Rickie Collins

[HRE Otto IV]

If he plays poorly vs SMU I think it is a huge risk to play him vs Pitt. Can’t lose that game and still make a Bowl.

IMO UNC is the only team we can beat with Collins.

 

[RedtheGOB]

Yeah, after the next 2 games with a bye week, let's see where he's at...

If there is no improvement, he's not getting thru reads, forcing balls into jumped coverage, etc...ok, serious discussions will need to be had with Carney, wildcat formations with Villari, etc., but we need to show a bit of patience here with Collins just like we did with Angeli... And it's really hard in this era where everyone wants everything immediately.

That said, I am certainly more concerned with Collin's play and red flags so far than I was with Angeli getting up to speed.

The SMU and PITT games will tell us a lot.

This is where I'm at too. The road trip to Texas is his mulligan. This is Syracuse, every QB has their nightmare game at some point. If no improvement at all which would be almost impossible given how bad the team was yesterday then you have a culture problem to go along with a talent and experience problem. The experience thing we knew was gonna be a problem.

The culture problem is the bigger problem and the coaches better nip that real fast and that probably starts with the QB1 honestly because that's who Fran has said is the man now. If the Team doesn't believe in Rickie and if Rickie doesn't believe in himself which is what we all saw yesterday then something needs to change.

The D is obvi more concerning but I think is more explainable. ERobs Defense is just predictable and doesn't have the experience or the firepower. Mensah looked a hell of alot like McCord when he would get rolling.

It's Sweet irony that McCord did the same thing to 10 teams last year as Duke just did to us with Mensah especially when we thought we might be on our way to something special this year. They're just way too young and don't have the veterans to handle the swings so when things get rolling the wrong way they don't know how to pull themselves out of the nosedive and neither do the coaches honestly given most are just as green.

 

[Archimedes]

Carney can run. Just putting that out there.

Throwing a true freshman into this situation could destroy his confidence if it goes bad. I don't know what level of competition Carney played at in TX. This might be too much of an ask of him.

 

[NCo’range]

Throwing a true freshman into this situation could destroy his confidence if it goes bad. I don't know what level of competition Carney played at in TX. This might be too much of an ask of him.

True and if RC was the bonafide qb2, what does that say about Carney? After all, FB plays a true freahman if he shows the potential.

 

[sufandu]

If he plays poorly vs SMU I think it is a huge risk to play him vs Pitt. Can’t lose that game and still make a Bowl.

IMO UNC is the only team we can beat with Collins.

I don't know that the other guys give us a better chance to win, but if it's clear he can't get it done, I don't see the benefit in continuing to play him. Sometimes you don't know if a guy has 'it' until he's in a live game. Throw a young guy in there and see if there's a Dungey-like guy that shows the signs in the spotlight even if he has a lot to learn. We may not win any more, but then we at least know if we have the makings of a QB.

 

[CuseBlood44]

I don’t know. I honestly think Fran picks the guy that can give us the best shot at wins. If carney or Williams could do that they wouldn’t have brought in angelli or Collins and they most certainly wouldn’t have Collins higher in the depth chart. I really think Collins might be the best option unfortunately. Carney looked very small in that one playing he came in for against Colgate.

Agree on Jakhari Disagree on Carney. Almost nobody rolls the dice on a true freshman

 

[CuseBlood44]

I don’t know. I honestly think Fran picks the guy that can give us the best shot at wins. If carney or Williams could do that they wouldn’t have brought in angelli or Collins and they most certainly wouldn’t have Collins higher in the depth chart. I really think Collins might be the best option unfortunately. Carney looked very small in that one playing he came in for against Colgate.

Agree on Jakhari Disagree on Carney. Almost nobody rolls the dice on a true freshman

 

[sufandu]

Throwing a true freshman into this situation could destroy his confidence if it goes bad. I don't know what level of competition Carney played at in TX. This might be too much of an ask of him.

Or it could show we have a player. The hand was forced with Dungey and it was obvious he was a player from the first drive.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

I don't know that the other guys give us a better chance to win, but if it's clear he can't get it done, I don't see the benefit in continuing to play him. Sometimes you don't know if a guy has 'it' until he's in a live game. Throw a young guy in there and see if there's a Dungey-like guy that shows the signs in the spotlight even if he has a lot to learn. We may not win any more, but then we at least know if we have the makings of a QB.

If Collins really is our 2nd best QB then this is a pretty poor group of QBs. Yet we hear every year that it is the best.

Worst case you figure out the young kids stink too and you need to clean house.

 

[Archimedes]

True and if RC was the bonafide qb2, what does that say about Carney? After all, FB plays a true freahman if he shows the potential.

There's a flip side to the coin. What if Carney goes in and plays great? Now, you potentially gotta pay big money to 2 QBs. Can SU do that?

To me, Collins simply has to get better. Ride with him and hope it happens. I'm not saying that's a good answer, at all, but it's the only one we've got for the long-term benefit of the program.

 

[sufandu]

If Collins really is our 2nd best QB then this is a pretty poor group of QBs. Yet we hear every year that it is the best.

