The Official SU Basketball Transparency Thread

[Scooch]

I posted this reply in the thread about the bus. But it ticked me off so much I want to make it a whole thing.

I said it a couple days ago, people don’t realize how far behind this program is when it comes to these things. A huge donor yesterday told me “NIL or die” and the main focus is getting players and spending money on them. Unfortunately this is reality when spending goes elsewhere. Melo center becoming outdated. Workout equipment outdated. I’m currently working with my brother to get them treadmills from this decade. So when people go nuts about Red and the coaching, I look at how much the program is lacking and the loudest complainers are usually the cheapest. Welcome to the NIL world

Everything about our hoops NIL, various funding, facilities, and the like is all cloak and dagger nonsense.

Don’t rip the “fan base” for not being keenly aware of this stuff when no one is publicly talking about this stuff.

How the hell is anyone supposed to know the state of our NIL when even the insiders here won’t address it transparently?

How are people supposed to have sympathy for these supposed massive obstacles that Autry is facing if he, you guys, and everyone else that’s connected won’t talk about it and have the media to write about it?

I’m pretty exhausted by the “I know things that you dummies don’t know” routine that goes on here.

Either spill the beans or stop vague posting about his stupid everyone is.

/rant

Here’s the thread for all the folks connected to the program to tell the rabble what you know.

Tell us, in specific detail, how and why our NIL fund isn’t sufficient.

Tell us why our facilities aren’t good enough.

Tell us about all the obstacles that the hoops staff faces that makes it difficult to compete at the highest levels.

Use this space to educate and enlighten, instead of vaguely alluding to these things you know but won’t write about. Make us better fans.

 

[Scooch]

Adding Jake ‘s reply to the bus thread here.

Our annual hoops NIL is about $2-3M annually. Closer to the 2. Really need it over $3M to be where it’d make our fan base happy to match the expectations on who we can get.

SEC and BIG teams can allocate north of 5M easily because of TV money. Other schools like Nova and UConn aren’t funding football like we are, and push most of their $ to hoops.

if you took our top 3 FB NIL deals, they’d probably be equal to what we spend on hoops.

I also believe unquestionably that Fran brought revenue sources with him that few coaches could bring. You don't have the kind of recruiting success that Fran has had purely by being a great guy.

Our FB boosters didn’t suddenly write the kind of checks that were required to lure the players and coaches we got in the past 12 months.

 

[TinyManInside]

Tell us about all the obstacles that the hoops staff faces that makes it difficult to compete at the highest levels.

One thing that is guaranteed to make it hard for SU to get recruits and compete at the highest levels is if the NIL budget is public knowledge and it pales in comparison to the other teams we are recruiting against. Sometimes closing the deal on a recruit isn’t the final $$$, it’s the relationship you develop during the recruitment. There will be players who eliminate us before even talking to Red if an inadequate NIL budget is public knowledge.

It sucks to not have the NIL budget as open knowledge, but there are advantages to not having it as open knowledge.

 

[Scooch]

One thing that is guaranteed to make it hard for SU to get recruits and compete at the highest levels is if the NIL budget is public knowledge and it pales in comparison to the other teams we are recruiting against. Sometimes closing the deal on a recruit isn’t the final $$$, it’s the relationship you develop during the recruitment. There will be players who eliminate us before even talking to Red if an inadequate NIL budget is public knowledge.

It sucks to not have the NIL budget as open knowledge, but there are advantages to not having it as open knowledge.

I totally get this. Although aren’t we less than a year away from NIL going in house and players being paid directly by schools? That’s a public number. Maybe I’m confusing elements of the House settlement?

Regardless, the thrust of my post was how tedious it is to hear insiders here b!tch at others for being stupid when they won’t share the info that would educate others. I’m really sick of it.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I actually think Red is doing fine with HS recruiting. It’s the transfer portal I think we bungled some of our spend on.

 

[RF2044]

I posted this reply in the thread about the bus. But it ticked me off so much I want to make it a whole thing.




Here’s the thread for all the folks connected to the program to tell the rabble what you know.

