optimistic about him than i was 3 months ago. Fennel 0 clue - pretty sure the pro league he played was sub par at best.

 

[Orangezoo]

A big part of that IMO is the poor performance over the past few seasons, coupled with coaching uncertainty. Good players generally have multiple options -- and we aren't as attractive of a destination right now as we used to be.

That said, we did land some quality players [George and Kings in particular]. Hope it's enough.

Exactly. To me, success ( which equals a tourney team) likely looks something like this

Kyle -8/8/2 production and leads the way for a much improved interior defense
Donnie- 17/9 First round talent shows up and is the clear alpha
Kingz- 14/5 - Continues on the trajectory he’s been on with chip on his shoulder and is a third team all ACC type of player
JJ- 13/4 - Improves his defense and uses his ability as a driver to be that third guy who steps up as a senior in big moments when needed
George - 10/7- in year 3 he feasts on having more options and grows into a consistent shooter and a top PG in the ACC

Kiyan- unphased and adds a smooth 5-7 ppg with consistent production and some big games when needed
White- provides an explosive 4-6 ppg and 3-4 rpg guy being a spark plug as an above the rim guy and defender and shows flashes he can turn into a star in year 2
Fennell- does his job as a big backup G giving a line around 4/3/3
Souare- numbers won’t stand out but gives 2/3 and a block and serves as a solid backup 5 man when needed.
Womack- anything he gives us id say is unexpected bonus at this juncture unless he steps in and outplays some of the other guys to force his way into the mix.

Bristow ? - if we add another piece then that would reduce the burden on the freshmen.

 

[Hopkins16]

Do we need to rely on insiders for anything on Kiyan? He’s played on national television a bunch for us to use our own eyes. He should be able to Play 10-15 mpg next year based on what I’ve seen.

That said Jerry Deng likely made a good decision for himself to go to NC State. They don’t have Donnie Freeman at his position. We do. He will start there. He wouldn’t here.

Deng made a good decision to go where he has a high probability of starting. The truth is, he should not be starting on any good team and I don’t wish bad for anyone, but I don’t see him being an effective player if he gets starter minutes. He’s a nice bench piece, but players of his caliber believe otherwise and that is why they transfer so often. We can look at our many transfers over the past 5 years as proof of that and see the dismal results.

 

[Niastri]

Exactly. To me, success ( which equals a tourney team) likely looks something like this

Kyle -8/8/2 production and leads the way for a much improved interior defense
Donnie- 17/9 First round talent shows up and is the clear alpha
Kingz- 14/5 - Continues on the trajectory he’s been on with chip on his shoulder and is a third team all ACC type of player
JJ- 13/4 - Improves his defense and uses his ability as a driver to be that third guy who steps up as a senior in big moments when needed
George - 10/7- in year 3 he feasts on having more options and grows into a consistent shooter and a top PG in the ACC

Kiyan- unphased and adds a smooth 5-7 ppg with consistent production and some big games when needed
White- provides an explosive 4-6 ppg and 3-4 rpg guy being a spark plug as an above the rim guy and defender and shows flashes he can turn into a star in year 2
Fennell- does his job as a big backup G giving a line around 4/3/3
Souare- numbers won’t stand out but gives 2/3 and a block and serves as a solid backup 5 man when needed.
Womack- anything he gives us id say is unexpected bonus at this juncture unless he steps in and outplays some of the other guys to force his way into the mix.

Bristow ? - if we add another piece then that would reduce the burden on the freshmen.

I agree with most of what you said, but I think your estimate on George is way low. He averaged 12.3 ppg and 6.5 apg in a team that was offensively challenged last season. I think he’s going to increase both those numbers this season. 14 per game on similar shots seems more reasonable of an estimate to me.

