Recruiting Picture for 2013

[bnoro]

Every article with big time prospects that seem to like us say that the recruit will decide at then end of their football season... So why is there concern? People aren't going to decide until later so we aren't going to take a B lister just to get a name listed on rivals.

 

[Symphony Steve]

Every article with big time prospects that seem to like us say that the recruit will decide at then end of their football season... So why is there concern? People aren't going to decide until later so we aren't going to take a B lister just to get a name listed on rivals.

I'd agree...except that a lot of players that like other schools have already committed to those schools. Some of them had interest in us as well. And not just the usual suspects, like Texas, State Penn, and Michigan. Our verbal commits at this point are, now let me see if I've got the number right, zero. Coming off classes ranked in the 50's at best. Not what I'd call improvement. But, you're right, it's early, and things can turn around in a hurry. Or not.

 

[javadoc]

Guys, help me out here, but I am not getting a warm and fuzzy picture that we are improving in this area, especially with it being DM's 4th recruiting year now.

The sky is falling!

Seriously, if you are that concerned, and you believe your concerns are valid, then all you can do is sit back and wait for Marrone to get canned.

 

[Symphony Steve]

The sky is falling!

Seriously, if you are that concerned, and you believe your concerns are valid, then all you can do is sit back and wait for Marrone to get canned.

OK. Might as well stop talking about it then. No point discussing the state of the program over here.

 

[DeepThrowIt]

One of the reasons for no commitments is the fact SU hasn't had their junior day yet. But I don't want to start that debate again...

The thing I'm concerned about is the fact that almost every article with kids who have been offered has some form of "I don't know much about Syracuse" in there. That is concerning..

 

[Cadillac]

 

[Cadillac]

I’m sorry. I had to get that exasperated GIF out of my system. I'm trying Ringo. I'm trying real hard to be the shepherd.

Remember June was a big month last year, so I will withhold even early judgment until then. But if DeepThrow is a touch concerned, I am too.

I personally don’t care about rankings at this point. I just want classes where 25 guys come in, 20 are on the two-deep as seniors, and 10-15 are on the field.

I know the sun’s out, but I think we still have to focus on squats and deadlifts and save the brocurls for later.

 

[javadoc]

OK. Might as well stop talking about it then. No point discussing the state of the program over here.

Admittedly there isn't a whole lot to discuss right now, IMO. There will be more once we see the team during the spring game, or if there is a development in which something actually happens (like a commit, an official announcement about facilities with plans, an announcement about the ACC, etc.).

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

The thing I'm concerned about is the fact that almost every article with kids who have been offered has some form of "I don't know much about Syracuse" in there. That is concerning..

Some of this has to do with the fact that Syracuse's recruiting base is much further away (Ohio, Michigan, Georgia) than it used to be.

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

One of the reasons for no commitments is the fact SU hasn't had their junior day yet. But I don't want to start that debate again...

The thing I'm concerned about is the fact that almost every article with kids who have been offered has some form of "I don't know much about Syracuse" in there. That is concerning..

This is a the biggest problem I see. We need to be on national television again. Do it anyway possible Friday nights, Yankee stadium who cares get on TV.

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

unless you think Perry Patterson was a 4 star recruit

I realize i am substantially parsing your post, but Perry Patterson was every bit a 4 star recruit (probably was a 3/4 star hoops player as well). He was Ashton Broyld-esque before the knee issues.

 

[PhatOrange]

OK. Might as well stop talking about it then. No point discussing the state of the program over here.

no commits by April 18, 2012 and you think thats dicussing the state of the program? sheesh signing day is February 2013.

 

[cusestudent]

This one is quite the crap shoot, and the sky seems to be falling for some...SU has never consistently gotten highly sought after, and the main reason for that is we are not a factory. We cannot do what the SEC, PAC 12, B1G, and Big 12 do. We simply do not have that sort of standing in college football and very few schools. Virginia Tech is the perfect example as to what SU needs to strive for, and I believe that is the path DM is taking on this. Offer some bigger name prospects and get your foot in the door with their school and their teammates that haven't blown up. Let those five stars and highly sought after four stars commit early, and take those big name schools out of the picture. I like the prospect of being in recruiting battles with Louisville, Vandy, Kentucky, USF, etc. on those supposedly high threes and low fours than waste a bunch of time and energy on the fours and fives that are getting 100 letters from Bama in a day, etc. The kids committing right now would never consider SU anyways, they are the ones that have been heavily recruited by the big boys since their freshman year, and already know where they want to play ball. The kids we target mainly commit in August and after the football season. Some people need to chill.

