The all-inclusive Rutgers dumpster fire thread...

[SUFaninNJ]

I always laugh when RU fans take potshots at Syracuse, NY.

Its funny because RU is in New Brunswick. They use the Piscataway address because they don't want to say the words "New Brunswick". (The football stadium is in Piscataway, but the University's main buildings are in New Brunswick.)

New Brunswick is now and has been for decades a crime-infested dump of a place. Crime, including violent crime, is commonplace.

The attached article is just one of many.

http://www.nj.com/middles e x/index...brunswick_announce_new_policing_strategy.html

I got chastised by a couple of people last year for referring to it by its nickname of New Gunswick. I work a town over and have had to report for jury duty there a couple of times. The gang element there is no joke. Drive bys and drug busts are not unusual. I used to work in Newark so I've seen worse. Still, not a place I want to spend much time.

 

[Noexcuse]

Last summer, I too was directed past the stadium. We were going from Monroe township to upstate. Looking at the maps, I wondered why I didn't just go further north on 95.

Evidently they will do anything they can to drum up attendance.

 

[Townie72]

I got chastised by a couple of people last year for referring to it by its nickname of New Gunswick. I work a town over and have had to report for jury duty there a couple of times. The gang element there is no joke. Drive bys and drug busts are not unusual. I used to work in Newark so I've seen worse. Still, not a place I want to spend much time.

I went into Trenton on a Saturday morning a few years ago to do some research at the main public library. The library, located just a few blocks from the main intersection of State and Broad Streets, was surrounded by a 10' high chain link fence topped with barbed wire. I was told to leave nothing of value in my car and to park inside the fenced area.

Trenton at one time was a pleasant town with parks and historic sites. Now it's like a bombed-out US version of Beirut. Along with towns like New Brunswick, Camden, Patterson and Newark it represents the failure of the US to maintain its cities.

In 1950, many German cities were literally pulverized by excessive bombing and burning and US cities were in great shape. Fifty years later and its the reverse.

 

[Noexcuse]

Good luck with Babers. I will take a B1G meathead who knows what a defense is any day of the week.

Let's talk in 3 years. Until then, it's all moot.

 

[colts15]

I went to both schools. Syracuse undergrad and Rutgers for grad school. I lived in both cities. Downtown New Brunswick is not great. However, the outskirts (more towards the university) are very nice. Rutgers is actually in the process of moving the central focus of the university to Livingston campus (which is across the river) instead of college ave. I think college age will always be the more desirable location based on off campus housing and nightlife though.

Anyway... I looked up crime rates for both cities. Syracuse has a higher violent crime rate and a higher property crime rate than New Brunswick. Both of which are well above the national averages. Having the experience of living in both locations... I wouldn't put one over the other. Both have their nice spots. Both have their bad spots. I know people from both schools who were mugged.

As a side note. I liked Syracuse's campus more than Rutgers. Rutgers has like 5 campus a few minutes from eachother so it is very spread out and sometimes a pain to get from class to class. I think I'm one of the rare people on this board (maybe in the country) that support both teams lol.

 

[orangefog]

I went to both schools. Syracuse undergrad and Rutgers for grad school. I lived in both cities. Downtown New Brunswick is not great. However, the outskirts (more towards the university) are very nice. Rutgers is actually in the process of moving the central focus of the university to Livingston campus (which is across the river) instead of college ave. I think college age will always be the more desirable location based on off campus housing and nightlife though.

Anyway... I looked up crime rates for both cities. Syracuse has a higher violent crime rate and a higher property crime rate than New Brunswick. Both of which are well above the national averages. Having the experience of living in both locations... I wouldn't put one over the other. Both have their nice spots. Both have their bad spots. I know people from both schools who were mugged.

As a side note. I liked Syracuse's campus more than Rutgers. Rutgers has like 5 campus a few minutes from eachother so it is very spread out and sometimes a pain to get from class to class. I think I'm one of the rare people on this board (maybe in the country) that support both teams lol.

I blame Nasean Howard.

 

[NJCuse97]

I went to both schools. Syracuse undergrad and Rutgers for grad school. I lived in both cities. Downtown New Brunswick is not great. However, the outskirts (more towards the university) are very nice. Rutgers is actually in the process of moving the central focus of the university to Livingston campus (which is across the river) instead of college ave. I think college age will always be the more desirable location based on off campus housing and nightlife though.

