Class of 2022 PF Maliq Brown (VA) COMMITTED/SIGNED TO SYRACUSE

[OrangeDW]

When did I say Benny is a guaranteed starter? We now have 2 years worth of evidence that woody is not a power-5 starter and may not be good enough to be a significant role player. If benny has a similarly terrible year next year then the comparisons will be exactly the same.

Benny is obviously a guaranteed starter. And he did less than Woody.

That’s where we’re at.

Somebody has to start.

Let’s hope this next crop of freshmen forwards improves over the course of their career, and doesn’t get thrown in the bushes by Christmas of their freshmen year.

 

[RF2044]

Or the thing that binds Woody and Kadary is a disposition that is at odds with doing the things consistently that get you on JB's a list. That same disposition is possibly at odds with their new coaches.

Once again, the idea that these perfectly good players left because JB was mean to them is not the only narrative - not even the most likely.

What JB has been 100% consistent on is his players meeting a certain threshold of effort/skill - and this is basically how most good coaches coach. You can't abide a player not maxing out their effort, esp in practice.

And to loop back around - the thing that will separate the 6 news players from seeing the floor or not - will be those same things.

The tie that binds all these players is that they are FRESHMEN. The most likely "narrative" is that not all frosh come in ready, with fully formulated skill sets, and with varying levels of readiness for the rigorous demand of what it takes to play high major collegiate basketball. And that often includes understanding how hard you have to work at the P5 level, on and off the court. That this occurs when some of these players are also acclimating to doing college scholastic work makes for a more difficult transition for some than others.

Additionally, how players perform as frosh is generally not the best indicator for how they might develop, or what they are capable of producing. Some guys come in ready -- like CJ Fair -- and don't make mistakes, which earns JB's trust. Some come in as blue chip recruits -- like Wallace, Owens, Coleman -- and produce like starters from the jump. And some come in not ready -- like Kris Joseph or Jesse Edwards -- but have the talent to develop into quality starters and do so once they get acclimated and adjust to the different level of play.

And some -- like MCW and Kadary -- come in show flashes, and get relegated to the bench anyway in favor of guys JB prefers to roll with. I'm not going out on a limb when I suggest that he has never used a big bench, outside of a small handful of years where the team had lots and lots of players who were good [and really, I can think of only two -- 2000, when we went about 8.5 deep, and 2012, when we could legitimately go 9.5 deep and did most games].

I'm a lot less sold on Woody than Kadary, but I do think that if Woody had stayed he would have remediated multiple problems plaguing last year's team -- primarily, athleticism, depth, and non-existent bench scoring.

 

[Melancer46]

Great breakdown! Have you done this with the other incoming Freshmen? I would love to hear your take on the rest of them.

Yes I have. I've posted write-ups in each of the recruit's individual threads and you can sorta find a summary here: The view from here

As I mentioned in the linked post, I hadn't seen Brown play outside of highlights when I wrote his part so that's out of date. My thoughts on Carey were not included yet either, but to summarize my thoughts on Carey:

He's a promising developmental PF/C IMO. Just based on his physical build, I think he may be best suited to being a tall PF as I just don't think he's going to fill out a ton. But if he does bulk up, he might be able to pitch in at C here and there. He's very athletic; just loves to run and jump. Didn't really show much skill outside of being an athlete and being coordinated, but that's a good jumping off point and if things go well, he could give us a vertical element to our offense that we haven't had in awhile.

 

[RF2044]

Oh yeah you’re right, busts NEVER happen! He did enough to be a bench player at best, which is exactly what he is doing at OK state.

Sometimes they do.

But one year isn't a full career -- that's just the beginning chapter. And again, he was probably a better fit here with his versatility than he is at Oklahoma State. Last year was not good -- if he barely plays again this year, I'll happily concede. But his story is still being written.

 

[Bayside44]

Watched this game and the one against Team Final (starring Emoni Bates, Jalen Duren, and Dereck Lively (#1 recruit this year, headed to Duke).

Very different box scores from Maliq in the two games and very different team results. I have no idea what the final score was against Team Final, but Maliq's team clearly got their doors blown off (not exactly surprising given the difference in talent levels between the two teams). Maliq unofficially finished that one with 10 points, 2 rebounds, and a block. All 10 points were dunks or standing layups at the rim.

