Recruiting And ranking correlation and Bill Snyder is awesome

[Don]

I checked the 2009 Scout team recruiting rankings vs the top twenty teams this year. Its not a surprise to me that of the top twenty teams today only two had recruiting classes ranked below top 40 in 2009 and that is Kansas state and Oregon state. Stunning enough Kansas state class was ranked 112 in 2009(ten places behind SU).

I chose to look at 2009 because they would be true seniors or redshirt juniors and most likely the leaders of your team all things being equal.

If you want to see why say Syracuse is where they are and West Virginia is where is where they are look at Steadman Bailey, Tayvon Austin and Geno Smith in that class vs our best players from that class of Alec lemon(hurt part of year) , Justin Pugh(hurt part of year)and probably Zach Chibane.

I think that most of the time that recruiting rankings are a pretty good indicator of where you will be in the next few years. That is unless your Bill Synder and Chris Peterson. Snyder is a great coach who just finds guys that are ready to play his system.

There are also teams that work the other way and get great recruits then play mediocre football. I would bet though that if you have classes ranked in the top 40 consistently you will be ranked at times in the top twenty and most times will be ranked somewhere near where your recruiting classes are ranked about 80 percent of the time.

 

[SURules]

Bill Snyder is a very very good coach. He's rebuilt K-State twice now. He does use a good number of Jucos but gets the job done.

 

[wfschrec]

I checked the 2009 Scout team recruiting rankings vs the top twenty teams this year. Its not a surprise to me that of the top twenty teams today only two had recruiting classes ranked below top 40 in 2009 and that is Kansas state and Oregon state. Stunning enough Kansas state class was ranked 112 in 2009(ten places behind SU).

I chose to look at 2009 because they would be true seniors or redshirt juniors and most likely the leaders of your team all things being equal.

If you want to see why say Syracuse is where they are and West Virginia is where is where they are look at Steadman Bailey, Tayvon Austin and Geno Smith in that class vs our best players from that class of Alec lemon(hurt part of year) , Justin Pugh(hurt part of year)and probably Zach Chibane.

I think that most of the time that recruiting rankings are a pretty good indicator of where you will be in the next few years. That is unless your Bill Synder and Chris Peterson. Snyder is a great coach who just finds guys that are ready to play his system.

There are also teams that work the other way and get great recruits then play mediocre football. I would bet though that if you have classes ranked in the top 40 consistently you will be ranked at times in the top twenty and most times will be ranked somewhere near where your recruiting classes are ranked about 80 percent of the time.

2009 would be a bad sample from a Cuse perspective because of the transition to Marrone ... I would like to see how the teams go next season and go back to 2010.

 

[OrangePA]

Snyder is great coach who relies very heavily on Jucos.

I think I heard that he brought 17 or so in last year.

 

[xc84]

I checked the 2009 Scout team recruiting rankings vs the top twenty teams this year. Its not a surprise to me that of the top twenty teams today only two had recruiting classes ranked below top 40 in 2009 and that is Kansas state and Oregon state. Stunning enough Kansas state class was ranked 112 in 2009(ten places behind SU).

I chose to look at 2009 because they would be true seniors or redshirt juniors and most likely the leaders of your team all things being equal.

If you want to see why say Syracuse is where they are and West Virginia is where is where they are look at Steadman Bailey, Tayvon Austin and Geno Smith in that class vs our best players from that class of Alec lemon(hurt part of year) , Justin Pugh(hurt part of year)and probably Zach Chibane.

I think that most of the time that recruiting rankings are a pretty good indicator of where you will be in the next few years. That is unless your Bill Synder and Chris Peterson. Snyder is a great coach who just finds guys that are ready to play his system.

There are also teams that work the other way and get great recruits then play mediocre football. I would bet though that if you have classes ranked in the top 40 consistently you will be ranked at times in the top twenty and most times will be ranked somewhere near where your recruiting classes are ranked about 80 percent of the time.

