Really don't see us being better next year

[Henny & Coke]

Yes, Rak has us spoiled.
We don't always need a maniac on offense (17 points from the center spot), but we need to get inside scoring from somewhere (last year, it was Grant, with Rak being a supplemental part on offense). Our zone needs a center who can stop the opponent's inside stuff (last year, that was Keita, in tandem with Rak). If you can't compete with teams like NC on the inside, you struggle.
Unless you can live on the perimeter with real good outside shooting from more than one guy. Can we?

I think it's pretty easy to forget that Chris McCullough scored in double-digits every single game for the first 8 games:

16 pts & 11 rebs vs Kennesaw - Double-double in 1st ever game.
13 pts & 4 rebs vs Hampton
12 pts & 6 rebs & 5 blocks & 3 steals! vs Cal
20 pts & 9 rebs vs Iowa - Both our leading scorer & rebounder in neutral site game vs decent comp & good win.
17 pts & 7 rebs vs Loyola
14 pts & 13 rebs vs Holy Cross - 2nd double-double in first 6 college games!
10 pts & 12 rebs vs Michigan - 3rd double-double in first 7 college games, and 2nd in a row!!
13 pts & 8 rebs vs St. Johns

Just take a look at that 8 game stretch...it's incredible, especially for a Freshman!

I'm not sure what happened to Chris' game in the 8 games after this, but I think it's causing many to overlook the important contributions he was making to the team early on. If nothing else, it shows the potential this kid is capable of.

 

[AlaskaSU]

Roberson and Joseph will both improve. IMO Roberson will blossom into a major player. He has made a lot of improvement in the last 10 games. He can be very good. Joseph should be better -- not great but better. He's a long term developmental project -- kind of like Scoop. Still have Cooney and G. The real big question is whether Coleman can play and be effective. He is the best option for a C that can do something offensively. If we don't get Bryant, and DC2 can't play, we will really be hurting at the center with just a freshman Diagne and CO. Center is the most difficult position in the zone to learn. No freshman has done well right away. The most talented, ready to play incoming freshman is Malachi Richardson. But he plays the same position as Cooney (SG) so he won't get a lot of minutes. IMO the other guys are not immediate impact players. They may develop after a year or two to be nice players but probably not next year.

Kaleb is kind of like Scoop?

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

I think it's pretty easy to forget that Chris McCullough scored in double-digits every single game for the first 8 games:

16 pts & 11 rebs vs Kennesaw - Double-double in 1st ever game.
13 pts & 4 rebs vs Hampton
12 pts & 6 rebs & 5 blocks & 3 steals! vs Cal
20 pts & 9 rebs vs Iowa - Both our leading scorer & rebounder in neutral site game vs decent comp & good win.
17 pts & 7 rebs vs Loyola
14 pts & 13 rebs vs Holy Cross - 2nd double-double in first 6 college games!
10 pts & 12 rebs vs Michigan - 3rd double-double in first 7 college games, and 2nd in a row!!
13 pts & 8 rebs vs St. Johns

Just take a look at that 8 game stretch...it's incredible, especially for a Freshman!

I'm not sure what happened to Chris' game in the 8 games after this, but I think it's causing many to overlook the important contributions he was making to the team early on. If nothing else, it shows the potential this kid is capable of.

I think he started reading his press clippings and stopped working.Unfortunately, when he did start working hard again, he got hurt. Next year he will be an absolute monster...count on it...

 

[TBCuse11]

pre-season top 15 next year.

 

[SoBristol]

I think it's pretty easy to forget that Chris McCullough scored in double-digits every single game for the first 8 games:
...

Just take a look at that 8 game stretch...it's incredible, especially for a Freshman!

I'm not sure what happened to Chris' game in the 8 games after this, but I think it's causing many to overlook the important contributions he was making to the team early on. If nothing else, it shows the potential this kid is capable of.

