So What happened?

[Don]

In 2010 we go 8-5 and win a bowl game over a Kansas state team that is now a top five team in the country.
Last year we beat West Virginia and I think are one solid win away from being 6-2 and being a ranked team. Instead of being ranked, in our last eleven games we go 2-9 with one of those wins over a FCS team and the other a 1 point win at home over a 2-4 team.

So I ask what happened? I mean seriously what happened?

It is mind boggling what has happened. I don't even want to hear about injuries or distractions or stuff like that I mean Penn state loses 14 players, changes coaches, goes through an incredible scandal and is 4-2 including a beat down of Northwestern.

I know lots of people Like to run down Nassib and he does deserve some blame but he is better than the QB's at LSU, Notre Dame and Stanford all ranked team.

The special teams are horrid and have cost us three games at least during this stretch and the coach is to blame there no doubt that is totally on him, there are teams with not as much talent as us that are not as bad as us there. This problem is a coaching problem first and foremost with a fragile ego field goal kicker second.

Turnovers are a big problem no question and I mean that in the sense that we don't protect the ball well enough and when we get turnovers we dont capitalize on them, for instance the Northwestern game and the big one the uconn game last year if we take advantage on early turnovers those are just complete different games.

lack of talent? Common man, we certaintly dont have elite talent but out talent is not at a 2-9 level no way now how not even close. Marrone has recruited three straight classes in the 50's and im sorry that is not 2-9 talent. we had enough talent to destroy West Virginia last year and play well against USC twice. Point blank pure and simple we have better talent than the last eleven 2-9 record straight up pure and simple, to even argue that is just crazy talk.

coaching issues? well the special teams problems are 90 percent on the coaches. the lack of a good slobber knocker run offense inside the five until five games into the season and then not using it in the next game is totally on the coaches 100 percent not even a question. The coach himself admits the turnover issues and bad penalties are on him although i think that is a fifty fifty deal between players and coaches.

Even with all of the above its just hard to fathom what has happened in the last eleven games. There is just no reason or excuse for it. There is no one issue but the turnovers both losing them and failing to captilize is a biggie. The lack of preperation on such things as red zone offense is a part, the horrid special teams is a biggie.
Still this team is good enough to be 6-5 or 7-4 instead of 2-9 and building towards better things and not worrying if we can even win 2 more games this year.

 

[Stern]

I know lots of people Like to run down Nassib and he does deserve some blame but he is better than the QB's at LSU, Notre Dame and Stanford all ranked team.

Can't agree with that statement

coaching issues? well the special teams problems are 90 percent on the coaches. the lack of a good slobber knocker run offense inside the five until five games into the season and then not using it in the next game is totally on the coaches 100 percent not even a question. The coach himself admits the turnover issues and bad penalties are on him although i think that is a fifty fifty deal between players and coaches.

I don't see it at 50-50. I see it as 80-20 tilted towards the coaches. The talent is there. SU has equal or better talent compared to every team in the Big East. Look at how SU out-gained Rutgers last Saturday. It's not the talent, its the coaching or lack there of. Marrone on "game-day" on the sideline has no clue what he is doing the majority of the time. Terrible decisions constantly. Team looks lost and unprepared at times. Basic football things, classic example from last week (and there a million examples I could list but here is just one)....like using your timeouts before the half to force Rutgers to punt deep from their own end. Hope for a bad snap or a block. Worst case you rough the kicker and opps, no time left it's halftime anyway. Rutgers gets 1 play with no timeouts from the 35...they are taking a knee anyway. Doug lacks basic football 101 knowledge. He treats his players like they are in the military. The team never looks like it is having fun. They seem like this is more of a job than a game. Doug is in so far over his head with this job its not even funny. I know a lot of you will disagree, and that's fine. Just my .2 cents

 

[OrangeinBoston]

In 2010 we go 8-5 and win a bowl game over a Kansas state team that is now a top five team in the country.
Last year we beat West Virginia and I think are one solid win away from being 6-2 and being a ranked team. Instead of being ranked, in our last eleven games we go 2-9 with one of those wins over a FCS team and the other a 1 point win at home over a 2-4 team.