 

[Sherman20]

Exactly. To me, success ( which equals a tourney team) likely looks something like this

Kyle -8/8/2 production and leads the way for a much improved interior defense
Donnie- 17/9 First round talent shows up and is the clear alpha
Kingz- 14/5 - Continues on the trajectory he’s been on with chip on his shoulder and is a third team all ACC type of player
JJ- 13/4 - Improves his defense and uses his ability as a driver to be that third guy who steps up as a senior in big moments when needed
George - 10/7- in year 3 he feasts on having more options and grows into a consistent shooter and a top PG in the ACC

Kiyan- unphased and adds a smooth 5-7 ppg with consistent production and some big games when needed
White- provides an explosive 4-6 ppg and 3-4 rpg guy being a spark plug as an above the rim guy and defender and shows flashes he can turn into a star in year 2
Fennell- does his job as a big backup G giving a line around 4/3/3
Souare- numbers won’t stand out but gives 2/3 and a block and serves as a solid backup 5 man when needed.
Womack- anything he gives us id say is unexpected bonus at this juncture unless he steps in and outplays some of the other guys to force his way into the mix.

Bristow ? - if we add another piece then that would reduce the burden on the freshmen.

JJ is going to be the team’s leading scorer unless Donnie explodes. I like Kingz but JJ is the most athletic and the fastest guy on the team and is gonna be a more efficient scorer and shooter with better pieces around him along with a legit PG. I do worry a lot about his defense. But maybe the rising tide of better players and better defenders lifts all boats.

 

[Cusefan0307]

JJ is going to be the team’s leading scorer unless Donnie explodes. I like Kingz but JJ is the most athletic and the fastest guy on the team and is gonna be a more efficient scorer and shooter with better pieces around him along with a legit PG. I do worry a lot about his defense. But maybe the rising tide of better players and better defenders lifts all

Here we go again.

 

[Sherman20]

Regarding the bolded statement, I think your concern is already handled. The top 7, at this moment, appears to be (in my internal order of importance) Freeman, George, Starling, Kingz, Kyle, White and Souare. Anthony and Fennell are the 8-9th players. Womack and Zephir are 10-11th. That top7 group is talented and experienced. 3 seniors, a junior and a sophomore. White and Souare are bouncy and White is very athletic. White is a top30 recruit, and Souare played 510 minutes on an ACC team last year.

Additionally, it is looking increasingly like Anthony is a very good player, who we’re going to want to see get minutes on a regular basis.

I would love another big to compete with Souare for minutes, and the recent misses on transfers Deng and Valencia still remains to be resolved. They will almost certainly try to find another tall, long armed athlete to be big man depth. We just don’t know where they are looking. Souare and Kyle scare me a little as our center duo.

We aren’t currently counting on Anthony or Fennell to be much more than limited minutes players. Fennell and Zephir are competing to be George’s backup, but Starling played a lot of point last year, and George played 36 minutes. One of the three backups to George at point just has to not hurt us.

We are loaded at wing and forward, with Freeman, Starling, Kingz, Anthony and White all options at the 2-4. Womack and Fennell are depth here. I see Freeman, Starling, and Kingz all getting big minutes 2-4, leaving spot minutes for everybody else to share.

I think White is gonna struggle to adjust, tbh. He’s a freak athlete but even Jerami Grant only averaged 4ppg and 3 rebounds as a freshman.

 

[McCuse]

Let

I think White is gonna struggle to adjust, tbh. He’s a freak athlete but even Jerami Grant only averaged 4ppg and 3 rebounds as a freshman.

Let's hope he's more like DC.

 

[Sherman20]

Here we go again.

What are you implying? I’m not necessarily advocating that. But I don’t see how it won’t happen. You really think JJ is gonna be the team’s third leading scorer? Yes he’ll probably average less, but 13 ppg after averaging 18ppg?

 

[Cusefan0307]

What are you implying? I’m not necessarily advocating that. But I don’t see how it won’t happen. You really think JJ is gonna be the team’s third leading scorer? Yes he’ll probably average less, but 13 ppg after averaging 18ppg?

