This is way more difficult than most think

[rrlbees]

People are making the vet and interview process as if Coyle needs to fly some stealth mission through the Middle East with top security clearance in hope that he gets the right hire. Guy has the time to do it right, see who is interested, who we can afford, etc. last time we had the time and went through it the right way we did fine.

Which time was that?

 

[rrlbees]

Those people, and many, many more, will be voting with their feet and their money.

Yes, because we have a plethora of D1 ADs on here.

 

[Scooch]

What will be a strange dynamic is to see what people, who are dismissing others opinions as crazy, will say if Coyle does keep Shafer another year. I'm predicting those people will feel their opinions are also better than Coyles. Bank on it, some have already said it.

So what? I don't understand some of the arguments people are making. Yes, if Shafer is retained lots of people will be upset. And?

 

[Crusty]

We're not going to get better next season on offense, either. The staff has already shown that they can't put together a consistent offensive line, even with a group of experienced players that had performed well together in the past.

So we're going to give the same staff a younger line, and they're going to suddenly figure that out? Doubtful.

This program's best chance to improve is to have a better coaching staff. I really don't want to feel that way, but that's where the evidence is pointing.

After three years, we are going backward. We are now at rock bottom. As I mentioned several times before these guys are in denial and never seem to accept responsibility. Their interviews are always pointing out mistakes by players and not their game plans or failure to make the proper adjustments. Lester has been out coached in the second half almost every game.

All of the questionable staff hires have proven to be less than optimal to disastrous. We failed to manage recruitment by unit properly leading to the current situation.

I am afraid that these chickens have all come home to roost. The skeptics were right.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Which time was that?

What time was that? read all the posts regarding what Coyle needs to do, how difficult it will be, attention mark Coyle, the deal he made, how much money he has to work with, etc, etc the nonsense. There are several of them. It's a load of crap. Let the guy do his job, it's not really that difficult. It really isn't.

 

[qdawgg]

Pitt gets a new coach every 6 months or so and makes a bowl almost every year. I think with a new coach, at worst, we can win a minimum of 4 games every year. That will at least be an improvement

 

[007]

Taking a different perspective...

If SS were let go tomorrow, how many programs anywhere in D1 would be knocking on his door as a potential HC? There are going to a lot of openings at the schools that are about to lose their HCs to bigger programs. I can not see any of them going after SS based on what he has produced. Of course, I have no way of knowing that will be the case, and of course SS has way more going for him than his W-L record.

The point is, how much more risk is there in going with a new HC relative to keeping a HC who might not be the choice of anyone else making a hire?

 

[qdawgg]

we lack an oline and a #1 Wr. no offense is going to work without both no matter how much millhouse says we should just pass pass pass.. did you see anyone open yesterday?

I guess part of the question is, is it the players or the system - along with coaching and play calling. There are a lot of teams that get more production out of the passing game with similar talent. Boise State used to put up huge yards with better classes than us but 20 - 30 points off from the top 25 teams they were beating.

 

[rrlbees]

So what? I don't understand some of the arguments people are making. Yes, if Shafer is retained lots of people will be upset. And?

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

 

[GoSU96]

What will be a strange dynamic is to see what people, who are dismissing others opinions as crazy, will say if Coyle does keep Shafer another year. I'm predicting those people will feel their opinions are also better than Coyles. Bank on it, some have already said it.

If Coyle thinks the internal assessment of the team leads to one more year, that's fine. Who cares what the fans think.

3-9 isn't a surprise, 3-1 was smoke and mirrors, didn't really think the record mattered all that much. The disturbing part is lack of progress and how it actually looks worse now than it did earlier in the year.

Again, ticket sales don't really matter. The school isn't going to go broke because of it.

 

[rrlbees]

What time was that? read all the posts regarding what Coyle needs to do, how difficult it will be, attention mark Coyle, the deal he made, how much money he has to work with, etc, etc the nonsense. There are several of them. It's a load of crap. Let the guy do his job, it's not really that difficult. It really isn't.

Huh? That's not question I responded to.

 

[Crusty]

Taking a different perspective...

If SS were let go tomorrow, how many programs anywhere in D1 would be knocking on his door as a potential HC? There are going to a lot of openings at the schools that are about to lose their HCs to bigger programs. I can not see any of them going after SS based on what he has produced. Of course, I have no way of knowing that will be the case, and of course SS has way more going for him than his W-L record.

The point is, how much more risk is there in going with a new HC relative to keeping a HC who might not be the choice of anyone else making a hire?

Scott will be $5.8 million richer and will get a high quality DC job somewhere. He will be much happier in the end. I certainly hope so as he is a quality guy. Bullough did pretty well here and helped himself. Lester is another question.

 

[Scooch]

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

And? So what? Who cares?

What point are you arguing?

 

[NineOneSeven]

Welcome to the Internet and actually, the world.

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

 

[Stern]

Those people, and many, many more, will be voting with their feet and their money.

100% true. Coyle can bring Shafer back, but this year they are struggling to draw 30,000 fans per game (LSU traveled a ton of fans to bump the number that game, Clemson will do the same this week. Other than that Rhode Island was the largest crowd of the year and SU failed to draw 30,000 for Pitt, Wake, and Central Mich.)

Bring Shafer back means 2 things happen

1) Attendance will actually get worse in 2016, that is obvious
2) Coyle's takes a HUGE roll of the dice with his decision. It's a results oriented business and a what have you done for me lately type of job. Coyle's judged on the big money maker sports and he can't give away a football season. He is graded on what Shafer does in 2016, that counts on his resume. If Shafer has a big 2016, that makes Coyle look great. But the other side of that coin matters too. AD's aren't supreme court judges, they don't have job security for life. They get graded on results, especially of the big-boy revenue making sports. Coyle can stand with Shafer in 2016 but if Shafer fails in 2016 then Coyle's seat will start to get warm. You only get so many "my bad's" as an AD when it comes to the big boy sports. Coyle was brought here to fix football...let's be honest. If his first major football decision is wrong, he dug himself a hole he might never get out of.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Huh? That's not question I responded to.