Anyway... I looked up crime rates for both cities. Syracuse has a higher violent crime rate and a higher property crime rate than New Brunswick. Both of which are well above the national averages. Having the experience of living in both locations... I wouldn't put one over the other. Both have their nice spots. Both have their bad spots. I know people from both schools who were mugged.

As a side note. I liked Syracuse's campus more than Rutgers. Rutgers has like 5 campus a few minutes from eachother so it is very spread out and sometimes a pain to get from class to class. I think I'm one of the rare people on this board (maybe in the country) that support both teams lol.

The Livingston Campus looks like an office park. I like the new business school building just fine, but the rest of that setting really lacks charm. I don't think they'll ever get the university recentered to that campus. Also don't underestimate the power of Nancy. She is working on connective corridors for both Newark and New Brunswick.

 

[Townie72]

The Livingston Campus looks like an office park. I like the new business school building just fine, but the rest of that setting really lacks charm. I don't think they'll ever get the university recentered to that campus. Also don't underestimate the power of Nancy. She is working on connective corridors for both Newark and New Brunswick.

Charm? In a State Government building? Charm?

They might try a few architectural tricks to keep the things from looking like what they really are. But since the building was built on the basis of low-bid from design through to completion, it will always lack "charm".

Real B1G schools can afford to add "charm" to their buildings and campus. They can separate themselves from the dictates of the NJ State purchasing system enough so they don't have to do everything "on the cheap".

And you can't paper over the fact that Rutgers really is an amalgam of five different schools and campuses.

 

[orangeinjersey]

I had siblings/friends attend RU, i applied and was accepted to RU, i live close to the campus, and I went to SU. I know both well. 100% the SU campus is better, no doubt. no bias.

That being said, if my kid got accepted to both, and RU was available at a significant discount (scholarships, aide etc) I wouldnt hesitate sending them to RU. 60k vs 30k is a no brainer financially.

 

[Townie72]

I had siblings/friends attend RU, i applied and was accepted to RU, i live close to the campus, and I went to SU. I know both well. 100% the SU campus is better, no doubt. no bias.

That being said, if my kid got accepted to both, and RU was available at a significant discount (scholarships, aide etc) I wouldnt hesitate sending them to RU. 60k vs 30k is a no brainer financially.

As I said earlier, the decision to attend RU is almost always financially-driven.

For scholarship athletes it's a strange decision since "price" isn't really a consideration.

They've tried to sell "Jersey Pride", but there can't be many that gullible that would fall for that nonsense. That might work in Ohio or Pennsylvania, but it doesn't come close to selling in Joisey.

It's not a real B1G school in the same sense that Iowa or Michigan or even Indiana is. It was given B1G membership because of the number of cable boxes in the vicinity of the school.

 

[atom58]

Depends on where you are from, I guess.

By DC standards, it's actually a pretty safe area. The eventwss draw the hoodlums in like a magnet.

Take a tour of Anacostia in Southeast DC next time and let me know how you feel.

Or, as I tried to point out in a recent thread about Temple, take a ride up North Broad Street in Philly to you get to the Temple campus (?) area at 22nd and Lehigh.

But the place that raises the hairs on my neck in anticipation of an impending threat is West Baltimore (as seen in "The Wire").

My wife --- who has no sense of direction --- after leaving a meeting at the Johns Hopkins U. main campus --- found herself in West Baltimore at 11:00pm. The cops stopped her and gave her directions out of "The Hood". They told her not to bother to stop at traffic lights until she got onto MLK Blvd close to Camden Yards.

She told me that the police seemed quite agitated at her presence and wanted to make sure she understood just how dangerous a situation she had put herself in. (She got a new car with a GPS the following week.)

I've been to Johns Hopkins in Baltimore in 2007 as part of work activity but couldn't tell too much from a drive-by of the neighborhood from the inside of a car. I had a friend who lived in Greenbelt (and years earlier went to the Baltimore harbor and a cemetery where Edgar Allan Poe is buried). I understand that Baltimore is worse than College Park. I've never been there but had a former roommate who got a degree in mathematics from UMd at College Park.

I worked with a Chinese student who had graduated from Temple. He told me all the buildings have security guards with one way to enter and whenever there was any shooting the police went in the opposite direction! Also, when I was job hunting I had an interview in Pennsylvania in 1998 and looking at the map took what I thought was the most direct way home - I wound up lost in North Philadelphia. I remember going down a one lane one way street side by side with another car which when it reached the intersection stopped to check for traffic and then ran the red light. It took me 30 minutes to get out of there - so much for my map reading and sense of directions.