Tell us, in specific detail, how and why our NIL fund isn’t sufficient.

Tell us why our facilities aren’t good enough.

Tell us about all the obstacles that the hoops staff faces that makes it difficult to compete at the highest levels.

Use this space to educate and enlighten, instead of vaguely alluding to these things you know but won’t write about. Make us better fans.

Primarily, it's excuses.

 

[phil77]

One thing I would like to see is stop blaming and making excuses for outside problems instead look internally at what other schools and programs are doing to raise more funds because clearly this is a new age where funding almost matters just as much as connections.

For myself I have never given to the football NIL not once because I didn’t believe in the program and what they were selling. Then Fran came in and brought hype he was all over the news outlets and was basically shoved down our face. He sold everyone on a new direction and return to Syracuse football greatness and his sale worked not only to fans like me but also to the community. I now give to the football NIL on a monthly basis.

I mentioned this as a big reason why it was time for outside hire but now we went internally what has Red done in the media to push our program? What has he done to inspire new donors? Instead of blaming others we should look internally for failures within our program. Fran not only did the behind the scenes stuff but was also out in front for all eyes to see. We are a communication school why aren’t our programs better at advertising our programs.

 

[two3zone]

I actually think Red is doing fine with HS recruiting. It’s the transfer portal I think we bungled some of our spend on.

And I'd argue the portal is far more important than HS. I don't get what he saw in some of these guys at all.

 

[PhatOrange]

Investors need to see returns. Red doesn’t really inspire investor confidence.

 

[Forloveoforange]

One thing that is guaranteed to make it hard for SU to get recruits and compete at the highest levels is if the NIL budget is public knowledge and it pales in comparison to the other teams we are recruiting against. Sometimes closing the deal on a recruit isn’t the final $$$, it’s the relationship you develop during the recruitment. There will be players who eliminate us before even talking to Red if an inadequate NIL budget is public knowledge.

It sucks to not have the NIL budget as open knowledge, but there are advantages to not having it as open knowledge.

I agree, if you say this fact is bad for recruiting, then don't say it. "If this ever gets out..." One of the problems with the internet forums is everyone has to judge for themselves what to say, and some people love to report whatever.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Primarily, it's excuses.

Underfunding has ruined many a good business.

 

[Red2003]

One thing I would like to see is stop blaming and making excuses for outside problems instead look internally at what other schools and programs are doing to raise more funds because clearly this is a new age where funding almost matters just as much as connections.

For myself I have never given to the football NIL not once because I didn’t believe in the program and what they were selling. Then Fran came in and brought hype he was all over the news outlets and was basically shoved down our face. He sold everyone on a new direction and return to Syracuse football greatness and his sale worked not only to fans like me but also to the community. I now give to the football NIL on a monthly basis.

I mentioned this as a big reason why it was time for outside hire but now we went internally what has Red done in the media to push our program? What has he done to inspire new donors? Instead of blaming others we should look internally for failures within our program. Fran not only did the behind the scenes stuff but was also out in front for all eyes to see. We are a communication school why aren’t our programs better at advertising our programs.

It's both an administration and a fanbase thing. Both group want our sports to "exceed and get back to where we were" but are also "juggling alot of other things" they want to have happen.

Pay very close attention to the words I used because right now when it comes to other places like the Blue Bloods or SEC Football those words become "win at all cost at Football or Men's basketball every year." That is all that matters to their admins and their fans.

They do not ask what have you done for me lately or need to be convinced or need to be hyped by a new hire. They open the checkbook every day and it's as much as needed. Doesn't matter if they go broke or they're lighting their money on fire. It is in their DNA.

 

[Bulldog04]

I lived in SEC country for 4 years very recently and there’s a major difference in how they run their schools compared to SU. Those schools know the main reason they are coming to school there is because of the football programs. The amount of applications they get a very direct correlation to the success of the football programs. They know that. They feed off that and promote it as such. They know kids aren’t coming there for the education.