100% true. Coyle can bring Shafer back, but this year they are struggling to draw 30,000 fans per game (LSU traveled a ton of fans to bump the number that game, Clemson will do the same this week. Other than that Rhode Island was the largest crowd of the year and SU failed to draw 30,000 for Pitt, Wake, and Central Mich.)

Bring Shafer back means 2 things happen

1) Attendance will actually get worse in 2016, that is obvious
2) Coyle's takes a HUGE roll of the dice with his decision. It's a results oriented business and a what have you done for me lately type of job. Coyle's judged on the big money maker sports and he can't give away a football season. He is graded on what Shafer does in 2016, that counts on his resume. If Shafer has a big 2016, that makes Coyle look great. But the other side of that coin matters too. AD's aren't supreme court judges, they don't have job security for life. They get graded on results, especially of the big-boy revenue making sports. Coyle can stand with Shafer in 2016 but if Shafer fails in 2016 then Coyle's seat will start to get warm. You only get so many "my bad's" as an AD when it comes to the big boy sports. Coyle was brought here to fix football...let's be honest. If his first major football decision is wrong, he dug himself a hole he might never get out of.

I don't think he's coming back. Coyle did not hire him, he has really no blood in game

 

[Stern]

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

And they won't be wrong for doing so. It's a fair opinion to have if you have a football coach coming of f back to back 3 win seasons and some how keeps his job. You don't see that often in D1 football these days. So if Shafer does keep his job, hell yeah Coyle will be questioned about it.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

What will be a strange dynamic is to see what people, who are dismissing others opinions as crazy, will say if Coyle does keep Shafer another year. I'm predicting those people will feel their opinions are also better than Coyles. Bank on it, some have already said it.

Coyle can make that call. If he does it's fine. I'll just have low interest, and the little bit I'll have will disappear quickly if we're not significantly better.

 

[rrlbees]

If Coyle thinks the internal assessment of the team leads to one more year, that's fine. Who cares what the fans think.

Agree. I won't care. Just find it a strange dynamic.

 

[rrlbees]

And? So what? Who cares? What point are you arguing?

I'm not arguing a point. I'm making a statement and a prediction.

 

[leftytg]

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

Back in 2003, the Red Sox were playing the Yankees in Game 7 of the ALCS. Pedro Martinez had pitched well for 7 innings and was clearly gassed, as was obvious to anyone who followed the Red Sox. Grady Little inexplicably left Pedro Martinez in the game, and the lead, and ultimately the game, was lost.

I, and millions of other Red Sox fans, were screaming at the screen, incredulous at what a stupid decision leaving Martinez in was. It was indefensible at the time, and even a decade later, remains indefensible.

Somewhere, there was a Red Sox fan version of bees saying, "well, none of you are MLB managers. Who are you to question a move like this? Grady Little knows more about baseball than anyone here." Which, of course, is true. Grady Little does know more about baseball. That doesn't insulate him from making a bad decision.


So yes - if Coyle doesn't see what is blindingly obvious to the vast, vast, vast majority of Syracuse football fans, and retains Shafer - I will most certainly say that he is making a major mistake, and will lose a lot of confidence in his competency as an AD. Much as I did for Grady Little (who, it should be noted, lost his job for that massive lapse of judgment.)

 

[N.Y. Orangeman]

And people will say Coyle is a bum, needs to be fired and that they know more about the job than he does.

I think you are stretching here. Tying SS to Coyle, even if he gives him another years, will not happen in the masses to the extent you suggest.

 

[Crusty]

Back in 2003, the Red Sox were playing the Yankees in Game 7 of the ALCS. Pedro Martinez had pitched well for 7 innings and was clearly gassed, as was obvious to anyone who followed the Red Sox. Grady Little inexplicably left Pedro Martinez in the game, and the lead, and ultimately the game, was lost.

I, and millions of other Red Sox fans, were screaming at the screen, incredulous at what a stupid decision leaving Martinez in was. It was indefensible at the time, and even a decade later, remains indefensible.

Somewhere, there was a Red Sox fan version of bees saying, "well, none of you are MLB managers. Who are you to question a move like this? Grady Little knows more about baseball than anyone here." Which, of course, is true. Grady Little does know more about baseball. That doesn't insulate him from making a bad decision.


So yes - if Coyle doesn't see what is blindingly obvious to the vast, vast, vast majority of Syracuse football fans, and retains Shafer - I will most certainly say that he is making a major mistake, and will lose a lot of confidence in his competency as an AD. Much as I did for Grady Little (who, it should be noted, lost his job for that massive lapse of judgment.)

Some of us liked that game.

 

[Scooch]

I'm not arguing a point. I'm making a statement and a prediction.

Not exactly a bold prediction. Yes, if Shafer isn't fired a lot of people will be upset with Coyle. Are you looking to score points when it happens? Who is a disagreeing?

 

[Willy75]

If Coyle thinks the internal assessment of the team leads to one more year, that's fine. Who cares what the fans think.

3-9 isn't a surprise, 3-1 was smoke and mirrors, didn't really think the record mattered all that much. The disturbing part is lack of progress and how it actually looks worse now than it did earlier in the year.

Again, ticket sales don't really matter. The school isn't going to go broke because of it.

Disagree, at the end of the day the fans, directly or indirectly, pay the bills. That's especially true when you have lots of fixed costs to cover and a new chancellor who has shown himself to be bottom line oriented to a fault.