He took 16 shots a game and shot 33% after February 1st. I hope that gets down to 11 or 12. I think if JJ is the leading scorer again Red is likely looking for a new job. Freeman can and should make a big jump. 18 and 10 would be nice.

 

[cuseincincy]

I still think we get at least one more. My preference would be a stretch 4 that can shoot. Another SF would also help. I feel like all of the guys that play the 3 this year, other than Womack, are actually tall 2 guards. Of course I can see Freeman and White playing together quite a bit also so that may answer that.

 

[2B20Again]

I agree, but I also understand that we can’t give Deng $1 million or more, hypothetically, if we’re only giving JJ and Kingz like $1 million or less, hypothetically. I just don’t know if the numbers add up. It seems like we should have a good amount of money leftover.

Posit that we have $10 million total for the roster between NIL and direct spending from the university (from the House settlement). That seems like what many knowledgeable people on here have been saying. These are some of the player costs I’ve seen thrown around here and online. Do people think they’re accurate?
Nait George = $2 million
Donnie = $1.5 million
JJ, Kingz and Kyle = $750K each? = $2.25 million
Souraye = $250K
Four Freshman = $1.5 million total? (Probably too high)
That’s like $7.5 million.

So shouldn’t we have like $2-2.5 million left? That’s a lot of dough. Shouldn’t we be able to pay for Deng or another stretch 4 and another center?

Im pretty sure the number is south of 8 million. However I have no idea how it’s divided.

 

[im4cuse]

Will Wade working.

Talking Transfers: What about the front court?

The guards look decent so far, let’s work on the bigs

www.backingthepack.com

 

[IthacaMatt]

Kingz is gonna be the 3. Deng would definitely be first forward sub.

Donnie's going to play some 3, too; whenever Donnie and Saddiq are on the court together. Neither one of those guys is a center, except against low level teams. We're still going to have to play Kyle or Soare when those 2 are out there together. That means you move Kingz to the 2 for more shooting, and JJ to the bench.

 

[Sherman20]

Will Wade working.

Talking Transfers: What about the front court?

The guards look decent so far, let’s work on the bigs

www.backingthepack.com

Yeah look at the amount of guard depth NC State has already. I’m sad to see Q on their team. I had such high hopes for him here.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Yeah look at the amount of guard depth NC State has already. I’m sad to see Q on their team. I had such high hopes for him here.

And yet they have the 9th best class in the conference with Will Wade according to 2 4 7.. Ours is 4th We would be upset if we had their haul.

 

[CuseSaint26]

And yet they have the 9th best class in the conference with Will Wade according to 2 4 7.. Ours is 4th We would be upset if we had their haul.

Decent guard depth, not a great roster and certainly not much “star potential”. They’ve been linked to some guys that are available and if able to land, that would be a different story but right now, our portal haul is head and shoulders above NC State’s

 

[RedtheGOB]

And yet they have the 9th best class in the conference with Will Wade according to 2 4 7.. Ours is 4th We would be upset if we had their haul.

Yea as I said above. I can't tell if they are just taking lots of names and making headlines or actually doing something.

Also Upset gets the understatement of the year award. People would be after Autry's head every day that went by if we lost Freeman or didn't pickup George or Kingz early on or didn't cut ties with all the rest.

At best people seem to be apprehensive about at the 5 and maybe JJ's minutes and maybe a little with the depth, obviously the coaching.

That seems reasonable but also compared to the last 2 years where we were severally lacking at 3 positions on the court at most times it's really a huge upgrade this offseason.

 

[Cappy3]

Donnie's going to play some 3, too; whenever Donnie and Saddiq are on the court together. Neither one of those guys is a center, except against low level teams. We're still going to have to play Kyle or Soare when those 2 are out there together. That means you move Kingz to the 2 for more shooting, and JJ to the bench.

Not as sold on White as you are. Watched the Jordan and wasn’t impressed. great athlete with virtually no offensive game, and only got one rebound. Having him and Kyle together would severely limit our offense imo.