SU to Host Middle Tennessee State in 2017

[Stern]

You're going to be one of those guys who can't find a seat on the bandwagon.

I predict Wisconsin wishing we weren't on their schedule (not because we'll be for sure better than them, but because they thought we'd be an easy P5 out).

What bandwagon, I'm not knocking SU football? It's not a knock on the SU team, it is just a knock on the logic of over-scheduling by the powers that be who make those calls. Which is what we have done to the determinate of the program

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Or we'll watch SU upset LSU in Baton Rouge and then be able to talk about it for decades. Because that's what I'm expecting.

As always, I don't get the desire to water down the schedule. From a fan's perspective, college football is all about great experiences in games against teams that matter.

You don't need to water it down but be smart about home and away. If you swap out LSU for a home game vs another BCS team and play Mid Tennessee State on the road, it is a balanced schedule. The LSU game should have been scheduled for another year. Adding them when you have FSU, Miami, and Louisville on the road already makes zero sense. Like I said before we could have our 2nd best team since 2001 and go 5-7.

 

[Scooch]

Our scheduling is fine. We play in a tough conference, and we play 1 tough OOC game each season.

It's fine.

 

[Frozen]

What bandwagon, I'm not knocking SU football? It's not a knock on the SU team, it is just a knock on the logic of over-scheduling by the powers that be who make those calls. Which is what we have done to the determinate of the program

When will it be ok for SU to resume scheduling Power 5 teams in your opinion? 2025? 2030? 2035?

 

[Stern]

When will it be ok for SU to resume scheduling Power 5 teams in your opinion? 2025? 2030? 2035?

We can schedule Power 5 teams, I never said they shouldn't. Go schedule Indiana, Kansas, Purdue, Vanderbilt, or schools on that level.

No need to schedule LSU, Wisconsin, Ohio St, Alabama...etc.

 

[Frozen]

We can schedule Power 5 teams, I never said they shouldn't. Go schedule Indiana, Kansas, Purdue, Vanderbilt, or schools on that level.

No need to schedule LSU, Wisconsin, Ohio St, Alabama...etc.

What if the schools you list become really good in the next four or five seasons? What then?

 

[Stern]

What if the schools you list become really good in the next four or five seasons? What then?

Then so be it. You played the odds and got burned. Put yourself in the best position possible though, that is the moral of the story.

 

[TheCusian]

Then so be it. You played the odds and got burned. Put yourself in the best position possible though, that is the moral of the story.

Define "best"...

I think the best position possible every year as 6 wins and a bowl. 1 decent/traditionally good P5, 2 non P5 but FBS, and an FCS school gets us there. But if Babers is the real deal, scheduling up is not a bad idea. I don't want to be NC State or Rutgers.

 

[Scooch]

We can schedule Power 5 teams, I never said they shouldn't. Go schedule Indiana, Kansas, Purdue, Vanderbilt, or schools on that level.

No need to schedule LSU, Wisconsin, Ohio St, Alabama...etc.

Why?

What the heck is the real difference between 8 wins and 7 wins if the extra loss is against a top 20 OOC team? All the bowls after the big 6 are the same, essentially.

I swear, it's like some people here don't enjoy sports. It's entertainment. It's fun to play brand name, out of conference teams. Many of my fondest SU football memories are of playing Florida, Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, Auburn, Michigan, Wisconsin, Tennessee, etc. in the regular season. Wasn't playing LSU last year fun? It sure was to me.

No one is advocating the kind of over-scheduling we did in the late 1990s. But one game a year against a good P5 OOC team? Yes, keep doing that.

 

[MSOrange]

Why?

What the heck is the real difference between 8 wins and 7 wins if the extra loss is against a top 20 OOC team? All the bowls after the big 6 are the same, essentially.

I swear, it's like some people here don't enjoy sports. It's entertainment. It's fun to play brand name, out of conference teams. Many of my fondest SU football memories are of playing Florida, Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, Auburn, Michigan, Wisconsin, Tennessee, etc. in the regular season. Wasn't playing LSU last year fun? It sure was to me.

No one is advocating the kind of over-scheduling we did in the late 1990s. But one game a year against a good P5 OOC team? Yes, keep doing that.

I agree with this. I'm fine with one game a year against a good Power 5 team but if I also wouldn't mind going easy in Dino's first year or two while he gets his system in place. But either way, no need to get carried away and overscheduling with too many strong teams.

 

[Stern]

Why?

What the heck is the real difference between 8 wins and 7 wins if the extra loss is against a top 20 OOC team? All the bowls after the big 6 are the same, essentially.

We are never going to agree on this, so I don't expect to change your mind which is cool. But here is the difference to me. The difference is it is tough to build a program back up and recruit better players when you have more than a couple games each year where you have no chance to win essentially. And games which you are essentially non-competitive in. Play teams on your level and stock pile wins. There are no brownie points for playing "tough" and losing vs good teams. A loss is a loss and only losing to LSU by 10 instead of 20+ isn't how you build a program. You can't go into a recruits house and say, hey we only lost to LSU by 10, we aren't bad. No, you want to walk into a recruits house and say we won 8 games last year and we are aiming for 9 or 10 this year. You can build off that, you aren't building off trying to sell kids you played a good team tough and kept it close in a loss. Play a team on your level and get a win! Wins matter.