So I ask what happened? I mean seriously what happened?

It is mind boggling what has happened. I don't even want to hear about injuries or distractions or stuff like that I mean Penn state loses 14 players, changes coaches, goes through an incredible scandal and is 4-2 including a beat down of Northwestern.

I know lots of people Like to run down Nassib and he does deserve some blame but he is better than the QB's at LSU, Notre Dame and Stanford all ranked team.

The special teams are horrid and have cost us three games at least during this stretch and the coach is to blame there no doubt that is totally on him, there are teams with not as much talent as us that are not as bad as us there. This problem is a coaching problem first and foremost with a fragile ego field goal kicker second.

Turnovers are a big problem no question and I mean that in the sense that we don't protect the ball well enough and when we get turnovers we dont capitalize on them, for instance the Northwestern game and the big one the uconn game last year if we take advantage on early turnovers those are just complete different games.

lack of talent? Common man, we certaintly dont have elite talent but out talent is not at a 2-9 level no way now how not even close. Marrone has recruited three straight classes in the 50's and im sorry that is not 2-9 talent. we had enough talent to destroy West Virginia last year and play well against USC twice. Point blank pure and simple we have better talent than the last eleven 2-9 record straight up pure and simple, to even argue that is just crazy talk.

coaching issues? well the special teams problems are 90 percent on the coaches. the lack of a good slobber knocker run offense inside the five until five games into the season and then not using it in the next game is totally on the coaches 100 percent not even a question. The coach himself admits the turnover issues and bad penalties are on him although i think that is a fifty fifty deal between players and coaches.

Even with all of the above its just hard to fathom what has happened in the last eleven games. There is just no reason or excuse for it. There is no one issue but the turnovers both losing them and failing to captilize is a biggie. The lack of preperation on such things as red zone offense is a part, the horrid special teams is a biggie.
Still this team is good enough to be 6-5 or 7-4 instead of 2-9 and building towards better things and not worrying if we can even win 2 more games this year.

I think this is a great question for the coach's show. E-mail it to him and see if he addresses it.

 

[Cusee44]

I know lots of people Like to run down Nassib and he does deserve some blame but he is better than the QB's at LSU, Notre Dame and Stanford all ranked team.

Stopped reading there.

 

[TheCusian]

Equal parts coaching, talent, injuries (last year on D), and bad luck. They are snake bit to a certain extent. I know I'm in the minority, but I see enough to make a strong second half push with the Temple game being the play-in game for a bowl.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Stopped reading there.

Me too...

 

[Cuseman78]

Stopped reading there.

Some of you really just don't watch any CFB at all. Ryan Nassib is MUCH better than Josh NUnes or Mettenberger at LSU. I guess it's fun for some to take shots at their own QB but atleast be right when you do.

 

[SoBristol]

OK, I'll play.
2010 was built on an experienced defense, led by 2 real good senior LBs, and an offense led by a bruising senior RB. Defense and take-aways won 4 of those low-scoring games. These leaders graduated.
2011 -- we got pushed around in the second half of the season. Younger, undersized LBs, not much pass rush, thin and beat up at CB, no second RB behind Bailey, Sales out for the season, weak OL.
2012 -- tougher OOC schedule = slow start to the season; losses to teams that turn out to be better than us (USC) or have proved they can beat a lot of teams (NW & Rutgers).

You can rail on Doug and play calling if you want; sure, there is justification for that (several questionable play sequences; red zone issues; turnovers; weak specials). Red zones are also a test of whether your OL is physical enough to get a push for a couple of yards up the middle; whether your WRs can get separation and make a play in the end zone; whether your QB can sprint out or pull off a QB draw; or whether your RBs can sprint to the markers as well as run between the tackles. Winning teams have special players on special teams (effective returners; gunners; blockers who can open lanes; LBs who can block an occasional kick).

