Rotation

[nolacuse44]

"Maybe if I just beat this dead horse long enough, I can rekindle that point that's been thoroughly disproven the past month..."

Yeah, to paraphrase TBC, that's the deadest disproven horse, and it's not even close.

 

[Brooky03]

He started 3-6 and ended 1-7. He took a bunch of ill-advised attempts. Not sure what the deal was. Most egregious was late in the first half when McCullough had pinned the VT guard down low and Cooney chucks up a 27 footer. To add insult to injury, McCullough trips over Muller going for the long offensive board and gets called for a foul.

Not bashing McCullough, but I'll take an uncontested 27 footer from Cooney over McCullough with the ball in the paint at this point.

 

[RF2044]

What does your point have to do with the fact Cooney should get a blow for a couple of minutes in the first half just to allow him to have more energy in the 2nd half. Obviously I don't see how this opinion is not fair. Of course your opinion is fine but your opinion is not any better than the one your are responding too. Discourse allows for different opinions. Cooney is our 2nd most important player but playing 40 minutes wears you down if it didn't more teams would play their best players 40 minutes.

If our team [collectively] had executed a little better in the second half, it wouldn't have gotten so tight. And then maybe JB would have subbed a bit more. In a tight game, when another team is making a big run, we aren't getting any calls, and we're facing a hostile crowd on the road, JB is going to go with his trusted players.

If we win this game comfortably, then Cooney probably doesn't play 40. Nor would he have needed to.

We didn't get the job done today in that regard.

 

[KaiserUEO]

If our team [collectively] had executed a little better in the second half, it wouldn't have gotten so tight. And then maybe JB would have subbed a bit more. In a tight game, when another team is making a big run, we aren't getting any calls, and we're facing a hostile crowd on the road, JB is going to go with his trusted players.

If we win this game comfortably, then Cooney probably doesn't play 40. Nor would he have needed to.

We didn't get the job done today in that regard.

You play to win the game...not next months games(s).

This has been JBs mantra for 39 years, some of this is just pure insanity.

And another thing, once it became tight...he needed 'his' guys to play it out and win it.

They gotta learn.

Not #s 8 & 9 on the bench.

 

[Alsacs]

Who said anything about sitting Cooney or any player in the second half JB could give them a blow in the first half. When you have a huge lead in the first half give the kid a blow so he can be fresher in the 2nd half. We were comfortably ahead the last 10 minutes in the first half. Our players wear down there is no doubt watching them at the end they are gassed.

 

[Alsacs]

You play to win the game...not next months games(s).

This has been JBs mantra for 39 years, some of this is just pure insanity.

And another thing, once it became tight...he needed 'his' guys to play it out and win it.

They gotta learn.

Not #s 8 & 9 on the bench.

You just described JB's mindset and why he has a lot of wins. This board can't even have a debate on whether this philosophy is the best. Obviously JB isn't going to change but the discussion can't happen because this topic becomes too polarizing. Which sucks because I appreciate JB's legacy at SU however I don't think questioning his philosophy is unfair. Their is a reason our program is stereotyped nationally as a team that is successful in November/December/January and then under achieve in March.

I honestly think regular season success is great but wish we had more success in March. We have had bad luck in 2010 and 2012 but season's like last year were not good. I loved 25-0 but that means nothing when you lose in the 2nd round. Kaiser your smart but you pick on low hanging fruit and do it well. Syracuse hoops = Georgia football. We always a contender but like UGA we have had bad luck and only have 1 ring when we should have more due to bad luck.

 

[KaiserUEO]

You just described JB's mindset and why he has a lot of wins. This board can't even have a debate on whether this philosophy is the best. Obviously JB isn't going to change but the discussion can't happen because this topic becomes too polarizing. Which sucks because I appreciate JB's legacy at SU however I don't think questioning his philosophy is unfair. Their is a reason our program is stereotyped nationally as a team that is successful in November/December/January and then under achieve in March.

I honestly think regular season success is great but wish we had more success in March. We have had bad luck in 2010 and 2012 but season's like last year were not good. I loved 25-0 but that means nothing when you lose in the 2nd round. Kaiser your smart but you pick on low hanging fruit and do it well. Syracuse hoops = Georgia football. We always a contender but like UGA we have had bad luck and only have 1 ring when we should have more due to bad luck.

i see zero reason to debate why US Steel...makes steel.

i get on a train because its going to follow the tracks.

when it goes off the tracks...bad shlit happens.

therefore i dont want it to go off the tracks.

nor do i debate why my train cant float or fly and get me someplace in a different manner.

 

[Alsacs]

i see zero reason to debate why US Steel...makes steel.

i get on a train because its going to follow the tracks.

when it goes off the tracks...bad shlit happens.

therefore i dont want it to go off the tracks.

nor do i debate why my train cant float or fly and get me someplace in a different manner.