 

[atom58]

It's a great story. Unfortunately it's fundamentally untrue. it's not the Maryland fan base doing this. It's those attracted to the Campus area who just want to raise Hell and are using Maryland athletics as a reason and as cover.

I don't know what you know about Maryland and the Maryland campus and its location.

But the riots and assorted other bad behavior in College Park are more a function of population in the areas surrounding College Park and the access to the area from other areas via the Metro than they are the actual Maryland base.

With easy access the area attracts people who are more interested in provoking and joining in disorder

People here in DC know this. The media won't report it as such because they don't like the story line it invites. athletics fan base.

I understand what you are saying but to the extent that some of those folks attend games, they are "fans". The people at UVa and Duke can tell you more about playing at UMd than anyone else. I remember reading that none of them were sad to see UMd go. It sounds crazy but I definitely remember one post at a Duke site where the fans at a BB game were told to try hiding under their seats if Duke won b/c the UMd "fans" were going to start throwing things - at least there is only one or two at WVa who do that inside a BB arena.

 

[Hoo's That]

I've been to Johns Hopkins in Baltimore in 2007 as part of work activity but couldn't tell too much from a drive-by of the neighborhood from the inside of a car. I had a friend who lived in Greenbelt (and years earlier went to the Baltimore harbor and a cemetery where Edgar Allan Poe is buried). I understand that Baltimore is worse than College Park. I've never been there but had a former roommate who got a degree in mathematics from UMd at College Park.

I worked with a Chinese student who had graduated from Temple. He told me all the buildings have security guards with one way to enter and whenever there was any shooting the police went in the opposite direction! Also, when I was job hunting I had an interview in Pennsylvania in 1998 and looking at the map took what I thought was the most direct way home - I wound up lost in North Philadelphia. I remember going down a one lane one way street side by side with another car which when it reached the intersection stopped to check for traffic and then ran the red light. It took me 30 minutes to get out of there - so much for my map reading and sense of directions.

"Goodness" of a neighborhood in Baltimore is measured block-by-block in some areas. There are places where one side of the street is in a good neighborhood and the other side of the street is in a bad neighborhood; goodness doesn't "fade in and out" like in other cities. The area around JHU Hospital has always been a bad area (that's why JHU Hospital was put there). There is a tall fence with guards surrounding the Hospital. The Charles Village area around the Homewood campus, which is not near the Hospital, is generally good and the Roland Park neighborhood just north of Homewood is the 2nd best in Baltimore. RP is just to the west of Guilford, which is the best neighborhood in Baltimore. As you go up Howard St. from North Ave. toward Homewood, you will see the neighborhoods change from good to bad and back to good in a 10-block stretch.

I had jury duty one time with a DC policeman. He was stationed in what he described as a really bad part of DC. He also said as bad as that part of DC was, it wasn't nearly as bad as a bad part of Baltimore.

 

[Hoo's That]

I understand what you are saying but to the extent that some of those folks attend games, they are "fans". The people at UVa and Duke can tell you more about playing at UMd than anyone else. I remember reading that none of them were sad to see UMd go. It sounds crazy but I definitely remember one post at a Duke site where the fans at a BB game were told to try hiding under their seats if Duke won b/c the UMd "fans" were going to start throwing things - at least there is only one or two at WVa who do that inside a BB arena.

We were sad to see UMd leave the ACC, but not at all sad to see their fans leave with them. They were notorious for throwing things from the stands (batteries in their stadium and, in a really notorious case, they hit Carlos Boozer of dook's mother with a thrown plastic soda bottle), and they would key the sides of opponents' cars in the lot. And then there's the couch burnings which gave the place the nickname of College Spark. You win a big game against them and they start burning stuff. You lose a big game against them and they start burning stuff. I'm glad our turn is over and it's RU's turn to deal w/them.

 

[Townie72]

I understand what you are saying but to the extent that some of those folks attend games, they are "fans". The people at UVa and Duke can tell you more about playing at UMd than anyone else. I remember reading that none of them were sad to see UMd go. It sounds crazy but I definitely remember one post at a Duke site where the fans at a BB game were told to try hiding under their seats if Duke won b/c the UMd "fans" were going to start throwing things - at least there is only one or two at WVa who do that inside a BB arena.