The other game, against Fork Union, Maliq was drifting for most of the game and then all hell broke loose towards the end as Fork Union couldn't handle a press to save their lives and Maliq imposed his will. He unofficially finished with:

• 29 points on 11/16 2 pointers (all dunks/layups) and 7/12 FT shooting for a TS% of 68.1%.
• 9 rebounds
• 2 assists to 2 turnovers
• 2 blocks and 1 steal

I'm going to give the other games a viewing as well, but personally, my expectations with him are very low. I can't really stress enough how poor the level of competition is. They'd struggle against even the bad high school teams I'm used to watching. And I just don't see Maliq's game translating against ACC caliber opponents (and honestly, pretty skeptical he can hack it at a mid-major level either).

The good with him is he's unselfish offensively. The ball doesn't stick to his hands; he either goes up with it/makes his move quickly or he keeps the ball moving elsewhere. His passing is also legitimately good; he made some nice pocket passes inside and one or two nice long passes to find cutters.

Outside of that, there isn't much positive that I can really say. He can run fine when he wants to, but he's not an explosive athlete. He regularly goes up for dunks and struggles to reach the rim. The lack of elevation shows defensively as well. He's able to pick up some helpside blocks where the offensive player just has no idea he's there or he gets to it before they get the ball up high, but he just doesn't get up well.

His highlights kinda sell him as a guy that plays like a dog and is always on the floor, making high effort plays and what not; his film is littered with lazy reach ins, getting blown by defensively, not boxing out/not trying to crash the glass, etc. There are flashes of him diving on the floor and stuff, but I wouldn't it's a regular thing with him.

I don't really think his scoring will translate in college; it's mostly a product of him being bigger than everyone else (though he did have a couple nice drives towards the end of the Fork Union game) and he looks like a poor free throw shooter to me.

All in all, I'm hoping I'll warm up to him more with the other couple games I've found, but to this point, he seems like a project player that doesn't have the athleticism to make the development time worthwhile. Maybe he just needs better trainers to unlock some additional athleticism; he doesn't look undeveloped physically so it's kinda confusing to me how little explosion he shows.

Peter Carey is a much more promising project to me. But you never know. I've certainly been wrong about recruits before. I just don't really see what makes Maliq attractive to us.

I saw him against Bishop McNamara, and agree. He's toolsy, but not explosive and had bad habits he could get away with against lesser comp but not against a top tier WCAC team.

 

[Cuse181]

We’ve got Benny….who was worse than Woody, and a bunch of freshmen.

This is what we’re rolling with?

Woody at least had a few good games here, early. He looked good early on. Wish we had him. Don’t care what’s happening at Ok. St. We’ve literally got zero proven production at forward. Why wouldn’t we want a Junior forward who was a decent recruit and who looked pretty good here when he got the chance?

Im not sure what you’re arguing about here… woody wasn’t good enough and that’s why he isn’t here. That has nothing to do with whether or not benny is good enough. They are two completely different situations and one player is a year older who found himself struggling on another team. Not to mention it was never an either-or situation, woody could easily have done even worse this year and seen even less playing time than Benny had he stayed.


Benny is obviously a guaranteed starter. And he did less than Woody.

That’s where we’re at.

Somebody has to start.

Let’s hope this next crop of freshmen forwards improves over the course of their career, and doesn’t get thrown in the bushes by Christmas of their freshmen year.

As for the team next year, not only is there still an open scholarship on the roster, but you have no clue how good the freshman will be nor how good Benny will. Once again, we have 2 years of woody to look at in 2 different systems with zero difference. The very least you could do is give Benny the same credence you’re giving woody.

Also, I’m not even sure why this is a discussion, where was this fierce defense of him last year? I didn’t see any of it.

 

[longtimefan]

I saw him against Bishop McNamara, and agree. He's toolsy, but not explosive and had bad habits he could get away with against lesser comp but not against a top tier WCAC team.

If so, then the question is "Can he be coached up"?.

Which is the question for many recruits, of course.

 

[0.2 YNdeeR]

MB looks good. Can't help but notice his teammate (#5 in white). Has size and a nice outside shot. Tyler Nickel? Just looked him up and, off course ... committed to UNC. #($(*@(*@

 

[OrangeDW]

Im not sure what you’re arguing about here… woody wasn’t good enough and that’s why he isn’t here. That has nothing to do with whether or not benny is good enough. They are two completely different situations and one player is a year older who found himself struggling on another team. Not to mention it was never an either-or situation, woody could easily have done even worse this year and seen even less playing time than Benny had he stayed.


Benny is obviously a guaranteed starter. And he did less than Woody.