The 2-4 start isn't that much of a mystery. We have an OK team, but need to cut down on turnovers (especially Nassib), break even on specials, and find something that works in the red zone. If you have those red zone solutions, send Doug a message.

 

[cuseguy]

You answered your question. You determined it's coaching. Read what you wrote again.

 

[rrlbees]

Can't agree with that statement



I don't see it at 50-50. I see it as 80-20 tilted towards the coaches. The talent is there. SU has equal or better talent compared to every team in the Big East. Look at how SU out-gained Rutgers last Saturday. It's not the talent, its the coaching or lack there of. Marrone on "game-day" on the sideline has no clue what he is doing the majority of the time. Terrible decisions constantly. Team looks lost and unprepared at times. Basic football things, classic example from last week (and there a million examples I could list but here is just one)....like using your timeouts before the half to force Rutgers to punt deep from their own end. Hope for a bad snap or a block. Worst case you rough the kicker and opps, no time left it's halftime anyway. Rutgers gets 1 play with no timeouts from the 35...they are taking a knee anyway. Doug lacks basic football 101 knowledge. He treats his players like they are in the military. The team never looks like it is having fun. They seem like this is more of a job than a game. Doug is in so far over his head with this job its not even funny. I know a lot of you will disagree, and that's fine. Just my .2 cents

While I also lay some of the blame on Marrone, he owns the losses, you are over the top. You talk like he is a Pop Warner coach.

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[rrlbees]

Stopped reading there.

Why? He is better than more than 1/2 the BCS QB's which makes him above average.

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[upperdeck]

maybe its because we have played #9, #17, #26 and minn was playing their most hyped home game in 10 years.. and we blew 3 of them with our own mistakes.. we could finish 6-6 with all 6 losses to top 25 teams

 

[xc84]

Can't agree with that statement



I don't see it at 50-50. I see it as 80-20 tilted towards the coaches. The talent is there. SU has equal or better talent compared to every team in the Big East. Look at how SU out-gained Rutgers last Saturday. It's not the talent, its the coaching or lack there of. Marrone on "game-day" on the sideline has no clue what he is doing the majority of the time. Terrible decisions constantly. Team looks lost and unprepared at times. Basic football things, classic example from last week (and there a million examples I could list but here is just one)....like using your timeouts before the half to force Rutgers to punt deep from their own end. Hope for a bad snap or a block. Worst case you rough the kicker and opps, no time left it's halftime anyway. Rutgers gets 1 play with no timeouts from the 35...they are taking a knee anyway. Doug lacks basic football 101 knowledge. He treats his players like they are in the military. The team never looks like it is having fun. They seem like this is more of a job than a game. Doug is in so far over his head with this job its not even funny. I know a lot of you will disagree, and that's fine. Just my .2 cents

Losses have been mostly due to mistakes by players. I am not saying the coaches have not made mistakes...but the problems that led to most of the losses happened on the field by individual players. Now one can argue that it's a reflection of the coach. I won't argue against that. But we haven't lost simply because Marrone e.g. called bad timeouts.

 

[Chip]

maybe its because we have played #9, #17, #26 and minn was playing their most hyped home game in 10 years.. and we blew 3 of them with our own mistakes.. we could finish 6-6 with all 6 losses to top 25 teams

I'm going to go ahead and say this is just a bit overstated. I could start with 2-0 Minnesota playing #8 Cal in their new stadium's first year in 2009, or maybe the USC game a year later. But you get the idea. Fun excuse though regardless.

If we win Friday, I'm going to believe in the 6-6 ers, hope they are right. And then, as I said previously, anxiously await their reaction if they're off by, say 2 or more the wrong way.

If we lose Friday, I'm going to tell the 6-6 ers that they're out of their G.D. minds if they think 6-6 is still possible.

First things first, don't let Friday be a What moment for the program.