 

[billsin01]

2. I can only recall one year SU cracked the top 25 in recruiting, and it might have been in 1995 or 96 if I recall correctly. We have never been a selector school no matter what run the program is on.

Yes, this. The original poster is making absurd claims about top 25 classes. We got close for a good stretch in the mid-to-late 90s (the class with mo mcclain, mo jackson, and jeremy cooper was maybe top 25 -- which of course undermines the ranking even further). But were rarely in teh top 25 and certainly were not 7 of 10 years in the 90s.

Also, the last good classes we had according to the sites were in the late 90s to the early 2000s, yet that coincides exactly with the time this program began it's precipitous decline. Those rankings almost always follow success, but rarely predict it.

 

[billsin01]

Some people need to chill.

Yup. This is the real point to make. No one -- or at least almost no one -- knows how recruiting is actually going. People here (myself included) draw conclusions from offers and highlight films, reported sizes and internet rumors. Coaches go to combines and meet with players and try to determine character, projectability and try to weigh ceiling/floor potential with each player.

But at the end of the day it's an absolutely inexact science for coaches and completely foolish for fans to spend much time worrying about it. And, as for recruiting sites, they are fine but extremely limited by the natural limits of trying to rank 2,000 players each year:

-- there is no set criteria for evaluation
-- they need to sell subscriptions/get users (thus skewing ratings from time to time)
-- there is a vast disparity between the qualifications of different writers
-- they are comparing a 17-year-old who started playing football 3 years ago in Mass. to an 18-year-old who's been doing nothing but playing football in Texas since the age of 2
-- they have no idea about work ethic/personality/educational standing for most players


It's just too hard to tell. And, as for DM's track record, how can anyone grade it as anything other than incomplete right now? It's not stellar, certainly, but it's also not awful. If we are sitting here in November and -- even if our record is a bit ugly -- we've seen some good things from Hale/Kobena/West/Fleming, AAM/Gulley/Smith, Broyld/Hunt we may think completely differently about his recruiting than we do today.

 

[tipphill]

waiting...waiting...i expect to see some improvement this year, but i am a proponent of winning overcomes a lot of problems.open up 2-0 and beat mizzou,and we are on the national radar. we get blown out and it will be same ol. very interested in seeing hcdm approach this year and if there is a team identity and cohesion, and not 80 players looking like What is going on

 

[tipphill]

Yup. This is the real point to make. No one -- or at least almost no one -- knows how recruiting is actually going. People here (myself included) draw conclusions from offers and highlight films, reported sizes and internet rumors. Coaches go to combines and meet with players and try to determine character, projectability and try to weigh ceiling/floor potential with each player.

But at the end of the day it's an absolutely inexact science for coaches and completely foolish for fans to spend much time worrying about it. And, as for recruiting sites, they are fine but extremely limited by the natural limits of trying to rank 2,000 players each year:

-- there is no set criteria for evaluation
-- they need to sell subscriptions/get users (thus skewing ratings from time to time)
-- there is a vast disparity between the qualifications of different writers
-- they are comparing a 17-year-old who started playing football 3 years ago in Mass. to an 18-year-old who's been doing nothing but playing football in Texas since the age of 2
-- they have no idea about work ethic/personality/educational standing for most players


It's just too hard to tell. And, as for DM's track record, how can anyone grade it as anything other than incomplete right now? It's not stellar, certainly, but it's also not awful. If we are sitting here in November and -- even if our record is a bit ugly -- we've seen some good things from Hale/Kobena/West/Fleming, AAM/Gulley/Smith, Broyld/Hunt we may think completely differently about his recruiting than we do today.

to me west has shown nothing. injury prone discipline issues etc. hoping aam comes up big,better shape and tougher

 

[PhatOrange]

Yes, this. The original poster is making absurd claims about top 25 classes. We got close for a good stretch in the mid-to-late 90s (the class with mo mcclain, mo jackson, and jeremy cooper was maybe top 25 -- which of course undermines the ranking even further). But were rarely in teh top 25 and certainly were not 7 of 10 years in the 90s.