Syracuse is very similar to Vandy except Vandy is in one of the best cities in the world, but they have always cared about academics 10x more than sports. However, bc they have gotten some money from donors, their football program has improved. And what do ya know, more recognition and more applications. When Syracuse had the success of the basketball team for all those years, kids (including myself) wanted to go there because of it. The lack of success makes it a negative talking point and correlation. However, the football team getting better is going to help for sure, we just need bball to get back to where it was.

Moral of the story- athletics are being put on the backburner for now from the “front offices” of the chancellor

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Investors need to see returns. Red doesn’t really inspire investor confidence.

So far Wildhack's big alumni hires are not doing as well as his one outside hire as far as on the field results. Hopefully Wildhack has figured that out and when the time is right, he uses that blueprint as replacements where needed.

But Red has the #6 recruiting class for next season. Melo, and hopefully others, will use this to get money flowing in the right direction.

 

[RF2044]

Underfunding has ruined many a good business.

Perhaps.

But on the list of causes about what has sunk, and what IS currently sinking SU basketball, that's pretty far down the list.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I posted this reply in the thread about the bus. But it ticked me off so much I want to make it a whole thing.




Here’s the thread for all the folks connected to the program to tell the rabble what you know.

Tell us, in specific detail, how and why our NIL fund isn’t sufficient.

Tell us why our facilities aren’t good enough.

Tell us about all the obstacles that the hoops staff faces that makes it difficult to compete at the highest levels.

Use this space to educate and enlighten, instead of vaguely alluding to these things you know but won’t write about. Make us better fans.

I've said that from day one. Currently the pot is not big enough to pay players and upgrade facilities. Cuse has a much smaller pool of alumni to pull from and the great majority might only get enthused during a Final Four run.

The huge crowd at the dome are mainly made up of townies who, for the most part, are not in a position to be big donors. Those that are, need good reasons to give. Will Syracuse survive if they attract some five and six figure donors or do they need to hit home rums with seven figure donors.

 

[Red2003]

I lived in SEC country for 4 years very recently and there’s a major difference in how they run their schools compared to SU. Those schools know the main reason they are coming to school there is because of the football programs. The amount of applications they get a very direct correlation to the success of the football programs. They know that. They feed off that and promote it as such. They know kids aren’t coming there for the education.

Syracuse is very similar to Vandy except Vandy is in one of the best cities in the world, but they have always cared about academics 10x more than sports. However, bc they have gotten some money from donors, their football program has improved. And what do ya know, more recognition and more applications. When Syracuse had the success of the basketball team for all those years, kids (including myself) wanted to go there because of it. The lack of success makes it a negative talking point and correlation. However, the football team getting better is going to help for sure, we just need bball to get back to where it was.

Moral of the story- athletics are being put on the backburner for now from the “front offices” of the chancellor

As I watched the 8OT's Iast night I laughed when someone in the comments wrote only 41% of these Georgia football players will actually get a degree. It's easy to look up anywhere, they're not even hiding or pretending anymore. Just is what it is.

 

[two3zone]

As I watched the 8OT's Iast night I laughed when someone in the comments wrote only 41% of these Georgia football players will actually get a degree. It's easy to look up anywhere, they're not even hiding or pretending anymore. Just is what it is.

I'd be shocked if some of out mid/late BB teams graduated 25% on time.

It's been going on forever.

 

[Red2003]

I've said that from day one. Currently the pot is not big enough to pay players and upgrade facilities. Cuse has a much smaller pool of alumni to pull from and the great majority might only get enthused during a Final Four run.

The huge crowd at the dome are mainly made up of townies who, for the most part, are not in a position to be big donors. Those that are, need good reasons to give. Will Syracuse survive if they attract some five and six figure donors or do they need to hit home rums with seven figure donors.

Had to respond Mr Clifton Park. Just a personal anecdote. I give a small amount to NIL but the mailers from SU for donations go right in the garbage and always have. For what they charge for Tuition and Room/Board I just think I'd be better spending the money on quickdraw than it being used for something that makes a difference there.

As I get older and if things keep going well for work maybe i'll look more into giving back money that goes 100% to hardship scholarships or more money to NIL. I don't consider myself a fairweather fan but I just can't get to too many games or be balling out as some big donor. Made it 3 football games for year 1 of of Fran Brown and bummed I can't make it today. Basketball should be able to get to a few this year again. Moved to Rexford a few years ago...

