The Walking Dead

[BlazeOrange]

I thought the episode was pretty poor overall. Such a disappointment after the frenetic pace of the first half of the season. I hate the way they are so slowly bringing Tyreese along since he's one of the best characters from the comics. He's been locked in a room pretty much the entire time. If they are going to lock him in a room, then (SPOILERS from the comics) the ...(END SPOILER from the comics).

Hopefully they'll get back to less talk, more action next week, and we can move on from Crazy Rick because even in the comics, Crazy Rick was the least interesting storyline to me.

Nothing to add other than a thank you to jekelish for clearly labelling spoilers from the comics. Although the show apparently deviates significantly from the written pages, the plots do converge at certain points OR may turn out to just be presented in a different sequence leading to the same big payoffs OR might have different characters assuming the same roles in a story arc. As a non-reader, I'd prefer to maintain as much surprise as possible.

 

[PeteCalvin]

I was not a big fan of the return episode two weeks ago, but Sunday's attack on the prison was awesome. I so want the Governor to get a Michonne ass beating again.

 

[jekelish]

Sunday was entertaining, but when you really stop to examine the episode, at least 75% of it still kinda sucked. Apart from the scene on the bridge and the attack at the end, what was actually good? It was a bunch of idiots talking about stupid stuff the rest of the episode. I liked the episode at the time, but the more I reflect on it, the more I think it was disappointing.

 

[PeteCalvin]

Sunday was entertaining, but when you really stop to examine the episode, at least 75% of it still kinda sucked. Apart from the scene on the bridge and the attack at the end, what was actually good? It was a bunch of idiots talking about stupid stuff the rest of the episode. I liked the episode at the time, but the more I reflect on it, the more I think it was disappointing.

You're one of those 'hard to please' kind of guys, aren't you?

 

[moqui]

Sunday was entertaining, but when you really stop to examine the episode, at least 75% of it still kinda sucked. Apart from the scene on the bridge and the attack at the end, what was actually good? It was a bunch of idiots talking about stupid stuff the rest of the episode. I liked the episode at the time, but the more I reflect on it, the more I think it was disappointing.

that's basically the series in a nutshell, isn't it? We keep watching it for the good 5 minutes each week, but the rest of the show is drudgery

 

[Solitude]

Tonights episode was one of the best of the season. There was some great character development in this one. And finally Michonne gets meaningful lines on the show!

 

[jekelish]

Plus, they brought Morgan back, and with the character, Lennie James. He's been the best actor on the show by a pretty wide margin, despite limited appearances.

SPOILERS

...and he's coming back for the season finale apparently. Hopefully they follow comic continuity and make him a permanent member of the group, because he's such a fantastic actor.

 

[PeteCalvin]

Also, not to spoil anything, but if anyone is reading through the comics...let me just tell you, issue 100 will make you hate Robert Kirkman with every fiber of your being.

And if people think the show is dark, they should read the comics. The comics are so freaking dark and morbid it's absurd.

Just read issue 100. You're right. I want to ring Kirkman's neck. How could he?! Talk about dark and brutal.

 

[Solitude]

Just read issue 100. You're right. I want to ring Kirkman's neck. How could he?! Talk about dark and brutal.

The last comic was so good! Update when you read through the rest. I wish this forum has spoiler tags...

 

[RF2044]

I have to say, the show has deviated significantly from the graphic novels [although in some cases it speeds up some of the plots that unfolded in the comic], but this show is awesome.

Impressive.

 

[Solitude]

I have to say, the show has deviated significantly from the graphic novels [although in some cases it speeds up some of the plots that unfolded in the comic], but this show is awesome.

Impressive.

Definitely. Kirkman realizes that some changes need to be made to adapt the show for a television audience. I also like that the majority of the content and themes of the comics remain, while allowing good changes like Daryl, Merle, Sophia in the barn, etc, to occur. I'm interested to see that direction the new showrunner takes the show in the third season due to the current showrunner getting canned.

 

[Solitude]

Just read issue 100. You're right. I want to ring Kirkman's neck. How could he?! Talk about dark and brutal.

BTW I think there is only one safe character in the comic book, Although that character always gets into some scary situations.

 

[jekelish]

BTW I think there is only one safe character in the comic book, Although that character always gets into some scary situations.

Yeah, Kirkman has gone on record saying there is only one safe character, and that character is named Carl.

 

[PeteCalvin]

BTW I think there is only one safe character in the comic book, Although that character always gets into some scary situations.

