There is a whole lot of

[Cusefan0307]

yeah just ignore CuseHulk he really doesnt go by anything more than blind optimism. And thats ok, its a fan forum. But we are somewhere between mediocre and bad, and thats not going to change this year. I give them a pass. We arent built like Duke or KU where u can lose multiple studs each year. Ennis was a dagger, but its only gonna be a 1 yr struggle. We will be back in the top 15 next year, status quo.

Lol. You my friend are CuseHulk's evil pessimistic twin brother. Also, I'm on to your schtick. You're afraid that Cooney is eventually going to be compared to or considered better than your beloved Gerry McNamara.

 

[TBCuse11]

No. The point is you can't use the "they could have lost a couple more games" card to prove they're not a good team because they also could have won a couple more. We literally threw away the Michigan and nova games. We were up 3 late in the St. John's game. We had 1 game we got blown out, cal. The 3 other losses we were in position to win. This team is getting better, if we played cal now it would be a much different game. They're getting better, but they still suck at closing out games.

im not using that card at all. i look at the talent on the floor, and its a bad version of Syracuse hoops. If people disagree, thats fine. Im just glad that our basement as a program is the bubble. thats a good thing.

 

[TBCuse11]

Lol. You my friend are CuseHulk's evil pessimistic twin brother. Also, I'm on to your schtick. You're afraid that Cooney is eventually going to be compared to or considered better than your beloved Gerry McNamara.

GMac isnt in my top 25 of favorite SU players. He was probably my 5th favorite on the title team alone.

 

[AZOrange]

GMac isnt in my top 25 of favorite SU players. He was probably my 5th favorite on the title team alone.

how is that possible? 25 guys ahead of Gmac?

 

[cusetown1]

the point is... we didnt win them because we arent good this year. good teams find a way, like we did last year for the most part.

I really don't care what the team is labeled at this point. College basketball is a crapshoot teams progress and regress throughout the season. Just look at Uconn loses by like 45 in a game and a month later they are National champions. Watch the spreads against the "good" teams we will play in the future, you'll probably be shocked how close to each other most teams are.

 

[RandygoCuse]

People have been complaining about fewer good teams in the NCAA the past couple of years, specifically that it's hard to find 68 fill in the brackets. Obviously players leaving early has hurt the overall talent level. But I also think that teams that the talent is spread thinner over more teams than in the past. Ironically, the increase in competition has made for lower overall quality. Some could argue that the NBA is the opposite.

 

[Lawrinson14]

People have been complaining about fewer good teams in the NCAA the past couple of years, specifically that it's hard to find 68 fill in the brackets. Obviously players leaving early has hurt the overall talent level. But I also think that teams that the talent is spread thinner over more teams than in the past. Ironically, the increase in competition has made for lower overall quality. Some could argue that the NBA is the opposite.

I think there has been a widespread regression towards the mean. In other words, bad teams have gotten better (mid majors), while truly top notch teams have become rarer and rarer.

So while it may appear that NCAA basketball is continuously down because of the lack of elite teams, it really isn't that different from years past.

 

[sufandu]

suck in college hoop. As bad as we are, and we are bad, thewre are a lot of teams we play that suck. Anyone watch B.C. and Pitt tonight? They suck. Every game will be tough for us, we just beat Va Tech by 2 in a game their 3rd best player didn't play in. Still, as I said, a lot of suck out there.

Despite what this thread has devolved into, I get what you're saying. You're not simply comparing our team to all of the other teams this year. When you do, it's possible to say we could scratch our way to a decent record and make the tournament, hence your comment about their being a lot of suck our there. You're also commenting on our quality of play as compared to what you've seen in college basketball in the past. With respect to that, we do suck.

I'm not sure why people get in an uproar over it. Can't we be fans and also be honest about how good our team is?

 

[Alsacs]

Good thread College hoops has really been destroyed by the NBA Draft. Every member of the 1992 Dream Team stayed in school atleast 2 years in college. Only Magic Johnson played 2 yrs of college hoops, and only Michael Jordan/Clyde Drexler left after their Junior year. Barkley/Bird/Ewing/Robinson/Malone/Stockton/Mullin/Pippen all played 4 years of college hoops.

It is amazing how from the 1980's to 2010's college hoops has seen a huge talent drain.

College football is the 2nd most popular sport because the NFL uses college football as its D-League. The NBA doesn't do the same for college hoops. Adam Silver wants to kids to have to stay 2 years, but he will have to give the NBAPA something in exchange to get that done.

 

[jordoo]

Its not just the NBA draft although it used to be that teams had a much better idea of what they were getting out of a 3 or 4 year college player. There are other factors.

Lack of team play and team play fundamentals.

The discounting and thus lack of a midrange game due to the 3pt shot.

The way the game is officiated in general with way too much contact not being called and players being rewarded for getting in the way rather than defending.

Finally the horrible job done by the refs being consistent with whatever they call and of course the way in college the refs protect the home team.

 

[Alsacs]

The block/charge is called SO MUCH better in the NBA than in College hoops it makes you wonder what the heck they teach college refs.

In college the refs love to emphatically call the charge with energy in the pros the refs correctly call the block/charge 95% of the time. In college it seems its 95% of the time always called a charge.

 

[Madbiker]

just curious if you have any children - because I suspect if one of them brings home a B - will you tell them they are doing badly?

this team is not bad - to say so just qualifies you as either someone that has no idea what you are looking at.

there are 351 teams in Div 1 - we are in the top 40

Except that our reference group isn't the 351 Div 1 teams that mostly play in mid major conferences. Our reference group is the top 25.