As for the team next year, not only is there still an open scholarship on the roster that, but you have no clue how good the freshman will be nor how good Benny will. Once again, we have 2 years of woody to look at in 2 different systems with zero difference. The very least you could do is give Benny the same credence you’re giving woody.

Also, I’m not even sure why this is a discussion, where was this fierce defense of him last year? I didn’t see any of it.

I’m glad we still have Benny.

You seem salty about Woody. “Not good enough and that’s why he’s not here”….lol. He left because he wanted to. Not like he ended up at Binghamton or something either.

 

[Melancer46]

I saw him against Bishop McNamara, and agree. He's toolsy, but not explosive and had bad habits he could get away with against lesser comp but not against a top tier WCAC team.

Yeah, the game against Emoni Bates and Duren was just eye-opening to me. First, because there's just such a drastic difference between the talent you see from Bates, Duren, and Lively vs. Team Loaded (which, I get it, the latter two are very promising NBA prospects and Bates was once viewed as such). But second, I thought getting a chance to go up against quite literally the best recruits in the country, you'd see a guy like Maliq hustling around, showing pride in his game, and just kinda going at these guys to prove himself. The only guys on Maliq's team that seemed to care about trying to rise to the occasion were #10 (Jayden Epps, 4 star recruit headed to Illinois) and #5 (Tyler Nickel, 4 star recruit headed to UNC). Epps was legitimately good while Nickel really struggled, but those two were at least trying to prove themselves out there. Duren and Lively were out to embarrass this team and Maliq just let them without showing much fight.

 

[Cuse181]

I’m glad we still have Benny.

You seem salty about Woody. “Not good enough and that’s why he’s not here”….lol. He left because he wanted to. Not like he ended up at Binghamton or something either.

Theorizing about someone else’s feelings in a discussion is a tool used to deflect attention away from a failing argument. My feelings on the transfer (positive or negative) does not have any impact on this discussion because at the end of the day he left to do what he thought was best for him. That being said, his feelings on what’s best for him has little to do with whether or not he has improved/would’ve contributed here.

 

[OrangeDW]

Theorizing about someone else’s feelings in a discussion is a tool used to deflect attention away from a failing argument. My feelings on the transfer (positive or negative) does not have any impact on this discussion because at the end of the day he left to do what he thought was best for him. That being said, his feelings on what’s best for him has little to do with whether or not he has improved/would’ve contributed here.

Cool. Stick to stats then. Woody played well here as a freshman when he got the chance.

 

[dasher]

An alternate way to think about it is: perhaps if we did a better job retaining guys we bring in and developing them over time, we wouldn't be in a situation where we currently have no alternatives to relying on lower rated incoming recruits to potentially start.

Would be nice to plug in a third-year guy who would be much more of a proven commodity at this point, than having to cross our fingers that Bunch / Taylor can nail it down as true frosh.

I would rather bring in better guys right from the jump. In every walk of life, the one that got a way was the gem. Except, they rarely are. And this is a perfect example of that. Now, the board has resorted to blaming his second coach after blaming his first coach. Maybe, he just isn't very good.

 

[RF2044]

I would rather bring in better guys right from the jump. In every walk of life, the one that got a way was the gem. Except, they rarely are. And this is a perfect example of that. Now, the board has resorted to blaming his second coach after blaming his first coach. Maybe, he just isn't very good.

I'm not "resorting" to anything -- I just recognize that sometimes players get better over time. And I liked the tools that Woody showed during the preseason portion of his freshman year. And I think that him getting benched / not being granted PT from that point forward was a bad choice.

Recruiting better guys is what should happen every year at a high major program. Bring in the best players you can, try to recruit "over" the incumbents, and let the chips fall where they may. The problem is, that's not what we're doing.

 

[Cuse181]

Cool. Stick to stats then. Woody played well here as a freshman when he got the chance.

And he stopped getting the chance here and stopped getting the chance at OK state. I’m sure that’s just a coincidence.

 

[OrangeDW]

And he stopped getting the chance here and stopped getting the chance at OK state. I’m sure that’s just a coincidence.

He got COVID, and then had like 17 forwards(who all transferred) to battle for PT.

He played good here. Stick to the stats.

 

[Cuse181]

He got COVID, and then had like 17 forwards(who all transferred) to battle for PT.

He played here. Stick to the stats.

Fixed it for you

 

[Orangezoo]

Watched this game and the one against Team Final (starring Emoni Bates, Jalen Duren, and Dereck Lively (#1 recruit this year, headed to Duke).