And has amazingly survived a brutal injury. He's like that Native American gunfighter in "The Quick and the Dead" who always says he can't be killed by a bullet. In this case, it's true.

 

[PeteCalvin]

The last comic was so good! Update when you read through the rest. I wish this forum has spoiler tags...

I have everything thru issue 102, and have issues 107 and 108. I need to find the single issues for 103-106 or just wait for the trade paperback to come out in June. I want so bad to read 107 and 108, but I won't. There is one store that may have the single issues I need. I'll find out tomorrow.

 

[jekelish]

So that season finale completely blew, eh?

 

[Solitude]

So that season finale completely blew, eh?

Yep I agree. It was very underwhelming. Looking back though I think I know why they did the episode/season the way they did. I'll take a few sentences to compare this season with the comics so be warned that I will lay down some minimal comic spoilers from the prison arc.

When we meet the governor in the comics he is bat insane to begin with. When the audience first interacts with the governor in the series, he is only starting to begin his progression into a mentally disturbed individual. He still has his good moments and only the first signs of his insane psyche are beginning to show. The writers wanted the audience to see how a person would develop into such a crazed person. Well we certainly witnessed that and I must admit they have done a really good job with the governor. So now at this point he isn't hiding his intentions from anyone. His brutally is on full display from both the audience and any character within his presence. He will now do whatever is necessary to kill those that he feels have done him wrong. So the ultimate fight at the prison as witnessed in the comics will most likely come in next seasons finale(we probably won't see the governor until the second half of next season i'm guessing. It is an interesting tweak and even though I appreciate the writers intent, but I'm disappointed that there was no big confrontation during this episode. It was pretty boring especially because of all the pointless foreshadowing. All we got out of it are future no name characters who will probably die pretty quickly from the walkers or the governor or because they all look sickly to begin with(they barely any food too). Also Andrea was pretty much pointless this season. It's really annoying that every character who dies is nonessential to the plot development of the show.

At the very least, we get Tyrese back in the fold. Hopefully he didn't forget his hammer...

 

[upperdeck]

Im not understanding why people were so down on the season ender? Also why so many people are caught up in what the comic book does. I dont know anyone personally who has read the book version so to most they dont matter . I wonder what the % of people who are readers vs those who are only watchers.

if they write a story people expect its disappointing and if they come up with a story no one expected people are complaining. for me the story went in a direction that it had to go since there were so few people left. if people think Andrea was pointless then you are really glossing over the major plot line of the whole story. you need a group, the group has to start moving or be threatened to create a story. this episode sets up several levels of where it can go next year. it also gets back to the heart of the story from the beginning.

 

[BlazeOrange]

Also why so many people are caught up in what the comic book does. I dont know anyone personally who has read the book version so to most they dont matter . I wonder what the % of people who are readers vs those who are only watchers.

if they write a story people expect its disappointing and if they come up with a story no one expected people are complaining.

I haven't read the comic (get mad when people plot spoilers from them w/o warning, but that's another story). But I note that Game of Thrones follows the books very closely without griping. Also, Daryl wasn't in the comics and everyone likes him, so I think the griping comes when they change what was written for something that is worse or doesn't make sense, especially if there isn't a TV production-type issue that could explain it.

My main beef last night was the Andrea-Milton sequence. Her being Chatty Cathy instead of focusing on escape was obvious. The other problem was why didn't Milton try to immobilize himself? If he wasn't too wounded to carry on an intelligent conversation, he should be able to do more than just sit there. He could've at least tried to cinch his belt around his ankles, gag himself, or do something to buy Andrea more time/give her a fighting chance.

 

[Solitude]

Im not understanding why people were so down on the season ender? Also why so many people are caught up in what the comic book does. I dont know anyone personally who has read the book version so to most they dont matter . I wonder what the % of people who are readers vs those who are only watchers.

if they write a story people expect its disappointing and if they come up with a story no one expected people are complaining. for me the story went in a direction that it had to go since there were so few people left. if people think Andrea was pointless then you are really glossing over the major plot line of the whole story. you need a group, the group has to start moving or be threatened to create a story. this episode sets up several levels of where it can go next year. it also gets back to the heart of the story from the beginning.