Worst case you figure out the young kids stink too and you need to clean house.

Yeah. I'm willing to take some lumps with a guy that will make young player mistakes, if he also looks like he can make some plays. My only caveat is that with our inconsistent oline, he needs to be able to protect himself, either by getting rid of the ball quickly or by being mobile. We don't need a true freshman getting murdered.



Fast forward to 1:58.

 

[AngryOtto]

I’m not sure any of the other qbs are ready but I’m not sure it could be much worse. It does not help when your receiver fumbles but Collins did not show things you want to see in a starting qb. He might throw a great ball in practice but his decision in live game action is poor.

 

[Hopkins16]

I hope I’m wrong, but I haven’t seen anything from Collins that shows promise. Some basic things he can do going forward is to not telegraph passes and look off your intended receiver; throw away the ball instead of taking the sack or trying to make something out of nothing with slow feet; figure out how to grip the ball better (does he have small and/or soft hands? Need to dry or rough up his throwing hand?).

If we keep losing and Collins shows little or no improvement, perhaps we let Carney play a few games to get his feet wet.

 

[atlanticuse]

Rickie isn’t dual threat. I’m not even sure he’s single threat. But those feet aren’t quick at all.

well, he's kind of a threat to our offense...

 

[kcsu]

Rickie is going to be provided with the opportunity to improve. He is well liked by the team and Fran isn't one to panic. I believe that the primary reason Rickie might be pulled is that he is most likely the odd man out next year. SU will need to determine which of the QBs on the roster need to be paid and retained. Steve is QB 1 and i believe that Carney will be their second choice. I simply don't see the money being available for Rickie. Given that scenario if he lays and egg against Smu a change could possibly happen after the bye week.

 

[hoopsupstate]

well, he's kind of a threat to our offense...

He’s not elusive at all. He also doesn’t seem to recognize opportunities to pick up easy yardage by running.

 

[OttosShoes]

Lots of stuff about patience and starts and whatnot. I get it, one wants to be fair and we're not particularly level headed about this stuff. The Rickie situation is not beyond repair.

That said, it's not the overall performance that concerns me personally. I instruct and coach aspiring racing drivers and I can usually tell pretty quick who 'has it' and who doesn't. It's not particularly important how fast they're driving when they're learning--it's how fast they learn.

I see a lot of parallels. Steve made mistakes, fixed them, and moved on. His skillset had a great trajectory. Rickie's made mistakes, apparently gotten shook-up about it, and then continued to make the same mistakes. Just from tape Duke knew he was going to go with his first read right from the start. That safety Weaver knew it so hard he left his apparent coverage on the first possession and immediately got an easy pick. I don't believe for a second the coaching staff hasn't told Rickie not to telegraph his passes.

While panic isn't warranted here (or ever), I just don't see a magic solution either. This sucks.

 

[sufandu]

I’m not sure any of the other qbs are ready but I’m not sure it could be much worse. It does not help when your receiver fumbles but Collins did not show things you want to see in a starting qb. He might throw a great ball in practice but his decision in live game action is poor.

He has great physical tools, they look better than Angeli's. I just don't see how a guy that looks like a deer in headlights in year 3 of college moves past that. The game should've slowed down by now.

 

[ManleyRocks]

There is a really good news clip of Carney from the DFW news. Looks like he throws a great ball…leading the receivers….over the proper shoulder….etc. (Although our guys caught the ball yesterday, Collins is going to get them killed with some of his passes yesterday into tight windows and behind the receivers or over the wrong shoulder) If Carney is as smart and as sound as he seems, he should be future. Fingers crossed.

 

[tep624]

Throwing a true freshman into this situation could destroy his confidence if it goes bad. I don't know what level of competition Carney played at in TX. This might be too much of an ask of him.

True, but sometimes you just have to fight with the army you have.

 

[JrodCuse]

The thing that really surprised me…zero rollouts or designed motion plays for Rickie early on. I was really expecting to see a new rushing element from the qb yesterday which would have helped negate some of duke’s pass rush.

 

[AZOrange]

If today wasn’t unplayable I don’t know what is. He literally dropped the ball on the turf during his windup.

The windup is his big flaw and something they’ve really worked on getting rid of. It shows you how nervous he was given it kept coming back

 

[AZOrange]

The thing that really surprised me…zero rollouts or designed motion plays for Rickie early on. I was really expecting to see a new rushing element from the qb yesterday which would have helped negate some of duke’s pass rush.

It was malpractice on HCFBs part

 

[AZOrange]

There is a really good news clip of Carney from the DFW news. Looks like he throws a great ball…leading the receivers….over the proper shoulder….etc. (Although our guys caught the ball yesterday, Collins is going to get them killed with some of his passes yesterday into tight windows and behind the receivers or over the wrong shoulder) If Carney is as smart and as sound as he seems, he should be future. Fingers crossed.

Carneys big issue will be his size. If he was taller he be at Texas or Ohio State

 

[AngryOtto]

Carneys big issue will be his size. If he was taller he be at Texas or Ohio State

Not sure height is as much a factor in college. Plenty of great college qbs that were 6 to 6’2.