Rickie Collins

[Archbold44]

I'm more than old enough to remember them and more, sigh.
But I'm not getting off the ledge today.
Our defense is just too bad. Our lowest scoring opponent was Holly Cross at 14 points. We've had to score more than 24 points in every game we've won and the vast majority were over 30 points with many close games.
I hope I'm wrong but I don't see Rickie carving anyone up.

Our defense tackled well against Clemson and won. Our defense tackled poorly in every other game... and the scoreboard reflected it. We try way too hard for turnovers... and all it takes is a marginally legal hit like Cook was the victim of for the ball to pop out. If I had a nickel for every defender we have getting dragged for 3-4 yards trying to strip the ball.

It is all basics. Blocking. Tackling. Treasure the football. Move forward on offense, keep the offense from moving forward on defense. 2nd and 5 sucks, but 2nd and 2 is worse. Get him on the ground.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

.


If Angeli is healthy in 2026 or 2027, then Carney can redshirt then. We actually need him now, assuming he is any good. And if he is not, then who cares about a RS?

To further expand on this...

In today's world a QB's redshirt will only matter if:

1. They are good enough to become QB1
2. They are never recruited over
3. They stay for a 5th year, never wanting to leave for another school or even the NFL Draft.

Is Carney good enough to eventually be QB1 (point #1)? If not, then who cares about a RS? Is he good enough to not be recruited over by someone from the 2026 or 2027 HS classes that Fran brings in (#2)? Or a portal QB for 2028 (also #2)? Will he be fine waiting until 2028 to be QB1, and/or never get homesick (#3)? If he is QB1 in 2028 will he be so good that he gets on Draft boards (also #3)? I doubt that one given his measurables.

So much has to happen for his RS to even come into play.

On top of that, playing more than 4 games as a true Frosh doesn't mean you cannot redshirt as a Soph or JR instead. What are the chances that Angeli will miss 5 games in 2026 and then miss 5 games again in 2027? Most likely QB2 will not be needed to the point that he cannot RS in 2026 or 2027.

IMO it is foolish to worry about a QB's RS when they can actually get legit playing time (ie not mop up duty).

If Carney has real potential, wouldn't he benefit from QB1 practice reps the last 8 weeks (6 games from Pitt on, 7 if we made a Bowl) of this season? If he doesn't have potential then he shouldn't play, in which case we shouldn't care anyway about his RS.

Again this is all assuming Collins vs SMU is the same Collins we saw vs Colgate and then vs Clemson and then vs Duke.

 

[Millhouse]

We are never going to have two good QBs
We usually don't have one
Who is going to sit here when you can transfer anywhere
This year is going to stink now and I'm not gonna hold it against brown because no one is going to succeed here with a back up QB

 

[bnoro]

I think everyone needs to take a step back. Bad interception on Drive 1. Bad decision not to throw the ball away after Yasin's long run. But, if Yasin follows his blockers on the leap run, rather than cut left, he gets a TD run. If the Cook fumble had ignited the defense, rather than deflate it, we are still in the game. Second Cook fumble. And more. This was a team loss. ST play was terrible on returns.

I get the frustration over Rickie... but we have had a lot of worse talent back there over the years. Don McPherson did not compete for a Heisman before he was a senior, fyi.

I think we keep rolling Rickie out there for a few more weeks. Give him SMU and Pitt. If he cannot show progression by then, then perhaps we make a switch to try to beat Georgia Tech and UNC. But if there is a way to preserve Carney's redshirt, then I think that is the right thing to do. Williams should be QB3 until we get to game 10. And games 10 and 11 seem to be bad places to start a freshman.

I agree with you. The Cook "fumble" changed the whole game.

But the non-scripted drive performance for the offense is a big worry for me going forward. Need to see some semblance of a competitive game next week.

 

[Archbold44]

I agree with you. The Cook "fumble" changed the whole game.

But the non-scripted drive performance for the offense is a big worry for me going forward. Need to see some semblance of a competitive game next week.

We'll see. When you get down, it changes the level of desperation. So the play calls are different because you want to score and score quickly. Clemson should have kept running the ball on us. Instead, they put it in Cade's hands to overthrow receivers, etc. Sometimes, you need to forget the score and score points. Forget how you get it there... get it there.