McCullough needs to come back 100% from the ACL injury and add some strength. He also needs to improve his shooting skills, footwork, and ability to finish. He started strong against (for the most part) smaller, over-matched opponents. When the real games started, against better defenders, he wasn't able to finish inside, his jump shot was not dependable, and free throw shooting was an adventure. It wasn't mental, or a frosh hitting a wall -- mostly about needing better skills to compete against a better caliber of players.

Potential? He is 6 ft 10 in with a huge upside -- few frosh in the country have more potential.

So what does next year's team need? Joseph needs to get stronger, and he will. He will surprise people. And we need Coleman or Diagne to provide inside depth and strength.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Next year reminds me of 2005-06, with a senior Cooney just chucking and chucking with impugnity a la Gerry, as it's often the best or only option.

We lose the best player on our team and there is no proven replacement who can offer a fraction of what we're losing.

We will have the same PG, who is extremely limited.

We haven't had a freshman who has been a "valuable" contributor and is not a PG since Donte, so it's hard to get overly excited that next year's frosh class AS FRESHMAN. By valuable, I don't mean nice, solid contributors like CJ or Jerami, I mean top 2-3 players on team, and that is what we will need with Rak gone. With the history of Rak, Melo, Coleman, McCullough as frosh, history suggests it will take time to acclimate.

I'd be surprised if McCullough hits his stride before mid-season, and Coleman is anybody's guess if he'll be able to stay on the court.

I've always been a major Cooney supporter, and I like the improvement by Roberson, but I think it's going to get worse next year before it gets better.

I hope we find a PG in the 2016 class who can step in like Flynn did when he pushed Wright aside. That would really allow the program to regain its stride.

What is happening with Joseph this year would of been the exact same thing that would of happened had MCW played his freshman year like a lot of people on this board wanted him to. Joseph is talented, he will be better next year. I'm bullish on next year. We will have as much returning talent as anyone, even losing Rak.

 

[andyw715]

As long as we can shoot we'll be ok.

 

[richard levy]

don't you know, we'll always be better next year

 

[RandygoCuse]

I think we will be better next year. Losing Rak will hurt, but we will have more depth. I expect G and Cooney to be strong, CM and Joseph to get better and we will get help from some of the freshmen. I'm optimistic about Coleman as well.

 

[OttoMets]

What is the parallel for Joseph's projected, and needed, improvement from 1 year to the next? I don't think there is one internally.

The last PGs we had that played significantly (i.e. started) and were at similar talent levels were Thues and Edwards. One left, the other was replaced by Autry. The other similar profile would possibly be Scoop, but he took a year hiatus which helped greatly. Perhaps this year would be similar to Lazarus if he was forced to run the show in 1995, but he wasn't.

I think Felix on Texas might be a good comparison to Kaleb. Came in expecting to back up Kabongo, and was clearly overwhelmed when forced to play big minutes early on. Two years later, he's a nice player, but not a game changer by any means.

Your original post isn't crazy, but I'm more bullish on Joseph than some.

Statistics aside, I think of him as a better version of Jason Hart this season and see him making a fairly dramatic improvement next summer.

My main concern is our lack of a center. Obokoh's slow. Coleman's never shown himself to be serviceable, and now he might be significantly worse than that. Could be a giant void in the middle of our defense.

 

[Trueblue25]

Roberson, G, Cooney, McCullough, Joseph, Richardson, Howard, Bryant/Coleman.

That's who we'll like see most next year, and that is damn promising. Hopefully BJ gains wait and finds his stride as well, we have a potentially great team.

Hoping Lydon could possibly redshirt to add some weight, though he's already reclassified. I don't see Buss ever contributing much more than he already has. Obokoh is a question mark.

 

[longislandcuse]

BJJ and Patterson are either gone or recruited over. That alone makes us better.

I'd like to run a backcourt of G and Cooney with Roberson/McCullough/Bryant or Diagne or Coleman at C. Defensively...lights out. I doubt that happens though as i'm sure Joseph will start at point.