Very different box scores from Maliq in the two games and very different team results. I have no idea what the final score was against Team Final, but Maliq's team clearly got their doors blown off (not exactly surprising given the difference in talent levels between the two teams). Maliq unofficially finished that one with 10 points, 2 rebounds, and a block. All 10 points were dunks or standing layups at the rim.

The other game, against Fork Union, Maliq was drifting for most of the game and then all hell broke loose towards the end as Fork Union couldn't handle a press to save their lives and Maliq imposed his will. He unofficially finished with:

• 29 points on 11/16 2 pointers (all dunks/layups) and 7/12 FT shooting for a TS% of 68.1%.
• 9 rebounds
• 2 assists to 2 turnovers
• 2 blocks and 1 steal

I'm going to give the other games a viewing as well, but personally, my expectations with him are very low. I can't really stress enough how poor the level of competition is. They'd struggle against even the bad high school teams I'm used to watching. And I just don't see Maliq's game translating against ACC caliber opponents (and honestly, pretty skeptical he can hack it at a mid-major level either).

The good with him is he's unselfish offensively. The ball doesn't stick to his hands; he either goes up with it/makes his move quickly or he keeps the ball moving elsewhere. His passing is also legitimately good; he made some nice pocket passes inside and one or two nice long passes to find cutters.

Outside of that, there isn't much positive that I can really say. He can run fine when he wants to, but he's not an explosive athlete. He regularly goes up for dunks and struggles to reach the rim. The lack of elevation shows defensively as well. He's able to pick up some helpside blocks where the offensive player just has no idea he's there or he gets to it before they get the ball up high, but he just doesn't get up well.

His highlights kinda sell him as a guy that plays like a dog and is always on the floor, making high effort plays and what not; his film is littered with lazy reach ins, getting blown by defensively, not boxing out/not trying to crash the glass, etc. There are flashes of him diving on the floor and stuff, but I wouldn't it's a regular thing with him.

I don't really think his scoring will translate in college; it's mostly a product of him being bigger than everyone else (though he did have a couple nice drives towards the end of the Fork Union game) and he looks like a poor free throw shooter to me.

All in all, I'm hoping I'll warm up to him more with the other couple games I've found, but to this point, he seems like a project player that doesn't have the athleticism to make the development time worthwhile. Maybe he just needs better trainers to unlock some additional athleticism; he doesn't look undeveloped physically so it's kinda confusing to me how little explosion he shows.

Peter Carey is a much more promising project to me. But you never know. I've certainly been wrong about recruits before. I just don't really see what makes Maliq attractive to us.

Curious what you find in the other games. This is lining up with what Bayside noted in terms of seeing him vs weak and strong comp.

 

[OrangeDW]

Fixed it for you

46% from the field. 39% from 3.

17 pts. and 9 Reb. per 40 minutes.

PER of 18.7 - tied for 3rd highest on the team(with Buddy).

The numbers are the numbers. I’m sorry they don’t align with your feelings.

 

[007]

Watched this game and the one against Team Final (starring Emoni Bates, Jalen Duren, and Dereck Lively (#1 recruit this year, headed to Duke).

Very different box scores from Maliq in the two games and very different team results. I have no idea what the final score was against Team Final, but Maliq's team clearly got their doors blown off (not exactly surprising given the difference in talent levels between the two teams). Maliq unofficially finished that one with 10 points, 2 rebounds, and a block. All 10 points were dunks or standing layups at the rim.

The other game, against Fork Union, Maliq was drifting for most of the game and then all hell broke loose towards the end as Fork Union couldn't handle a press to save their lives and Maliq imposed his will. He unofficially finished with:

• 29 points on 11/16 2 pointers (all dunks/layups) and 7/12 FT shooting for a TS% of 68.1%.
• 9 rebounds
• 2 assists to 2 turnovers
• 2 blocks and 1 steal

I'm going to give the other games a viewing as well, but personally, my expectations with him are very low. I can't really stress enough how poor the level of competition is. They'd struggle against even the bad high school teams I'm used to watching. And I just don't see Maliq's game translating against ACC caliber opponents (and honestly, pretty skeptical he can hack it at a mid-major level either).

The good with him is he's unselfish offensively. The ball doesn't stick to his hands; he either goes up with it/makes his move quickly or he keeps the ball moving elsewhere. His passing is also legitimately good; he made some nice pocket passes inside and one or two nice long passes to find cutters.

Outside of that, there isn't much positive that I can really say. He can run fine when he wants to, but he's not an explosive athlete. He regularly goes up for dunks and struggles to reach the rim. The lack of elevation shows defensively as well. He's able to pick up some helpside blocks where the offensive player just has no idea he's there or he gets to it before they get the ball up high, but he just doesn't get up well.