At some point, we should have shifted from winning the game to developing Rickie. He didn't get 4 quarters of Colgate. We might have to do the same this week. Or maybe we did. He is used to our defense, where I am sure screen plays for 12 yards 9 out of 10 times. Maybe we need to practice against 13 defenders to replicate what it is like against competent defenses. I don't know.

Different sets... Two RBs... two WRs... TE... make sure he gets time and have him go through simpler reads. One WR and then dump off to RB. He did a great fake against Clemson for that TD. He CAN do it. When he gets comfortable, then start bringing back our 3, 4, and 5 receiver packages. For the WRs... the best case scenario is the best Rickie Collins QB that they can get... it is worth some attention for a game to get him to his maximum productivity. And then the coaches have to spin this as the game plan for this week, rather than training wheels for Rickie.

 

[Oakland]

I think everyone needs to take a step back. Bad interception on Drive 1. Bad decision not to throw the ball away after Yasin's long run. But, if Yasin follows his blockers on the leap run, rather than cut left, he gets a TD run. If the Cook fumble had ignited the defense, rather than deflate it, we are still in the game. Second Cook fumble. And more. This was a team loss. ST play was terrible on returns.

I get the frustration over Rickie... but we have had a lot of worse talent back there over the years. Don McPherson did not compete for a Heisman before he was a senior, fyi.

I think we keep rolling Rickie out there for a few more weeks. Give him SMU and Pitt. If he cannot show progression by then, then perhaps we make a switch to try to beat Georgia Tech and UNC. But if there is a way to preserve Carney's redshirt, then I think that is the right thing to do. Williams should be QB3 until we get to game 10. And games 10 and 11 seem to be bad places to start a freshman.

Thanks for mentioning Yasin's cut to the left - I was wondering if I was the only one who thought that.

 

[kingtidge]

We are never going to have two good QBs
We usually don't have one. Not true. We have had good # 1 QB's that always seem to get injured... McCord aside...
Who is going to sit here when you can transfer anywhere. The portal giveth; the portal taketh away...
This year is going to stink now and I'm not gonna hold it against brown because no one is going to succeed here with a back up QB. So this year's now gonna stink because we can no longer win with Notre Dame's backup QB??

I have retorts in bold...

 

[Cusefan0307]

We need to remember that Duke's defense is terrible. It was the best possibly matchup for him to start and we scored 3 points. He's only going to play better defenses here on out.

 

[Scooch]

Does he though? I haven’t seen anything special about his arm.

Also he doesn’t seem to know how to pass, which is more important. That IMO can’t be fixed this year.

Agreed. I feel like folks here throw around the "special arm" compliment far too often. I'll never forget someone here raving that Perry Patterson had "the strongest arm in college football". I believe that's around the time I started goofing on the annual "deepest QB room in years" take, and that was 20 years ago!

Most guys who are P4 QBs can huck the ball fairly far. That's why they're at a P4 program. But precious few are very good passers. Collins is absolutely not a very good passer. There's no evidence of that.

 

[baggerbob]

Hopefully that means after a week if practice Carney is Number 1.

 

[OttosShoes]

Hopefully that means after a week if practice Carney is Number 1.

I think for HCFB to say “probably” and not some variation of “I trust my guys” shows how serious the QB room situation is.

Small chance we may actually see Carney start in Dallas.

 

[bnoro]

I think for HCFB to say “probably” and not some variation of “I trust my guys” shows how serious the QB room situation is.

Small chance we may actually see Carney start in Dallas.

I think he's quite clearly talking about the three guys vying for the backup spot here.

 

[OttosShoes]

I think he's quite clearly talking about the three guys vying for the backup spot here.

Yes that is heavily implied. But once Steve won, the depth chart wasn't a talking point he engaged, it was just "I trust my guys." Then Rickie has a troubling debut and immediately the depth chart is a talking point again.

To be clear I'll guess <5% chance of a Carney start. But before I read that I would've guessed 0%. Stuff is up in the air.

 

[Millhouse]

I have retorts in bold...

I'm assuming you think shrader was good

Not arguing I just didn't think we have good QBs more often than not

 

[Archbold44]

To further expand on this...

In today's world a QB's redshirt will only matter if:

1. They are good enough to become QB1
2. They are never recruited over
3. They stay for a 5th year, never wanting to leave for another school or even the NFL Draft.