LSU schedules us like SU schedules Colgate. It's a sure fire win and they know it!

 

[Stern]

Define "best"...

I think the best position possible every year as 6 wins and a bowl. 1 decent/traditionally good P5, 2 non P5 but FBS, and an FCS school gets us there. But if Babers is the real deal, scheduling up is not a bad idea. I don't want to be NC State or Rutgers.

Easy to define that. With Clemson and FSU every year you realistically are starting off with 2 losses, even if Syracuse improves to get on that level to be competitive and win those games is going to be difficult. Not saying SU will never beat them on occasion, but you won't go into any season thinking SU is favored vs those programs as those 2 programs are powerhouses right now and on auto-pilot as college football monsters. And if you schedule a ND or LSU on top of that, odds are you aren't winning that so you start off at 3 losses. Which means getting to 6 wins and a bowl leaves you no margin for error in every other game. If you have an off day vs Wake or BC and lose OR your starting QB goes down for a couple week and you are stuck with a back-up; your season is screwed and you have almost no chance at a bowl because every game becomes must win just to make a low level bowl. You need to give yourself a cushion and some margin of error where you don't need to be perfect in every game that isn't vs LSU, Clem, FSU. Put yourself in the BEST position to get to 6 wins or more every year. When you are SU and at this level now looking to improve and grow, there is nothing wrong with playing more than a few cupcakes OOC and when you do schedule OOC P5 keep it with schools on the same level as you (ie Indiana, Purdue, Kansas...etc)

 

[Frozen]

LSU schedules us like SU schedules Colgate. It's a sure fire win and they know it!

But that's the thing...

If Dino turns the ship around like we hope he will, SU is not a guaranteed win for LSU in 2017. And Wisconsin is not a guaranteed loss for SU in 2020.

Looking at it as a Positive Pete, SU will be much, much better by 2020 and we can go into Camp Randall and expect to go toe to toe with the Badgers and possibly come out with a win, as opposed to merely hoping we can give them a game for two quarters before losing.

If you choose to be a Negative Nate, then we should never schedule a top shelf P5 team because the SU program will never get to an Alabama or Ohio State level.

While I don't think we'll ever be Bama or OSU, I think we can get back to being a regular visitor to the Top 25. I'm somewhere between a Positive Pete and a Cautiously Optimistic Carl.

 

[Eric15]

I swear, it's like some people here don't enjoy sports. It's entertainment. It's fun to play brand name, out of conference teams. Many of my fondest SU football memories are of playing Florida, Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, Auburn, Michigan, Wisconsin, Tennessee, etc. in the regular season. Wasn't playing LSU last year fun? It sure was to me.

Admins, please tack this paragraph to the top of this board for now until the end of time. Thanks in advance.

 

[Stern]

But that's the thing...

If Dino turns the ship around like we hope he will, SU is not a guaranteed win for LSU in 2017.
.

I love Dino and think he is gonna do great. But he ain't turning this ship around in a year to that level to win at LSU on the road. Hope I'm wrong though.

There are many ways to build a program back up to being a consistent Top 25 program, I don't think over-scheudling and scheduling "likely" losses every year is the way to do it though

 

[Ish88888]

Love this game. Perfect blend of interesting team, but beatable. This is an up and coming program and will be no cake walk. As for scheduling the big boys, even with our futility over the last 10-12 years, its been seeing teams like iowa, ped st. Lsu, fsu, and west Virginia up close in the dome that has made me keep my seasons over the years.

 

[Eric15]

The prior scheduling (or lack there of) is embarrassing. Whoever was in charge of that should be let go. I am going to have a hell of a time going to the LSU game but it was idiotic to play it in 2017. We could have our best team in years and still go 7-5 against that schedule. And on the other side we could have a decent Bowl level team and easily go 5-7.

The part of your post above that I bolded is all you have to worry about. Go have an incredible time in one of the most exciting venues in all of sports -- I'll be there as well and will buy you a beer.

The rest of your post is just unnecessary overthinking.

 

[HtownOrange]

All this worry about LSU being a loss next year seems a bit premature.

1: LSU is a title contender this year.
2: If LSU is nearly as good as advertised, they will lose many players.
3: HCDB has a proven system.
4: HCDB is very pleased with what talent he has in the cupboard.
5: Syracuse has traditionally recruited smart kids, this team is smart.
6: HCDB claims it takes 1.5 years for everything to "click" with the team. Yet HCDB is very pleased, meaning he has more to work with than previously thought. Implementation fo HCDB's system may take 1/2 to 1 season.
7: If LSU loses a few extra kids due to a great season and the Orange are ahead of schedule, the set up for a perfect storm is brewing.

WILDCARD: Les miles is a wildcard and he is often good for a confusing loss or two.