 

[two3zone]

Had to respond Mr Clifton Park. Just a personal anecdote. I give a small amount to NIL but the mailers from SU for donations go right in the garbage and always have. For what they charge for Tuition and Room/Board I just think I'd be better spending the money on quickdraw than it being used for something that makes a difference there.

As I get older and if things keep going well for work maybe i'll look more into giving back money that goes 100% to hardship scholarships or more money to NIL. I don't consider myself a fairweather fan but I just can't get to too many games or be balling out as some big donor. Made it 3 football games for year 1 of of Fran Brown and bummed I can't make it today. Basketball should be able to get to a few this year again. Moved to Rexford a few years ago...

This is the way.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Had to respond Mr Clifton Park. Just a personal anecdote. I give a small amount to NIL but the mailers from SU for donations go right in the garbage and always have. For what they charge for Tuition and Room/Board I just think I'd be better spending the money on quickdraw than it being used for something that makes a difference there.

As I get older and if things keep going well for work maybe i'll look more into giving back money that goes 100% to hardship scholarships or more money to NIL. I don't consider myself a fairweather fan but I just can't get to too many games or be balling out as some big donor. Made it 3 football games for year 1 of of Fran Brown and bummed I can't make it today. Basketball should be able to get to a few this year again. Moved to Rexford a few years ago...

I donate a small amount to the NIL collective consigliere started but my wife and I endowed a scholarship in perpetuity for nursing students at the University of Utah earlier this year.

People are free to do what they like with their money but I feel there's a more positive impact on the world I can have by supporting the nursing profession than college sports.

 

[Bayside44]

One thing I would like to see is stop blaming and making excuses for outside problems instead look internally at what other schools and programs are doing to raise more funds because clearly this is a new age where funding almost matters just as much as connections.

For myself I have never given to the football NIL not once because I didn’t believe in the program and what they were selling. Then Fran came in and brought hype he was all over the news outlets and was basically shoved down our face. He sold everyone on a new direction and return to Syracuse football greatness and his sale worked not only to fans like me but also to the community. I now give to the football NIL on a monthly basis.

I mentioned this as a big reason why it was time for outside hire but now we went internally what has Red done in the media to push our program? What has he done to inspire new donors? Instead of blaming others we should look internally for failures within our program. Fran not only did the behind the scenes stuff but was also out in front for all eyes to see. We are a communication school why aren’t our programs better at advertising our programs.

Since you asked Red and staff has taken the show on the road and has done numerous events in our key cities to raise money, build the donor base, etc etc. He's appeared at events with at least Jerami Grant and other big Cuse names to do so. Carmelo didn't sign up just because either.

Not pointing you out but this general what has he done trope is annoying as heck when he's been pounding the pavement just as hard as Fran as done.

Not sure people truly realized the power of JB and how he was able to bend everything to his will. I say that as a compliment to JB.

 

[Bayside44]

So far Wildhack's big alumni hires are not doing as well as his one outside hire as far as on the field results. Hopefully Wildhack has figured that out and when the time is right, he uses that blueprint as replacements where needed.

But Red has the #6 recruiting class for next season. Melo, and hopefully others, will use this to get money flowing in the right direction.

Gait, Trainor, Flo? Really?

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Gait, Trainor, Flo? Really?

If you read all those fan boards, yes. LOL!!!

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I donate a small amount to the NIL collective consigliere started but my wife and I endowed a scholarship in perpetuity for nursing students at the University of Utah earlier this year.

People are free to do what they like with their money but I feel there's a more positive impact on the world I can have by supporting the nursing profession than college sports.

Exactly. Most people have to choose where their donations go to. Do they donate to underprivileged kids? Do you donate to battered women or down on their luck veterans? Do you donate to your church or to an animal rescue group?

Or do you donate to 18-22 year olds who are already getting a full four or five years college education?

Unless your pot is big enough, most people can't or won't donate to everyone so they have to make personal choices.