 

[jordoo]

The block/charge is called SO MUCH better in the NBA than in College hoops it makes you wonder what the heck they teach college refs.

In college the refs love to emphatically call the charge with energy in the pros the refs correctly call the block/charge 95% of the time. In college it seems its 95% of the time always called a charge.

It drives me crazy to see the refs not only get the block/charge wrong but also make the call like its the biggest thing that's happened to them all week. I have no idea why the refs in college are so demonstrous making charge calls specifically but any calls. Call it and go do your job no one is there to see your shenanigans. It's all part of them inserting themselves into the game rather than just enforcing the rules which is wrong on so many levels.

 

[jordoo]

Except that our reference group isn't the 351 Div 1 teams that mostly play in mid major conferences. Our reference group is the top 25.

Its probably hard to find 25 teams that are definitely and clearly better than SU. After about 6 teams the next 40 are way too hard to put in order due to the overall blaahhhness.

 

[Alsacs]

It drives me crazy to see the refs not only get the block/charge wrong but also make the call like its the biggest thing that's happened to them all week. I have no idea why the refs in college are so disastrous making charge calls specifically but any calls. Call it and go do your job no one is there to see your shenanigans. It's all part of them inserting themselves into the game rather than just enforcing the rules which is wrong on so many levels.

It is called the Tim Higgins/Ted Valentine "I want everyone on TV to know my name" corollary.

 

[jordoo]

It is called the Tim Higgins/Ted Valentine "I want everyone on TV to know my name" corollary.

Carl Hess is always good for one mind blowing late call that he makes from halfcourt 40' away.

The fact that we know not only these guys names, but what they look like and can picture how they make these calls tells you everything you need to know.

 

[dasher]

Despite what this thread has devolved into, I get what you're saying. You're not simply comparing our team to all of the other teams this year. When you do, it's possible to say we could scratch our way to a decent record and make the tournament, hence your comment about their being a lot of suck our there. You're also commenting on our quality of play as compared to what you've seen in college basketball in the past. With respect to that, we do suck.

I'm not sure why people get in an uproar over it. Can't we be fans and also be honest about how good our team is?

EXACTLY

 

[jekelish]

I've noticed this trend this year, too. I haven't read much of the thread because I can only imagine the mud slinging going on, but it feels like this is one of the worst college hoops seasons in recent memory.

 

[Eagles20]

I've noticed this trend this year, too. I haven't read much of the thread because I can only imagine the mud slinging going on, but it feels like this is one of the worst college hoops seasons in recent memory.

Well get used to it because this is where college hoops is going to be moving forward. You either accept it and watch it or start watching more NBA where better players force defenses to be more spread out and court spacing and overall team shooting is better. The college game is so packed in.

 

[RF2044]

I've noticed this trend this year, too. I haven't read much of the thread because I can only imagine the mud slinging going on, but it feels like this is one of the worst college hoops seasons in recent memory.

From an SU fan's persepective, this is a two-fold issue: number one, our team is down [relatively]. And number two, there is a dearth of top teams this year--maybe UK and Duke. Otherwise, who's the next best? Wisconsin?

Agree that this is possibly the most down hoops season in recent memory.

 

[orange79]

Agree that this is possibly the most down hoops season in recent memory.

So, what you're saying is that UConn defends their title, right?

 

[TinyManInside]

Well get used to it because this is where college hoops is going to be moving forward. You either accept it and watch it or start watching more NBA where better players force defenses to be more spread out and court spacing and overall team shooting is better. The college game is so packed in.

I've sat courtside recently at a few NBA games and then at the Va Tech game last Saturday. The NBA game is just a cleaner, more fluid game (played by freakin' giants). NBA refs actually call contact pretty consistently. The college refs let the games turn into rock fights, and not only that, they are woefully inconsistent on what they will call, and when they will call it.

 

[jordoo]

I've sat courtside recently at a few NBA games and then at the Va Tech game last Saturday. The NBA game is just a cleaner, more fluid game (played by freakin' giants). NBA refs actually call contact pretty consistently. The college refs let the games turn into rock fights, and not only that, they are woefully inconsistent on what they will call, and when they will call it.

Agreed and basketball was never meant to be a contact sport.

 

[Eagles20]

Agreed and basketball was never meant to be a contact sport.

Is the College game really that much more pysical or can NBA players just work through more contact? That is something I wonder. I think on the perimeter the NBA players don't hand check as much, but inside and on drives it's still a contact sport. Melo gets a lot of contact in the post and foul line extended, he is just strong enough to work through contact and finish.

I think the defensive 3 seconds also cleans up the spacing issues college basketball has. In college just having a big or two sit around the paint closes up driving lanes and many college athletes just don't shoot a good enough percentage to pull them out.

The NBA has the best athletes in the world and its amazing what skill and athleticism does to make a game look better. I really try to separate the two and accept the difference in style. I'm still curious why they completely ditched last seasons early attempts to clean up hand checking. Too many whistles cause teams wouldn't adjust so they just scrapped it?

 

[Fly Rodder]

How many D1 college teams were there in say 1990 compared to today's ~340? It seems like there are more and more D1 teams every year. I don't blame them. There has to be some decent coin for smaller schools either being a punching bag or winning a conference and making the dance. I'm sure that there are guys who would be valuable bench and program guys at p5 school, but aren't because they can get lots of playing time at a smaller school.