Atom;

I know the UMCP fans at games --- particularly the basketball fans --- are rude and generally awful. They have that well-earned reputation.

But these people have almost nothing to do with the violence in downtown College Park that surrounded certain key games. These are the locals --- not aligned with the University --- who are there to make as much trouble as they can.

 

[Townie72]

"Goodness" of a neighborhood in Baltimore is measured block-by-block in some areas. There are places where one side of the street is in a good neighborhood and the other side of the street is in a bad neighborhood; goodness doesn't "fade in and out" like in other cities. The area around JHU Hospital has always been a bad area (that's why JHU Hospital was put there). There is a tall fence with guards surrounding the Hospital. The Charles Village area around the Homewood campus, which is not near the Hospital, is generally good and the Roland Park neighborhood just north of Homewood is the 2nd best in Baltimore. RP is just to the west of Guilford, which is the best neighborhood in Baltimore. As you go up Howard St. from North Ave. toward Homewood, you will see the neighborhoods change from good to bad and back to good in a 10-block stretch.

I had jury duty one time with a DC policeman. He was stationed in what he described as a really bad part of DC. He also said as bad as that part of DC was, it wasn't nearly as bad as a bad part of Baltimore.

Baltimore vs. DC - Well, there are plenty of dodgy places in DC.

But there is a huge difference between Baltimore and DC which has to do with the huge difference between the history and economic base of the two cities. In the 1940's and 50's there was a very large migration of people from the South into Baltimore attracted by jobs in manufacturing and shipping. Those jobs have largely dried up. DC on the other hand is populated by people with deep, deep roots in the City and a relatively good jobs situation. ("The Corner" is a great book on Baltimore's current status (1997) and its history.)

 

[Hoo's That]

Baltimore vs. DC - Well, there are plenty of dodgy places in DC.

But there is a huge difference between Baltimore and DC which has to do with the huge difference between the history and economic base of the two cities. In the 1940's and 50's there was a very large migration of people from the South into Baltimore attracted by jobs in manufacturing and shipping. Those jobs have largely dried up. DC on the other hand is populated by people with deep, deep roots in the City and a relatively good jobs situation. ("The Corner" is a great book on Baltimore's current status (1997) and its history.)

What the policeman said was, "Make no mistake about it, I work in a bad neighborhood. But it's still not as bad as a bad neighborhood in Baltimore." Baltimore has lost roughly half of its population since the 50s. That's never good. I like how Baltimore has a Little Italy and Greektown. DC can be too plain vanilla at times.

 

[kirbivore]

I like how Baltimore has a Little Italy and Greektown. DC can be too plain vanilla at times.

 

[atom58]

Yeah, I remember a song lyric ("the city's dyin") from Randy Newman's "Baltimore" - deindustrialization tends to do that. Anyway, I appreciate the input from Hoo's That et al. and will not hijack this thread. I suppose there are places in NJ very similar to that North Philadelphia area in which I got lost. (I believe we should give people "a hand up not a hand out" (my terms) - a saner work-study-welfare system could help to combat our urban problems - to some extent anyway. There will never be a panacea.)

 

[Townie72]

Yeah, I remember a song lyric ("the city's dyin") from Randy Newman's "Baltimore" - deindustrialization tends to do that. Anyway, I appreciate the input from Hoo's That et al. and will not hijack this thread. I suppose there are places in NJ very similar to that North Philadelphia area in which I got lost. (I believe we should give people "a hand up not a hand out" (my terms) - a saner work-study-welfare system could help to combat our urban problems - to some extent anyway. There will never be a panacea.)

A "saner work-study-welfare system would require us to have a clearly stated admission of what the problem is. And that 's not going to happen any time soon.

 

[TheCusian]

A "saner work-study-welfare system would require us to have a clearly stated admission of what the problem is. And that 's not going to happen any time soon.

Take it OT. Back to hating on Rutgers, please.

 

[Toga]

Big changes with B1G / Rutgers
B1G News: Delany Announces B1G Championship Game Changes

 

[Briancuse]

Big changes with B1G / Rutgers
B1G News: Delany Announces B1G Championship Game Changes

They have to bring back Kyle Flood to coach the game.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[orangeinjersey]

So a guy who threw 3 passes in 3 seasons at TCU, is still in the running, speaks volumes about what they had