So basically JB can do no wrong? I love what JB has done for SU but I can be objective and say his philosophy has made us a good program but has also left some flesh on the bone. We are a Keith Smart jumper from having 2 NCs so I am not saying JB has underachieved but I can see that he is stubborn and with age has become more cranky.
Syracuse basketball is not US Steel. That would be Duke. We are a damn good stock but not an elite stock.

 

[GonzoInMD]

So basically JB can do no wrong? I love what JB has done for SU but I can be objective and say his philosophy has made us a good program but has also left some flesh on the bone. We are a Keith Smart jumper from having 2 NCs so I am not saying JB has underachieved but I can see that he is stubborn and with age has become more cranky.
Syracuse basketball is not US Steel. That would be Duke. We are a damn good stock but not an elite stock.

I believe what he's trying to say is that JB does what he does...and no amount of us fulminating about it on forums like this is going to change that.

 

[KaiserUEO]

So basically JB can do no wrong? I love what JB has done for SU but I can be objective and say his philosophy has made us a good program but has also left some flesh on the bone. We are a Keith Smart jumper from having 2 NCs so I am not saying JB has underachieved but I can see that he is stubborn and with age has become more cranky.
Syracuse basketball is not US Steel. That would be Duke. We are a damn good stock but not an elite stock.

no.

he can do wrong, but its the same 'wrongs' hes done for 39 years.

so whats the point?

its also 39 highly successful years.

Syracuse is not a good program, but a GREAT program.

other than dook, and shoot me now...storz, everyone has left flesh on the bone.

the US Steel reference was not to compare to dook, but to say dont go asking them to build a house out of wood or brick.

i dont go grabbing a glass of water and wonder why it doesnt make me feel like a glass of vodka does...and then yell at poland spring.

its fluckin useless.

and alsacs, this place is better because of you, but with all due respect...dont go bringing up keith smart.

im pretty sure you werent a student or older and certainly didnt feel the pain like some others here have.

and to that point...JB LEARNED from it and became one of'...if not THE best last 2 minute hoop coaches ive seen in the last 28 or whatever years its been.

so as much as that bugs me...and not a day goes by in hoop season and many other days that it doesnt...im ok with it because it GOT us 2003.

 

[KingOnuaku]

I'd like to see Cooney get a breather here or there, but not due to lack of production. His overall game has been a lot better the past month or so. I just think the kid is being asked to do a bit too much. Is BJ that bad where he couldn't give him a few minute breather here or there?

Yes. He is that bad.

 

[Alsacs]

no.

he can do wrong, but its the same 'wrongs' hes done for 39 years.

so whats the point?

its also 39 highly successful years.

Syracuse is not a good program, but a GREAT program.

other than dook, and shoot me now...storz, everyone has left flesh on the bone.

the US Steel reference was not to compare to dook, but to say dont go asking them to build a house out of wood or brick.

i dont go grabbing a glass of water and wonder why it doesnt make me feel like a glass of vodka does...and then yell at poland spring.

its fluckin useless.

and alsacs, this place is better because of you, but with all due respect...dont go bringing up keith smart.

im pretty sure you werent a student or older and certainly didnt feel the pain like some others here have.

and to that point...JB LEARNED from it and became one of'...if not THE best last 2 minute hoop coaches ive seen in the last 28 or whatever years its been.

so as much as that bugs me...and not a day goes by in hoop season and many other days that it doesnt...im ok with it because it GOT us 2003.

I know you realize I only brought up that name to give JB the benefit of the doubt when people say only 1 NC.

My point is though if somebody is stubborn and their philosophy can be debated it doesn't mean you can't have the debate anyway.
JB like most people does what he feels works best but that doesn't mean it can't be questioned even if we know it's not going change. Sounding off is part what is great about a message board. I admit JB will forget more about basketball than I personally will ever learn. My point is anybody who doesn't circle the wagons around JB is lumped together and that gets rather annoying. Their are on some on this board who hate JB, some who hate some of his decisions, and some who want to let out of frustration but appreciate the greatness. All of these people are lumped together as the same and the other side circles together.

Different opinions I feel are great. I like hearing different opinions even if they are trollish just to hear the perceptive. I had a debate with an Arizona friend who said what is the difference between JB and Lute Olson. I said JB had the Big East and the more wins. He said it was east coast bias and I looked at the numbers Lute Olaon and JB are pretty close everywhere but wins. This type of debate can't happen on this board. I agree JB is better but the debate is closer than people think.

 

[TBCuse11]

"Maybe if I just beat this dead horse long enough, I can rekindle that point that's been thoroughly disproven the past month..."

LOL. thats about all that can be said to that. Disproven? Maybe in your very biased eyes... and thats cool.

 

[TBCuse11]

You just described JB's mindset and why he has a lot of wins. This board can't even have a debate on whether this philosophy is the best. Obviously JB isn't going to change but the discussion can't happen because this topic becomes too polarizing. Which sucks because I appreciate JB's legacy at SU however I don't think questioning his philosophy is unfair. Their is a reason our program is stereotyped nationally as a team that is successful in November/December/January and then under achieve in March.