Conclusion: Stop worrying about next season when we haven't even seen a down of football this season.

 

[HtownOrange]

Why?

I swear, it's like some people here don't enjoy sports. It's entertainment. It's fun to play brand name, out of conference teams. Many of my fondest SU football memories are of playing Florida, Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, Auburn, Michigan, Wisconsin, Tennessee, etc. in the regular season. Wasn't playing LSU last year fun? It sure was to me.

And how many games against the cupcakes does each of us recall...they were fun, but let's be honest, they simply didn't leave a mark. Spot on, Scooch.

 

[Frozen]

All this worry about LSU being a loss next year seems a bit premature.

1: LSU is a title contender this year.
2: If LSU is nearly as good as advertised, they will lose many players.
3: HCDB has a proven system.
4: HCDB is very pleased with what talent he has in the cupboard.
5: Syracuse has traditionally recruited smart kids, this team is smart.
6: HCDB claims it takes 1.5 years for everything to "click" with the team. Yet HCDB is very pleased, meaning he has more to work with than previously thought. Implementation fo HCDB's system may take 1/2 to 1 season.
7: If LSU loses a few extra kids due to a great season and the Orange are ahead of schedule, the set up for a perfect storm is brewing.

WILDCARD: Les miles is a wildcard and he is often good for a confusing loss or two.

Conclusion: Stop worrying about next season when we haven't even seen a down of football this season.

And what if Miles goes to the NFL in 2017?

 

[rocklloyd]

I love Dino and think he is gonna do great. But he ain't turning this ship around in a year to that level to win at LSU on the road. Hope I'm wrong though.

There are many ways to build a program back up to being a consistent Top 25 program, I don't think over-scheudling and scheduling "likely" losses every year is the way to do it though

Right and wins bring the casual fan back. None of us are in the casual category. Going 1-3 to start the season, but wearing the badge of honor that says we played hard teams does nothing for the casual fan.

 

[Eric15]

Right and wins bring the casual fan back. None of us are in the casual category. Going 1-3 to start the season, but wearing the badge of honor that says we played hard teams does nothing for the casual fan.

When the LSU series was scheduled, we had just come off winning three bowl games in the prior four seasons (2010, 2012, 2013). How many more good seasons than that would you want before you feel ready to schedule one big time game per season?

 

[Scooch]

We are never going to agree on this, so I don't expect to change your mind which is cool. But here is the difference to me. The difference is it is tough to build a program back up and recruit better players when you have more than a couple games each year where you have no chance to win essentially. And games which you are essentially non-competitive in. Play teams on your level and stock pile wins. There are no brownie points for playing "tough" and losing vs good teams. A loss is a loss and only losing to LSU by 10 instead of 20+ isn't how you build a program. You can't go into a recruits house and say, hey we only lost to LSU by 10, we aren't bad. No, you want to walk into a recruits house and say we won 8 games last year and we are aiming for 9 or 10 this year. You can build off that, you aren't building off trying to sell kids you played a good team tough and kept it close in a loss. Play a team on your level and get a win! Wins matter.

LSU schedules us like SU schedules Colgate. It's a sure fire win and they know it!

Our disagreement is that I don't see these games as being unwinnable. We're 4 years out from playing Wisconsin, how anyone can chalk that up as a game we have no chance to win is utterly beyond me.

And recruits aren't dumb. They talk to other programs. I am completely sure that there are significant negative recruiting tactics used against schools who pad their win/loss record with cupcakes. And recruits themselves LOVE to see big name opponents on schedules.

I mean, what is more effective?

> Team A saying to a kid "we won 8 games last year and we are aiming for 9 or 10 this year".

>Or Team B saying "4 of those 8 wins were against garbage schools. We won 7 games last year, against great competition, and when you're a sophomore while Team A is playing Howard you'd be playing against LSU for us".

My 2 cents.

 

[Eric15]

Our disagreement is that I don't see these games as being unwinnable. We're 4 years out from playing Wisconsin, how anyone can chalk that up as a game we have no chance to win is utterly beyond me.

And recruits aren't dumb. They talk to other programs. I am completely sure that there are significant negative recruiting tactics used against schools who pad their win/loss record with cupcakes. And recruits themselves LOVE to see big name opponents on schedules.

I mean, what is more effective?

> Team A saying to a kid "we won 8 games last year and we are aiming for 9 or 10 this year".

>Or Team B saying "4 of those 8 wins were against garbage schools. We won 7 games last year, against great competition, and when you're a sophomore while Team A is playing Howard you'd be playing against LSU for us".

My 2 cents.

Exactly. If you're an 18 year old kid, what is more desirable?

(a) A guaranteed opportunity to play in a regular season game in an SEC or Big Ten venue in front of 100k people

(b) Having a slightly higher probability of playing in the Motor City Bowl on a late December Tuesday afternoon against East Carolina in front of 10k people.

This is college football. The regular season matters. It's not a boring means to an end like in many other sports.

 

[kcsu]

We are Syracuse not Rutgers. We play a national schedule.
Dare to be great!