 

[GoSU96]

Can't agree with that statement



I don't see it at 50-50. I see it as 80-20 tilted towards the coaches. The talent is there. SU has equal or better talent compared to every team in the Big East. Look at how SU out-gained Rutgers last Saturday. It's not the talent, its the coaching or lack there of. Marrone on "game-day" on the sideline has no clue what he is doing the majority of the time. Terrible decisions constantly. Team looks lost and unprepared at times. Basic football things, classic example from last week (and there a million examples I could list but here is just one)....like using your timeouts before the half to force Rutgers to punt deep from their own end. Hope for a bad snap or a block. Worst case you rough the kicker and opps, no time left it's halftime anyway. Rutgers gets 1 play with no timeouts from the 35...they are taking a knee anyway. Doug lacks basic football 101 knowledge. He treats his players like they are in the military. The team never looks like it is having fun. They seem like this is more of a job than a game. Doug is in so far over his head with this job its not even funny. I know a lot of you will disagree, and that's fine. Just my .2 cents

I guess the team was out there drawing up plays in the dirt when they were outgaining Rutgers.

 

[RICuse44]

Some of you really just don't watch any CFB at all. Ryan Nassib is MUCH better than Josh NUnes or Mettenberger at LSU. I guess it's fun for some to take shots at their own QB but atleast be right when you do.

I think you need to look at the offenses those teams run. Of the three (Stanford, LSU, and ND) only ND runs a version of the spread. And from what I've seen the rely fairly heavily on their running game and that big TE to make plays (much more conservative version than Kelly had at Cinci with the likes of Tony Pike). LSU and Stanford are more pro style in their attacks where their QBs are game managers. Our version of the spread requires the QB to make plays with his arm and, eventually I think they envision this, with his legs. I think Nassib is better suited to a pro style offense with a strong running game that uses more play action, bootlegs, and shotgun formations reserved for 3rd down or 2nd and long. We are putting a square peg in a round hole. So in short I think they are asking to much out of him for his skill set.

 

[kingottoiii]

IMO a B coaching job this year should end up in a 7-5 record. Stony Brook, UConn, USF, and Temple are awful. No excuse for losing to them. USC is loaded so you don't expect to beat them. Northwestern, Minny, Pitt, RU, Cincy, Louisville, Mizzou are all toss up games. So a B job goes .500 vs those teams.

As to prior years:

2011
We squeaked by Wake (aided by their QB getting hurt), Rhode Island, Toledo (aided by the PAT call, and half their D being hurt as well as their RB), and Tulane. Everyone of those wins left a lot to be desired. WV was obviously an outlier where our O and D systems matched very well against WV, which is why it was not replicated.

2010
We won a shoot out vs K St and were aided by the celebration call. They were 106th in D that year which is why we were able to put up so many points. Four of the other Ws were over some of the worst teams in CFB (Akron, Maine, Colgate, RU). Then there was WV again, same matchup advantages, and a Cincy team playing an awful backup QB. USF was a good win. Then again BJ Daniels was awful. I give credit to our D but he does have games like that.

2009
Maine and Akron are nothing to write home about. RU we caught them off guard as we used an O and a D that we had not used all year. Northwestern was a very good win. Mike Williams went nuts that game and we made plays on D when we had to.

So when you look at our Ws you will see cupcakes and upsets. When you look at the toss up games we have fared very poorly.

 

[dollarbill44]

What happened? We turned the corner. The problem is it was into oncoming traffic on a one-way street because Marrone's binder had an old map in it.

 

[upperdeck]

put Mike Williams on this team and we are probably 5-1 or 4-2 just because we probably hit 1-2 more home run throws and we probably score 2-3 more times in the red zone.

 

[Millhouse]

Why? He is better than more than 1/2 the BCS QB's which makes him above average.

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not according to passer rating he isn't. and that ignores all the rushing yards put up by qbs.

he's 52nd. and you can see that more of the guys below him are non bcs than above him.

and we haven't played enough big east games to see him sink even further like he did the last two years.