 

[tbonezone]

We lose the best player on our team and there is no proven replacement who can offer a fraction of what we're losing...

 

[Madbiker]

Kaleb is kind of like Scoop?

Only in the way it took Scoop 3 years (counting his red shirt year) to develop into a PG who could make shots. I'm not comparing their games...just development time.

 

[MadNY3]

Respectfully, next year could be awesome.

 

[SoBristol]

Comment today by the PS writer: next year, when Joseph rotates out, G moves to the point, and JB can insert Richardson instead of Patterson. Nice way to add a second shooter.

 

[tbonezone]

Only in the way it took Scoop 3 years (counting his red shirt year) to develop into a PG who could make shots. I'm not comparing their games...just development time.

for some context jardine's SU page:
linkhttps://www.suathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=7748

not sure it helps your argument.

 

[moqui]

I understand why you feel that way, and I agree that many are putting too much belief in the freshman all coming in ready not only to play but to play at a very high level. But I don't think the 05-06 comparison holds up. Let's just look at the returning players

Sr. Cooney > Sr. McNamara (he's a better shooter & a better defender and with a true PG won't have to be a ball dominant chucker player like senior GMac
Sr. Gbinije = Jr. Nichols
Jr. Roberson > Jr. Roberts
So. McCullough > Jr. Watkins (at least on offense)
So. Joseph < Fr. Devendorf (with the exception that KJ brings true PG skills to the table, which the 06 team badly lacked)

the O6 bench was led by Louis McCroskey & Josh Wright, with other contributions by Matt Gorman and Arinze Onuaku & Andy Rautins, who where not yet the Arinze & Andy we grew to love

and that is where the freshman class will come in. The freshman don't have to arrive as all conference talents, they just have to give solid bench play. MR & FH don't have to clear a high bar to be better than Louie Mac & Josh W. And from the trio Diagne, Lydon & Obokoh we should be able to find a back up 4/5 combo that can produce more than the combined 2.3 ppg, 2.4 rpg we got from Matt & Arinze

 

[Jasoncuse]

How can anybody claim this team will be a FF contender or preseason top 10-15?!?

Losing Xmas will be extremely difficult to overcome. His offense alone will be tough to replaced, but hes also a good rebounder and above average defender inside. He's our best player and this isn't like replacing Fair. Rak has shown a unique skill set this year and is a rarity for this program - a great interior scorer.

How much better can Trevor and G be next year? Roberson and KJ can improve but I'm not expecting a huge jump. I don't think BJ or Buss will play much.

CMC and DC are coming off knee surgeries, so the range of outcomes for their play is all over the place. I'm not even sure DC is any good anyhow.

The recruiting class looks pretty good with the potential to be great but we have one top 25 type coming in. The other 3 are more long term players than immediate help. If Bryant comes, that'll help soften losing Xmas but it seems so many of you are basing any success next year on the frosh, and we know that's not a great way to succeed.

i am worried about low post scoring, interior defense and PG play. We should probably be deeper and will have more guard options, but who knows. I think if we are to make any kind of noise next year, it'll be after a slow start to the year.

 

[Jasoncuse]

Comment today by the PS writer: next year, when Joseph rotates out, G moves to the point, and JB can insert Richardson instead of Patterson. Nice way to add a second shooter.

3rd shooter right? That can help mask interior scoring problems, but that depends on Malachi being ready to play a good chunk of significant minutes right away.

 

[pearl31]

lol people seem to think next year's team will have to mirror what this year's is doing in terms of how we attack offensively... certainly it will be a different team next year, but simply because Rak leaves does not mean we lose that amount of points per game without matched (or even improved) scoring from elsewhere.
and to say guys like Kaleb and Roberson won't be better is just dumb

 

[Brooky03]

I'm at work, so I haven't read through this thread, but here's my take:

PG- Joesph will be much improved. If anything, the kid is an incredibly hard worker. He has talent; he was just thrust into a considerably larger role than anticipated. Howard probably won't get much run, so Joseph is going to be our guy and I have faith. If Howard is really far from being ready, Patterson is not a bad option at all as a backup.