Is Carney good enough to eventually be QB1 (point #1)? If not, then who cares about a RS? Is he good enough to not be recruited over by someone from the 2026 or 2027 HS classes that Fran brings in (#2)? Or a portal QB for 2028 (also #2)? Will he be fine waiting until 2028 to be QB1, and/or never get homesick (#3)? If he is QB1 in 2028 will he be so good that he gets on Draft boards (also #3)? I doubt that one given his measurables.

So much has to happen for his RS to even come into play.

On top of that, playing more than 4 games as a true Frosh doesn't mean you cannot redshirt as a Soph or JR instead. What are the chances that Angeli will miss 5 games in 2026 and then miss 5 games again in 2027? Most likely QB2 will not be needed to the point that he cannot RS in 2026 or 2027.

IMO it is foolish to worry about a QB's RS when they can actually get legit playing time (ie not mop up duty).

If Carney has real potential, wouldn't he benefit from QB1 practice reps the last 8 weeks (6 games from Pitt on, 7 if we made a Bowl) of this season? If he doesn't have potential then he shouldn't play, in which case we shouldn't care anyway about his RS.

Again this is all assuming Collins vs SMU is the same Collins we saw vs Colgate and then vs Clemson and then vs Duke.

Of course, if you give him starts, you give him tape to audition for a new job in 2026. Carney with 4 games of experience could either (a) drop down to being Angeli's back up for 2026; or (b) compete for the Q1 job somewhere else. If he is just competent... plenty of non-P4 schools could see enough in 4 games to want to hand the reigns to him. If you are a Mac, C-USA, or Sun Belt program that loses your QB... why not hand him the reigns for a year and put all of your NIL into that basket. We took Collins with his 12 passes at LSU over 2 years.

 

[Archbold44]

Agreed. I feel like folks here throw around the "special arm" compliment far too often. I'll never forget someone here raving that Perry Patterson had "the strongest arm in college football". I believe that's around the time I started goofing on the annual "deepest QB room in years" take, and that was 20 years ago!

Most guys who are P4 QBs can huck the ball fairly far. That's why they're at a P4 program. But precious few are very good passers. Collins is absolutely not a very good passer. There's no evidence of that.

I dunno. I think he has a real good arm. I think he made some good passes. Again, I have seen so much garbage over the years, I am hesitant to get all worried about this one game. He caused a lot of his own problems, but I also see fixable things. I am sorry that I just cannot get as negative. I never saw us as an 8-win team anyway, so I guess the disappointment is a bit tempered. If we are post-Pitt and not seeing any improvement, then maybe I will get more antsy. But you gotta give a guy 2-3 games before being able to judge.

 

[timkay99]

Yes that is heavily implied. But once Steve won, the depth chart wasn't a talking point he engaged, it was just "I trust my guys." Then Rickie has a troubling debut and immediately the depth chart is a talking point again.

To be clear I'll guess <5% chance of a Carney start. But before I read that I would've guessed 0%. Stuff is up in the air.

It wasn't implied, that was the question about the backup QB that you are referencing.

 

[tbonezone]

game one you excuse your back-up for not having the practice reps, the film , the coaching etc.etc.
game two is a true evaluation of what you got going forward. next game tells the tale.

 

[tep624]

Of course, if you give him starts, you give him tape to audition for a new job in 2026. Carney with 4 games of experience could either (a) drop down to being Angeli's back up for 2026; or (b) compete for the Q1 job somewhere else. If he is just competent... plenty of non-P4 schools could see enough in 4 games to want to hand the reigns to him. If you are a Mac, C-USA, or Sun Belt program that loses your QB... why not hand him the reigns for a year and put all of your NIL into that basket. We took Collins with his 12 passes at LSU over 2 years.

At this point we should have zero concern about Carney being successful and transferring out. That’s like wringing your hands over one of your competent staff leaving for a promotion you can’t give them.

Fran strikes me as wanting to put his team in the best position to win each week, whatever that takes.

If Carney isn’t ready, then he’s not ready and that’s fine. But if he’s ready and it’s an improvement, he should be out there.

 

[OttosShoes]

It wasn't implied, that was the question about the backup QB that you are referencing.

Yes I know. What is implied is that if Carney isn’t QB2, then he’s 3 or 4 as opposed to 1. But that’s just semantics. I’m not saying you have call it implied if you don’t want to, the point is that there is uncertainty in the QB room.