His highlights kinda sell him as a guy that plays like a dog and is always on the floor, making high effort plays and what not; his film is littered with lazy reach ins, getting blown by defensively, not boxing out/not trying to crash the glass, etc. There are flashes of him diving on the floor and stuff, but I wouldn't it's a regular thing with him.

I don't really think his scoring will translate in college; it's mostly a product of him being bigger than everyone else (though he did have a couple nice drives towards the end of the Fork Union game) and he looks like a poor free throw shooter to me.

All in all, I'm hoping I'll warm up to him more with the other couple games I've found, but to this point, he seems like a project player that doesn't have the athleticism to make the development time worthwhile. Maybe he just needs better trainers to unlock some additional athleticism; he doesn't look undeveloped physically so it's kinda confusing to me how little explosion he shows.

Peter Carey is a much more promising project to me. But you never know. I've certainly been wrong about recruits before. I just don't really see what makes Maliq attractive to us.

Thank you for taking the time to do these extensive write ups, Melancer. Although I am reluctant to admit it, I have many of the same concerns about how ready MB will be to perform at this level. His lack of explosiveness, to me anyway, seems to stick out. On the other hand, I think he has exceptional court awareness and feel for the game. It will be interesting to see how that plays out once he gets here.

 

[Jake]

I think there is great benefit to familiarity, repetition and good fit. Woody would no doubt be in a better place had he stayed than transferred. Same for Brycen and some others who have left.

 

[Orangezoo]

I would rather bring in better guys right from the jump. In every walk of life, the one that got a way was the gem. Except, they rarely are. And this is a perfect example of that. Now, the board has resorted to blaming his second coach after blaming his first coach. Maybe, he just isn't very good.

very possible dash. I wasn't blaming Mike B just what I saw watching them didn't look like a program being run by a guy who is going to do much more than our current aging coach.

Maybe we find out what he is all about this year. Woody was definitely a a guy who looked years away his Jr year and then had promise his final year. Then he showed up early games, covid happened and he disappeared then left. Then doesn't get much run at Okie St so maybe him being a guy that needed 3 yrs was right all along. Don't know.

 

[dasher]

I'm not "resorting" to anything -- I just recognize that sometimes players get better over time. And I liked the tools that Woody showed during the preseason portion of his freshman year. And I think that him getting benched / not being granted PT from that point forward was a bad choice.

Recruiting better guys is what should happen every year at a high major program. Bring in the best players you can, try to recruit "over" the incumbents, and let the chips fall where they may. The problem is, that's not what we're doing.

I don't disagree with that last paragraph at all. As a matter of fact, we don't even wait for them to get here before we decide not to recruit over them. As I have said, I have no problem not bringing in a frosh forward or even a soph but a sr portal forward would make all the sense in the world. yet, we aren't doing it.

 

[Cuse181]

46% from the field. 39% from 3.

17 pts. and 9 Reb. per 40 minutes.

PER of 18.7 - tied for 3rd highest on the team(with Buddy).

The numbers are the numbers. I’m sorry they don’t align with your feelings.

He scored 38 points the entire year and 18 came against Ryder and Niagara.

as for how your method of looking at stats is completely outlandish, guess who these players are:

50% from the field, 33% from 3, 20 points, 3 rebounds and 6 assists per 40 minutes.

33.3% from the field 100% from 3, 24 points, 8 rebounds per 40 minutes

65% from the field, 10 points, 9 rebounds, 3 blocks and 3 assists per 40 minutes
PER 19.5

50% from the field, 13% from 3, 14 points, 11 rebounds, 1.6 blocks per 40 minutes
PER 16.2

 

[rrlbees]

He scored 38 points the entire year and 18 came against Ryder and Niagara.

as for how your method of looking at stats is completely outlandish, guess who these players are:

50% from the field, 33% from 3, 20 points, 3 rebounds and 6 assists per 40 minutes.

33.3% from the field 100% from 3, 24 points, 8 rebounds per 40 minutes

65% from the field, 10 points, 9 rebounds, 3 blocks and 3 assists per 40 minutes
PER 19.5

50% from the field, 13% from 3, 14 points, 11 rebounds, 1.6 blocks per 40 minutes
PER 16.2

That’s what happens when you use stats for a player without a lot of minutes, many against subs. Heck, going to an extreme, if you look at SUs advanced metrics and per 40 stats, Chris Lavalle was our best player.