2009 Marone barely had time to scrape together a class...but the guys he got are pretty damn good. You forgot about Brandon Sharpe, Phillip Thomas, Andrew Tiller (In NFL), and Shamarko Thomas. Remarkable really. And Cuse still kicked WV's ass last year and the year before.

Good teams get good players. Forget about rankings. Rankings are tail lights.

 

[bevosu]

Bringing in Jucos SU has to be more selective when it comes to academic standards than KS.

Kansas State can pick from a much wider assortment of Jucos than a lot of colleges can.

Snyder has proven that he's a very good coach. His Juco approach works well at Kansas State. He wouldn't be able to do what he does at a college with semi-tight academic standards.

Kansas State's 4 year graduation rate is in the 30-40% range. Syracuse is 70%.

 

[Don]

Oh Im not picking on Marrone's first class at all. Im saying and I think the number will prove this out, that for the most part if your recruiting classes are in the top 40 on a regular basis then i think there is a good chance you break into the top 20-25 on a regular basis I think the ranking and the correlations would prove that out, there are exceptions both ways no doubt. I only picked 2009 like I said because these players would most likely be the players who understand your systems and have grown with your program by now. as i said there are exceptions for instance Rutgers did well in 2009 recruiting and is doing well in the polls yet Pitt did well in 2009 recruiting and is not doing well. Yet I think overall the facts are there that you need to recruit well to rate well( I know obvious statement). All of Marrones classes since 2010 are in the 50's I think we start to become a solid team again. This years class will be smaller because his 2009 class was smaller.

There are other factors no doubt such as schedules and coaching stability and even your league the ratings system not being correct on players etc etc. but for the most part the teams that get the highest rated classes get the highest rankings and thus the better bowls and more money and exposure.

 

[dollarbill44]

It's an interesting stat, though not really surprising. Taking the top 40 to get 25 leaves a fair amount of room for error. Still, I would expect that there might be one or two more teams that were below 40. It would be interesting to see the correlation between top 20 recruiting and top 20 rankings and top 10 - top 10.

 

[billsin01]

I think that most of the time that recruiting rankings are a pretty good indicator of where you will be in the next few years. That is unless your Bill Synder and Chris Peterson. Snyder is a great coach who just finds guys that are ready to play his system.

I couldn't really disagree with this more. Recruiting rankings are fun for fans and, generally, you will get a good recruit if he has four or five stars. But to try and compare classes and suggest that there is any sort of predictive value or correlation beyond the obvious (good programs get ranked in the top 40 year in and year out) is basically absurd. A bunch of rag-tag freelance writers with basically no talent evaluation credentials using some sort of ambiguous ranking system to figure out who will be in the top 25? I'm not buying that. And that's not even taking into account all the things that they can't really predict (i.e. how hard a kid works, the system he's in, the coaching situation, injuries, off-field incidents ...).

In fact, you want a top 40 for this year right now? Take almost the entire SEC, the upper half of the big 10, big 12, pac 10 and acc, a couple good BE schools and Notre Dame. There you go.

 

[44cuse]

Wait...wait...wait...I thought recruiting rankings meant nothing?

44cuse

 

[retro44]

wasn't the 2009 recruiting class ron prince's

 

[SWC75]

We beat them 36-34 22 months ago. They seem to have made more progress than we have since then.

Hopefully we are about to have a breakthrough of our own.

 

[Upstate]

Not for nothing, but KSU has only committed 9 penalties this year (in 5 games). That's pretty incredible.

 

[wfschrec]

Not for nothing, but KSU has only committed 9 penalties this year (in 5 games). That's pretty incredible.

It must cost Snyder quite a bit for those officials ...

 

[BlueCurtain]

Wait...wait...wait...I thought recruiting rankings meant nothing?

44cuse

They only mean nothing when we're mediocre, apparently. Funny how we don't dismiss recruiting rankings on the basketball side.

The hardships of this world are a lot easier to accept when we stop trying to distort reality. And the reality is we'll be mediocre until we start recruiting more play-makers. Recruit more play-makers and those rankings will adjust accordingly.

 

[PhatOrange]

It helps that snyder has two premiere jucos located in Kansas and many players are 'placed' there.