I actually read the comic books after the first season of the show. I think its good to compare an original work to the adaption. This isn't to criticize the show, because there are many great elements of the show that are not in the comic. The barn scene for example was far more dramatic in the television show. I also believe many of the storylines are done amazingly well. I really love the character development of Carl Daryl, Carol, Merle, and the Governor (as I mentioned previously). Additionally characters who aren't in the comics are just as amazing as characters who aren't.

I think many of the issues come down to believability as well as the development of characters who are killed off. Examples of this include Andrea not really trying to escape until its far too late, the governor's latest victims only running instead of shooting back (as well as his ability to kill a swarm of human beings with a single 30 round clip [one handed btw], and also Rick's visions of his wife. Finally, we seem to only see character development in characters who will die the same episode such as Axel and T-Dog.

All of this in addition to the fact that the showrunner was consistently lacking material for the actors to work with on shooting days is probably the reason Glen Mazzara got the axe (and he wrote the last episode too...). To say that episode was anti-climactic and underwhelming is an understatement. I really look forward to next season with Scott Gimple at the helm. He has written some amazing episodes.

 

[jekelish]

The problem with the season finale is that, really, nothing happened. It was such an underwhelming and anticlimactic end it's absurd. They built to this big showdown with the Governor, and then...well, nothing. They scared his people off with two guns, basically, and then he shot his own people and disappeared. Such BS.

And then Rick decides to take in the people of Woodbury. I'm fine with that. But the fact that he brought them all back to that dirty prison, which has seen several breaches in security so it's not that much more fortified than the town, is ridiculously illogical. Woodbury had running water, actual homes, it was well fortified, had supplies, etc. Kirkman said in an interview, in a total cop out answer, "they went to the prison because the Governor is still out there." What utter BS. He's out there, but he's unhinged and without an army. He has TWO OTHER GUYS, and that's it. Plus, those two seem awfully skeptical of him now, and they are all running dangerously low on ammo. So why on earth would Rick and the now dozens of people under his care give a if the Governor is still around? It's literally 3 versus probably 30 or 40.

 

[Solitude]

The problem with the season finale is that, really, nothing happened. It was such an underwhelming and anticlimactic end it's absurd. They built to this big showdown with the Governor, and then...well, nothing. They scared his people off with two guns, basically, and then he shot his own people and disappeared. Such BS.

And then Rick decides to take in the people of Woodbury. I'm fine with that. But the fact that he brought them all back to that dirty prison, which has seen several breaches in security so it's not that much more fortified than the town, is ridiculously illogical. Woodbury had running water, actual homes, it was well fortified, had supplies, etc. Kirkman said in an interview, in a total cop out answer, "they went to the prison because the Governor is still out there." What utter BS. He's out there, but he's unhinged and without an army. He has TWO OTHER GUYS, and that's it. Plus, those two seem awfully skeptical of him now, and they are all running dangerously low on ammo. So why on earth would Rick and the now dozens of people under his care give a if the Governor is still around? It's literally 3 versus probably 30 or 40.

I think that's the point of the prison. It gives the characters a very false sense of security. They believe that it can be fortified to keep them safe, but in reality it traps them. I think next season will revolve around this issue especially as how it pertains to the walkers. Woodbury is just too large to defend imho though I would agree that the prison isn't a better option. Additionally I doubt they left any supplies behind. They will take everything of value. Also lets not forget they do have a generator in the prison which they can use when needed. And Herschel knows how to farm and the prison is much more suited to this. The entire season took place over 2 1/2 weeks so they aren't close to winter yet.

 

[jekelish]

I think that's the point of the prison. It gives the characters a very false sense of security. They believe that it can be fortified to keep them safe, but in reality it traps them. I think next season will revolve around this issue especially as how it pertains to the walkers. Woodbury is just too large to defend imho though I would agree that the prison isn't a better option. Additionally I doubt they left any supplies behind. They will take everything of value. Also lets not forget they do have a generator in the prison which they can use when needed.

Eh, frankly I think that they decided to stay at the prison because AMC realized it's a cheaper set to shoot on.

 

[Solitude]

Eh, frankly I think that they decided to stay at the prison because AMC realized it's a cheaper set to shoot on.

Or due to the natural progression of the show. Spoiler below







They join a community later on in the series so it would be redundant to join Woodbury at this point of the show, because it would ruin the natural progression of the series.

 

[jekelish]

Yeah I know that happens, I've read the comics. And I agree with your assessment of how it would be, well, what you said (I'm too lazy to spoiler text).

The bottom line is that it has diverged so much from the comic storyline that I just don't think it makes sense for them to stay in the prison.