Also, the last good classes we had according to the sites were in the late 90s to the early 2000s, yet that coincides exactly with the time this program began it's precipitous decline. Those rankings almost always follow success, but rarely predict it.

Im not even sure there was anybody ranking classes in the early 90's - I'm not sure what year Prepstar started doing it. To my knowledge Syracuse had one class ranked in the top 25 by Prepstar and it was the Lou Gachelin class that came in between 20 - 30.

If I remember correctly PrepStars also had 3 ratings classifications - there was no silly star ratings. Kids were either "Dream Teamers", "All Americans" or "All Regional"

 

[tipphill]

I guess the way we played in the 1990's was also a joke then? You guys can argue your point all you want, and if you so believe we are on the right track in recruiting, you are fully entitled to that opinion. I am also entiltled to mine, am I not? I do agree that talent isn't evreything, look at FSU or Miami. But having some highly touted recruits on your team is a nice problem to have, ist it not?

good talent overcomes bad coaching (play makers), good coaching cannot overcome poor talent--just my opinion

 

[SmilinBob]

I'd venture a guess that the staff has made inroads at certain high schools and 2013 should be a decent recruiting year for us and I'm hoping it shows the hard ground work they've laid down in recruiting this class. This past class is as fast as I've seen coming here in a while and I'm hoping that continues and now we get some girth as well along with that speed. I do believe that Marrone and staff are pretty good evaluators and they need to get a better percentage of their top targeted guys and I'm hoping that the ground work that has been done will do just that.

I'll wait until February until I make my first real comment on how good this 2013 is.

 

[CuseLegacy]

The thing I'm concerned about is the fact that almost every article with kids who have been offered has some form of "I don't know much about Syracuse" in there. That is concerning..[/quote]

^^^^^
This is why when they closed the practices they should have been controlling the message on the SU website, giving potential recruits something to see. Also it is the reason that I am disappointed that they aren't getting the Spring game carried on ESPN3. If you don't "advertise" your "product" how is anyone going to know about it, especially kids in TX, NC, MI, etc.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I appologize to all Orange Fans as I got a bit passionate, but again, the opening of this thread is about whether or not we are IMPROVING our RECRUITING PROGRAM, not about the one that has been here over the last 10 plus years. This is an important piece of the puzzle. Also, no one has mentioned any news on possible recruits that may come calling this Saturday? Maybe there is no news?

Open your wallet, not easy to recruit with D3 facilities.. Get out and look around

 

[kingottoiii]

Open your wallet, not easy to recruit with D3 facilities.. Get out and look around

That excuse is way over played here. We are not that much different than our peers. And we will always be behind. If Marrone cannot over come that, then he is the wrong guy. Lets be honest here a HC who is a recruiter would be doing a lot better at getting talent give the current situation. Hell you can make an argument that GRob was a better recruiter.

 

[tipphill]

That excuse is way over played here. We are not that much different than our peers. And we will always be behind. If Marrone cannot over come that, then he is the wrong guy. Lets be honest here a HC who is a recruiter would be doing a lot better at getting talent give the current situation. Hell you can make an argument that GRob was a better recruiter.

yes we are much different than our peers---marrone i believe maybe a great evaluator of talent but he needs something to sell. if he gets that and still cannot seal the deal on recruits, then i will agree. our facilities need to be at least comparable and they are not. i also agree that grob was not that bad a recruiter just a bad coach.

 

[kingottoiii]

yes we are much different than our peers---marrone i believe maybe a great evaluator of talent but he needs something to sell. if he gets that and still cannot seal the deal on recruits, then i will agree. our facilities need to be at least comparable and they are not. i also agree that grob was not that bad a recruiter just a bad coach.

Ok so where are we lacking? Just saying it does not make it so. Give examples. Several of our peers have ZERO indoor facilities. Some have a bubble. Some only have plans or are currently building a facility. Currently we have Manley. That is not ideal but it is better than nothing. Are kids really going elsewhere because our field is 80 yards vs SOME other schools having 100?

Our biggest issue IMO is the locker rooms and lounges. Those IMO can be fixed pretty quickly. Focusing on the indoor facility and allowing those to stay as is, IMO is not a smart idea. You can fix those NOW and at the same time fund raise for an new facility. If you do that, then we will be in line with most of our peers and people will have to stop making excuses for Marrone's failures as a recruiter.