I honestly think regular season success is great but wish we had more success in March. We have had bad luck in 2010 and 2012 but season's like last year were not good. I loved 25-0 but that means nothing when you lose in the 2nd round. Kaiser your smart but you pick on low hanging fruit and do it well. Syracuse hoops = Georgia football. We always a contender but like UGA we have had bad luck and only have 1 ring when we should have more due to bad luck.

spot on. JB is a great regular season coach. Lots of wins for his legacy, but just one title in 40 years for the fans. (spare me the "we got unlucky a few times" reply)

 

[rrlbees]

spot on. JB is a great regular season coach. Lots of wins for his legacy, but just one title in 40 years for the fans. (spare me the "we got unlucky a few times" reply)

Yea because replies would be factual.

 

[Macky44]

dead horse, but... how on earth does Cooney never sit. He was about 7 for 25 today? G and Joseph up top (or Ron) with Chris, Roberson and Rak down low is far from a bad lineup. Trevor is not the bionic man, in fact he gets gassed almost every game. I know the apologists will come out, but he was a selfish player today and it as ugly.

I dont fully blame him, hes gassed by the 10 minute mark. Chris McC is an extreme talent and he gets no run. Jim is missing the ball on him, and that hasnt happened much if ever since he has been coach.

Roberson has outplayed McC since he has been back from his injury. I think this is really the only answer needed. Chris will remain the starter, but will be backing up Roberson and Christmas going forward in terms of real time.

 

[TBCuse11]

Roberson has outplayed McC since he has been back from his injury. I think this is really the only answer needed. Chris will remain the starter, but will be backing up Roberson and Christmas going forward in terms of real time.

our best team is with all 3 of them in and G and Cooney up top. this is not even close to be honest...

 

[TBCuse11]

Yea because replies would be factual.

unlucky? that is what we are falling back on now? Oh boy... a new low for this board.
I guess u can call it unlucky if you refuse to develop depth and then a key player goes down, forcing guys who are helpless to play. You could call that unlucky, but you would be dead wrong.

 

[Full_Rebar]

I just think it's interesting that some people can't equate the lack of execution with possible fatigue. Not being able to make free throws, being a step slow on defense, or in making decisions can absolutely be related to playing high minutes.

It's not complicated to try and use the tv timeouts to steal a brief rest for Cooney in each half against teams like VT. You'd think our bench was comprised of D3 talent.

 

[RF2044]

LOL. thats about all that can be said to that. Disproven? Maybe in your very biased eyes... and thats cool.

Riiiiiiight.

 

[Alsacs]

I just think it's interesting that some people can't equate the lack of execution with possible fatigue. Not being able to make free throws, being a step slow on defense, or in making decisions can absolutely be related to playing high minutes.

It's not complicated to try and use the tv timeouts to steal a brief rest for Cooney in each half against teams like VT. You'd think our bench was comprised of D3 talent.

The problem with the board is all criticism is lumped as anti-JB and thus it gets swept away as illegitimate points. JB's loyalty to Syracuse University is remarkable and he has given more SU than any of us have, but he isn't above legitimate criticism. Our players who play high 30 mpg have to get tired during games and sometimes at the end. I hate that constructive criticism is lumped together with all criticism.

I know JB is unlikely to change his philosophy, but the fact it can't be discussed in a fair way is a joke. I give credit when its due. Kaiser is right JB's end of game execution is among the best in the nation. He fouls when up 3 correctly and calls good plays in end of games scenairos. Our FT shooting cost us the Nova game and almost the VT game. I said made he should use TOs in the middle of the games just to save some energy/legs for our guys so they have more at the end and that point will get turned into a bashing JB by the circle the wagons portion of the fanbase when its nothing more a legit constructive point.

 

[Macky44]

our best team is with all 3 of them in and G and Cooney up top. this is not even close to be honest...

I don't necessarily disagree with that...however i think McC has been foul prone lately much like Rak, so Boeheim has been keeping Chris on the bench to save him for backup reasons. It's starting to look like a Waiters type situation.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Clearly the 400-500 minutes the players spend each week in the Melo Center aren't doing anything to develop depth.

But 2-3 minutes of action in a game makes all the difference.

:noidea:

 

[Alsacs]

Clearly the 400-500 minutes the players spend each week in the Melo Center aren't doing anything to develop depth.

But 2-3 minutes of action in a game makes all the difference.

:noidea:

This post is why you can't have a discussion. Its a passive aggressive dig at a point that is fair. So basically your point is practice is where every player develops and that on the court experience can't possibly help players. Also, our players practice very little during the season. Their have been articles JB during the season doesn't practice hard to save the players legs.

Seriously the point remains playing high 30 mpg WEARS you down so that at the end you may not have the same amount of energy as a player who has played high 20 mpg or low 30 mpg. This point can't be true so I will just act smarter than the people who are making a legit point and try to make them look crazy/or they are complainers. Why can't a legitimate discussion happen? Nah making the other side look stupid is better.

 

[Alsacs]

Cue the response from one of the four posters I KNOW will respond.