 

[Millhouse]

Some of you really just don't watch any CFB at all. Ryan Nassib is MUCH better than Josh NUnes or Mettenberger at LSU. I guess it's fun for some to take shots at their own QB but atleast be right when you do.

none of them are any good.

the question is why is nassib throwing so much more?

mittenburger 169 attempts
noons 184
naseeb 250

nassib has very few good conference games with a good rating. rutgers this year was his 2nd best as a starter (i've pointed it out a lot). why are we depending so much on the arm of someone who's not that good.

but the people loudest about marrone here are often the ones who want to throw it even more and think nassib is really good. saintfistin comes to mind

 

[xc84]

none of them are any good.

the question is why is nassib throwing so much more?

mittenburger 169
noons 184
naseeb 250

nassib has very few good conference games with a good rating. rutgers this year was his 2nd best as a starter (i've pointed it out a lot). why are we depending so much on the arm of someone who's not that good.

but the people loudest about marrone here are often the ones who want to throw it even more and think nassib is really good. saintfistin comes to mind

The offense revolves around a short, tight passing game. I don't think the strategy is "let's pass a lot because we have Nassib". I think it is, let's pass a lot and Nassib is our QB.

The thing with Nassib is, (IMO), when he's not thinking and just playing, he seems to do better. e.g. He leads his team down the field well. Amazingly well in some cases. But when they get into the red zone, he seems to freeze up. I know that is over-simplified and try to avoid that type of comment but that's how I see it. Of course, it's not all about Nassib or any one player or coach.

 

[Millhouse]

The offense revolves around a short, tight passing game. I don't think the strategy is "let's pass a lot because we have Nassib". I think it is, let's pass a lot and Nassib is our QB.

The thing with Nassib is, (IMO), when he's not thinking and just playing, he seems to do better. e.g. He leads his team down the field well. Amazingly well in some cases. But when they get into the red zone, he seems to freeze up. I know that is over-simplified and try to avoid that type of comment but that's how I see it. Of course, it's not all about Nassib or any one player or coach.

i think you're right but then I look at the qbs he's recruited and wonder. it's a mystery to me.

 

[BomberOrange]

IMO a B coaching job this year should end up in a 7-5 record. Stony Brook, UConn, USF, and Temple are awful. No excuse for losing to them. USC is loaded so you don't expect to beat them. Northwestern, Minny, Pitt, RU, Cincy, Louisville, Mizzou are all toss up games. So a B job goes .500 vs those teams.

As to prior years:

2011
We squeaked by Wake (aided by their QB getting hurt), Rhode Island, Toledo (aided by the PAT call, and half their D being hurt as well as their RB), and Tulane. Everyone of those wins left a lot to be desired. WV was obviously an outlier where our O and D systems matched very well against WV, which is why it was not replicated.

2010
We won a shoot out vs K St and were aided by the celebration call. They were 106th in D that year which is why we were able to put up so many points. Four of the other Ws were over some of the worst teams in CFB (Akron, Maine, Colgate, RU). Then there was WV again, same matchup advantages, and a Cincy team playing an awful backup QB. USF was a good win. Then again BJ Daniels was awful. I give credit to our D but he does have games like that.

2009
Maine and Akron are nothing to write home about. RU we caught them off guard as we used an O and a D that we had not used all year. Northwestern was a very good win. Mike Williams went nuts that game and we made plays on D when we had to.

So when you look at our Ws you will see cupcakes and upsets. When you look at the toss up games we have fared very poorly.

Jesus, do you ever give credit anywhere? Im not saying we are good, because we are not, but c'mon every win has an asterisk to you. The glass half empty story is old. You probably would give the '92 Florida win an asterisk because we opened the game with a reverse KO return for a TD which doesnt happen too often. Or how about the Clemson Gator Bowl win in '96..yeah that was just a good matchup for us right? Wins & losses happen for millions of reasons and you cant just look at EVERY win and throw an asterisk on them. Yes the WF QB who was torching us last year got hurt...well guess what, that is football. Players get hurt and it affects outcomes. Refs make shitty calls and it sometimes affects results and we will never know (K St pinstripe bowl,Toledo last yr, NW this yr).

 

[BomberOrange]

correcting myself..it was the '91 Florida game.