SG- Cooney is currently a top 20 SG in college ball. Even if he doesn't improve, he'll be giving us everything we need. Richardson won't set the world on fire, but he's still an elite guard coming out of high school. I expect 10-15 minutes of really solid play off the bench from him, which we don't have at all right now.

I could split hairs between SF and PF, but there's no real difference. This is where our stregth will be, where we're weak this year. Gbinije will put up a lot more shots than he is currently, which is a good thing in my opinion. McCullough will be no worse than he was this season and we're already seeing how big the impact of not having him is. Roberson will be a monster as either a starter or a guy getting 20+ minutes off the bench. Diagne is the real deal and everything about his game screams college ready as long as he learns the defensive rotations.

C- This is obviously the weak spot. Coleman was more productive on a per minute basis than he gets credit for, but it's tough to rely on his knees to hold up. Obokoh can take up space, but I don't know if he'll do much else. The strength at this position really comes down to Thomas Bryant. If we land him, we're a top 10 team all season, no question.

 

[CuseitUp]

We go from 8 scholarship players to 12-13. That alone makes us a better team next year. .

True, but Boehiem will only play 7 of them anyways...

 

[reedny]

Comparisons to 05-06 are fun, but with this year's downward trajectory the thread question is more provocative: will we be competitive in the ACC next year without Rak's 18 ppg and 9 rpg?

I think the likely answer is "yes", if we get good answers to these 4 (pretty obvious) questions:

1- Will we be better at guard and SF? PG improves as KJ gets more experience and Frank Howard brings depth to the spot -- along with size and quickness on defense. SG improves b/c the starter (and leader of the team) returns with a better surrounding cast. And SF improves because we have 2 quality guys returning to their natural position - G and TR, both of whom can contribute in different ways. G can come off the bench and play either guard spot, or spell TR as a third shooter. In the later case, TC would slide over to the point (for KJ) and Richardson would come in and dazzle at SG. Pretty hard not to get excited about the prospect of having TC, Richardson and G on the perimeter. So I think we're in better shape at all three spots.

2- Does TB come in? If we get him, plan on great size and instant energy at the 5 spot. No he won't have Rak's polished panoply of post moves. But he does have offensive skills, along with tenacity and knowledge of the game. Francis and Tee will know more about his potential, but I'd put him in the CM category .. maybe even more game-ready. Realistically, he's probably a 6-8 ppg, 5 rb guy.

3- Does DC2 finally play to his potential? Most posters are forgetting how good he can be ... I don't think Kennedy Meeks is a silly comparison. He's got that kind of size and ability .. if he's physically ready. He had a long rehab.. the staff gave him lots of time. And all he's doing is lifting and reloading for his return to the court. If his body is ready, which it should be, I can see him being an effective scorer inside. Lots of variables here.. but even in a backup role, he could give us 6 ppg and 4-5 rbpg playing 15 minutes behind TB. If he's the starting center, CM can still slide over and, unlike this year, we won't become smaller and more vulnerable to teams with big front lines because Diagne can back up the 4. He has PF size and can score the ball. So .. will we be better at the post next year? No, but we'll be deeper and less vulnerable to fouls, and we'll get more scoring out of the PF position .. which is next.

4- Does CM come back? Huge hole at PF without him right now.. we miss his size, shot-blocking and offense. Next year -- if he doesn't enter the draft -- he'll start at PF with Diagne and Lydon backing up. That makes us deeper and better than this year. I like Diagne's game .. the kid can shoot it and moves very well. He should be able to contribute backing up PF .. allowing CM to slide over to the middle if we don't get TB or DC2 is not producing. So PF will be an upgrade from the present team ... deeper and better.

 

[pearl31]

Does CM come back? Huge hole at PF without him right now

Disagree. Roberson, especially in the few games, has been a revelation at the 4